EliteXC to Fold

[ACCBiggz]

EliteXC will be closing its doors in the next few days cancelling their upcoming card on November 8th (Lightweight Championship: Diaz vs. Alvarez). The negotiations with CBS fell through and they informed their fighters of the closing... Sources: Meltzer, Sherdog, MMA Weekly, etc.

[Bigpapa42]

Been rumored for awhile that they've been having serious problems. Too bad. They've actually had some pretty good fights, outside of the whole Kimbo sideshow. Was looking forward to the next show, particuarly the Diaz-Alvarez title fight.

[blackphoenix]

God damn it, this is bad for FeMMA. While I wasn't a fan of most of what EXC did, they support women's mma like no one else. This is seriously bad for the girls, since Dana White is very against women's mma. Nargh.

[ACCBiggz]

Not bad really... EliteXC only promoted Gina Carano. She helped MMA a bit by bringing it more mainstream, but they didn't go out and really push all top fighters. And this opens the door for Affliction and/or AFL to jump in. AFL already has Tara LaRosa and company and could really get this niche, or Affliction could jump in and perhaps work with the AFL to set up legit fights down the road for Women's MMA on their PPV's. EXC folding isn't bad for Female MMA, because we don't know who will pick up the slack. Apprently the UFC is already in negotiations with Jake Shields, Rafeal Feijao, and Dave Herman. *places salt shaker on the table*

[blackphoenix]

AFL has got really bad news following it, especially from the female fighers perspective, girls have been signed to contracts for months and months now and no fights have been organised.. hell the biggest fight of Roxi vs Tara was being run on an independent card with NO tv coverage then got pulled because AFL couldn't afford the fight. Tara may still champion the AFL name, but many of the other girls are starting to mutter frustration about fights not happening. Thankfully (but strangely) AFL signed the girls to non exclusive contracts so they can still get work in japan etc but AFL seems a bit shaky at this point. Josh Barnett has already pushed his girls (Roxi, Shayna and Fuji) to Afflication but he said he has gotten nothing but brickwalls and seriously lowball offers from the girls. XC was good in that it had major TV spotlight, and they were starting to bring in other girls through KOTC/SHOXC and the undercard of other shows. They had just signed to girls to the heavyweight division, that would have made a big difference credibility wise, and have given fights to Shayna Bazler, Tonya Evinger, Julie Kedsie, Rosi Sexton, Debi Purcell and Cyborg (all well earned top flight womens fighters). To say that XC was only promoting Gina I think is a an unbalance view of what was going on... XC and Gina were breaking the ceiling and taking female MMA to the larger audience that in turn was creating oppotunities for the rest of the female MMA community. A few girls were very excited about just recently signing contracts. It's sad to see a organisation that really did give FeMMA a great boost go. I hope someone does step into the space and carry the torch, hell I think if Dana could get over his ego (hell run it as a seperate show from his blessed men) he could make a lot of money from FeMMA.

[Bigpapa42]

Elite having Carano on network TV brought women's MMA to the fore for a lot of average fans who never saw much of womens MMA in the likes of Bodog. While they were definitely pushing Carano heavily, they did have Cyborg on the card in July, so they were pushing the division as more than just Carano. It would be cool to see Carano land in the AFL, just for the LaRosa superfight. I still think LaRosa would take that. But there's no way that the AFL gets that fight anywhere near the mainstream exposure that Elite would have got Carano-Cyborg on CBS. In a business like MMA, I think having more than one promotion of note is a good thing. Because you can't count on a promotion to do anything beyond what lies in its own self-interest. It is a business, after all. I think that competition tends to force them into considering the "great good" a bit more. It forces them to do more than just think about their own profit. I don't think Elite was exactly forcing the UFC to change a whole lot, but competition is still competition.

[blackphoenix]

[QUOTE=Bigpapa42;510280]. It would be cool to see Carano land in the AFL, just for the LaRosa superfight. I still think LaRosa would take that. But there's no way that the AFL gets that fight anywhere near the mainstream exposure that Elite would have got Carano-Cyborg on CBS. [/QUOTE] And the problem is that LaRosa has said before that she doesn't want to go up to Carano, while I don't think that Carano can possibly weight wise go down LaRosa. Roxi Vs Tara is a big one. The big promo fight after Carano vs Cyborg for Gina is... Toughhill vs Carano. Erin's been looking around for a fight lately and gladiator vs gladiator might get some main stream appeal.

