Jim Cornette Books The Invasion

[shamelessposer]

(Keep in mind before you click that there's some foul language toward the end of this trailer.)

 

 

I've always wondered how you'd ever manage to get lifelong WWF fans to cheer for invading WCW wrestlers. In this trailer, Jim Cornette does a great job of selling it. I'm now seriously considering a purchase of the two-disc set to find out what else he has to say.

[haloed]

That is really cool. I may have to order one myself. He's off to a great start with his ideas. Hearing all the way through would be great.

[MrCanada]

The only problem I have have with "re-booking" or this fantasy booking is a lot of the time bookers do not at all take into account what really happened.

 

The stars the WWF got at the time for WCW (aka not many) is mainly because it would've cost millions of dollars to bring in the nWo/Goldberg/ext at that time. And with them it obviously would've played out better. And a lot of those guys just sat out collecting cheques from Turner because they had guarantees. They only came to WWE once their original WCW contracts expired.

 

The only proper way to "rebook it" is use the guys WWE could get...

 

Booker T

Diamond Dallas Page

Buff Bagwell

Lance Storm

Mike Awesome

Gregory (Shane) Helms

Billy Kidman

Chavo Guerrero Jr.

Sean O'Haire

Chuck Palumbo

Mark Jindrak

Hugh Morrus

Evan Karagias

Jamie Noble

Johnny Stamboli

Kanyon

Kaz Hayashi

Lash LeRoux

Mike Sanders

Elix Skipper

Reno

Shawn Stasiask

Jimmy Yang

Stacy Keibler

Torrie Wilson

 

 

of course adding ECW was a brilliant idea and the "Alliance" wasnt that bad of an idea despite how it was handled because it gave you the Dudleys, RVD, & Rhyno who were all on the uppercard.

[haloed]

The only problem I have have with "re-booking" or this fantasy booking is a lot of the time bookers do not at all take into account what really happened.

 

The stars the WWF got at the time for WCW (aka not many) is mainly because it would've cost millions of dollars to bring in the nWo/Goldberg/ext at that time. And with them it obviously would've played out better. And a lot of those guys just sat out collecting cheques from Turner because they had guarantees. They only came to WWE once their original WCW contracts expired.

 

The only proper way to "rebook it" is use the guys WWE could get...

 

Booker T

Diamond Dallas Page

Buff Bagwell

Lance Storm

Mike Awesome

Gregory (Shane) Helms

Billy Kidman

Chavo Guerrero Jr.

Sean O'Haire

Chuck Palumbo

Mark Jindrak

Hugh Morrus

Evan Karagias

Jamie Noble

Johnny Stamboli

Kanyon

Kaz Hayashi

Lash LeRoux

Mike Sanders

Elix Skipper

Reno

Shawn Stasiask

Jimmy Yang

Stacy Keibler

Torrie Wilson

 

 

of course adding ECW was a brilliant idea and the "Alliance" wasnt that bad of an idea despite how it was handled because it gave you the Dudleys, RVD, & Rhyno who were all on the uppercard.

 

 

Thing is that it would of been worth trying to get Sting, Flair, Goldberg, etc. because the WWF vs WCW at the time would of been huge and the money WWF could of made would of been a lot of cash if the angle would of been booked properly that is. It would of trumped the n.W.o. in every way if done right.

[MrCanada]

Thing is that it would of been worth trying to get Sting, Flair, Goldberg, etc. because the WWF vs WCW at the time would of been huge and the money WWF could of made would of been a lot of cash if the angle would of been booked properly that is. It would of trumped the n.W.o. in every way if done right.

 

But that would mean you would have to pay some people (Goldberg had 3-4 years left, so at least 4-5 million dollars) just to have the right to negotiate with them at which point you would have to pay them a signing bonus on top of the downside of a deal. So is Goldberg really worth 5 million bucks just to sign him? If you go back and read reports from back then that was the major hold up. All the guys who did sign with WWF wanted to go there. They accepted buyouts from Turner that were really low or next to nothing. All the other guys showed up in WWF shortly after their Turner contracts were up.

