small suggestion

[Bull]

wat do you guys think about brining back tweeners like in ewr? just for a more realistice feel. . .imo there are always guys who dont really fit a face or heel role and are best suited as tweeners and for the japanise promotions that dont rly have a face/heel divide just a thought. . .

[Togg]

Promotion product has the option to have no face or heel divide. In promotions like WWE you dont see Tweeners. you have solid heel and solid face worker. TNA on the other hand has tweeners but thats mostly all the promotion, so TNA might have no face/heel divide or a low face/heel divide. all that is covered in promotion pact. also turning stars would become more difficult i feel. sorry to shoot down the idea buddy. there is prob others who have a posotive opinion on this:)

[Bull]

its cool i was just wantin to see wat other ppl thought. . .

[ubernoob]

I would like it for a simple reason. I'll use something like what I had planned out at a point in time. Take someone like Mr. Kennedy (who I like, partly because he's from GB, partly because he has a good charisma/feel about him)... I would make him a tweener, because against someone like Cena, whos a top face, I would want him to get booed... When he goes up against someone like Randy Orton though, a top heel, I'd want him to get cheered. You don't get a punishment for a heel-heel matchup, neither would you with a face-face matchup with the introduction of tweener. I believe it would be a fairly easy item to add, and wouldn't take too much time (correct me if im wrong.) As with other additions, you always have the choice of using it... If you don't want to, don't... (Like myself with the new areas in Europe, I could care less.) More options are never a bad thing.

[Akki]

I think that depending on your Traditional product definition, you may or may not get "punished" for face vs face or heel vs heel matches. Obviously the Face/Heel divide has to do with it, too. I'd like to think that the gimmick (Face/Heel ratings) has to do with it too, but I might be wrong. An Old-School Face or Heel isn't going to be a tweener by definition, but someone who is ****y could definetely be one. I really wouldn't care if this was in, because if everything is done right with the current setup, you should have no problem portraying someone as a tweener.

[Adam Ryland]

[QUOTE=ubernoob;397444]Take someone like Mr. Kennedy (who I like, partly because he's from GB, partly because he has a good charisma/feel about him)... I would make him a tweener, because against someone like Cena, whos a top face, I would want him to get booed... When he goes up against someone like Randy Orton though, a top heel, I'd want him to get cheered. You don't get a punishment for a heel-heel matchup, neither would you with a face-face matchup with the introduction of tweener.[/QUOTE] I'd imagine this is why it keeps getting suggested, and the flaw is obvious - it's a completely player-oriented feature, it's so that you can essentially have your cake and eat it too. You want to be able use a worker as both a face and heel at the same time and not have any penalties. I can see the appeal, but it's lazy booking and flat out does not work like that in real life; if anybody ever truly booked a character who flipped between face and heel at will, either the fans would decide for you or the confusion would kill of any momentum that the worker had. You cannot sustain a true tweener in a promotion that runs a proper face\heel divide because it goes against the entire concept of good vs. bad, which is the absolute fundamental basis of that type of booking. There can be faces who act heelish, heels who act with some nobility, or wrestlers who have so little direction \ are so bland that it doesn't matter whether they're a face or heel, but a true tweener simply would not work in that context. People always bring up early Stone Cold as an example, but he wasn't truly a tweener at any point - the WWF just did a masterful job of slowly turning him while keeping the rebellious elements of his character in place. [QUOTE=ubernoob;397444](Like myself with the new areas in Europe, [B]I could care less[/B].)[/QUOTE] Off topic, but why have people started using this phrase in this way? It seems to have started recently....it's "I [I]couldn't[/I] care less", otherwise it doesn't make any sense! Saying you could care less about something is absolutely meaningless, that could apply to anything!

[Akki]

[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;397474]Off topic, but why have people started using this phrase in this way? It seems to have started recently....it's "I [I]couldn't[/I] care less", otherwise it doesn't make any sense! Saying you could care less about something is absolutely meaningless, that could apply to anything![/QUOTE] Well, considering that it's coming from the same people who suggest ideas which would amount to "lazy booking", asking them to type an extra 3 characters might be a bit much. And Adam, this isn't sarcasm. It's more hyperbole.

[Self]

"I could care less" is almost a compliment. Say if someone is ripping on... um... Charlotte Church, and they're all saying "Dude. I so don't care about her. Opera sucks and no one watches her talk show." You could come back with "You know what, she's with a rugby player, and she's kinda fit, so it's possible for me to care less about her, say if she ditched Henson and got hit in the face with a shovel." It's possibly the worst compliment in the world, but...

[Greek]

But Adam, it doesn't have to be a feuture with no negative effect. The way I would put the feature is that if you set a worker as a tweener the crowd won't be upset when he fights a face or a hell BUT the crowd won't be as into it! What I mean by this is that a tweener fighting against a face will draw less than a pure heel vs face (same of course applies to heel vs tweener). So if you introduce it to the game this way then there will be both the positive and the negative effect :)

[Bull]

its not necessarily the tweener role im tryin to suggest i guess but something like a characters characteristics(if that makes any sense) like a face who not fully a face and vice-versa. like having a face caracter who sometimes shows the characteristic of a heel and a heel that sometimes does things a face would do with out acutually changing roles. kinda like when finlay was a heel but sometimes got cheered becuz he would fight anyone heels or faces if you get wat im sayin. . .and also like chris jericho who has more of a heelish character but gets cheered as a face. . .but i suppose its nothing you cant already do in the game. . . so whatever you guys think. . .

[cyberkitten01]

Anyone I'd consider a Tweener works best as a Babyface, that way they can fight heels and faces an necessary

[ubernoob]

[QUOTE=cyberkitten01;397921]Anyone I'd consider a Tweener works best as a Babyface, that way they can fight heels and faces an necessary[/QUOTE] Yeah, that's what I do now. About the care less, I chalk it up to the same reason we call things a "near miss" which is basically a hit ;) Thanks for the input though Adam.

[Michael Wayne]

[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;397474] Off topic, but why have people started using this phrase in this way? It seems to have started recently....it's "I [I]couldn't[/I] care less", otherwise it doesn't make any sense! Saying you could care less about something is absolutely meaningless, that could apply to anything![/QUOTE] They failed English class and don't know their GRAMMAR¿ :p Just a guess...

[cyberkitten01]

Someone on a forum actually praised me once because I said 'I couldn't care less', apparently not enough people get it right :confused:

[Michael Wayne]

[img]http://www.incompetech.com/Images/caring.png[/img]

[sprinklefurball]

I'm pretty sure Raven was a tweener in his WCW days, or am I confused?

[alden]

raven was a straight up heel big time in wcw. Although alot of heel's got lost in the nwo stuff so.....

[crayon]

Yeah, I think his character just really resonated with some people, putting him over as more than a heel, despite his actions. But I guess that's more a factor that goes off certain sectors of the fanbase, (or the weakness of the babyfaces) than his actual gimmick. Same might be said of someone like Christian or The Rock when they play straight heels

[alden]

I think raven was a good example of how a tweener MIGHT work. ECW raven was evil as hell *brain washing kids is as evil as you can get ;)* but in wcw he was more alof. He talked about how he looked out for the "outcasts" and the "freaks". To some people i am sure that spoke to them *go through high school without felling like a freak, it's hard as hell :)* I think people were able to relate to him. If you look at his out of ring actions he might be a "face" the same way jimmy jacobs was a face. But in ring stuff pure heel.