My opinions so far

[Cathcart Chiswick]

And there [I]is[/I] a bear hug with a success rate -- Marat Khoklov has one. If you want to make a character who uses a bear hug as a finisher, make one. The fact remains, none of the non-player characters in the game [I]except [/I]Khoklov (as far as I know -- there might be another trademark I missed) use the bear hug to finish matches. Same thing with Rhino Umaga's Boston crab, etc. (And by "etc.", I mean "I couldn't find a wrestler in the database whose trademark move was a full nelson, and that's just as well, really".)

[Adam Ryland]

[QUOTE=Cathcart Chiswick](And by "etc.", I mean "I couldn't find a wrestler in the database whose trademark move was a full nelson, and that's just as well, really".)[/QUOTE] Puerto Rican Power and T-Rex. The previous posts are correct, creating trademark moves for submissions is the sensible approach.

[masterofnone]

[QUOTE=Beeker]The bearhug last finished someone off when Brock Lesnar locked one on Hulk Hogan then smeared the blood across his chest. But that was more for the visual impact than being a legitimate submission. The boston crab hasn't been credible since the days of Rick Martel in the AWA. Yes, Jericho uses (used) an elevated boston crab (which depending on his motivation varied wildly from savage to sloppy looking) but I think that's a seperate hold in the game. (I've only played a few games so far.) And the full nelson hasn't been a viable finisher since the epic Billy Jack Haynes/Hercules match at Wrestlemania III. And I'm well aware that Chris Masters has attempted to make the Maserlock a viable finisher, but that just hasn't worked in my opinion.[/QUOTE] But they don't use the "Bear Hug", "Boston Crab" and "Full Nelson" - those are the "Brock Lock '02", "Walls of Jericho" and "Masterlock".

[Beeker]

[QUOTE=masterofnone]But they don't use the "Bear Hug", "Boston Crab" and "Full Nelson" - those are the "Brock Lock '02", "Walls of Jericho" and "Masterlock".[/QUOTE] The Brock Lock 02 is actually the Stretch Muffler. I don't think they named the Bearhug he used. Maybe the Bear Brock Hug or something equally silly. But that was the point I was trying to make was that making it a Signature Move or Trademarked Move means those moves damiende suggested as being 'submissions' are just that. I just didn't explicitly state that, which I suppose I should have. Going back to cainekiss' opinion on the ref checking each and ever (rest) submission hold. Sartagis answered this before you asked it. Due to it being "legitimate wrestling" it is not shoot fighting. And I've seen/watched my fair share of indy stuff; the ref 'lifting the arm three times' usually to allow a babyface rally or to draw the crowd into the match. Occasionally there is the Main Event Sleeper (see Triple H a few years back... I think Jeff Hardy and Spike Dudley went out to it.) Due to WS II being a hybrid of wrestling and shoot fighting, I think a bit of creative discretion by Adam means that you can imply the ref is checking each hold, even if the game doesn't explicitly tell the player so. In fact, I think we're both seeing the same point here. An enjoyable (and customizable) wrestling/fighting simulator game.

[masterofnone]

I think both the bear hug (02) and the Stretch Muffler (03-04) were called the Brock Lock when Lesnar used them, which is why I included the year to differentiate :D But my point remains: They were signature holds of the wrestlers, not just some regular guy slapping one on.

[The Humanoid Typhoon]

It was just called a Bear Hug. I have the match.