 

A guarantee is a guarantee. The only way out of a guaranteed contract is to declare bankruptcy, something AOL/Time Warner didnt want to do obviously, and legally couldnt.

[haloed]

But that would mean you would have to pay some people (Goldberg had 3-4 years left, so at least 4-5 million dollars) just to have the right to negotiate with them at which point you would have to pay them a signing bonus on top of the downside of a deal. So is Goldberg really worth 5 million bucks just to sign him? If you go back and read reports from back then that was the major hold up. All the guys who did sign with WWF wanted to go there. They accepted buyouts from Turner that were really low or next to nothing. All the other guys showed up in WWF shortly after their Turner contracts were up.

 

A guarantee is a guarantee. The only way out of a guaranteed contract is to declare bankruptcy, something AOL/Time Warner didnt want to do obviously, and legally couldnt.

 

True enough, but the merchandise that would of been moved, PPVs that would of been bought, tickets to shows that would of been bought would of went up by a lot. Not to mention WCW fans would of come over to see what was going to happen, you would have both WWF and WCW fans at shows cheering for their favorite promotion, buying shirts and posters (you name it) of their favorites. I just think with the Invasion being booked properly the payoff would of eventually trumped all the money WWF would have had to use to bring guys like Goldberg, Sting, Flair over right away. The old saying is "You gotta spend money to make money." Like I say that's just my opinion, but I believe wrestling would of seen a huge boom period, bigger than the Monday night wars with WCW/nWo and WWF Attitude.

 

If WWE would of done it right all those wrestling fans that gave Nitro and Raw those big ratings may never have quit watching wrestling and WWE could be potenially making even more money today than they already do.

[The Celt]

(Keep in mind before you click that there's some foul language toward the end of this trailer.)

 

 

I've always wondered how you'd ever manage to get lifelong WWF fans to cheer for invading WCW wrestlers. In this trailer, Jim Cornette does a great job of selling it. I'm now seriously considering a purchase of the two-disc set to find out what else he has to say.

 

Honestly I've heard Jim's ideas for this aren't so great. One of his major ideas is to headline with Terry Funk Vs The Undertaker, a match that today might sound good on paper at a stretch, but back in 2001 the mainstream WCW and WWF didn't really buy into Chainsaw Charlie/Terry Funk like the ECW crowd did.

[haloed]

Just to add to my thought...

 

A successful Invasion angle could of lead to two far more recognizable 'brands' with one being WWE and the other WCW, instead of Raw and Smackdown that would occasionally end up doing war with one another on PPV or whatever.

 

 

To TheCelt,

 

Funk was pretty over among WCW fans and older fans so it may have worked, but not every feud withing the larger picture is going to be golden.

[Stennick]

But that would mean you would have to pay some people (Goldberg had 3-4 years left, so at least 4-5 million dollars) just to have the right to negotiate with them at which point you would have to pay them a signing bonus on top of the downside of a deal. So is Goldberg really worth 5 million bucks just to sign him? If you go back and read reports from back then that was the major hold up. All the guys who did sign with WWF wanted to go there. They accepted buyouts from Turner that were really low or next to nothing. All the other guys showed up in WWF shortly after their Turner contracts were up.

 

A guarantee is a guarantee. The only way out of a guaranteed contract is to declare bankruptcy, something AOL/Time Warner didnt want to do obviously, and legally couldnt.

 

The problem with this is within the first year that the WCW was bought Flair, Hogan, The Outsiders, Goldberg, Scott Steiner were ALL brought in. So either A. he paid for their contracts anyway or B. Their contracts all expired within a year anyway so it wouldn't have been THAT much.

[Hyde Hill]

I have seen it and possible spoiler:

 

He doesn't buy out those guys and his other main program is Mankind vs Austin, sorry but Funk vs Taker and Foley vs Austin in 2001 is not headline imho.

 

It's a pretty entertaining video mainly because it is Cornette but it isn't great imho.

[haloed]

Thanks for the heads up Hyde. I think I'll pass on it than.