[ACCBiggz]

[QUOTE]they did have Cyborg on the card in July, so they were pushing the division as more than just Carano. [/QUOTE] Two fighters aren't a division. They had her on to give Carano's next opponent some legitamacy and name value so it would draw more on the televised card. Not saying Cyborg isn't decent or anything, but they weren't building a division. They were doing the same thing as they were with Kimbo, exploiting one person for maximization of profits. [QUOTE]hell I think if Dana could get over his ego (hell run it as a seperate show from his blessed men) he could make a lot of money from FeMMA.[/QUOTE] I think Dana would "get over his ego" if there was legit purpose for women's MMA. I agree with the likes of Jordan Breen when talking about women's MMA is the fact there is no depth. The majority of skilled fighters are across the sea fighting at 115-125. Carano has a special weight class created for her where everybody she is fighting is at a weight and probable height/reach disadvantage. There isn't this fair and balance to women's MMA YET. It's going to take time to devolop the women's side of things and there is no spot, in my opinion, in the UFC for a special 2-3 person division highlighting someone like Carano or anyone else. [QUOTE]In a business like MMA, I think having more than one promotion of note is a good thing. Because you can't count on a promotion to do anything beyond what lies in its own self-interest. It is a business, after all. I think that competition tends to force them into considering the "great good" a bit more. It forces them to do more than just think about their own profit. I don't think Elite was exactly forcing the UFC to change a whole lot, but competition is still competition.[/QUOTE] Competition is good, and Dana even talks good things about places like Strikeforce and others. Because they are doing it right. Elite XC and the people behind it were not. They were in it for the money and exploited people along the way. That's the problem I had with EliteXC, and I am very happy to see them go.

[blackphoenix]

[QUOTE=ACCBiggz;510296]Two fighters aren't a division. They had her on to give Carano's next opponent some legitamacy and name value so it would draw more on the televised card. Not saying Cyborg isn't decent or anything, but they weren't building a division. They were doing the same thing as they were with Kimbo, exploiting one person for maximization of profits. I think Dana would "get over his ego" if there was legit purpose for women's MMA. I agree with the likes of Jordan Breen when talking about women's MMA is the fact there is no depth. The majority of skilled fighters are across the sea fighting at 115-125. Carano has a special weight class created for her where everybody she is fighting is at a weight and probable height/reach disadvantage. There isn't this fair and balance to women's MMA YET. It's going to take time to devolop the women's side of things and there is no spot, in my opinion, in the UFC for a special 2-3 person division highlighting someone like Carano or anyone else. [/QUOTE] I disagree about lack of depth, and will seem to counter my point made earlier (lol) in that while XC did allow alot of others to fight, there are still alot of very good women Japanese and American (Fuji etc and Amanda Buckner, Toughhill etc) who haven't got a fight and CAN'T get a fight at the moment because all of the greenhorns coming through don't want to fight them/promotions can't afford them. Somebody needs to give the girls some kinda of premier place to get too, even if it was on WEC rather than UFC they need something. Hell their is lack of depth in some of the men's divisions in the UFC too.

[ACCBiggz]

[QUOTE]I disagree about lack of depth, and will seem to counter my point made earlier (lol) in that while XC did allow alot of others to fight, there are still alot of very good women Japanese and American (Fuji etc and Amanda Buckner, Toughhill etc) who haven't got a fight and CAN'T get a fight at the moment because all of the greenhorns coming through don't want to fight them/promotions can't afford them. Somebody needs to give the girls some kinda of premier place to get too, even if it was on WEC rather than UFC they need something. Hell their is lack of depth in some of the men's divisions in the UFC too.[/QUOTE] Mega Megu - 115 Amanda Buckner - 135 Erin Toughill - 150 Gina Carano - 140 (possibly 145 now) Cristiane Santos - 140 (Which I believe she moved up for the sole purpose of EXC's asking so they could make the Carano fight, although I could be wrong. Would have to go back and search pre-EXC bouts/weigh-ins) Tara Larosa - 132/135 Roxanne Modafferi - 135 Kelly Kobad - 140 (Again, think this is a move up for EXC. Believe she is 130-135 or so.) But yeah, I agree there are talented fighters out there... but not enough to create a division in the UFC for yet. That's my argument. You seem to disagree, so please, compile a list of a credible, actual division that could be used at whatever weight you want. As you can tell the majority of the American-esque Female MMA divison is around 135, so you'll get Tara, Roxanne, Baszler, Kobald, Cyborg, and Buckner. And outside of Cyborg the other women have already fought one another once or twice anyway. I, for one, don't want to see them repeatedly fight one another for 3 years until PERHAPS depth finally starts occuring with decent well-rounded fighters. I am interested to see if Frank Shamrock goes back to Strikeforce for a potential rematch with Cung Le, or maybe they bring in Ken for that "long awaited" match. Or if whereever Tito signs they try to put on Tito/Frank II. Or if Frank toils away another year or more of his talent before thinking about stepping back in.

