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adam will you have some sort of hidden dream match stat?


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say for like samoa joe vs angle rey vs sabu? hogan vs austin i was thinking that this could be good for a promotion to have a dream match on its card. ofcourse this would have to be based on all sorts of factors overness career high;lihgts. such as championships promotions worked skills and factors that can affect it would be relationships of course. say angles in wwe and samoa joe in tna. they are both major promotions and fans around the world would want these 2 to have a match and it would just be huge. but of course than cannot. but say a contract expires or the promotion has arelationship with your promotion. you sign the match dream matchs should have an extra level of hype from the crowed of course u cant always guarante a dream match example hogan vs austin its the match everyone wants, but neither of these men woudl lay down for the other. they both have done everything in the buisness and are very old school when it comes to taking a loss. and even dislike each other but now you would need ways to work around that. money. money can motivate almost anything. now if they ont do it for money then company loyalty could come into play also. they might just have love for the buisness and be professional just for one night for the good of the buisness and company. as well as giving the rest of the roster a large audience to view them. sorry for alot of stuff not being properly typed. i'm just typing random thoughts. i might edit it later.
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[QUOTE=DodgyDavid;157227]tip, don't just write random thoughts! Anyhoo, I doubt this will be added considering that Adam uses and made cornellverse, so putting in stuff like that would be a problem.[/QUOTE] I'm sure there is some dream match's in the Cornellverse as well, or is it ran totally different, and I'm just unaware of it? I aggree about the post being kind of hard to decipher (random thoughts), but I think I get the overall feel of it, correct me if I'm wrong. What the OP is asking for is some kind of enhancement/pull encentive, for an understandable match up that just has not been able to happen, for reasons such as being in different promotions, brands or just any reason whatsoever (maybe a teaser in the same promotion that never happens). To help the OP out, since all the stuff is in for this go round of TEW (the 2007 version), with only little enhancements being made to correct small glitch's and things of this nature. You can achieve something similar, by making a good storyline, where the two eventually (maybe after a VERY long time, maybe after 3 or 4 weeks) end up in a huge match up. The only problem I can foresee in doing something like this (you must use the right people in the storylines, number one, don't want heat being lost), is when they eventually do get together, if they don't match up.... You know the little comments like "Such and such just didn't seem to click, they don't work together and it hurt the match". However, if your story is solid, and the crowd is ready for it, it don't matter how bad the match ends up, your crowd will love it, and you can still get an a or A+ out of it. Don't forget to Pre-Book it far in advance, so they are really ready for it when it finally comes.
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[QUOTE=DodgyDavid;157227]tip, don't just write random thoughts! Anyhoo, I doubt this will be added considering that Adam uses and made cornellverse, so putting in stuff like that would be a problem.[/QUOTE] I'm sure there is some dream match's in the Cornellverse as well, or is it ran totally different, and I'm just unaware of it? I aggree about the post being kind of hard to decipher (random thoughts), but I think I get the overall feel of it, correct me if I'm wrong. What the OP is asking for is some kind of enhancement/pull encentive, for an understandable match up that just has not been able to happen, for reasons such as being in different promotions, brands or just any reason whatsoever (maybe a teaser in the same promotion that never happens). To help the OP out, since all the stuff is in for this go round of TEW (the 2007 version), with only little enhancements being made to correct small glitch's and things of this nature. You can achieve something similar, by making a good storyline, where the two eventually (maybe after a VERY long time, maybe after 3 or 4 weeks) end up in a huge match up. The only problem I can foresee in doing something like this (you must use the right people in the storylines, number one, don't want heat being lost), is when they eventually do get together, if they don't match up.... You know the little comments like "Such and such just didn't seem to click, they don't work together and it hurt the match". However, if your story is solid, and the crowd is ready for it, it don't matter how bad the match ends up, your crowd will love it, and you can still get an a or A+ out of it. Don't forget to Pre-Book it far in advance, so they are really ready for it when it finally comes.
