Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 *Contains Spoiler Info* For results go to second post Ok on the product type vis a vis wrestler type debate I am going to run an experiment to but this one to bed. I have made 33 wrestlers 3 of each active type all with the same skills, potential,age, size (middleweight), personality and popularity. They all start unemployed so momentum will not be a factor. I have set all areas and countries the same as far as product preference, importance, afluance and wresyling community. Young Lion and loyalty is off everywhere and economy is high and rising everywhere. I then start up a new fed using the grand avatar which I set to National popularity. (same percentage each time of course). I will then hire aformentioned 33 wrestlers and autopush. (product will start with all at none and zero) if any wrestler shows a non linked push e.g. not a wrestler of same type one above or below I will reload the game. If this doesnt happen I will set the product to have one as key feature with the rest at none and autopush again. I will then score the various pushes with zero for midcard, 1 for uppermid, 2 for main, -1 for lower mid, -2 for opener and -3 for enhancement talent. I put midcard as the zero point as with autpush more wrestlers are pushed higher automaticly then are pushed lower and most are pushed as midcarder. I will then repeat this proces for each product type totting up the scores per wrestler type. I will then check if changing the heel divide, t and a levels, match percentage, match intensity/danger (within recomended data check) has any effect. -> doesn´t This proces I will do in 3 seperate saved games. (Home location always the same = South West as there are no competitors there.) Then I will tot up the scores and devide them by 3 .This will then give a score per wrestler type per product ranging from theoretical -9 to plus 6. With anything below -1 being a negative effect and anything above 1 being a positive one. I will then rank these acordingly per product type. Once these figures are known to me I will be checking if settings below medium have an effect on the autopush. -> doesn´t If anyone has suggestions on how to make this an even more valid experiment please let me know.
Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Author Posted December 29, 2008 <p>Ok the results where markedly conistent even the inconsitencies. (wrestlers pushes being seperate by more then 1, where consistent. Where this happend I made the data consistent by making the least amount of impact to the overall rankings.) I will now show the scores per product type from top to bottem. Making categories for very good 4 and above, good 2 and 3, medium good 1 to plus 0, zero itself and medium bad below zero to -1, bad -2 to -3, and very bad -4 and below.</p><p> </p><p> I have split them up but remember +1 to -1 doesnt mean they are particulary good or bad for the product type as it can simply be the AI aranging the numbers per push.</p><p> </p><p> Traditional: Luchador(6), Brawler(4), Psychopath(4)|| Regular(3), Technician (3) || Purosu(1)|| Entertainer(0),MMA(0)||----||----|| Super Junior(-4), Spot Monkey(-4), Cruiserweight(-6)</p><p> </p><p> Mainstream: Brawler(6), Cruiserweight(6), Regular(4)|| Entertainer(3) || Techician (1), MMA (1)||----|| Psychopatch (-1), Super Junior(-1) || Purosu(-3), Spot Monkey(-3)|| Luchador(-6)</p><p> </p><p> Comedy: Entertainer(6), Technician(6)|| MMA(3), Super Junior(2)|| Brawler(1), Psychopath(1)|| Regular(0), Purosu(0)||----|| Cruiserweight(-2) || Spot Monkey (-4), Luchador (-6)</p><p> </p><p> Cult: Entertainer(6), Regular(6),Purosu(4)|| Spot Monkey(3), Luchador(2)||----||Cruserweight(0), Super Junior(0), Technician (0) ||----|| MMA(-3)|| Brawler (-4), Psychopath(-7)</p><p> </p><p> Risque: Brawler(6), Entertainer(5), Regular(5)|| Technician(3), MMA(2)||----|| Purosu(0)|| Psycho(-1), Super Junior(-1), Cruiserweight(-1)||----|| Spot Monkey(-4), Luchador(-7)</p><p> </p><p> Modern: Super Junior(6),Technician(5), Cruiserweight(4)|| Purosu(3), Regular(3)||----|| Bralwer(0), MMA(0)|| Psychopath(-1)|| Spot Monkey(-2)|| Entertainer(-4), Luchador(-7)</p><p> </p><p> Realism: MMA(6), Regular(5), Technician (4)|| Brawler(3), Purosu(2)|| Psychopath(1)|| Entertainer(0)|| Super Junior(-1)|| Cruiserweight(-3), Spot Monkey(-3)|| Luchador(-7)</p><p> </p><p> Hyper Realism: MMA(6), Purosu(6),Technicia(4)|| Brawler(3)|| Super Junior(1)|| Psychopath(0), Entertainer(0), Regular(0)||----|| Cruiserweight(-2) || Spot Monkey(-4), Luchador (-7)</p><p> </p><p> Hardcore: MMA(6),Spot Monkey(6), Psychopath(4)|| Brawler(3)|| Technician(1)|| Super Junior(0), Entertainer(0)|| Cruiserweight (-1), Regular(-1)||----|| Purosu(-4), Luchador(-7)</p><p> </p><p> Lucha Libre: Cruiserweight(6), Luchador(5), Super Junior(4), Entertainer(4)||----|| MMA(1)|| Brawler(0), Psychopath(0), Technician(0)||----|| Regular(-2)|| Purosu(-4), Spot Monkey(-7)</p><p> </p><p> Pure: Technician(6), Super Junior(5), Purosu(4), Regular(4)|| Psychopaths(2)||----|| Brawler(0), MMA(0)|| Entertainer(-1) || Cruiserweight(-2)|| Luchador(-5), Spot Monkey(-6)</p><p> </p><p> Daredevil: Cruiserweight(6), Luchador(6), Spot Monkey(4)|| Super Junior(3)|| Brawler(1), Psychopath(1)|| MMA(0)|| Technicians(-1)|| Regular(-2)|| Entertainer(-4), Purosu(-7)</p>
