chris caulfield Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Just thought I'd create a thread so everyone could give their opinions about the fights. I thought despite not having much hype this was an awesome card for fights. The main event was amazing and is a possible candidate for fight of the year. Nog looked like his old self and if it was anyone but Couture that he was fighting he probably would of finished it. Would love to see him fight winner of Lesnar vs. Carwin. Thiago Silva impressed me against Jardine but I still think he needs another few wins to get back near contendership. Rosholt really impressed me against Leben, not so much in the first two rounds but in the third where his corner told him to get the finish and he just went in there and did it. He could of had a first round finish if he did what he did in the third. Maia really dissapointed me with his gameplan. Why would he try and stand for any ammount of time with Marquardt when the only way he was going to finish it was on the ground. The actual finish was amazing and props to Marquardt but did Maia really think he was going to land the head kick on Marquardt? The other fights were good aswell. Vera got a win but I still want to see more from him at light heavyweight. Duffee and Simpson both looked like complete beasts especially Duffee with that brutal KO for the record. Was also impressed with Dunham etting the win over Aurelio so he is one to watch now. Would like to see the Gonzaga vs. Tuchscherer as it sounds like a great win for Gonzaga. So what did you guys think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 1. Couture/Noogueira was simply phenomenal. Fight of the Year, and one of the greatest fights in MMA history. 2. Thiago Silva/Jardine didn't surprise me. I picked Jardine, but his chin and Silva's power/aggression made it a shaky pick. Pretty standard. 3. Rosholt did impress me. Still don't think he will ever be anything great, but nice to see improvement. 4. Maia really dissapointed me with his gameplan. All fights start standing and if you have watched his past fights he doesn't mind to throw a few before attempting a takedown/clinch/pulling guard. And while Marquardt does have good striking it's not like he is known for killing anyone, but he may start getting that reputation after a 3rd straight (T)KO - this was his first legit KO since 2003 and probably against the first outright legit opponent. This is exactly what I told Josh Gross a couple weeks ago when he asked about Maia/Silva and I said I didn't want it unlike all the hype surrounding Maia - he's simply not ready for the upper echilon fighters yet. Thankfully, Nate ended all the hype last night and Maia will go back to training. Good performance by Vera, but I was slightly disappointed in the fight. Figured both guys would come out a bit more aggressive and have a great fight. Decent fight nonetheless. Simpson looked fine, Duffee got the "record" for fastest KO even though it's not really the fastest in UFC history. He's apprently asked to be fast tracked in the division so we'll see who is next for him. And Dunham had a good fight vs. Aurelio but it is nothing super spectacular, but another solid win for the prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_w_w Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 I enjoyed the card. Pleasantly surprised with Rosholt, but kind of expected it I guess - Leben seems to have peaked (at a pretty low level). Not terribly surprised about Maia. Personally, I don't fault his gameplan, as Nate is good enough that he couldn't just shoot in and take him down. So, he had to strike with a bit to try to lull him in for the takedown. What I fault him with, however, is really, really poor striking skills. The leg kick was badly telegraphed. Against someone of Marquart's skill level, that's just asking for a clean of shot to the face. Jardine & Silva... sigh. Jardine is the definition of unreliable. The Vera fight (not going to pretend I can spell the other guy's name) was fairly disappointing to me. Nog & Couture was fun. Glad that match finally happened. Edit: and /sigh @ Aurelio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RennikKain076 Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Great Card, I loved the main event both Nog and Couture gave it all they had and Nog showed that he is still very much a serious threat to Lesnar or Carwin as long as he's healthy. I hope they match him up with the winner of that fight early next year. I think Nog takes a beating but i'll pick him to beat either one of them. If he wants another fight before next year i'd love to see him rematch Frank Mir. I think a healthy Nog beats Mir comfortably. Thiago Silva looked impressive his striking has improved quite well. It wouldnt shock me if he breaks into the top five at 205 within a year especially if he gets matched up with Forrest Griffin. I cant help but shake my head when I see Jardine fight that guys striking is so sloppy. He comes and just windmills all these crazy punches like he thinks he's in a video game. Couple that with a below average chin and any aggressive opponent with some power is going to put this guy to sleep. It kinda sucks that Maia vs Marquardt ended so quickly I wouldve loved to see it hit the ground at least once but Nate did