[Stennick]

I have seen it and possible spoiler:

 

He doesn't buy out those guys and his other main program is Mankind vs Austin, sorry but Funk vs Taker and Foley vs Austin in 2001 is not headline imho.

 

It's a pretty entertaining video mainly because it is Cornette but it isn't great imho.

 

Foley was still pretty over having just retired in the main event of WM the year before and still doing the fun Edge/Christian skits throughout the year.

 

Funk though idk he's got friends though. Foley wanted to book him in the whole ECW revival thing as well or in a bigger part or something of that nature. Taking a chunk out of Vince's behind during a kiss my ass segment or something.

[Remianen]

I have seen it and possible spoiler:

 

He doesn't buy out those guys and his other main program is Mankind vs Austin, sorry but Funk vs Taker and Foley vs Austin in 2001 is not headline imho.

 

It's a pretty entertaining video mainly because it is Cornette but it isn't great imho.

 

Anyone who's taking the word of a huge TNA mark about a WWE event being rewritten, is off his rocker.

 

Yes, I'm kidding.

 

See, here's the problem. You're judging an overarching storyline based on one (or two) of the matches in it. That ignores anything that might've occurred to build to those matches. Saying 'Austin-Foley' and 'Funk-Taker' isn't great, is myopic and well, let's face it, a TNA move. And before you get defensive about that comment, I'll cite one thing to you: Angle-Joe. There are things called 'builds' that make seemingly 'bad' matches a whole lot better because they're the summit of a promotional mountain. Cornette's whole point, his entire thesis, is that with the right BUILD, the storyline could've come off far better than it did. You gonna deny that?

[shamelessposer]

Foley was still pretty over having just retired in the main event of WM the year before and still doing the fun Edge/Christian skits throughout the year.

 

Funk though idk he's got friends though. Foley wanted to book him in the whole ECW revival thing as well or in a bigger part or something of that nature. Taking a chunk out of Vince's behind during a kiss my ass segment or something.

 

This is what I don't get. At the time, Foley was one of the most over men in wrestling. Terry Funk has spent about the last twenty years coming out of nowhere and immediately rising to a prominent position in a promotion's card. These two were each incredibly marketable, in their own way. Why should it be so hard to believe that with a year's buildup, both men could be at the top of the card?

[Guest TDubTNA]

Anyone who's taking the word of a huge TNA mark about a WWE event being rewritten, is off his rocker.

 

Yes, I'm kidding.

 

See, here's the problem. You're judging an overarching storyline based on one (or two) of the matches in it. That ignores anything that might've occurred to build to those matches. Saying 'Austin-Foley' and 'Funk-Taker' isn't great, is myopic and well, let's face it, a TNA move. And before you get defensive about that comment, I'll cite one thing to you: Angle-Joe. There are things called 'builds' that make seemingly 'bad' matches a whole lot better because they're the summit of a promotional mountain. Cornette's whole point, his entire thesis, is that with the right BUILD, the storyline could've come off far better than it did. You gonna deny that?

 

 

 

 

I agree with Remi 100%. Although it wasn't a great DVD Cornette did a good job of an angle that could have been way better but did you really think Vince was gonna put WCW guys over. Also not having the big WCW guys right off the bat didn't help either. Also with what Remi said if you really listened to what Cornette said about the Taker-Funk feud and the Austin-Foley feud you would pay to see those matches based on the build Cornette was giving them. The DVD is good for little stories Jim tells throughout the DVD which I like.

[Hyde Hill]

Anyone who's taking the word of a huge TNA mark about a WWE event being rewritten, is off his rocker.

 

Yes, I'm kidding.

 

See, here's the problem. You're judging an overarching storyline based on one (or two) of the matches in it. That ignores anything that might've occurred to build to those matches. Saying 'Austin-Foley' and 'Funk-Taker' isn't great, is myopic and well, let's face it, a TNA move. And before you get defensive about that comment, I'll cite one thing to you: Angle-Joe. There are things called 'builds' that make seemingly 'bad' matches a whole lot better because they're the summit of a promotional mountain. Cornette's whole point, his entire thesis, is that with the right BUILD, the storyline could've come off far better than it did. You gonna deny that?