supershot Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 So to some this all up, the better the score, the better each wrestling type is with each product?
Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Author Posted December 29, 2008 Finished for now. I will probably be checking for the influences of below medium product settings and for the preferences of the default settings of the c-verse companies at a later date.
Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Author Posted December 29, 2008 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="supershot" data-cite="supershot" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="20892" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So to some this all up, the better the score, the better each wrestling type is with each product?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> in very short yeah</p>
Ockbald Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 <p>Wait Luchadores suck for Comedy based federations? The hell? I know a bunch of real life federations that are pretty much a different kind of lucha with many comedy spots, WLW in the cornellverse is even BASED on one of them!</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> Damn I have to rethink all my strategy now. Thank you for this insight, Hyde Hill.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> (First post here)</p>
Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Author Posted December 29, 2008 Well WLW is a mix of multiples like said ill prolly run tests with the default products of the different feds in the future. So far can say Highest ranked has way the most influence so if lucha is higher then comedy then luchadors will prolly do fine. Xcept if the rest of the medium and above products are anti lucha too maybe.
Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Author Posted December 29, 2008 just tested wlw. Luchas are fine there 2 points the ones that stuggle are brawlers, psychos and mma. Once done all feds ill post em.
infinitywpi Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 This is, of course, assuming that a Brawler with, say, all skills at C is considered the equal of a lucha with all skills at C and a spot monket with all skills at C. But it does give a good baseline, so that's useful.
Remianen Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 <p>Hmm, that looks really odd. Considering the 'Entertainer' style is tailor made for Mainstream, you'd think they'd get preferential treatment in that product.</p><p> </p><p> Nice rule of thumb analysis though. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>
FINisher Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 Nice job! <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Lucha, Pure, Modern, Realism, Hyper-realism and Daredevil are spot on but MMA worker in Hardcore product seizes to amaze me 'cause usually the owner blocks MMA workers <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" />
Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Author Posted December 29, 2008 Yeah the owner blocks are kinda wierd specially as they like to block psycho,MMA,flyer types even if they work for said product. I will be doing the different default products per company later today but remember this will be with the different area preferences set as equel (assuming they have an influence). Thanks for the positive feedback so far btw.
Tempest Kane Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 This is by far the most useful thread posted in a long time. Good work. I look forward to seeing the promotion break downs.
infinitywpi Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 What woudl be really interesting... and time-consuming... would be to make workers that have every possible combination of skill levels (To keep it simple, just F/E/D/C/B/A) and styles... which means, what... a few thousand workers per style?... and then do the same experiment so we can see who gets pushed more, the Entertainer with C Charisma or the Psychopath with A Hardcore...