what he had to do great win. Marquardt gets my vote for the next title shot at Silva, let Hendo and Okami (if he beats Sonnen) fight for the next shot. Although if Silva moves up to fight Frank Mir Hendo vs Marquardt would be great. Brandon Vera wins but I dont really have much to say about it, i'd like to see Vera come out more aggresive in the future. Rosholt was very impressive he's improving quickly as an athlete of his calibur should. I look forward to seeing him fight in the near future. Duffee looks like a beast cant wait to see him fight again, Simpson looked very good against Herman, and Gonzaga solidified his spot as a dangerous gate keeper to the top level as he took apart Tuchscherer. I havent seen the Aurelio vs Dunham fight yet but it sounds like Dunham soundly beat him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 If he wants another fight before next year i'd love to see him rematch Frank Mir. I think a healthy Nog beats Mir comfortably. Mir vs. Kongo in November. Mir wanted to accept Anderson's challenge but they told him to focus on Kongo. I havent seen the Aurelio vs Dunham fight yet but it sounds like Dunham soundly beat him. Split decision, Round Two would have been the swing round. As for Hendo/Nate/Silva. It's no-fault booking no matter what the UFC does. Either we get Anderson at 205 while those two fight, or we get one of those while the other fights someone respectable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigpapa42 Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Quite enjoyed the event. The Couture-Nogueira was everything I had hoped for and more. Classic fight. An absolute war between two warriors. Amused to see Tim Hague dropped that quickly. Never thought he should be in the UFC in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RennikKain076 Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Mir vs. Kongo in November. Mir wanted to accept Anderson's challenge but they told him to focus on Kongo. Split decision, Round Two would have been the swing round. As for Hendo/Nate/Silva. It's no-fault booking no matter what the UFC does. Either we get Anderson at 205 while those two fight, or we get one of those while the other fights someone respectable. I know he's booked to fight Kongo but the UFC could always get Kongo a diffrent opponent probably wont happen but I can hope. I think Mir vs Nog II or Mir vs Silva are much more marketable fights than Mir vs Kongo. Todd Duffee said he wants to be thrown in with legit competiton in his next fight so do him vs Kongo. Like I said im sure Mir vs Kongo isnt changing but I can hope. Yeah I know the decision was split but all of the MMA websites were scoring the fight for Dunham so I imagined he won pretty clearly. But like I said I havent seen it yet. I agree you cant go wrong with matching Silva up against either or those guys. But honestly I dont see anyway Hendo beats Silva I really dont think he can hold him down for 25 miniutes and standing he'll get tore up. Marquardt actually tries to get dominate postion on the ground and has a submission game so I think he's the more interesting rematch between the two but I guess it's a matter of opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 I think Henderson has a much better opportunity to beat Anderson than Marquardt, and more deserving of the fight. Henderson has much bigger wins and has not lost since the Anderson fight (unlike Nate). Add that with Dan actually won the first round against Anderson and I think he should get the fight. Dan has a better top game and is a decent grappler. Marquardt probably has better jits, but neither have the level of Anderson's and Dan has the better chance standing with Silva. Not to mention last fight against Marquardt Anderson even out-wrestled him. he's improved, but I don't see him beating Silva, at least with Dan there is a chance he could use his base to pick up the win and has better power and a big time chin. Either way I wouldn't be disappointed, but out of the two I think Dan has a 100% better shot to defeat Anderson than Nate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayo Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 I thought it was a decent event. I was very surprised by Maia getting GTFO'd, same goes with Jardine. Anyway, atleast the main event was good since I'm a Couture and Minotauro fan and they made a good performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RennikKain076 Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Yeah Henderson won the first round from Silva but what did he do? He laid in his guard and hit him with some weak ground and pound and then Silva came out and smoked him in the 2nd. Hendersons stand up isnt nearly good enough to trouble Silva, If Silva isnt playing around he kills Hendo on the feet just like he did in the first fight. Marquardt's stand up isnt as predictable as Hendersons he doesnt have as much power but he can mix it up very well and if he can get Silva to the ground I think he'll actually try to improve his postion and possibly put Anderson in some bad spots much like Lutter did. Dont get me wrong Silva destroyed Nate the first time out but I think Marquardt is capable of putting on a much better performance than he did that night. I dont think Hendo can do any better than he