ブッチャー Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 First off, I should state that this is still an early WIP. So, I basically started this mod back when TEW2013 was new, but after doing like 10 venues, Phil Parent's excellent venues mod came out, and I abandoned it since somebody else had already done half the work. But I still had to modify for my own purposes, because what I had been doing in my brief foray into making my own mod, was separating all the venues into their respective prefectures, with the cities/towns/districts etc listed in the description. Even though all the venues had been entered in by Phil, it was still a great deal of work. I only did a few regions, as that was all I needed for my game. Anyways, now that TEW2016 has opening and closing dates, I decided to start it up again. Rather than just modifying Phil's work again, for several reasons I decided to start basically from scratch. I was going to need to modify all the venues anyway (or at least do the research into all the venues, which is the hardest part), and it takes just about as much effort to do that as it does to just make the venues myself. ----------- So, the reason why I wanted it separated into prefectures was that as I always start as small or very low regional promotions, so I wanted to be able to run tours and feel like I'm actually touring, even if I'm only running shows in one region. And I added the extra detail about where they're located because I was planning to do a dynasty, and I wanted that info to possibly use as flavour in my posts. I never did get around to doing the dynasty, though. ----------- Basically this mod, while it can be used by anyone, is especially geared towards smaller Japanese companies, touring companies, and dynasty writers, who might the info useful in their writeups. However, it's still in the early stages. I've only done three of the prefectures in Kanto so far, and it's... going very slowly. I worked on it for three of the last four days to get that much done. And when I say I worked for three days on it, I don't mean a few hours each day. I mean like 14 hours per day, and I think it's starting to fry my brain. With 130 venues so far, that equals about 20 minutes per entry, most of it spent trawling through (translated) Japanese Wikipedia, and various other Japanese websites, most often the official websites of the venues, trying to find the location, capacities, and opening (and in some cases, closing) dates of the venues. Mostly I just make mods for myself, but this one being so ridiculously labour intensive, I figured I probably shouldn't keep it to myself. Especially since there isn't, to my knowledge, anything else quite like it out there. The only question is: Does anyone really care? Is it worth the effort? Would anybody actually find it useful? I'm going to continue on and finish Kanto at least, but is it worth continuing beyond that? I'm including a preview version here of what I've done so far. It includes the 130 venues I've done so far between Tokyo (TK, and TM for the Tokyo Metropolis), Tochigi (TO) and Saitama (SA), so people can get a first hand look for themselves and see what it's like. Note that the venues of Saitama typically contain more info that the others (being the most recent one that I've done), info that I could have added to Tokyo and Tochigi, because it was info that was just as available but that I didn't think to add, although mostly they're just notes and stuff for myself. Anyway, take a look and tell me what you guys think. DOWNLOAD PREVIEW VERSION Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mootinie Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 This is really useful because some regions of Japan in previous mods had a lot of Kanto venues but not ones for the wider regions. When I ran my last NJPW save, there was one region where the largest arena only seated 5000 when I could draw 10,000 just for a tour show. It was a shame because I always thought all regions of Japan would have large baseball stadiums and medium-sized basketball gymnasiums that I could hold shows in. So yes, absolutely worth it and would definitely improve my experiences playing puroresu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beejus Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Quite excellent, sir. I don't play as Japanese promotions, but I will be happy to have this available for the flavor that it adds to the game world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snakesonaplane Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Wow very cool! Thank you for working on this. I'm working (albeit slowly) on a Japan only mod, and stuff like this would be awesome for that, im sure there are others similarly who would benefit, so please keep at it and thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ブッチャー Posted July 10, 2016 Author Share Posted July 10, 2016 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Mootinie" data-cite="Mootinie" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="42117" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>It was a shame because I always thought all regions of Japan would have large baseball stadiums and medium-sized basketball gymnasiums that I could hold shows in.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Speaking of which, I came across a bunch of baseball stadiums, but I think only added a few, because I've been finding it difficult to do so.</p><p> </p><p> The problem is that while it may be easy enough to find out the number of seats that are in a lot of these places, when companies run there they're not usually full up to the absolute maximum potential capacity. So I imagine they're usually set up in some other way.</p><p> </p><p> Take the Tokyo Dome for example. It has a baseball capacity of 46,000. It's also got a listed capacity under the generic "event" label of 42,000-55,000. So let's say you sell 42,000 tickets, I imagine the outfield seats would not be used at all, since there would be thousands of people on folding chairs all around the ring. Plus if they were using the outfield bleachers, and the entire field was covered with people, I'm sure you could get at least 10,000 on the field, which would take you over the 55,000 stated capacity.</p><p> </p><p> But you don't have to get up the maximum capacity for it to be a good venue. NJPW has run their Wrestle Kingdom event there every year since it started in 2007. Six of those times they've had less than 40,000 attendance, and four of those six were under 30,000. But even at their lowest attended one, 25,204 from this year, it's still not a bad venue for the show.