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[QUOTE=djthefunkchris;157230]I'm sure there is some dream match's in the Cornellverse as well, or is it ran totally different, and I'm just unaware of it?[/QUOTE] I could be wrong but I think the idea of pre-programmed dream matches goes against Adam's desire to maintain some randomness to every game so it's not always the same. This is why worker chemistry is random. Predetermined dream matches would almost HAVE to be exceptions for worker chemistry because bad chemistry between workers can wreck a match's quality. That is, unless the match takes place in an SE fed where only overness matters. But do you see the variables involved with designing a hardcoded dream match? Fed type, worker skill, worker overness, just to name a few. All of those things can change whether a dream match is truly a dream match.
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[QUOTE=djthefunkchris;157230]I'm sure there is some dream match's in the Cornellverse as well, or is it ran totally different, and I'm just unaware of it?[/QUOTE] I could be wrong but I think the idea of pre-programmed dream matches goes against Adam's desire to maintain some randomness to every game so it's not always the same. This is why worker chemistry is random. Predetermined dream matches would almost HAVE to be exceptions for worker chemistry because bad chemistry between workers can wreck a match's quality. That is, unless the match takes place in an SE fed where only overness matters. But do you see the variables involved with designing a hardcoded dream match? Fed type, worker skill, worker overness, just to name a few. All of those things can change whether a dream match is truly a dream match.
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[QUOTE=Remianen;157268]I could be wrong but I think the idea of pre-programmed dream matches goes against Adam's desire to maintain some randomness to every game so it's not always the same. This is why worker chemistry is random. Predetermined dream matches would almost HAVE to be exceptions for worker chemistry because bad chemistry between workers can wreck a match's quality. That is, unless the match takes place in an SE fed where only overness matters. But do you see the variables involved with designing a hardcoded dream match? Fed type, worker skill, worker overness, just to name a few. All of those things can change whether a dream match is truly a dream match.[/QUOTE] Oh for sure. I have seen many posts like yours and understood them as well (Although, just might have been a post by you before too:-). Just so many posts, I'm sure the OP hasn't been as fortunate as I have to see the same ones I have. I don't want someone with ideas to get discouraged and maybe not post a Great idea that no one else has thought of before. The only thing that I haven't seen though, is just why it couldn't be random, and.... ongoing. I understand the Pre-determining thing for sure, don't get me wrong. However, something that was done at random, on say the first of every month, or the 1st of every year, or maybe every 200 match's. I don't know how it would work, but there has to be a way (not for this one, but maybe next one) that this could be achieved without it being at the start of the game. Maybe after two or three years, the websight starts a column about "dream Matchups" and has there own little simulation of it, in the form of a write up of how they think it would go. I just think some of these ideas, including the OP's, gets thrown to the side, simply because it hasn't been done before, and there has been a well thought out debate to it in the past. Sometimes not everything is thought of, and I believe this one has always been only looked at from the same exact side of the line (at least in all the posts I have read so far, might be others that already covered this). For the most part, every idea I have seen is totally do-able. However, the questions are, would it enhance the game play? Would it help achieve the goals of the designer? Can the goal be achieved in a reasonable time frame? Is it a "believable" idea? I believe in every mod, including the Cornelverse, that it would be very believable if the program would be able to come up with a believable "Dream Match", even if it only happens once or twice a year. With the other additions that were added, such as the websight coming back, the big names effecting events, and such, this could be something added as well. I know it's too late for this version, but it's something that should probably be thought about more for the next version. If the programming of the game allowed for it to overide the random "chemistry" over time, with the "dream match" being something like Samoa Joe vs. Kurt Angle scenario (top two Sports Entertainment promotions, having their bassically best go head to head). Of course, once they are in the same promotion, and you know its going to happen, it's not really a "dream" anymore... so there is this as well, lol. In other words, the Dream match would only be good for ONE match (my opinion, others might not think so). Afterwards, we seen it already, so it's not really a dream. Maybe after a few years, like 3 or 4, of them not fighting, it could very well end up a dream match again. The randomness would have to come over time in the game. I can see exactly where your coming from, if the game had to decide all the dream matchs at the start of the game. What if it didn't do it till after a six month period, or just in January, running side by side with the awards and top 100 workers? Just a few thoughts on it. I am perfectly fine doing it the alternative way I use now, by using storylines to create momentum, and having it climax with the two workers facing each other (not really facing each other till the end of the storyline).
