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Oh My Gosh... This is probably the coolest thing ever. Now Adam, I have a question about it. In the Journal you said that we don't have to specify which match. So does that mean we [I]CAN'T[/I] or does that mean we can but if we don't the fans won't be angry? Do gimmick matches, like cage matches get better heat?
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No. I have an old-school view that people pay to see the wrestlers involved, not the matches *. I think adding gimmick matches can make for better matches, and can add some interest for existing fans, but if Joe Public doesn't want to see Undertaker vs Big Show, it doesn't matter if you put them in a Hell In A Cell, a Punjabi Prison match, or anything else, the gimmick won't cause them to start watching. Therefore attendance and buy rate wouldn't be effected, as it's only the loyal core audience - who would be there anyway - who are going to be extra interested. * The rare exception being the Royal Rumble.
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i think there is more exceptions than just the Royal Rumble. For instance i really couldn't care less about the WWE womens division, but if you tell me there is going to be a Buck naked, bowl of jelly on a pole match between Mickey James and Trish, im buying that PPV! Flippancy aside though i think that just being able to book the various match types is fine. It would be nice to see this implemented into story booking as well though!
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[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;135578]No. I have an old-school view that people pay to see the wrestlers involved, not the matches *. I think adding gimmick matches can make for better matches, and can add some interest for existing fans, but if Joe Public doesn't want to see Undertaker vs Big Show, it doesn't matter if you put them in a Hell In A Cell, a Punjabi Prison match, or anything else, the gimmick won't cause them to start watching. Therefore attendance and buy rate wouldn't be effected, as it's only the loyal core audience - who would be there anyway - who are going to be extra interested. * The rare exception being the Royal Rumble.[/QUOTE] I can think of another exception that has caused me in the past to really make an attempt to see the show....War Games. Elimination chamber can be a selling point as well, regardless of all the people involved, although not as much as the RR or WG.
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its a match inside a cage made out of what looks like bamboo sticks from the garden centre. The winner is the 1st person to fall over backwards and destroy the flimsy looking structure whilst trying your hardest not too look like a 64 year old taking on someone who is 64 stone.
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[QUOTE=Monitor;135604]I can think of another exception that has caused me in the past to really make an attempt to see the show....War Games. Elimination chamber can be a selling point as well, regardless of all the people involved, although not as much as the RR or WG.[/QUOTE] If you van honestly say that you would buy a PPV that is headlined by an Elimination Chamber match that includes the Great Khali, Undertaker, Big Show, Kane, Mark Henry and Viscera, you truly ARE a hardcore fan of the WWE. I must say. [QUOTE]i think there is more exceptions than just the Royal Rumble. For instance i really couldn't care less about the WWE womens division, but if you tell me there is going to be a Buck naked, bowl of jelly on a pole match between Mickey James and Trish, im buying that PPV! Flippancy aside though i think that just being able to book the various match types is fine. It would be nice to see this implemented into story booking as well though![/QUOTE] You would pay to see Mickie James and Trish, not the Buck Naked match. By default, someone who thinks these two divas are hot, would probably pay for a Singles match between these two as well. I hope you get my point.
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Out of interest, will it be possible to modify the advanced bookings as you go? Like add someone in. It links with my next Question, can you advance book a royal rumble? For instance, have it announced, and then as the weeks go, you get people announcing there entry, and qualifying matches, and as you go along you add the people in to the match already on the advanced booking.
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Stipulations definetly add not only to the PPV buys but to the heat of a storyline. I think 2004's Armageddon did alot better then expected once the stip was advertised, JBL & Big Show were not going to draw anything alone and WWE knew it. If you booked Jeremy Borash v James Mitchell v Don West in an Ultimate X match it wouldn't garner much interest I would imagine, whereas Christopher Daniels v AJ Styles v Chris Sabin would. My point being it is important these days as to who the wrestler in the stip match is, Mick Foley in a Bra & Panties would turn people away in droves whereas advertised in a Hell In A Cell it would do tremendous....... Now I know this sounds crazy because it would be impossibke to code but I was thinking advanced booked stip matches could be linked to not only the workers popularity but his stats, for eg. Booking Foley in a HIAC match wouldn't just draw because of his popularity but also his "Brawling" stat being so high (could even be broadened to "Rumble" stat) would add to the match heat. Another example is a Hardcore match, if both particapnts booked had C popularity overall and their feud was averaging C the match could draw up to a B heat rating simply because both guys have an A* rating Harcore stat.