</p><p> </p><p> Conversely in TEW, booking a 55,000 seat stadium if you're only expecting 30,000 is a terrible idea. So that makes it tough to determine what to set the capacity at. Do you set it as high as it can reasonably go? Do you try to be a bit more moderate?</p><p> </p><p> I've been thinking I might do several different entries for huge venues like baseball stadiums, with different capacities to emulate this.</p><p> </p><p> Anyone have any thoughts about that?</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genadi Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Wow Butcher great work! Really nice to see areas like Japan get some love <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hive Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Looks good, man! I agree with Don Genadi, it's great to see Japan get some love. <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 <p>Wow this looks great. Do keep going. I love attention to some of the smaller details having some similar work before. Most might not notice it and even with Generic Venues some might not see it as needed. But I really do think every small touch helps with that immersion and bring a mod to life. </p><p> </p><p> Good luck with this and keep us posted.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snakesonaplane Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="42117" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Conversely in TEW, booking a 55,000 seat stadium if you're only expecting 30,000 is a terrible idea. So that makes it tough to determine what to set the capacity at. Do you set it as high as it can reasonably go? Do you try to be a bit more <p> </p><p> Anyone have any thoughts about that?</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> It's definitely hard to judge but at the end of the day it's your mod and there is not really a wrong answer here. I've done a spreadsheet of Japanese and Mexican venues to improve these locations, and what I examined in Japan for venues like that is what is stated official capacity, what is the highest ever draw there, as well as the claimed attendances over as long time as possible on data available. If njpw held a show and claimed super no vacancy, and this was at the venue official capacity I would go with that. If its above capacity I would round down to nearest hundred, or even take off more if it sounded just too worked. If there is no official capacity data available I'll look for a sold out show and round down the nearest hundred. Combinations of these things usually.</p><p> </p><p> The think to remember is Japan kayfabes their attendances a lot so its always going to be hard to get the capacity 100% correct anyway, so don't beat yourself up about it! Haha, its more important to get the venue names, characteristics, and locations correct, so there are diverse locations. The capacity only needs to be roughly correct, if you are off by less than a 1000 on a big venue over 10k who cares? And usually by looking at claimed attendances over a long time you can work out a good guesstimate, and just go with these as they will often be the best option possible given limited data.</p><p> </p><p> I've got a spreasaheet of Japanese and Mexican venues I did myself to create a similar mod as this that I can share with you, you can compare guesstimates! <span class="ipsEmoji">😂</span></p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ブッチャー Posted July 11, 2016 Author Share Posted July 11, 2016 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="snakesonaplane" data-cite="snakesonaplane" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="42117" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>The think to remember is Japan kayfabes their attendances a lot so its always going to be hard to get the capacity 100% correct anyway, so don't beat yourself up about it! Haha, its more important to get the venue names, characteristics, and locations correct, so there are diverse locations. The capacity only needs to be roughly correct, if you are off by less than a 1000 on a big venue over 10k who cares?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Oh yeah, Japanese companies are notorious for inflating attendance figures. Shin-kiba 1st Ring is a textbook example. It's got an official capacity of 284-290, depending on which language wikipedia page you're looking at. The official site doesn't list one but that seems about right. Maybe you can get a bit more in there, (I might bump it up to 300), but I can't imagine much more than that. It's the seventh most used venue in the world, according to wrestlingdata.com, so anybody who's seen a little Japanese indy wrestling has probably seen the place before (although companies like New Japan and NOAH run there as well), and couldn't possibly believe many of the claimed attendances. Hell, I bet there's a bunch of matches on youtube that take place there. Aside from 666 (who always claim 666 as their attendance everywhere), the highest claim was DDT with attendance of 661. That's utterly ridiculous. They have a bunch of claims over 600, and they and many other companies have claims of over 500 or 400.</p><p> </p><p> And that's why I've mostly just used wrestlingdata.com as a resource for finding venues rather than for determining capacities in all but a handful of cases. But that's what makes this so difficult. I'm trying to find official numbers as often as possible. </p><p> </p><p> Actually, I have relaxed on that a bit from when I first started off doing Tokyo.</p><p> </p><p> Like for a couple places that were basketball arenas, I'd find the fixed seating capacity, then figuring in the room it takes for the ring, I'd add 500 or so for all the folding chairs on the floor.</p><p> </p><p> Towards the end of doing Saitama, I actually got a good idea though. I noticed that I had been seeing a lot of places, especially the secondary gymnasiums, or "sub arenas" as they usually call them, that had no seating. But a bunch of them did list the dimensions and/or area of the floor. So I looked around a found this <a href="http://www.banquettablespro.com/space-and-capacity-calculator" rel="external nofollow">calulator for banquets and meeting rooms</a>. So I used that (after converting from metres to feet) and under "Theater or Auditorium Style", they list two numbers for spacious or maximum number of chairs. So that gives me a good idea of what the place can hold.