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[QUOTE=Remianen;157268]I could be wrong but I think the idea of pre-programmed dream matches goes against Adam's desire to maintain some randomness to every game so it's not always the same. This is why worker chemistry is random. Predetermined dream matches would almost HAVE to be exceptions for worker chemistry because bad chemistry between workers can wreck a match's quality. That is, unless the match takes place in an SE fed where only overness matters. But do you see the variables involved with designing a hardcoded dream match? Fed type, worker skill, worker overness, just to name a few. All of those things can change whether a dream match is truly a dream match.[/QUOTE] Oh for sure. I have seen many posts like yours and understood them as well (Although, just might have been a post by you before too:-). Just so many posts, I'm sure the OP hasn't been as fortunate as I have to see the same ones I have. I don't want someone with ideas to get discouraged and maybe not post a Great idea that no one else has thought of before. The only thing that I haven't seen though, is just why it couldn't be random, and.... ongoing. I understand the Pre-determining thing for sure, don't get me wrong. However, something that was done at random, on say the first of every month, or the 1st of every year, or maybe every 200 match's. I don't know how it would work, but there has to be a way (not for this one, but maybe next one) that this could be achieved without it being at the start of the game. Maybe after two or three years, the websight starts a column about "dream Matchups" and has there own little simulation of it, in the form of a write up of how they think it would go. I just think some of these ideas, including the OP's, gets thrown to the side, simply because it hasn't been done before, and there has been a well thought out debate to it in the past. Sometimes not everything is thought of, and I believe this one has always been only looked at from the same exact side of the line (at least in all the posts I have read so far, might be others that already covered this). For the most part, every idea I have seen is totally do-able. However, the questions are, would it enhance the game play? Would it help achieve the goals of the designer? Can the goal be achieved in a reasonable time frame? Is it a "believable" idea? I believe in every mod, including the Cornelverse, that it would be very believable if the program would be able to come up with a believable "Dream Match", even if it only happens once or twice a year. With the other additions that were added, such as the websight coming back, the big names effecting events, and such, this could be something added as well. I know it's too late for this version, but it's something that should probably be thought about more for the next version. If the programming of the game allowed for it to overide the random "chemistry" over time, with the "dream match" being something like Samoa Joe vs. Kurt Angle scenario (top two Sports Entertainment promotions, having their bassically best go head to head). Of course, once they are in the same promotion, and you know its going to happen, it's not really a "dream" anymore... so there is this as well, lol. In other words, the Dream match would only be good for ONE match (my opinion, others might not think so). Afterwards, we seen it already, so it's not really a dream. Maybe after a few years, like 3 or 4, of them not fighting, it could very well end up a dream match again. The randomness would have to come over time in the game. I can see exactly where your coming from, if the game had to decide all the dream matchs at the start of the game. What if it didn't do it till after a six month period, or just in January, running side by side with the awards and top 100 workers? Just a few thoughts on it. I am perfectly fine doing it the alternative way I use now, by using storylines to create momentum, and having it climax with the two workers facing each other (not really facing each other till the end of the storyline).
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I think you misunderstood me. It's not that I don't like the idea on some level. But a big part of me agrees with Adam in that every game should be different from other games. Even though I generally play ONE game to the exclusion of all others, I can see the merits of ensuring that you don't feel as comfortable from one savegame to the next. Your suggestion sounds great but can already be done in 05. I make dream matches every single show, without exception. Nemesis vs Mariko Yoshida? Done! Sensational Ogiwara vs Mariko Yoshida? Done! Nemesis vs Terry Funk in a Japanese Barbed Wire Death Match? Doin' it tomorrow! The problem with "dream matches" is that they're highly subjective and on top of that, they're fairly easy to bring about. One of the only reasons Angle-Joe was a dream match, in my view, is because folks thought it would never happen. It's the forbidden fruit phenomenon (People always want what they "can't" have). But adding the random element to it would be awesome but it would also stand to annoy a lot of people, I'd wager. When your "dream" Angle-Joe match crashes and burns because they have bad chemistry and/or they aren't the 'dream' combination in your promotion or the world, it could upset a lot of folks looking to re-create that dream scenario. I don't mind either way, to be honest. I don't think 07 is going to be SO different that the basic rules of booking logic will no longer apply (read: I'm fairly sure Adam isn't turning 07 into 'WWE Booking 101'). Dream matches should be rare and they shouldn't be announced in any way to the booker. Sure, the fans may want to see a certain match but that shouldn't automatically make it a dream match. Besides, like you said, dream matches usually come about from workers that have a low likelihood of ever meeting. Once they're in the same promotion, is it still a dream match since folks can pretty much guess that it's going to happen?
