A pro football sim from GDS

[Maximus]

*[B]First off[/B]*, I hope that everyone will respect whatever answer we get from Arlie on the question I am asking in this thread. I dont want to stir up any negative comments as I just want an answer for referneces purposes only. If I feel that a flame will erupt because of this question and its answer to it, I will ask for it to be deleted. Arlie, I understand that you are under a "no compete" clause. However, [I][U]assuming[/U[/I]] that you are going to release a pro football sim, can you confirm if your next *pro* football sim will be able to import leagues/careers from TPF. Believe it or not I have yet to play TPF for about 5 months because I wasn't sure if I really wanted to get serious in my career because I wanted to be sure we were able to import leagues into the next/new pro football sim. Any feedback on this issue would be great. Thanks.

[Maximus]

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[Guest IrishHand]

I consider game-to-game compatibility to be highly overrated - generally it forces a programmer to retain a flawed system, and keeps him from dramatically improving the depth and accuracy of the players. I can tell you right now that a big part of the reason that TPB2005 is a big step forward from the original was the large-scale overhaul of the ratings system.

[Maximus]

Overrated to you. Considered overlooked by many. This is crucial to alot more people than you think...and it can be done without holding the games progression back. EDIT: spelling

[Maximus]

^^^^

[markprior22]

[QUOTE=IrishHand]I consider game-to-game compatibility to be highly overrated - generally it forces a programmer to retain a flawed system, and keeps him from dramatically improving the depth and accuracy of the players. I can tell you right now that a big part of the reason that TPB2005 is a big step forward from the original was the large-scale overhaul of the ratings system.[/QUOTE] I have to agree with this statement. A lot of people like to continue careers but if it comes down to maintaining compatibility vs much improved but incompatible code...give me the improved code any day.

[Maximus]

Hey markprior22. :) Well, if importing is immpossible...at least allow for the stats/ratings of players & teams to be edited in the next pro football sim (assuming there will be one). So that we can at least manually create an unlimited amout of players in the new game. Basically re-creating the players from TPF so that the league can continue with TPF players. Make any sense. :D

[Maximus]

Well, since Arlie has not responded to my PM or this thread, I am assuming that the answer is no. If this is the case at least make it possible to edit stats, salaries and player history so that we can edit the incoming leagues from TPF. It may take longer but I would be willing to do it. [I][B]**Again, this is only assuming the there will be a new pro football sim in the furure**[/B][/I]

[Arlie Rahn]

I would state that it depends on a few things: 1. Whether or not I am allowed to use the save gave structure for imports from .400 with TPF (something I think could be worked out if it was the gating item). 2. If I choose to keep a similar system. The thinking is that I have a chance to "redo" many things I didn't like with TPF in a new game and I don't want to be limited to keeping version compatibility if there are ways that can make this new game even better. To be fair, I would assume that there will not be version compatibility between games and then, if it does happen, it's a pleasant surprise and not something that was expected. There are simply to many variables at this point for me to make that type of commitment.

[Maximus]

Arlie, if the case is that we wont be able to import leagues,players teams, league history....how about allowing for your next pro football sim to be able to have the ability to edit such things such as stats/ratings/general information like age, DOB, draft (college year and round drated) . That would be great. EDITED to add the following; My idea is that if we can not import leagues then at least we can manually create/imort via by creating each individual player/team/league history. This would take a long time to do because it would have to be done manually [U][B]BUT[/B][/U] it can be done and therefore save leagues (offline or solo) from having to start over.

[Maximus]

Arlie, another idea is to have the stats (from TPF) from leagues, teams & players saved in a database (access). From there we could create an outside utility that can be imported into that database. I would hate to lose all of the stats my league has compiled over is leagues history. I understand that a new engine may not allow for this to happen but if the leagues stats, player & team history, and league records csan be saved via an access database, then an outside utility could be made. **I know it was basically a rewrtie of my post above but I left out a few thing I wanted to say**. So is this idea possible? Where stats froom TPF can be saved via a database (such as access) and to be used to combine the outgoing stats from the new pro-football sim? Is this even logoical?

[Arlie Rahn]

I will try and work in some format of allowing a stat import to ratings, but I don't know the specifics at this point.

[Maximus]

[QUOTE=Arlie Rahn]I will try and work in some format of allowing a stat import to ratings, but I don't know the specifics at this point.[/QUOTE] I think if we could just export player stats, careers, a players & teams history, league and team records, it can be done. This could be exported (from TPF) into csv format, saved in a database and then reopened when/if a new pro football sim is released by GDS (which I hope to God there will be :) ). [U][B][U]While importing of an actual league may be not be done, maybe we can edit the following [I]within[/I] the game itself or in a utility:[/U][/B][/U] [B]all ratings Player names DOB (date of birth) College attended Salary The team the player plays on Awards acquired (milestones/mvp,ect) Player position Stats (this way we can edit stats in the new pro football sim from other games we played...i.e TPF). Free Agents Draft pool team location stadium specs, ect[/B] Nor sure if the data can be pulled from .txt, csv, html, or database files but its worth the try. Anyone, please feel free to add more comments of things that can be added by a 3rd party utitliy so that leagues from TPF wont be lost. Thanks for all of the support. [B]***NOTE***[/B] I understand that we as the gamer do not want to hold back the progression of any sim just because we want to import leagues, HOWEVER, we still may be able save our leagues from TPF via a utility and then export the new league stats, history, ect made from GDS and then combine the two. This way, for those of use who like to keep track of a league and its history will be able to do so. [I][B]**I would be MORE than happy to assist when and if that time comes**[/B][/I]

