Pinning Moves With 0% Success Rate?

[D-Lyrium]

There are some pinning moves that have a zero success rate, why is this? Crucifix Cradle's, for example. It blatantly states that it's a pinning move (which it is), but it's success rate is zero. If I understand it right, this means that it can never result in the referee counting a pinfall, even though it clearly is one? Is that an error, or is there some reason it's like that? Edit: I just managed to successfully hit a Cruicifix Cradle, and the referee counted the fall (kicked out at 2 though), so now I'm completely confused :(

[Adam Ryland]

Not an error, just a way to make it realistic. Nobody has ever gotten a three count off a legsweep-pin (the one Red does a lot in real life), but the ref still counts. Same in WreSpi - the ref has to count, as the Crucifix is a pinning predicament, but you're never going to get a victory off it.

[FuelFan0102]

[QUOTE=Adam Ryland]the ref has to count, as the Crucifix is a pinning predicament, but you're never going to get a victory off it.[/QUOTE] Next thing you're gonna say Adam is that you'll never get a victory off a backslide. MUGA~!!!!!!

[D-Lyrium]

So 0% success means it'll never get a three, but the ref will still count? Meh, not sure if I like that... Just because it's never happened, doesn't mean it never will. You'd never get a pin off a Lariat in America (ignoring Bradshaw for a moment. I wish I could do THAT more often :p), but in Japan it's a legitimate finisher for some people. Same with the Death Valley Driver. Maybe it should be edited so that all moves that end in a pin have at least 1% chance of being successful? That way, it'll happen, but extremely rarely.. Obviously moves like an Eye Gouge won't result in a pin..but a move that's considered weak in the US might be devestating elsewhere (like a Piledriver. On the UD Indy Circuit it rarely gets a three count, but in Mexico it's been put over as being so destructive that it's banned and only heels use it, very VERY sparingly). Maybe you could implement some kind of "region-specific" stat for moves. So you could have an "American" piledriver, that would have a success rate of maybe 30%, Ouch factor of about 60%, and it would only ever be used in the US (because it represents the American fans view of the Piledriver) and a "Mexican" Piledriver, with ouch of 70 or 80, Frequency of 1%, Success of 100% (I'm not joking. NOBODY kicks out of a Piledriver in Mexico. The reciever almost always sells it by being knocked out), that's only ever used in Mexico? Or is that going too far? We could always make a copy of the move I guess, but the point of the region-specific thing is to stop it being used in other countries :/ Meh, maybe I'll just shut up and get back to playing the game ;)

[spmkillie]

yeah i think making it 1% would have been better. 0% defeats the purpose of it being there

[Nutlaw]

Yeah, come on. Every once in a while someone gets lucky with one of these. Why even have a move that doesn't do anything at all? :)

[XellenceOfXecution]

[QUOTE=D-Lyrium] Maybe it should be edited so that all moves that end in a pin have at least 1% chance of being successful? That way, it'll happen, but extremely rarely..[/QUOTE] I totally agree! 1% or even 2 or 3% stilll won't happen much. That should be realistic enough. (I'll probably end up editing that stuff myself. ;) )

[Vladamire Dracos]

Might I make the suggestion that if you did split the moves into region specific versions, that you assign them to the NPC move sets that represent those regions (The "Mexican Piledriver" talked about above would only be assigned to luchadores, and maybe people from there) that way you don't have to worry about it showing up in america or the UK that often (unless a luchador travels there for a show).

[Adam Ryland]

You're not looking at this from a game \ stats point of view though. If you had a Low level move like Backslide with even a 1% chance of finishing the bout, matches would rarely get to the stage of having finishers. Even in just an average length match, you get about 50 Low level moves in - if you simply went for a Backslide each time (and remember it would have a high Frequency, and therefore hit most times), you'd be looking at pretty high chance of matches ending in a fluke pinfall from one of them. Statistically, 1% isn't *that* rare. Even if you said "well it is only 1% once the opponent is in Danger", it's still going to be a pretty good option to go for every time - nobody is going to use their Fighting Spirit to block a 1% move, and statistically you'd be able to hit maybe 10 backslides for every 1 finisher - eventually you're bound to get a pin. If it bothers you that much, I suggest changing all the moves you want to be pinnable to High level, and giving them the 1% success rate you want. However, I suspect you won't be that happy when you start losing hard fought battles to....a chin lock submission.

[D-Lyrium]

The way I was thinking it would work, a "Mexican Piledriver" would only be used in Mexico, even if a luchadore travels to America. If he does, and uses a Piledriver, it would be an "American Piledriver". It would be representative of the way fans see the move, and how they react to it, not that the actual move itself is any different. But then I realised it was a silly idea, and was way too indepth :P