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I think you misunderstood me. It's not that I don't like the idea on some level. But a big part of me agrees with Adam in that every game should be different from other games. Even though I generally play ONE game to the exclusion of all others, I can see the merits of ensuring that you don't feel as comfortable from one savegame to the next. Your suggestion sounds great but can already be done in 05. I make dream matches every single show, without exception. Nemesis vs Mariko Yoshida? Done! Sensational Ogiwara vs Mariko Yoshida? Done! Nemesis vs Terry Funk in a Japanese Barbed Wire Death Match? Doin' it tomorrow! The problem with "dream matches" is that they're highly subjective and on top of that, they're fairly easy to bring about. One of the only reasons Angle-Joe was a dream match, in my view, is because folks thought it would never happen. It's the forbidden fruit phenomenon (People always want what they "can't" have). But adding the random element to it would be awesome but it would also stand to annoy a lot of people, I'd wager. When your "dream" Angle-Joe match crashes and burns because they have bad chemistry and/or they aren't the 'dream' combination in your promotion or the world, it could upset a lot of folks looking to re-create that dream scenario. I don't mind either way, to be honest. I don't think 07 is going to be SO different that the basic rules of booking logic will no longer apply (read: I'm fairly sure Adam isn't turning 07 into 'WWE Booking 101'). Dream matches should be rare and they shouldn't be announced in any way to the booker. Sure, the fans may want to see a certain match but that shouldn't automatically make it a dream match. Besides, like you said, dream matches usually come about from workers that have a low likelihood of ever meeting. Once they're in the same promotion, is it still a dream match since folks can pretty much guess that it's going to happen?
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Exactly. I was worried you weren't getting what I was saying till the last paragraph. All I'm trying to do is find an option of how to utilize it so that it confirms to what your saying (backing Adam on) about not having the same game over and over, and always being unique. It's why the suggestion to wait till the first of the year, or some other date, to actually have it even compute... The Randomness would only be superficial (it would appear random). I would expect a check on stats/overness/match's/perhaps style, weight, and other elements to be figured into the equation to find the best match ups. The reason for the waiting a year, is so most of the workers (meaning working wrestlers) do not have the exact same stats they started the game with, and so would not be easy to just make two workers with identical stats/elements to make an easy "Dream Match" appear. I like the Websight thing. This might actually have a varience of what we are talking about in it. I remember the EWR one, where it would give you the top 5 brawlers, or technicians, etc.. and if you happened to have two of the five, booking them in a match would almost certainly give something of a "Dream Match" effect, in the fact that you got a very high rated match, even if they were not very popular/over wrestlers. Like I said, I'm trying to help an idea that I can see both sides on, and try to appease the other side, while still keeping the original idea.
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Exactly. I was worried you weren't getting what I was saying till the last paragraph. All I'm trying to do is find an option of how to utilize it so that it confirms to what your saying (backing Adam on) about not having the same game over and over, and always being unique. It's why the suggestion to wait till the first of the year, or some other date, to actually have it even compute... The Randomness would only be superficial (it would appear random). I would expect a check on stats/overness/match's/perhaps style, weight, and other elements to be figured into the equation to find the best match ups. The reason for the waiting a year, is so most of the workers (meaning working wrestlers) do not have the exact same stats they started the game with, and so would not be easy to just make two workers with identical stats/elements to make an easy "Dream Match" appear. I like the Websight thing. This might actually have a varience of what we are talking about in it. I remember the EWR one, where it would give you the top 5 brawlers, or technicians, etc.. and if you happened to have two of the five, booking them in a match would almost certainly give something of a "Dream Match" effect, in the fact that you got a very high rated match, even if they were not very popular/over wrestlers. Like I said, I'm trying to help an idea that I can see both sides on, and try to appease the other side, while still keeping the original idea.