 

No but like I said I saw the whole thing and I wasn't that impressed with the build as well, plus from Cornette's own mouth a booker looks at what match ups will draw and then makes storylines for them. And Funk taking a branding iron to Taker is not got storyline telling imho.

 

It's entertaining and his semi - shoot matches storyline idea is pretty good but I expected much better.

 

Edit: And yes he does it far better then the real Invasion but that in itself is not a hard feat as it was terribly done.

[BurningHamster]

No but like I said I saw the whole thing and I wasn't that impressed with the build as well, plus from Cornette's own mouth a booker looks at what match ups will draw and then makes storylines for them. And Funk taking a branding iron to Taker is not got storyline telling imho.

 

It's entertaining and his semi - shoot matches storyline idea is pretty good but I expected much better.

 

Edit: And yes he does it far better then the real Invasion but that in itself is not a hard feat as it was terribly done.

 

I haven't seen it so I can't judge but to me the idea of Undertaking, who always does the impervious to pain thing having to deal with a flaming branding iron sounds like a good time to me. But then my taste is pretty weird.

[CQI13]

Honestly I've heard Jim's ideas for this aren't so great. One of his major ideas is to headline with Terry Funk Vs The Undertaker, a match that today might sound good on paper at a stretch, but back in 2001 the mainstream WCW and WWF didn't really buy into Chainsaw Charlie/Terry Funk like the ECW crowd did.

 

He wouldn't have headlined with it, but it would have been on the card.

[Wade]

I'm watching it right now, and it's pretty good.

[Candyman]

The only problem I have have with "re-booking" or this fantasy booking is a lot of the time bookers do not at all take into account what really happened.

 

The stars the WWF got at the time for WCW (aka not many) is mainly because it would've cost millions of dollars to bring in the nWo/Goldberg/ext at that time. And with them it obviously would've played out better. And a lot of those guys just sat out collecting cheques from Turner because they had guarantees. They only came to WWE once their original WCW contracts expired.

 

The only proper way to "rebook it" is use the guys WWE could get...

 

Correct. Any rewriting of that storyline that includes anybody the WWE didn't bring in (Sting, Goldberg, nWo, etc.) is a fairytale.

 

The problem with this is within the first year that the WCW was bought Flair, Hogan, The Outsiders, Goldberg, Scott Steiner were ALL brought in. So either A. he paid for their contracts anyway or B. Their contracts all expired within a year anyway so it wouldn't have been THAT much.

 

Or they got bored. You're assuming they would've been willing to be apart of the Invasion, and that's why it's a fairytale. We don't know why they didn't sign immediately, so we don't know if it would've been possible to bring them in. Maybe they wanted the time off. Maybe they didn't want to be associated with WCW. Maybe they didn't trust the WWE to book the angle right.

 

See, here's the problem. You're judging an overarching storyline based on one (or two) of the matches in it. That ignores anything that might've occurred to build to those matches. Saying 'Austin-Foley' and 'Funk-Taker' isn't great, is myopic and well, let's face it, a TNA move. And before you get defensive about that comment, I'll cite one thing to you: Angle-Joe. There are things called 'builds' that make seemingly 'bad' matches a whole lot better because they're the summit of a promotional mountain. Cornette's whole point, his entire thesis, is that with the right BUILD, the storyline could've come off far better than it did. You gonna deny that?

 

And we have a winner. There's a HUGE difference between reading a sentence on a computer screen and seeing it play out on television. I mean, 15 years ago who would've thought Isaac Yankem interfering in an Undertaker-Shawn Michaels cage match would be worth seeing?

 

I'm definitely going to watch this.

[PeterHilton]

I'm interested in seeing this.

 

But on the topic of booking with the guys who didn't come in: I don't see the issue.

 

Sports fans do it all the time, discussing what players could've been signed or drafted, etc.

 

And as has already been mentioned, Flair, Hogan, Goldberg, etc came in shortly after the WCW was bought anyways, which to me at least seems to indicate they wanted to come in but didn't want to take reduced buy-outs like DDP and Booker (among others) did.

