Release Date Change... Idea?

[pat666]

You guys would pay $35 for a game that doesn't have complete mouse scrolling support?

 

35$ for a game a spend hours and hours and hours. It's Nothing.

I paid 70$ for FF VII Remake that i finished in 30 hours.

 

I must of played at least Thousands of hours on TEW 2016 if not more.

 

I know Adam ALWAYS delivers. He's gained my trust.

[franticloser]

35$ for a game a spend hours and hours and hours. It's Nothing.

I paid 70$ for FF VII Remake that i finished in 30 hours.

 

I must of played at least Thousands of hours on TEW 2016 if not more.

 

I know Adam ALWAYS delivers. He's gained my trust.

 

 

I am with you on this well in the vein of paying 35 dollars for something I will sink hundreds of hours in. FF VII Remake is a much longer game if you go through it and do everything. But I've sunk probably close to 200 dollars in CK2 with all the DLC and that is probably my second most played game after TEW.

[Munit]

35$ for a game a spend hours and hours and hours. It's Nothing.

I paid 70$ for FF VII Remake that i finished in 30 hours.

 

I must of played at least Thousands of hours on TEW 2016 if not more.

 

I know Adam ALWAYS delivers. He's gained my trust.

 

Yeah that's a great point. If TEW 16 or 13 was on steam back when I bought it, I don't know how many hours would be clocked in. I think i've played TEW more than any other game.. and its a game I back to for years! Other companies do the Beta/Early access stuff. If they can't do it, they can't do it. I just support the idea a lot.

[pat666]

It's also a game that you play without playing..

How many times have we just sat there during dinners thinking of ideas for our upcomming shows. How many times at work we are drafting idead/shows on piece of paper.

 

I mean it's crazy the amount of time we spend on TEW. And like I said it's 35$. It's Nothing.

[Tomato Can]

Adam's earned my trust with every prior version of this game. He's going to keep working on this version, and I'm going to enjoy playing it...just like all the others. From past experience, I expect to get several hundred hours of entertainment playing this game over the next few years. That's worth $35 to me.

 

This!!!!

[Arlie Rahn]

Guys, as I've said in other posts, we really appreciate your enthusiasm. With that in mind, I will try to give you some reasons on why we want to avoid taking pre-orders or releasing the game in its current state (when more changes are ongoing):

 

1. Whenever you do pre-orders, there is a huge push to get the game out ASAP. People have already paid, they are getting restless and even the best companies often cut corners to get the game out and relieve some of that pressure. Our preference as a company is to wait until we feel comfortable releasing the game before taking your money. That doesn't mean the game is perfect, but it atleast at a spot where we've resolved most of the known issues.

 

2. It is very hard to support the open beta demo and a released full version (for early buyers) at the same time. If we let people buy a "beta" version of the full version today, Adam would be spending time fixing the full version issues and then trying to go back and fix issues (maybe even the same one) in the demo beta version. That's a lot for one person.

 

3. The psychology of people play-testing a free demo is significantly different than someone who paid $35 and hits an error in year one. It just is. The person who paid is going to have a lot less patience and be more likely to bad-mouth the game. In some ways, that's fair as not everyone who buys the game wants to sign up to be a beta tester for the first two weeks. On the flip side, if you get the free demo and hit some issues, you usually don't mind as much (it was free). You can either go back to TEW2016 if you don't want to test it or embrace the beta process.

 

4. Finally, a lot of times we may need to make database changes in the early beta that leave a save unusable. For a limited demo, that's not as big a deal as people have to restart fairly often as it is (once they hit the limit). But, if we have a full version that people purchased, that becomes more frustrating. Imagine spending $35, setting up a mod and playing out 4-5 years and then being told you have to restart because patch 10 makes all prior saves invalid? It also puts Adam in a situation early where he may have to go against a better long term fix during this beta period in order to try and keep beta saves usable. There's always a chance early in development that the save format needs to be changed, but that chance goes down once we complete the public demo period.

 

Many companies who make great games take preorders and do a very good job with it. We just find that for our unique situation as a smaller company, the limited demo public beta period before taking money from customers works the best.

[Levinux]

Guys, as I've said in other posts, we really appreciate your enthusiasm. With that in mind, I will try to give you some reasons on why we want to avoid taking pre-orders or releasing the game in its current state (when more changes are ongoing):

 

1. Whenever you do pre-orders, there is a huge push to get the game out ASAP. People have already paid, they are getting restless and even the best companies often cut corners to get the game out and relieve some of that pressure. Our preference as a company is to wait until we feel comfortable releasing the game before taking your money. That doesn't mean the game is perfect, but it atleast at a spot where we've resolved most of the known issues.

 

2. It is very hard to support the open beta demo and a released full version (for early buyers) at the same time. If we let people buy a "beta" version of the full version today, Adam would be spending time fixing the full version issues and then trying to go back and fix issues (maybe even the same one) in the demo beta version. That's a lot for one person.

 

3. The psychology of people play-testing a free demo is significantly different than someone who paid $35 and hits an error in year one. It just is. The person who paid is going to have a lot less patience and be more likely to bad-mouth the game. In some ways, that's fair as not everyone who buys the game wants to sign up to be a beta tester for the first two weeks. On the flip side, if you get the free demo and hit some issues, you usually don't mind as much (it was free). You can either go back to TEW2016 if you don't want to test it or embrace the beta process.

 

4. Finally, a lot of times we may need to make database changes in the early beta that leave a save unusable. For a limited demo, that's not as big a deal as people have to restart fairly often as it is (once they hit the limit). But, if we have a full version that people purchased, that becomes more frustrating. Imagine spending $35, setting up a mod and playing out 4-5 years and then being told you have to restart because patch 10 makes all prior saves invalid? It also puts Adam in a situation early where he may have to go against a better long term fix during this beta period in order to try and keep beta saves usable. There's always a chance early in development that the save format needs to be changed, but that chance goes down once we complete the public demo period.