[BlizzardVeers]

Considering how hard Bodog was pushing the woman's division, Elite XC didn't do much for anyone but Gina Carano. I agree with Biggz, Elite XC really didn't have a whole lot of depth in that division. They didn't have a great deal of depth or talent in any division to be honest, except Middleweight. Elite XC folding wasn't unexpected, but I have to kind of laugh since Seth KO'd Kimbo and Elite XC with one punch. This is pretty bad blow for woman's MMA in the US, but for MMA in general it is not. Affliction or the UFC is rumored to take the CBS slot. I do think that if Dana ever did get his head out of his butt and put together woman's MMA, he would likely put it under a different company name than the UFC. This does sort of suck though, they finally seemed to be getting their television production together.

[CQI13]

I remember hearing an interview with Dana White a few months back, and he said the reason why the UFC/CBS thing fell through originally (and why CBS went with XC) was because CBS wanted to buy a sizeable share of UFC, and Dana had said that he's too young to be selling any interest in UFC. Then again, I think it was in the same interview that he took no ownership of not signing Fedor this whole time (he kept blaming Fedor's agent & camp, and continually said Fedor never wanted to sign with UFC because "then he'd have to fight someone". So not sure exactly how much truth there is to the UFC/CBS deal falling through coming from him. And I thought Spike was owned by CBS, so I'm assuming Dana had mentioned it was CBS Sports that would be running the UFC shows, like they were with XC.

[blackphoenix]

[QUOTE=ACCBiggz;510410]Mega Megu - 115 Amanda Buckner - 135 Erin Toughill - 150 Gina Carano - 140 (possibly 145 now) Cristiane Santos - 140 (Which I believe she moved up for the sole purpose of EXC's asking so they could make the Carano fight, although I could be wrong. Would have to go back and search pre-EXC bouts/weigh-ins) Tara Larosa - 132/135 Roxanne Modafferi - 135 Kelly Kobad - 140 (Again, think this is a move up for EXC. Believe she is 130-135 or so.) But yeah, I agree there are talented fighters out there... but not enough to create a division in the UFC for yet. That's my argument. You seem to disagree, so please, compile a list of a credible, actual division that could be used at whatever weight you want. As you can tell the majority of the American-esque Female MMA divison is around 135, so you'll get Tara, Roxanne, Baszler, Kobald, Cyborg, and Buckner. And outside of Cyborg the other women have already fought one another once or twice anyway. I, for one, don't want to see them repeatedly fight one another for 3 years until PERHAPS depth finally starts occuring with decent well-rounded fighters. I am interested to see if Frank Shamrock goes back to Strikeforce for a potential rematch with Cung Le, or maybe they bring in Ken for that "long awaited" match. Or if whereever Tito signs they try to put on Tito/Frank II. Or if Frank toils away another year or more of his talent before thinking about stepping back in.[/QUOTE] I heart you. :) I will do my list, for you later today. Got to get some studying done, but i think a mix of green horns and vets could do possibily two divisions.

[ACCBiggz]

Sherdog reports that Affliction and/or CBS are "strongly" rumored to pick up the women of EliteXC. And Jake Shields is leaning heavily to the UFC: [QUOTE]"The UFC's the most likely option," he said. "That's where I'm certainly leaning. I haven't had any talks with them yet; I have to get my contract released. That's definitely the number one option I'm looking at. I was on good terms with them before I signed this last contract, so I don't think there should be any problem."[/QUOTE]

[grits207]

Hopefully this means Reis will go to WEC.

[ACCBiggz]

[B]"Partnership between Affliction MMA and Golden Boy Promotions off"[/B] Just thought I'd post that here instead of a new thread.

[chris caulfield]

[QUOTE=ACCBiggz;513638][B]"Partnership between Affliction MMA and Golden Boy Promotions off"[/B] Just thought I'd post that here instead of a new thread.[/QUOTE] Where is the source?