</p><p> </p><p> So, looking at the last results I had, a place of 952m² came back with a result of 1,280 for spacious rows of chairs, and 1,707 for maximum rows of chairs. I figure somewhere in between those should be about right.</p><p> </p><p> Also, while originally I was only adding venues that were on wrestlingdata.com, I started to realise on they Japanese cities' websites that there were sometimes links to other gymnasiums in the city, and while they may not have been for wrestling in the past, there's no reason they <em>couldn't</em> be. They look exactly the same as the other 200 gyms I've seen, so if I have good info on the place, why not use it? So I started adding a few of those places too.</p><p> </p><p> It's a very exhausting process though. Usually it consists of googling the city, then opening the wikipedia page. Then opening the japanese wikipedia page. Then I translate the page and look for (usually) gymnasiums, or arenas or sports parks or whatever. Sometimes I get lucky and there's a wikipedia page with the info I need. Usually there isn't, but I often find the name of the gymnasium I'm looking for (the one I saw on wrestlingdata.com). So then I find it on the untranslated wiki page and google it. Or sometimes I'll just google the city's name in kanji along with the kanji for "gymnasium" or "bunka centre" or whatever and I'll find it. Sometimes it's even more complicated. Although even if I do find a website on the place, whether I find any usable info or not is a crapshoot. Sometimes they just list activity fees and things like that.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="snakesonaplane" data-cite="snakesonaplane" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="42117" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I've got a spreasaheet of Japanese and Mexican venues I did myself to create a similar mod as this that I can share with you, you can compare guesstimates! <span class="ipsEmoji">😂</span></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Sure, that could certainly come in handy. Thanks!</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snakesonaplane Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 <p>Have you seen this site?</p><p> </p><p> <a href="https://worldcombat.wordpress.com/japanese-venue-list/" rel="external nofollow">https://worldcombat.wordpress.com/japanese-venue-list/</a></p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ブッチャー Posted July 16, 2016 Author Share Posted July 16, 2016 No, I hadn't seen that. Thanks for the link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daman077c Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="42117" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Oh yeah' date=' Japanese companies are notorious for inflating attendance figures. Shin-kiba 1st Ring is a textbook example. It's got an official capacity of 284-290, depending on which language wikipedia page you're looking at. The official site doesn't list one but that seems about right.[/quote']<p> </p><p> The official site has a seating chart (it's a PDF) with a listed capacity of 285, but you I've seen setups for ~385 (370 seated, with standing room). Generally promotions like Stardom stick to a setup that seats ~335 (<a href="http://i.imgur.com/C3iFEn6.jpg" rel="external nofollow">looks like this</a>). </p><p> </p><p> I have a bunch of seating charts for different buildings that I've pulled off of ticket sites over the last few years - it's always interesting to see what the attendance claims are against what the seating chart says. Like Dragon Gate regularly claiming 1,000 at Kobe Sambo Hall, despite only having seats for 885, etc. If you want them, I can certainly upload them for you onto Imgur or whatever. I have slowly been working on a mod of my own for the Japanese women's scene (separate from InfernalMIKO's mod she's been doing), but I dunno if it'll ever get released... still lots of stuff to adjust, and I have an innate feeling a lot of the workers are either overrated or underrated on stats.</p></div></blockquote> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justtxyank Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 I would love to see this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ブッチャー Posted August 11, 2016 Author Share Posted August 11, 2016 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="daman077c" data-cite="daman077c" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="42117" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>The official site has a seating chart (it's a PDF) with a listed capacity of 285, but you I've seen setups for ~385 (370 seated, with standing room). Generally promotions like Stardom stick to a setup that seats ~335 (<a href="http://i.imgur.com/C3iFEn6.jpg" rel="external nofollow">looks like this</a>).</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Interesting... That seating chart shows 350 seats, so I guess you can get significantly more than 300 people in there.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="daman077c" data-cite="daman077c" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="42117" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I have a bunch of seating charts for different buildings that I've pulled off of ticket sites over the last few years - it's always interesting to see what the attendance claims are against what the seating chart says. Like Dragon Gate regularly claiming 1,000 at Kobe Sambo Hall, despite only having seats for 885, etc. If you want them, I can certainly upload them for you onto Imgur or whatever.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Yeah, if you don't mind that would be awesome, sounds like it could be an incredibly useful resource. Thanks!</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> I really need to get back to this. I've been doing graphics work lately, after I got kinda burnt out on this and progress came to a halt. After I started adding a bunch of perfectly suitable venues which had no previous record of usage for wrestling (at least not on wrestlingdata.com), Kanagawa ended up having more venues than even Tokyo. And I don't even think I even finished Kanagawa, though I did most of it. I'm gonna have to go back and redo Tokyo, Tochigi and Saitama, but that can wait a good while, there are more important priorities.</p><p> </p><p> I think I might start doing one prefecture from each region and just rotate, instead of focusing on completing one region before moving on to the next, and periodically upload what I've got so far.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.