5 Things you need to know about WMMA 3 *Possible Spoilers*

[TEWFan]

This is a preview I wrote for 411mania.com, but it will be posted on Monday. Since I love you guys, I am going to post it here so you get the scoop early. With the WMMA 3 demo coming out at some point today I don't think Adam will be mad at me or something I will also write an official review that will be posted the day the full version comes out, Dec. 11th.

 

 

<B>1. New Fighters, New Renders</B>: This one is pretty obvious. I don't know how many fighters WMMA 2 had, but this version has around 1,100! That means plenty of new fighters with some cool renders. Some of the new renders look like they where inspired by WWE wrestlers (One looks like Kofi Kingston, one like Sheamus) and others are entirely original. Some older characters have also gotten new renders (Juzoas Skerla, Monica Masters) and others have gotten a name change (Vic Timms is now Vic Micelli or something like that, Grant Capelli is Grant Kyle).

 

<B>2. Styles Make Fights:</B> One of the things that I absolutely love is that styles really make fights. In WMMA 2 whenever you pit a good/great fighter against a "can" there was practically zero chance of an upset. Not so in WMMA 3. If you pit a star fighter against a "can" that happens to be strong in areas where the star's defense is weak, upsets will happen! They don't happen all the time, but frequently enough to make you think about your match-making. The "critical rating" of the fights is also affected by styles. Put two boring, grapple heavy guys with no stand-up and chances are the match will be an awful snoozefest. Put two dynamite strikers with good chins and weak ground games and watch them stand and bang their way to a great bout. Obviously other factors come into play: charisma for example and also how good a guy is at a particular skill. Two good wrestlers will put on a great bout, while two poor wrestlers (if wrestling was their main skill) will likely bore you. Putting two great fighters in a bout is not a guarantee of a great match, however. They might be so good that they cancel each other and end up boring the crowd.

 

<B>3. Fighters are smart:</B> The realism of the fight engine and how smart fighters are is awesome. For example, a great stand-up guy with decent submissions fights another stand-up guy, but that guy has weak submission defense. Knowing that his opponent's submission defense is weaker than his submission skill will mean that Fighter A might actually try to take the fight to the ground and use some submissions, something he will NOT try to do against a Jiu-Jitsu master, for example. Wrestlers who get punch-drunk will abandon their gameplan and go for a desperation takedown like in real life. A wrestler who wants to get the fight to the ground and who has been unable to get a takedown might settle for pushing his opponent to the cage and trying to use it to get the takedown. Gameplans really matter and whenever an upset (or a one-sided domination) happens you can go back to the report and realize that the fighter with the best gameplan won. This include using leg kicks to weaken the legs and thus, limiting the shot of a wrestler.

 

<B>4. Locking in a submission is no guarantee:</B> In WMMA 2 whenever a fighter locked in a submission, it was 99% of the time a fight ending sub. Not in WMMA 3! Fighters can gas their arms when going for a guillotine, fighters can escape subs because they where not properly applied and they can even hold on until the end of the round. In my BCF game I fell in love with Jake Keane because he survived a Seth O'Breen arm bar for 25 seconds until the round was over and then went on to win the bout in the next round. In my XCC game I labeled a new fighter whose name I am not going to spoil a choker because he had a guy in an arm bar twice and somehow the other guy managed to pop his arm free and then went on to beat the new guy by TKO in round 3.

 

<B>5. Fighter Development and the Fog of War:</B> Young (or old has beens) can develop properly since every month they can compete in a local show. Every region holds at least one local show a month. Fighting a local fighter is not a guaranteed win, I have seen local fighters beat the established guy. The Fog of War adds a nice twist, since you might hire a 7-0 prospect thinking he is the next big thing and then watch him struggle because he has never fought this level of competition before. When it comes to hiring and developing guys, there is a lot more gambling and a lot more uncertainty than in any other WMMA game before.

[Mr T Jobs To Me]

Dagnabbit, that's 5 things I already knew about WMMA 3 via the Developer's Journal. How's about some real spoilers such as what year the database is set in, which promotions are in, who the champions are, etc...

[BlizzardVeers]

"Some of the new renders look like they where inspired by WWE wrestlers"

Might want to fix this.

[caspian2]

Wow thanks so much for sharing with us. Cant wait for the demo!!!

[Daffanka]

Dagnabbit, that's 5 things I already knew about WMMA 3 via the Developer's Journal. How's about some real spoilers such as what year the database is set in, which promotions are in, who the champions are, etc...

 

To be fair we only knew this in theory and not how it would be applied. It sounds really cool!

 

I'm not sure how much he can spoil either but we'll find out about all the database info when the demo hits.

[TEWFan]

Just out of curiosity, is Dagnabbit the character from the R.A. Salvatore novels or did you got that from somewhere else? I am a Salvatore junkie

 

In my original preview I did mention some of the new things, but I really don't want to spoil it for the people who want to see it for themselves. Also, I don't want Adam getting mad at me! Highlight below spoilers to read the parts of my 411mania preview that I left out. Like I said, I already submited that preview to 411mania.com, but it has been scheduled to be posted on Monday.

