Relative vs Absolute Statistics

[Adam Ryland]

This poll is quite simple, which type of statistics would you prefer? [U]Absolute Statistics[/U] This means that all statistics given are on the same scale. So a person with 100% power is better than someone with 99% power, even if the first person weights 130lbs and the second person 260lbs. [B]Advantages[/B]: Easier for mod makers, simple to understand [B]Disadvantages[/B]: Realistically, it reduces the ranges available for each weight category, i.e. even a lightweight who is considered very strong amongst his peers is unlikely to get a rating above 40-50, because even a "weak" super heavyweight is going have more power just because of his size (NB: I realise this is a generalisation, i'm just trying to illustrate the example). [U]Relative Statistics[/U] This means that all statistics take into account weight difference. So a 130lb athlete with 100% power is super strong amongst fellow 130lbers, is the same strength as a 90% power guy who weighs 145lbs, the same strength as a 80% power guy who weighs 160lbs, and so on (NB: those figures are purely off the top of my head to illustrate the example, they shouldn't be taken as anything serious). [B]Advantages[/B]: Allows mod makers to decide stats by weight category, without needing to worry about balancing them with heavier \ lighter fighters. [B]Disadvantages[/B]: The player and mod maker must learn to think by weight category when making comparisons. Presents problems with fighters who move up and down weight classes. For what should be obvious reasons, "i'd like to be able to choose in-game which I'd like to use" is not an option.

[Carter]

I chose relative. It's more realistic and if fighters did go up and down in weight class, maybe it would be the job as promoter to to feed his fighter (if he was in for "a push") heavier, less talented fighters (stand up or on the mat) until he put on some mass either through your suggestion as his promoter (that could be a option in the game) and/or through him getting older with age. (Amir Kahn.) I think its safe to say that this option would require more thought and analitical research which for this game, would replace having to book 5 hours of WWE television every week. Because, lets not forget, UFC only book 13 PPV's, a handful of Ultimate Fight Night, and a smattering of unbranded "house shows" every year. Sorry about the use of (brackets).

[Jasx12]

I personally think Relative stats would be very cool.

[dvdWarrior]

I voted for Relative. It just sounds better all around to me. :eek:

[toddthebod]

[QUOTE=Carter;221887] I think its safe to say that this option would require more thought and analitical research which for this game, would replace having to book 5 hours of WWE television every week. Because, lets not forget, UFC only book 13 PPV's, a handful of Ultimate Fight Night, and a smattering of unbranded "house shows" every year. [/QUOTE] I voted relative as well because it would be more realistic. However, I'm wondering what these "unbranded house shows" are that you speak of and where do I find out when these are.

[Sensai of Mattitude]

Relative statistics sound good, as long as it wouldn't affect the ability for fighters to change weight class (because alot of their stats would have to drop back down to low numbers, or just change in general). Either's good for me, really.

[Carter]

[QUOTE=toddthebod;221945]I voted relative as well because it would be more realistic. However, I'm wondering what these "unbranded house shows" are that you speak of and where do I find out when these are.[/QUOTE] I'm not sure, I heard it mentioned by the UFC colour man, him who does Fear Factor, in an interview about the UFC a few months back. I would presume its just young fighters and such Dana can look at.

[Capelli King]

I have to go for relative because it is realistic. Of corse it is easier to rate fighters when it is absolute but realistically a guy which weighs 120lbs will very unlikely have the power of a 300lb guy. On the other hand the 300lb guy will unlikely never have the speed or agility of the lighter fighter. So there should be a penalty for lighter fighters fighting heavyer ones. For example a 100% power LHW should be (for example) the same as a 80% HW power and so on. This will make it interesting putting fighters up against each other in "open weight" tournaments or titles. You could get an average HW doing better than a superstar featherweight, simply because he took advantage of their power and weight. :cool: This one is for Adam-Maybe another idea would be that depending on the weight you could have limits. In other words have an absolute system (which in my view is better overall as it is easier to understand and mod), simply for example a featherweight could be limited to lets say a maximum of 45% power. A lighteight maximum 60% and so on. Similarly a heavyweight could be limited to 50% speed a lightweight 65% and so on. :D I think the above system (which in fact is neighther an absolute or relative) will be the most appropriate. Of corse the minus of such a system in comparisson to a relative system, will be that results will be more predictable. But on the other hand results are usually predictable. One other problem, will be that if a fighter moved up a weight class, he would start with the power of his previous class (or the minimum for that weight class) and he would have to build up that stat in training. On the other hand that is also realistic. By the way what do people think of this idea?

[toddthebod]

[QUOTE=Carter;221948]I'm not sure, I heard it mentioned by the UFC colour man, him who does Fear Factor, in an interview about the UFC a few months back. I would presume its just young fighters and such Dana can look at.[/QUOTE] This would probably be other organizations shows. That guy would be Joe Rogan and I would like to ask Adam something and make a statement. First, Adam, would the stats go to a lowered state if a fighter moves up or down in weight? My statement is more of a beg that when both fake and real mods are put out that fighters stats aren't based on their popularity. This was a huge problem with TEW as the real world mods, the most popular workers had better stats when they didn't really have better skills then some of the people that were over. What, I'm basically saying is that please don't make GSP an A+ or 100% in anything other then conditioning. Chuck Liddell's best stat should be counter punching and he should basically be no higher then a B+ or 87%. Thanks for listening everyone!