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[QUOTE=TeemuFoundation;135905]If you van honestly say that you would buy a PPV that is headlined by an Elimination Chamber match that includes the Great Khali, Undertaker, Big Show, Kane, Mark Henry and Viscera, you truly ARE a hardcore fan of the WWE. I must say. You would pay to see Mickie James and Trish, not the Buck Naked match. By default, someone who thinks these two divas are hot, would probably pay for a Singles match between these two as well. I hope you get my point.[/QUOTE] I'm sure there is a good chance a person that thinks those 2 are hot would rather see them naked than just wrestle a regular 1 on 1 match. But, you do have a really good point about the Chamber. I consider this match my favorite gimmick match and I was going to say before that I'd like to see it no matter who was involved. But if you put about a ton and a quarter (literally, do the math) of mostly big, ugly, non-athleticism like those 6 worker's, I'm not sure I would even watch it if someone else paid for it.
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[QUOTE=CarlitoCoool;135917]If you booked Jeremy Borash v James Mitchell v Don West in an Ultimate X match it wouldn't garner much interest Now I know this sounds crazy because it would be impossibke to code but I was thinking advanced booked stip matches could be linked to not only the workers popularity but his stats, for eg. Booking Foley in a HIAC match wouldn't just draw because of his popularity but also his "Brawling" stat being so high (could even be broadened to "Rumble" stat) would add to the match heat. Another example is a Hardcore match, if both particapnts booked had C popularity overall and their feud was averaging C the match could draw up to a B heat rating simply because both guys have an A* rating Harcore stat.[/QUOTE] 1) I would pay to see that, just to see if one of them kills themselves. 2) that is a great Idea. It's true that after Mick Foley's history that if he went into a Hell In The Cell that EVEN I would buy it, and I am cheap. No matter what am I buying Foley/ Flair I quit.
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[QUOTE=The Franchise;136041]I'm curious if Advance Bookings will gain and/or lose heat based on how they're built up. I would love to build up a mild, midcard match into something I could headline with.[/QUOTE] Booya! I'd love to see the heat for advance booked matches be more fluid than they are in 05. As it stands now, it's best to advance book a match either at the last minute (day of the show) or at some point way in advance when all the participants are at their peak momentum/overness. Plus, I dunno how it is for anyone else, but advance booking midcard matches seems pointless since they never have enough overness to make for good match heat. I've had two midcarders in an A* rated storyline with A and B+ momentum advance booked for a match on a PPV and gotten only B- heat. That's good, don't get me wrong, but I think there are often midcard matches that come with A* heat when advance booked. Put 'TLC' together with any combination of the Dudleyz, Hardyz, and/or Edge & Christian (back in the day) and that would make for an A* heat match. It's also possible to have surprises (like the MITB TLC match at Mania turned out A LOT better than I expected). wooodaddy has a point as well. It would be great to be able to cancel or modify advance booked matches also. That's been known to happen in reality (and not just involving WWE) where matches are changed/improved upon after the initial announcement. Like, a singles match turns into a triple threat and later a stip is thrown in to sweeten it even more.
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[QUOTE=Remianen;136068] wooodaddy has a point as well. It would be great to be able to cancel or modify advance booked matches also. That's been known to happen in reality (and not just involving WWE) where matches are changed/improved upon after the initial announcement. Like, a singles match turns into a triple threat and later a stip is thrown in to sweeten it even more.[/QUOTE] Exactly, I hate like heck to book the guy twice in a show and have to disappoint my fans.... your idea is a nice bonus, and i like it a lot
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[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;135578]No. I have an old-school view that people pay to see the wrestlers involved, not the matches *. I think adding gimmick matches can make for better matches, and can add some interest for existing fans, but if Joe Public doesn't want to see Undertaker vs Big Show, it doesn't matter if you put them in a Hell In A Cell, a Punjabi Prison match, or anything else, the gimmick won't cause them to start watching. Therefore attendance and buy rate wouldn't be effected, as it's only the loyal core audience - who would be there anyway - who are going to be extra interested. * The rare exception being the Royal Rumble.[/QUOTE] This just isn't true. HITC matches draw great numbers and there is a reason territories used to book cage matches to blow off feuds. These matches mean something.
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Yeah, they do mean something, nobody is disputing that. A match inside a cage means more than a regular one on one. But if the fued was so good that it requires a cage match for the blowoff, chances are you're going to buy the PPV to see the two guys fight. Whether it's in a cage or a cell or not. The stipulation adds to the drama/intensity/grandeur of the situation, but doesn't really affect the buyrate that much. Except, as has been said, the Royal Rumble. There are very, very few examples where the type of match is more over than the people wrestling in it. TLC matches probably sold more tickets than the Hardyz ever did, for example, but at the end of the day if people are buying your PPV soley for a midcard tag team match, you don't deserve a good buyrate :p Probably the only real examples of Main Events that have been sold on the stipulations more than the wrestlers involved, are the Triple Cage Match (which is really, really clutching at straws) and the Elimination Chamber. Aswell as the aforementioned Royal Rumble. If they don't care about Big Show vs Kamala, they're not going to care about Big Show vs Kamala in a Cage. If they really want to see Angle vs Benoit in a HiaC, they'll want to see Angle vs Benoit without it just as much if you've done your job properly.