[moring]

If there isn't some type of import option, be it a direct rating/stat import, or a stat with that stats creating new ratings than I will not be purchasing it. We are now in season 3 of NFLsim and we will be on 5 or 6 at the earliest that a new pro sim would be available from GDS (under the assumption that one has been in the works for awhile). Hope that doesn't sound harsh, it isn't meant to as I fully support Arlie, but at the same time if the time isn't taken this time to allow importing of stats/etc, than more than likely it won't be a priority 1-2 years after a new sim is released and we will be back at square one again. Kevin nflsim.net mlbsim.net

[Maximus]

Let me chime in one more time here. :) If there is some sort of issue where leagues cannot be imported, [B]at the [B]LEAST[/B][/B] allow for all ratings Player names DOB (date of birth) College attended Salary The team the player plays on Awards acquired (milestones/mvp,ect) Player position Stats (this way we can edit stats in the new pro football sim from other games we played...i.e TPF). Free Agents Draft pool team location stadium specs, ect ...to be editied. This way, while still a lot of work...the league can continue. Just some thoughts and I think Arlie understand why its needed.

[Guest SPeeDy]

Establishing careers and being able to import them into a new version is germane to a new game release. An example of this would be OOTP6. You can import OOTP5 seasons, but nothing prior to that. Where this gets murky is that we are not really discussing the same game anymore. As a result I would not expect any "new" game to have prior season import capabiliy since it may violate any non-compete clauses.

[Maximus]

[QUOTE=SPeeDy]Establishing careers and being able to import them into a new version is germane to a new game release. An example of this would be OOTP6. You can import OOTP5 seasons, but nothing prior to that. Where this gets murky is that we are not really discussing the same game anymore. As a result I would not expect any "new" game to have prior season import capabiliy since it may violate any non-compete clauses.[/QUOTE] While we may not be able to import TPF into any new game because of any deal that was reached between .400 & GDS, we still have have the right to create a utility that would do that. .400ss cannot legally do anything about that.

[Guest SPeeDy]

That is true.

[Maximus]

Just to chime in again... :) ... all we would is a database to store the stats from TPF and then import stats from the new pro football sim into the same database. However, a better way (a longer way as well) would be to edit all of the following (for every player and team); all ratings Player names DOB (date of birth) College attended Salary The team the player plays on Awards acquired (milestones/mvp,ect) Player position Stats (this way we can edit stats in the new pro football sim from other games we played...i.e TPF). Free Agents Draft pool team location stadium specs, ect

[Maximus]

Arlie, another idea that would be cool is having a "prospect tracker". This way one can track prospects from the team screen. (OOTP style). You can track players that you may have on your list for drafting purposes, free agency & trades. (Opps, I should have put this in the game suggestion forum).

[BDCoach]

Importing from TPF I would agree with Kevin Morning's comments. After having supported TPF through all its problems, and the parties involved with their legal problems, if we cannot import ( some way, some how ) the leagues we've spent time establishing then I would not buy the new game either. Just wouldn't make good business sense to financially support a company that didn't take care of its consumers. Bruce PSFL Commish [url]http://psflsim.com[/url]

[Maximus]

I feel very confident that Arlie will somehow arrange for a way for leagues to continue. We may not be able to directly import leagues due to the new sim engine (which is understandabe) However, I have (PM'd him) taked with Arlie and he has told me that what I speak of here is possible (see below); [I]However, another way (a longer way as well) would be to edit all of the following (for every player and team); all ratings Player names DOB (date of birth) College attended Salary The team the player plays on Awards acquired (milestones/mvp,ect) Player position The players & teams stats (this way we can edit stats in the new pro football sim from other games we played...i.e TPF, Madden, FBpro). Free Agents Draft pool team location stadiums & it's specs, ect[/I] He said to be that this "could" be possible and that something he "should" look into once the time comes. Now, this is a PM that he and I sent back to one another. As you can tell, this was a concern to me as well. As I think we will all admit, Arlie has gone out of his way in order to produce one of the finest first releases of any pro football sim to date. I am [B]NOT[/B] saying its the best or the finest tuned among other great pro football sims but in its first incarnation its been agreed by many that for a first release.....it was better than any pro football sim on the PC. Again basing it on first releases. So, my final comment in the post (not the entire thread) will be, "Lets not underestimate Arlie and his willingness to provide a true to life, consistant world of pro football gaming." :)

[Bob Hanson]

Looks like EA is going to enter the sim market. [url]http://sports.ign.com/articles/572/572886p1.html[/url] [QUOTE]Meaning no ESPN NFL 2K6, no more NFL GameDay, and bye-bye NFL Blitz. All football fans will be left with are Madden, NFL Street, and a new unannounced football management game that is in the works from, you guessed it, EA Sports. "All of our data shows that there is a huge market for manager-style games," said Jeff Brown, Director of Corporate Communications for Electronic Arts, "and you could see a new type of football game from EA."[/QUOTE]