Hyde Hill Posted December 29, 2008 Author Posted December 29, 2008 <p>Hehe if you want to do that go ahead infity, plus remember you need multiples of each skill level of the same type to make the test work. This is just a pure test of autopush of wrestler types vs product type. </p><p> </p><p> Now on to the set promotions. I have found out that as far as the autopush goes with all other settings equel the only setting that matters is the one at key. I assume that those set lower will have an impact but not on the autopush.(apart from the obvious changes you see in the analysis screen). I have found 6 promotions that have multiple set at key so I will be testing those shortly and posting the results.</p>
Thomnipotent Posted December 29, 2008 Posted December 29, 2008 You know, it's times like this that I wish the GDS boards had some sort of kudos point system where you can award posters for particularly useful/awesome posts. Hyde, this is bloody wonderful. Thank you for your work.
supershot Posted December 30, 2008 Posted December 30, 2008 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Thomnipotent" data-cite="Thomnipotent" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="20892" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>You know, it's times like this that I wish the GDS boards had some sort of kudos point system where you can award posters for particularly useful/awesome posts. Hyde, this is bloody wonderful. Thank you for your work.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I agree. This would be very worthy of points/award. </p><p> </p><p> Keep it up!</p>
Hyde Hill Posted December 30, 2008 Author Posted December 30, 2008 <p>Ok as posted before with all the rest being equel the key product setting determines the ranking in the autopush. This doesnt mean that changing stuff to medium or heavy (or even low/verylow) doesnt have an effect on the compatibility of a wrestler to that type of organisation. For instance I have seen cruiserweights go up on autopush with TCW after increasing modern to medium. But in these cases things are not equel and for a precise study on this matter e.g skill differences vs push differences vs product type somebody or me at a later date (when I have lots of time so best think up of a way to get me imprisoned or something lol) has to run infinitywipy's suggestion.</p><p> </p><p> Now for those promotions with multiple key features here are the results.</p><p> </p><p> AAA(Traditional + Mainstream): Regular(6), Entertainer(5), Brawler(5)|| Psychopaths(2), Technicians(2)|| Cruiserweights(1) || Luchador(0), Purosu(0)||----||----|| MMA(-4), Spot Monkey(-4), Super Junior(-6)</p><p> </p><p> 5SSW(Traditional+Modern): Purosu(6), Technician(6), Regular(4)|| Brawler(2), Psychopaths(2)|| Super Junior(1)||----|| Entertainer(-1), Cruiserweight(-1),Luchador(-1)||----|| Spot Monkey(-5)</p><p> </p><p> GCG(Traditional+Realism): Technician(5), Brawler(5), Psychopath(5), Regular(4)|| Purosu(2)||----|| MMA(0), Luchador(0)||----||----|| Super Junior(-4), Spot Monkey(-4), Cruiserweight(-6)</p><p> </p><p> OLLIE(Traditional+Lucha Libre): Luchador(6), Entertainer(6), Technician(4)|| Super Junior(2)|| Brawler(1), Psychopath(1), Regular(1)||----|| Purosu(-1)|| Cruiserweight(-2)|| Spot Monkey(-5), MMA(-6)</p><p> </p><p> MPWF(Traditional+Lucha+Entertainment): Entertainment(6), Cruiserweight(5), Luchador(4)|| Brawler(3), Regular(3)||----|| Technician(0)|| Purosu(-1), Psychopath(-1), Super Junior(-1)|| Spot Monkey(-5), MMA(-6)</p><p> </p><p> ROF(Realism+Pure): Regular(6), Techician(5), Purosu(5)|| MMA(2)|| Brawler(1), Psychopath(1), Super Junior(1)||----|| Cruiserweight(-1)|| Entertainer(-2)|| Spot Monkey(-4), Luchador(-7)</p>
Hyde Hill Posted December 30, 2008 Author Posted December 30, 2008 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="20892" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>You know, it's times like this that I wish the GDS boards had some sort of kudos point system where you can award posters for particularly useful/awesome posts. Hyde, this is bloody wonderful. Thank you for your work.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="supershot" data-cite="supershot" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="20892" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I agree. This would be very worthy of points/award. <p> </p><p> Keep it up!</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> <img alt=":o" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/redface.png.900245280682ef18c5d82399a93c5827.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" />:o:o Aww shucks thanks guys.</p><p> </p><p> If someone could PM me on how to host the data/save game I am using for this, that would be grand as then other people can use the data to make up combinations. And if anybody is nuts enough make workers of different skill levels per type as well. But for now I am glad as to have been able to give a baseline.</p>
The Masked Orange Posted January 29, 2009 Posted January 29, 2009 bump/:p on basis this is an insanely cool thread:D, with no MAW:(
Hyde Hill Posted January 29, 2009 Author Posted January 29, 2009 bump/:p on basis this is an insanely cool thread:D, with no MAW:( Thanks again and MAW only has traditional at Key so thats the one ya want.