[ACCBiggz]

Probably should have clarified in there that this only applies to the Boxing & MMA joint cards. Golden Boy will still help promote Affliction, as they are keeping the sports seperate. [B]ESPN.com:[/B][QUOTE] In September, Golden Boy announced with fanfare a deal with fledgling MMA promoter and apparel company Affliction under which it would co-promote pay-per-view events with boxing and MMA matches on the same card. [B]But Golden Boy CEO Richard Schaefer told ESPN.com that they've had a change of heart and will keep the sports separate.[/B] The companies are planning their first MMA-only co-promotion in January. The idea of both sports on the same card was heavily criticized, which Schaefer acknowledged was part of the decision. "We want to get to know the MMA market better and truly evaluate if there are synergies between the two sports," he said. "We are planning to do some focus groups where we will ask boxing and MMA fans how they would feel about it. Once we get the results of that, then we'll be in a much better position to decide which strategy to apply."[/QUOTE]

[ACCBiggz]

And Dana obviously agrees to me, and instead of saying he doesn't like to watch women fighting like in the past... he clearly states why the UFC does not have a division and won't pursue Gina Carano and company: [QUOTE]“I think Gina Carano is a talented fighter, I think she’s a star,” White said. “She should have been the main event of that night, or Jake Shields. My thing with women fighting is that there’s just not enough good women out there to create a whole division. Could I do some one off fights here and there, yeah, but that’s not really what we do.”[/QUOTE] -MMAWeekly.com

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=ACCBiggz;515029]And Dana obviously agrees to me, and instead of saying he doesn't like to watch women fighting like in the past... he clearly states why the UFC does not have a division and won't pursue Gina Carano and company: -MMAWeekly.com[/QUOTE] It is a legitimate point. The women's side of MMA does need to grow considerably. At the same time, an easy counterpoint to that is that the UFC could easily help women's MMA to grow if they chose to. The UFC could be a major catalyst to developing that side of the sport as a whole. Consider if you combined the star power of Carano with the marketing power of the UFC. She could be one of the most recognized fighters on the planet in a very short time. That would very likely draw more talent in, which would significantly boost the talent level within a short time. Consider the possibility... The UFC signs Carano and about 8-10 other decent women fighters. They market Carano hard. They put a few women's fights on some of the free shows. They put Carano on some PPVs in relatively gimme wins. If the response from the fans is decent, they hold a female TUF and populate the division with some fighters who come in with name power, if not skills. Hell, use the WEC for some of the fights. The only real cost involved would be signing and marketing Carano, as I doubt most of the female fighters would be on major contracts. If it bombs really badly with UFC fans, they get Carano through her few fights and then bury the whole deal. So while its legitimate to say that women's MMA does not currently offer enough for the UFC to make it a major feature, the fact that they are not doing anything to help it says, to me at least, that they aren't interested in seeing it grow.

[ACCBiggz]

[QUOTE=Bigpapa42;515219]It is a legitimate point. The women's side of MMA does need to grow considerably. At the same time, an easy counterpoint to that is that the UFC could easily help women's MMA to grow if they chose to. The UFC could be a major catalyst to developing that side of the sport as a whole. Consider if you combined the star power of Carano with the marketing power of the UFC. She could be one of the most recognized fighters on the planet in a very short time. That would very likely draw more talent in, which would significantly boost the talent level within a short time. [B]Consider the possibility... The UFC signs Carano and about 8-10 other decent women fighters.[/B] They market Carano hard. They put a few women's fights on some of the free shows. They put Carano on some PPVs in relatively gimme wins. If the response from the fans is decent, they hold a female TUF and populate the division with some fighters who come in with name power, if not skills. Hell, use the WEC for some of the fights. The only real cost involved would be signing and marketing Carano, as I doubt most of the female fighters would be on major contracts. If it bombs really badly with UFC fans, they get Carano through her few fights and then bury the whole deal. So while its legitimate to say that women's MMA does not currently offer enough for the UFC to make it a major feature, the fact that they are not doing anything to help it says, to me at least, that they aren't interested in seeing it grow.[/QUOTE] That's the problem as stated by Dana and myself... there aren't that many fighters in her weight class to begin a division. It's going to take [B]YEARS[/B] for a competitive women's division to form, and then maybe the UFC will revisit the idea, but not until such a time comes.