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[QUOTE=D-Lyrium;136481]Yeah, they do mean something, nobody is disputing that. A match inside a cage means more than a regular one on one. But if the fued was so good that it requires a cage match for the blowoff, chances are you're going to buy the PPV to see the two guys fight. Whether it's in a cage or a cell or not. The stipulation adds to the drama/intensity/grandeur of the situation, but doesn't really affect the buyrate that much. Except, as has been said, the Royal Rumble. There are very, very few examples where the type of match is more over than the people wrestling in it. TLC matches probably sold more tickets than the Hardyz ever did, for example, but at the end of the day if people are buying your PPV soley for a midcard tag team match, you don't deserve a good buyrate :p Probably the only real examples of Main Events that have been sold on the stipulations more than the wrestlers involved, are the Triple Cage Match (which is really, really clutching at straws) and the Elimination Chamber. Aswell as the aforementioned Royal Rumble. If they don't care about Big Show vs Kamala, they're not going to care about Big Show vs Kamala in a Cage. If they really want to see Angle vs Benoit in a HiaC, they'll want to see Angle vs Benoit without it just as much if you've done your job properly.[/QUOTE] I have to disagree with you D, as I said before, JBL v Big Show feud had very little heat but once the WWE announced the Barb Wire they still drew an acceptable buy rate, it can be said for many feuds that is the case. My main point is even with an old school view on it, let's take WCW in the late 80's for example, the promotion were not advertising cage matches, they were advertising Ric Flair in cage matches, a guy the people knew would bleed and bump all over the place. Had WCW advertised Tim Horner v Gladiator #1 they would not have sold an extra ticket.
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[QUOTE=D-Lyrium;136481]Yeah, they do mean something, nobody is disputing that. A match inside a cage means more than a regular one on one. But if the fued was so good that it requires a cage match for the blowoff, chances are you're going to buy the PPV to see the two guys fight. Whether it's in a cage or a cell or not. The stipulation adds to the drama/intensity/grandeur of the situation, but doesn't really affect the buyrate that much. Except, as has been said, the Royal Rumble. There are very, very few examples where the type of match is more over than the people wrestling in it. TLC matches probably sold more tickets than the Hardyz ever did, for example, but at the end of the day if people are buying your PPV soley for a midcard tag team match, you don't deserve a good buyrate :p[/QUOTE] I can't agree with this for me. When thinking of the buying habits of myself and many of my friends (several of whom own bars who you'd think this would be a business decision for), that's the case for them but not for me. For them, it's a case of buying the event that people will want to see as well. I haven't purchased a WWE PPV event in like 2 years, because they don't appeal to me at all. There's just not $30-40 worth of entertainment value in them to me. They're not the least bit compelling enough for me to want to spend the money JUST so I can watch it at home. I've SEEN several of the PPVs (having friends who own bars who order them helps lots :p) but as for me paying the cost? Nah. By contrast, I've purchased several TNA PPVs over the last year and I don't even KNOW most of their workers. Ultimate X match? Buy. House of Fun match? Buy. Punjabi Prison match? Pass (but that's because I knew one of the workers scheduled to be in the match sucks). So yeah, for many people, putting the Undertaker in a PPV match is enough to sell it. Or Triple H or DX or Cena or Edge or whoever else. But for other people, it's the match type or the history of the match type that sells the event far moreso than the people involved. Given the history of the Hell in a Cell match, do you think WWE is going to put Batista & Khali in one? Using your TLC comment, how many folks are going to buy Batista v Khali v Lashley in a TLC match? But in the end, this is totally unproveable because if there was a company who could guarantee a certain buyrate just by following a particular formula, that formula would be patented/copyrighted and that company's market value would exceed that of Berkshire Hathaway and Microsoft (probably combined).
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I would think the best way that all of this could be done is to have the match type be a multiplier of or the heat for the two wrestlers. Say Randy Orton vs. John Cena has a B- heat. RO vs. JC in a cage B heat. RO vs. JC. in a Hell in the Cell A heat. Something like that anyways. Where the stipulation has an effect on the outcome. Like with the previously mentioned match of the big men in the Elimantion Chamber. I'd rather watch them in and Elimantion Chamber then just a standarded 6 man match. Get my point!
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[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;135578]No. I have an old-school view that people pay to see the wrestlers involved, not the matches *.[/QUOTE] I have to disagree with that. Back in the day in the states, Gimmick Matches were a big deal. Whenever there was a Cage Match ticket prices would increase and ticket sales would increase, I suppose you can say the Workers helped it get over, But the Cage Match helped just as much. I mean, Watch the ROH Straight Shootin' with Bobby Heenan and Jim Cornette Vol. 3. You can clearly see has they are going through old event posters that Gimmick Matches were a big deal.
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