 

 

*SPOILER*

 

 

The game starts in 1998. Titles have histories now. There is ONE new promotion already out. The database seems to have been reset in a way, some veterans are now prospects and some of WMMA 2's big prospects are now established fighters (Spencer Rubenstein and Marlon John come to mind). The new promotion is set in Brazil. Fighters can ask for time off (James Foster seems to do this after his very first fight). Lance Decker (from TEW fame) is the owner of GAMMA. Retirements take other things besides age into consideration, I have seen relatively young (34-35 years old) guys retiring and 40-somethings still active.

[grits207]

I don't know how many fighters WMMA 2 had, but this version has around 1,100!

 

Awesome! I believe WMMA 2 had around 800 characters (including non-fighters) so 1100 would be a pretty big improvement.

 

Can't wait for the demo!!!

[Mr T Jobs To Me]

Just out of curiosity, is Dagnabbit the character from the R.A. Salvatore novels or did you got that from somewhere else? I am a Salvatore junkie

 

In my original preview I did mention some of the new things, but I really don't want to spoil it for the people who want to see it for themselves. Also, I don't want Adam getting mad at me! Highlight below spoilers to read the parts of my 411mania preview that I left out. Like I said, I already submited that preview to 411mania.com, but it has been scheduled to be posted on Monday.

 

 

Appreciate that, TEW Fan! Dagnabbit is just something old rednecks typically say around here.

 

Strange about the start date though... Could have sworn WMMA 2 was set later than that.

[FlameSnoopy]

WMMA2 is set in January 1999. This might seal the fact, that I won't be buying this installment. Had there been a cool improvement to the database, I might have. Just have to wait and see I guess.

[Adam Ryland]

WMMA2 is set in January 1999. This might seal the fact, that I won't be buying this installment. Had there been a cool improvement to the database, I might have. Just have to wait and see I guess.

 

How does the date impact whether the database is better or worse than the previous installment? I can't see any way to go from "it's set in January 1998" to "it has no cool improvements".

[ripwalk]

How does the date impact whether the database is better or worse than the previous installment? I can't see any way to go from "it's set in January 1998" to "it has no cool improvements".

 

Adam, while I agree 100 per cent with you that this is a dumb reason to not buy the game, I also don't really understand the rationale for moving the game back in time, but also apparently disrupting the 'realism' that comes from the database flowing continuously. As in, this guy said some fighters change status from prospects to veterans, etc... Yet the game moves back in time?

 

Anyway, I don't see why, but I'm sure there's a reason for it?

[Scottie]

WMMA2 had a pretty big change from No. 1 if I remember correctly. It will take a little bit to get used to, but I'm sure after a bit of play we'll get used to it. The title histories addition sounds great.

[Adam Ryland]

I suggest you save the questions until you've actually seen the database.

[MFP40]

A wizard did it!

 

Seriously, I'm sure it was done to provide a better playing experience. I really don't see how this makes somebody not purchase the game.

[LoNdOn]

I suggest you save the questions until you've actually seen the database.

 

And seeing as you are online, obviously the demo is going to come out within the next ten minutes.

 

Can't wait to explore.

[1234]

Sounds good, not particularly a fan of changing the database, the date is ok, but don't like changing names. But still mega-excited just for the demo.

 

And I must make guy-who-looks-like-Sheamus a champion.

[TEWFan]

That is why I had removed that bit from my initial post. People start assuming things without actually playing it.

 

The database is larger, plays better and feels more realistic than the last game. Some changes are always made for balancing purposes. I personally felt that the databases in the last two games where a bit small and WMMA 3 fixes that problem. I really don't understand how a change in date means the database is not worth playing.

 

Like I said about the "cans", even guys that in WMMA 2 where never hired because a) they lost all the time, b)they flat out sucked or c) had no redeeming qualities whatsoever are USEFUL this time around. Every fighter feels like he has a chance to win the fight, every character has a purpose, even more so with the "of the night" bonuses.

 

I don't know about you guys but I'd rather have a change in date with a better, well-balanced database instead of relying on the same guys all the time. Even bigger props to Adam when you consider that (in my opinion and I bet a lot of mod-makers agree with me) making a good, balanced and realistic WMMA database is far harder than it is in TEW.

[Mr T Jobs To Me]

WMMA2 is set in January 1999. This might seal the fact, that I won't be buying this installment. Had there been a cool improvement to the database, I might have. Just have to wait and see I guess.

 

Yeah, that's a letdown for me too, but I still loved both my GAMMA and SIGMA games from the era.

 

How does the date impact whether the database is better or worse than the previous installment? I can't see any way to go from "it's set in January 1998" to "it has no cool improvements".

 

I'm sure we all know the data will be upgraded and more complete, but moving backwards means that the universe hasn't really evolved. I can see the justification with you probably feeling the starting point provided a variety of challenges and had a solid base, along with eras now being included and there probably being a change from mostly one-dimensional regens to complete fighters, but the element of telling the next chapter of a story with the default database is going to be missing.