JTandSilentBob Posted January 30, 2009 Posted January 30, 2009 Ok as posted before with all the rest being equel the key product setting determines the ranking in the autopush. This doesnt mean that changing stuff to medium or heavy (or even low/verylow) doesnt have an effect on the compatibility of a wrestler to that type of organisation. For instance I have seen cruiserweights go up on autopush with TCW after increasing modern to medium. But in these cases things are not equel and for a precise study on this matter e.g skill differences vs push differences vs product type somebody or me at a later date (when I have lots of time so best think up of a way to get me imprisoned or something lol) has to run infinitywipy's suggestion. Now for those promotions with multiple key features here are the results. AAA(Traditional + Mainstream): Regular(6), Entertainer(5), Brawler(5)|| Psychopaths(2), Technicians(2)|| Cruiserweights(1) || Luchador(0), Purosu(0)||----||----|| MMA(-4), Spot Monkey(-4), Super Junior(-6) 5SSW(Traditional+Modern): Purosu(6), Technician(6), Regular(4)|| Brawler(2), Psychopaths(2)|| Super Junior(1)||----|| Entertainer(-1), Cruiserweight(-1),Luchador(-1)||----|| Spot Monkey(-5) GCG(Traditional+Realism): Technician(5), Brawler(5), Psychopath(5), Regular(4)|| Purosu(2)||----|| MMA(0), Luchador(0)||----||----|| Super Junior(-4), Spot Monkey(-4), Cruiserweight(-6) OLLIE(Traditional+Lucha Libre): Luchador(6), Entertainer(6), Technician(4)|| Super Junior(2)|| Brawler(1), Psychopath(1), Regular(1)||----|| Purosu(-1)|| Cruiserweight(-2)|| Spot Monkey(-5), MMA(-6) MPWF(Traditional+Lucha+Entertainment): Entertainment(6), Cruiserweight(5), Luchador(4)|| Brawler(3), Regular(3)||----|| Technician(0)|| Purosu(-1), Psychopath(-1), Super Junior(-1)|| Spot Monkey(-5), MMA(-6) ROF(Realism+Pure): Regular(6), Techician(5), Purosu(5)|| MMA(2)|| Brawler(1), Psychopath(1), Super Junior(1)||----|| Cruiserweight(-1)|| Entertainer(-2)|| Spot Monkey(-4), Luchador(-7) Spot Monkeys seem to be getting the short end of the stick.... wassup wit dat?
Hyde Hill Posted January 30, 2009 Author Posted January 30, 2009 Well traditional feds dont like em if ya check the first post and all these except rof have traditional. They do tend to get shorthanded a lot in general tough luckily there arent many around.