 

But I firmly believe the E made a mistake because a well-booked Invasion storyline would've paid for itself in the long run. I mean, WMX8 could have featured some variation on the Kliq vs nWo and Austin vs Goldberg (which in 2001/02 would have been epic) as well as Rock/Hogan and Flair/Undertaker.

 

They had the opportunity to gamble some investment money up front and create a company where literally every single one of the biggest stars in American wrestling would all be under one banner and they punted away.

 

That's not a "fairy tale." That was a huge missed opportunity by the E.

[Stennick]

Or they got bored. You're assuming they would've been willing to be apart of the Invasion, and that's why it's a fairytale. We don't know why they didn't sign immediately, so we don't know if it would've been possible to bring them in. Maybe they wanted the time off. Maybe they didn't want to be associated with WCW. Maybe they didn't trust the WWE to book the angle right.

 

 

 

And we have a winner. There's a HUGE difference between reading a sentence on a computer screen and seeing it play out on television. I mean, 15 years ago who would've thought Isaac Yankem interfering in an Undertaker-Shawn Michaels cage match would be worth seeing?

 

I'm definitely going to watch this.

 

They sat out because they wanted to make the free money. Nash, Goldberg, Hall, Hogan had a lawsuit he was trying to get cleared up etc. They stated numerous times they sat out because of the money. Furthermore if Vince would have purchased the contract from Time Warner then they would have had no choice or say in the matter.

 

Its not like guys like Nash, Hall, Hogan, etc didn't want to take part in the biggest storyline in the history of the business. They had a chance to do EXACTLY what they did in 96 come in and lead an invasion. I think its been said several times the InVasion wasn't supposed to happen so quickly guys like HHH got hurt along with some other plans going wrong and they hotshotted the Invasion not too mention WCW t.v show fell through.

 

They sat out to collect the check they wouldn't collect if they joined Vince thats the only reason they sat out. Then one by one starting with Flair in December, your telling me they sign Flair the NIGHT after the InVasion ends but coudln't bring him in earlier? The guy that many viewed as WCW was on television the night after it ended. Two months later the nWo showed up, four months later Goldberg showed up , etc.

 

Issac Yankum didn't show up, the Undertaker's young, hellfire and brimstone, paul bearer lead brother showed up. If you would have told me a man with a red and black mask, nearly seven foot tall monster would have showed up and destroyed the Undertaker I would have said that sounds freaking awesome.

 

You saying that you just can't write Yankum showing up. I get what your saying but your pretty much competely wrong in the matter. The fans didn't know it was him, he was repackaged with an interesting backstory, a mysterious character and an awesome look so yeah when you write it like that it sounds like it makes perfect sense.

 

The InVasion could have been booked any seperate number of ways. I personaly liked the idea of warring factions inside WCW. Like maybe have WCW faces and heels and WWF faces and heels.

 

In a lot of ways its almost what the nWo was trying to become albiet in the a completely wrong way but none the less Eric Bischoff had the idea five years earlier just coudln't execute it.

[PeterHilton]

In a lot of ways its almost what the nWo was trying to become albiet in the a completely wrong way but none the less Eric Bischoff had the idea five years earlier just coudln't execute it.

 

To be fair, the "invasion" aspect of the nWo was executed flawlessly; Eric just couldn't bring himself to let his boys lose when it was time for the good guys to win.

[Stennick]

Thats very true the invasion part of it was done perfectly. So perfectly it lasted all of 1997 without fail.

[MrCanada]

My biggest issue (I guess) is a lot of fantasy bookers try to rebook this storyline the most often it seems. And most of their answers are "Goldberg, Hogan, Outsiders, Steiner, Flair, Sting", or ignore injuires to people like HHH & Bnoit, and they then pass off their amazing booking as proof they are smarter then WWF brass... Thats not the case. Obviously and angle pitting Austin, Rock, Undertaker, Mankind, & Triple H vs. Goldberg, Hogan, Nash, Hall & Flair is going to make a lot more money then what they did. NO FECES! But thats not the point. The only way to rebook history is book it on reality, or you are fantasy booking and not at all talented or creative.