 

I, like a lot of people, enjoy the creativity that goes into watching these databases evolve through multiple iterations and it's actually one of the most appealing parts of the games to me. A new edition should bring a new experience, whereas I'm worried that things will feel all too familiar for the first few years.

[TEWFan]

I, like a lot of people, enjoy the creativity that goes into watching these databases evolve through multiple iterations and it's actually one of the most appealing parts of the games to me. A new edition should bring a new experience, whereas I'm worried that things will feel all too familiar for the first few years.

 

 

I can guarantee that is not the case. I have played for two years already in two separate games and in both cases the data evolved differently. I do understand your point, I am the type of guy that spends two HOURS on every new TEW release just reading all the bios and seeing the evolution of things. But trust me, the game is so much better right now.

[SammoHung]

Awesome. I had the opposite fear: the database being moved up too far ahead in time: i loved the idea of that set point in time when the monodimensional fighters are starting to disappear but the martial arts have yet to completely mature as a sport.

I have played WMMA 2 so long going so far ahead in time that really the starting situation doesn't affect me particularly: it's not as if there were established title lineages or stuff like that in WMMA2, so not much of a "ret-con" work really.

 

That is why I had removed that bit from my initial post. People start assuming things without actually playing it.

 

Yeah, clinging at every piece of info.

 

The database is larger, plays better and feels more realistic than the last game. Some changes are always made for balancing purposes. I personally felt that the databases in the last two games where a bit small and WMMA 3 fixes that problem. I really don't understand how a change in date means the database is not worth playing.

 

Me neither, by that reasoning i should have never bought Street Fighter Alpha because it was set years before Street Fighter 2?

 

Like I said about the "cans", even guys that in WMMA 2 where never hired because a) they lost all the time, b)they flat out sucked or c) had no redeeming qualities whatsoever are USEFUL this time around. Every fighter feels like he has a chance to win the fight, every character has a purpose, even more so with the "of the night" bonuses.

 

Great point in the review, love how it sounds. Can't wait to play it :-) With so many new stats and degrees of complexity, it feels like it's going to be a completely new experience.

 

I don't know about you guys but I'd rather have a change in date with a better, well-balanced database instead of relying on the same guys all the time. Even bigger props to Adam when you consider that (in my opinion and I bet a lot of mod-makers agree with me) making a good, balanced and realistic WMMA database is far harder than it is in TEW.

 

I'd have a database starting in 1994, everything is going to be different in any playthrough anyway.

[Adam Ryland]

I'm sure we all know the data will be upgraded and more complete, but moving backwards means that the universe hasn't really evolved.

 

A new edition should bring a new experience, whereas I'm worried that things will feel all too familiar for the first few years.

 

Again, this is all based on one assumption - which is incorrect.

 

Please will people just wait for the database to come out; it's incredibly annoying that I spent over a month working on perfecting this database for an optimal gameplay experience and yet I've already got people making negative remarks over something they've not even seen.

[Daffanka]

With the pretty drastic improvements of the game itself I'm assuming the first priority was adapting the database to them rather than taking a potentially not-so-well-adapted database and running with it.

 

I'm really excited myself, not just for the game itself but seeing what kind of mods can be cooked up.

[Mr T Jobs To Me]

I can guarantee that is not the case. I have played for two years already in two separate games and in both cases the data evolved differently. I do understand your point, I am the type of guy that spends two HOURS on every new TEW release just reading all the bios and seeing the evolution of things. But trust me, the game is so much better right now.

 

That's the case in any simulation game worth its salt though. The basic principle of the genre is not to be on any "rails", for things to evolve differently as you go. I don't care how much things have been built on, the basic outlines of that time have been set. Mark Cohen's an old legend, Fezzik's lording over ALPHA-1, James Foster is GAMMA's big draw. You can't make significant changes because it's a betrayal of previous canon. Even if the database moved forward a year instead of backwards, anything that happened could be justified.

 

When I was doing the Historical C'Verse mod, I had to move it up for every new edition of the game, even if it was just a couple months, because I didn't like writing from inside of the box of my last vision. You can't truly move forward without moving forward. If you're the type of guy who spends two hours checking out the evolution of things for TEW, then you should understand what I mean.

[RedsRule]

Again, this is all based on one assumption - which is incorrect.

 

Please will people just wait for the database to come out; it's incredibly annoying that I spent over a month working on perfecting this database for an optimal gameplay experience and yet I've already got people making negative remarks over something they've not even seen.

 

Just ignore them, because it is very stupid to make comments on something that hasnt happened. I personally dont care if the game is moved back in time.

[FlameSnoopy]

The flow was exactly what I meant. I didn't play WMMA1, so it obviously didn't bother me when you decided to reimagine it. But doing it again, this time, with me having played the database a lot, I would have liked to explore the scenes. See what is different, see how the careers developed, who are the champions, etc. When TEW2010 was released, there was - as usual - a huge buzz and discussion around the database - several pages of length if I remember correctly.

 

And had some of you read my post correctly, it wasn't the sole reason. At the moment where I stand, I just don't see too many improvements for me to buy this game.

 

And now that I have actually typed this thing up, there has been a discussion already. I'm too slow!