[y2trav]

[QUOTE=Carter;221948]I'm not sure, I heard it mentioned by the UFC colour man, him who does Fear Factor, in an interview about the UFC a few months back. I would presume its just young fighters and such Dana can look at.[/QUOTE] they also own the wec, which is a smaller show, but they dont have any "house shows"

[rjhabeeb]

house shows are shows like the XFO and other regional organizations where the UFC has talent scouts they are not always sanctioned which maybe be why it is talked about as such.............It has to be relative stats by the way

[Jorge_JBR]

I went with relative states. And being from Texas, I know all about these "house shows." There are many small time promotions that only promote one or two events a year if ever. Dallas/Ft. Worth is a pretty good area for MMA, and while we don't have a team in the World Combant League or whatever it's called, most of the teams have a hell of a lot of Dallas people.

[Ghostface]

Relative seems the best of the two.

[Capelli King]

[QUOTE=toddthebod;222027]What, I'm basically saying is that please don't make GSP an A+ or 100% in anything other then conditioning.[/QUOTE] If you think some guys are over rated, under rate them!

[SpaceMountain]

I voted for relative, just seems more realistic to me.

[toddthebod]

[QUOTE=Capelli King;222056]If you think some guys are over rated, under rate them![/QUOTE] Not sure what that means but I was expressing that I want this to be the most genuine sim as possible.

[Guest kungfuchef]

Relative for sure. I don't want to see jens pulver be as strong as fedor. For example.

[Adam Ryland]

[QUOTE=kungfuchef;222288]Relative for sure. I don't want to see jens pulver be as strong as fedor. For example.[/QUOTE] Just to be clear, using Relative Statistics doesn't prevent that from happening any more than using Absolute Statistics - if someone chooses to make Pulver as strong as Fedor, then that's their business, that's completely a question of the database maker's views, it has nothing to do with the type of statistics being used.

[Unregistered]

[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;222292]Just to be clear, using Relative Statistics doesn't prevent that from happening any more than using Absolute Statistics - if someone chooses to make Pulver as strong as Fedor, then that's their business, that's completely a question of the database maker's views, it has nothing to do with the type of statistics being used.[/QUOTE] I don't think he understood by what he meant by the definitions really. At first look I admit, I wasn't sure what each meant either. So long as there is a way in the game to make Fedor unbeatable (as he is in real life), I'm a happy dude.:cool:

[Capelli King]

[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;222292]Just to be clear, using Relative Statistics doesn't prevent that from happening any more than using Absolute Statistics - if someone chooses to make Pulver as strong as Fedor, then that's their business, that's completely a question of the database maker's views, it has nothing to do with the type of statistics being used.[/QUOTE] What about the computer generated fighters? Will the computer generate super strong LW for example? Also will a LW develop his power stat the same way a HW does? If yes, then i will say we "have" to have the relative feature.

[Ghostface]

[QUOTE=toddthebod;222094]Not sure what that means but I was expressing that I want this to be the most genuine sim as possible.[/QUOTE] There's always going to be some aspect of personal opinion involved in any mod. What some people consider a great fighter, others might find mediocre. You can always edit it yourself though.

[javier_83]

i think relative, i choose for accident the wrong option :p

[TylerDrew]

I voted for Relative now I'm rethinking it. Would it be doable to have an Absolute system BUT make say a 40 in Str at Lightweight a A? It would make scouting alot easier(THe main draw back of a Absolute system.) while still keeping the positives of the Absolute system.

[Capelli King]

[QUOTE=TylerDrew;222712]I voted for Relative now I'm rethinking it. Would it be doable to have an Absolute system BUT make say a 40 in Str at Lightweight a A? It would make scouting alot easier(THe main draw back of a Absolute system.) while still keeping the positives of the Absolute system.[/QUOTE] I proposed something similar to this. I proposed a limits per weight category. So fo a LW 45 power would be an A+ statistic relative to other LW fighters and so on. As you suggested you will have the benifits of both. But i noticed no one seconded this till now.

[y2trav]

[QUOTE=Capelli King;222731]I proposed something similar to this. I proposed a limits per weight category. So fo a LW 45 power would be an A+ statistic relative to other LW fighters and so on. As you suggested you will have the benifits of both. But i noticed no one seconded this till now.[/QUOTE] i dont like have limits on how strgon someone is based on their weight...two PERFECT examples of this are sean sherk and matt hughes...both are probably stronger than 90% of the middleweights AND lightheavys, and sherk is a 155lber, and hughes fights at 170. the same way, tito is prob stronger than any heavyweight on the ufc roster.