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This could be brought in by using the stats as markers. If, ofr instance, two workers work for two different promotions for a long period of time, are never in the same promotion during that time, have never faced each other in the ring, and have similar wrestling styles, putting them in the ring the [i]first[/i] time would count as a "dream match".
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This could be brought in by using the stats as markers. If, ofr instance, two workers work for two different promotions for a long period of time, are never in the same promotion during that time, have never faced each other in the ring, and have similar wrestling styles, putting them in the ring the [i]first[/i] time would count as a "dream match".
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So I don't come here very often, and I have even fewer posts. I think that the dream match concept is really good, yet isn't going to work out well when/if it's ever implemented. I could be wrong. I base my thinking off the many dream matches WCW killed, and also the big dream matches that the WWF DID deliver on, BIG TIME. But, once they were done a second time, the luster wore off. It's a one-time every 10 years deal at best.
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So I don't come here very often, and I have even fewer posts. I think that the dream match concept is really good, yet isn't going to work out well when/if it's ever implemented. I could be wrong. I base my thinking off the many dream matches WCW killed, and also the big dream matches that the WWF DID deliver on, BIG TIME. But, once they were done a second time, the luster wore off. It's a one-time every 10 years deal at best.
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I agree with the thoughts above that 'dream match' would fall under chemistry randomness, which is a good thing. Ric Flair and Sting obviously had great chemistry in the NWA and WCW. But how was Dusty Rhodes (or whoever it was who booked them) to know that they'd have great chemistry? He took a punt. Much like you do in TEW. The punt paid off. Sometimes they don't, as is the case in professional wrestling. If you find something good for no particular reason, roll with it, or words to that effect are one of the hints that come up on the loading pages and its quite correct of not only TEW, but professional wrestling in general. There's not always a rhyme or reason as to why one man gets over, or why two wrestlers just click or don't click, its fate in many ways and the random chemistry best replicates that.
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I agree with the thoughts above that 'dream match' would fall under chemistry randomness, which is a good thing. Ric Flair and Sting obviously had great chemistry in the NWA and WCW. But how was Dusty Rhodes (or whoever it was who booked them) to know that they'd have great chemistry? He took a punt. Much like you do in TEW. The punt paid off. Sometimes they don't, as is the case in professional wrestling. If you find something good for no particular reason, roll with it, or words to that effect are one of the hints that come up on the loading pages and its quite correct of not only TEW, but professional wrestling in general. There's not always a rhyme or reason as to why one man gets over, or why two wrestlers just click or don't click, its fate in many ways and the random chemistry best replicates that.
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[QUOTE=Remianen;157268]I could be wrong but I think the idea of pre-programmed dream matches goes against Adam's desire to maintain some randomness to every game so it's not always the same. This is why worker chemistry is random. Predetermined dream matches would almost HAVE to be exceptions for worker chemistry because bad chemistry between workers can wreck a match's quality. [B]That is, unless the match takes place in an SE fed where only overness matters[/B]. But do you see the variables involved with designing a hardcoded dream match? Fed type, worker skill, worker overness, just to name a few. All of those things can change whether a dream match is truly a dream match.[/QUOTE] I'm learning new things off you every day it seems - so in summing up, if you have a tag team that your road agent notes has no chemistry, it has little effect in a SE promotion?
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[QUOTE=Remianen;157268]I could be wrong but I think the idea of pre-programmed dream matches goes against Adam's desire to maintain some randomness to every game so it's not always the same. This is why worker chemistry is random. Predetermined dream matches would almost HAVE to be exceptions for worker chemistry because bad chemistry between workers can wreck a match's quality. [B]That is, unless the match takes place in an SE fed where only overness matters[/B]. But do you see the variables involved with designing a hardcoded dream match? Fed type, worker skill, worker overness, just to name a few. All of those things can change whether a dream match is truly a dream match.[/QUOTE] I'm learning new things off you every day it seems - so in summing up, if you have a tag team that your road agent notes has no chemistry, it has little effect in a SE promotion?
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