Nedew Posted May 2, 2009 Posted May 2, 2009 Using ampulator's method of turning this into calculating an entire product's style biases (Key x3, Heavy x2, Medium x1), I worked out 4C's. I'll throw in his SWF as well. 4C: Modern - Key Feature (x3) Daredevil - Heavy (x2) Cult - Heavy (x2) Mainstream - Medium (x1) Comedy - Medium (x1) Hardcore - Medium (x1) Cruiserweight: 4 6 0 6 -2 -1 = 27 Super Junior: 6 3 0 -1 2 0 = 25 Technician: 5 -1 0 1 6 1 = 21 Regular: 3 x3 -2 x2 6 x2 4 x1 0 x1 -1 x1 = 20 Spot Monkey: -2 4 3 -3 -4 6 = 7 MMA: 0 0 -3 1 3 6 = 4 Brawler: 0 1 -4 6 1 3 = 4 Entertainer: -4 -4 6 3 6 0 = 1 Puroresu: 3 -7 4 -3 0 -4 = -4 Psychopath: -1 1 -7 -1 1 4 = -11 Luchador: -7 6 2 -6 -6 -7 = -24 SWF Mainstream: Key Feature Traditional: Heavy Comedy: Heavy Cut: Heavy Risque: Heavy Mainstream: Entertainer(3) Traditional: Entertainer(0) Comedy: Entertainer(6) Cult: Entertainer(6) Risque: Entertainer(5) 3x3 + 2x0 + 2x6 + 2x6 + 2x5 = 43 Mainstream: Regular(4) Traditional: Regular(3) Comedy: Regular(0) Cult: Regular(6) Risque: Regular(5) 3x4 + 2x3 + 2x0 + 2x6 + 2x5 = 40 Mainstream: Brawler(6) Traditional: Brawler(4) Comedy: Brawler(1) Cult: Brawler (-4) Risque: Brawler(6) 3x6 + 2x4 + 2x1 + 2x-4 + 2x6 = 32 Mainstream: Techician (1) Traditional: Technician (3) Comedy: Technician(6) Cult: Technician (0) Risque: Technician(3) 3x1 + 2x2 + 2x6 + 2x0 + 2x3 = 25 Mainstream: MMA (1) Traditional: MMA(0) Comedy: MMA(3) Cult: MMA(-3) Risque: MMA(2) 3x1 + 2x0 + 2x3+ 2x-3 + 2x2 = 7 Mainstream: Puroresu(-3) Traditional: Puroresu(1) Comedy: Puroresu(0) Cult: Puroresu(4) Risque: Puroresu(0) 3x-3 + 2x1 + 2x0 + 2x4 + 2x0 = 1 Mainstream: Cruiserweight(6) Traditional: Cruiserweight(-6) Comedy: Cruiserweight(-2) Cult: Cruserweight(0) Risque: Cruiserweight(-1) 3x6 + 2x-6 + 2x-2 + 2x0 + 2x-1 = 0 Mainstream: Psychopatch (-1) Traditional: Psychopath(4) Comedy: Psychopath(1) Cult: Psychopath(-7) Risque: Psycho(-1) 3x-1 + 2x4 + 2x1 + 2x-7 + 2x-1 = -9 Mainstream: Super Junior(-1) Traditional: Super Junior(-4) Comedy: Super Junior(2) Cult: Super Junior(0) Risque: Super Junior(-1) 3x-1 + 2x-4 + 2x2 + 2x0 + 2x-1 = -9 Mainstream: Spot Monkey(-3) Traditional: Spot Monkey(-4) Comedy: Spot Monkey (-4 Cult: Spot Monkey(3) Risque: Spot Monkey(-4) 3x-3 + 2x-4 + 2x-4 + 2x3 + 2x-4 = -27 Mainstream: Luchador(-6) Traditional: Luchador(6) Comedy: Luchador (-6) Cult: Luchador(2) Risque: Luchador(-7) 3x-6 + 2x 6 + 2x-6 + 2x2 + 2x-7 = -28
hrdcoresidebrns Posted May 2, 2009 Posted May 2, 2009 I have some odd autopushes in my latest game that I can't figure out. Importing the WIW data from the CVerse1975 mod, I signed Bulldozer Brandon Smith, who was immediately pushed to the main event when I assigned autopush. Now considering that he has F+ overness in Hawaii and that the bulk of the roster has higher popularity there, I can only assume it's because his style is 'Puroresu'. However, the product of WIW has Traditional at 'Key' and Daredevil at 'Medium', with everything else set at 'Low' or worse. Puro wrestlers are rated '1' in Traditional and '-7' (!!!) in Daredevil. Why would the game autopush a puro wrestler so high in that product then?
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