 

Many companies who make great games take preorders and do a very good job with it. We just find that for our unique situation as a smaller company, the limited demo public beta period before taking money from customers works the best.

 

As much as I would pay for TEW2020 right now, I agree here. Whether I buy it now if possible, or in a few weeks when actually released, it'll be the same game, so there is no harm in waiting.

 

Keep up the great work.

[Eastshire]

All fair and well reason points. I’m just anxious to sink my teeth in.

[Skerge]

I’d be down to pay for early access.

[djthefunkchris]

Is there any difference between the two besides the time block?

 

They are two different applications, so both would need the same exact fix, no matter how small the difference between them are, and would take more time.

 

edit: and then I see Arlie answered.

[The Nickman]

believe it or not, some people are happy with the game in its current state.

I certainly am. There’s minor changes I’d like to see implemented still just to improve QoL somewhat, but the game itself is great IMO.

[ThrowawayAccount1227]

I just want to play and I find it really screwy releasing a beta so early with only 2 months of playtime for pushing the actual release far back. Give us 4-6 months.

[franticloser]

It wasn't intended to be that way. It was only suppose to be a week between but due to several issues popping up they pushed it back.

[djthefunkchris]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="ThrowawayAccount1227" data-cite="ThrowawayAccount1227" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="48456" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><strong><span style="text-decoration:underline;">I just want to play</span></strong> and I find it really screwy releasing a beta so early with only 2 months of playtime for pushing the actual release far back. Give us 4-6 months.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I understand, and I believe that's most peoples thoughts right now, heck even mine.</p><p> </p><p> The beta isn't released to play a real game, but to test the game. There is a difference. </p><p> </p><p> The only reason I don't say "Hey, extending the beta is a horrible idea" business wise, is because of how many errors there have been so far, and the argument that there might be quite a bit more in longer games is something I think could be a reality this time around. But I do think business wise it's not a smart idea for GDS to do.</p>

[bengreedy]

I'd give Adam $100 to play the game as-is past Feb tonight.

[Arlie Rahn]

The issue with extending the beta is it would take a chunk of the two weeks to change the timeframe, add in additional code/features and re-test it. The goal is to test the "trouble areas" and those are the same with 2 months or 4 months: customization options, interface changes, screen transitions, some DB calls after changes, etc. If everything was great and we just hit issues at the end of the 2nd month (and had a ton of stability in later months in the earlier beta), maybe that would make sense. But it doesn't given what we are working on with TEW2020.

[Theheel]

The issue with extending the beta is it would take a chunk of the two weeks to change the timeframe, add in additional code/features and re-test it. The goal is to test the "trouble areas" and those are the same with 2 months or 4 months: customization options, interface changes, screen transitions, some DB calls after changes, etc. If everything was great and we just hit issues at the end of the 2nd month (and had a ton of stability in later months in the earlier beta), maybe that would make sense. But it doesn't given what we are working on with TEW2020.

 

 

I get it and understanding the reasoning. It's not what I was hoping to hear as the 2-month limit is limiting my enthusiasm to create a long term save (the fear of it not being saveable in the final version). Maybe I'll play around in the database to get more familiar with it or I'll convert a save and build it up or just play 16 until we are ready to go.

 

 

Regardless I am looking forward to the day that we get to dig in for real

[Arlie Rahn]

OK, yeah - I see what you mean now. That makes sense. My response would be if you can bear with us for the next two weeks - you can get the full version then. If we stopped and redid the beta, you may have a few more months now - but would have to wait until the end of May for the full version. Everything has a tradeoff.

[Civnid]

Good thing I came into this game late. Still reading the handbook, still gonna try out a bunch of different feds and mess around with wacky booking just to see how the systems work together. This way, I'm ready to start my real save by the time the game actually releases. This is why you're better off not reading anything about the game until one week before release

[djthefunkchris]

Good thing I came into this game late. Still reading the handbook, still gonna try out a bunch of different feds and mess around with wacky booking just to see how the systems work together. This way, I'm ready to start my real save by the time the game actually releases. This is why you're better off not reading anything about the game until one week before release

 

You didn't mean to do that at all, did you?

[MTrevinos]

Greydog et al,

 

I completely understand your feelings behind pushing the official release back until the game itself is exactly where you want it.

 

BUT...

 

Would you guys be open to releasing a PRE-ORDER beta on Thursday? What I mean by that is a version of the game that you can start anytime, and play more than two months? Basically the full game AS-IS with the understanding it's not the finished product.

 

I, for one, have been having a blast playing but having it be limited to two months starting in January is getting a bit stale. I'd love to be able to buy the game in its current form now as a pre-order beta knowing that's there will be bugs etc.

 

Possible? With everything going on in the world there are a lot of people stuck at home and this would be a much-appreciated distraction.

 

 

I would love this. Due to COVID-19 we all need a distraction and I would buy this game with the full understanding that it's in a BETA state.

[djthefunkchris]

I would love this. Due to COVID-19 we all need a distraction and I would buy this game with the full understanding that it's in a BETA state.

 

Arlie chimed in and said that doing something like this would require Adam to have to update two different programs, perhaps taking twice as long to update, twice as long until you have a game you don't have to worry about having to start over when it's finally finished. You understand if they done this, chances are some of the updates can crash your game, making you start over after two months anyways. Not to mention those of us willing to wait for a product we can play extended games with would be screwed because the time would be extended until that can happen.

 

Either no one is listening, or they could care less. I'm betting people care, they just aren't listening.