did the first time around at best I see him taking a round or two before getting rocked on the feet and submited again. I dont think either guy has much of a chance against Silva but I can honestly say i'd put money on Marquardt shocking the world before I would Dan. The only way Hendo wins that fight is if he can wrestle Silva down for 25 miniutes and I dont see that happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Yeah Henderson won the first round from Silva but what did he do? He laid in his guard and hit him with some weak ground and pound and then Silva came out and smoked him in the 2nd. Hendersons stand up isnt nearly good enough to trouble Silva, If Silva isnt playing around he kills Hendo on the feet just like he did in the first fight. Marquardt's stand up isnt as predictable as Hendersons he doesnt have as much power but he can mix it up very well and if he can get Silva to the ground I think he'll actually try to improve his postion and possibly put Anderson in some bad spots much like Lutter did. Ok first and foremost Lutter may have mounted Silva, but he never once had him in any sort of trouble. I've watched that fight numerous times and don't see where everyone gets that notion from. Henderson had a gameplan, and he wasn't trying to force anything in the first round. He got the bodylock, tripped Silva, and then worked some GnP and was trying to wear Silva down a little in the first. In the second round he took a clean shot from Anderson that had him back peddling a bit, and then eventually, iirc, pulled guard for some reason unbeknown to anyone - people can speculate that Dan was hurt, but no one knows for sure as he seemed to have his wits about him during that exchange --- it wasn't till the brutal ground and pound Silva unleased when he made the mistake that gave him the choke, we very easily could have seen a third round. But Anderson didn't "kill" Dan on the feet in the first fight, he did his damage on the ground. Dont get me wrong Silva destroyed Nate the first time out but I think Marquardt is capable of putting on a much better performance than he did that night. I dont think Hendo can do any better than he did the first time around at best I see him taking a round or two before getting rocked on the feet and submited again. I think both men can do better. Gameplans change from fight to fight. I defintely can see Henderson changing his gameplan up a bit and making it more of a fight. The biggest problem in the fight for Nate that I see is the fact Silva outwrestled him, a huge part of his game and gameplan against Anderson, in the first fight. The only takedown Nate got was from Anderson doing a flying knee/kick, and then could not do anything on the ground against Silva. Then Silva rocked him with a huge straight left, and when Nate tried to bring the fight back down to the mat Anderson hit a beautiful switch and then finished with one of the hardest punches I've seen on the ground. Striking - Anderson over both, clearly. Wrestling - Dan over Anderson and Anderson over Nate Jiu-Jitsu - Anderson over both. Now that doesn't mean I would be utterly shocked by either man upsetting him, but at least, in my view, Dan not only has beaten tougher competition and did better against Anderson to warrant the first shot, but holds an advantage in one of the categories whereas Nate doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RennikKain076 Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 I never said Lutter had him in trouble I said he put Silva in a bad spot underneath him in the mount. Silva came out in 2nd and for the short time they were standing unleashed a wicked flurry on Hendo which had him hurt im pretty sure I saw a interview where Dan said Silva knocked him a little silly with that kick on the feet it's been a while though so who knows but anyway, Did he out strike him for 10 minutes no he didnt need that much time but I feel very comfortable saying that if Hendo stands for any long period of time with Silva he will get hammered soundly my opinion from watching both mens fights throughout the years. I know Hendo's gameplan was to keep Silva grounded and I dont see what other gameplan he could use in a rematch but that wont work in a five round fight I dont think it will anyway I dont think Henderson has the submission skills or a good enough gnp attack to make it work. Nate was rocked by Silva's left and grabed a leg and to Silva's credit like you said he hit a beautiful switch and finished Marquardt shortly after but I would say part of the reason that happened was because Nate was already hurt and at that point Silva surprised with that switch him. So I highly doubt Silva actually out wrestles Marquardt in a rematch. Im not saying Hendo hasnt done more in his career he has but I think Marquardt has done more to deserve the title shot now. He lost a fight he shouldve won if not for the point deductions to Leites, He destroyed Kampmann who was 4-0 in the UFC at that time, he dominated Gouvia, and just knocked out the undefeated Maia in seconds. Henderson got a good win over Palhares, a very controversial decision over Rich Franklin which I scored for Franklin, and he beat Bisping who is a good fighter but dont you think he's overrated? I do. Both have three fight winning streaks and while it's close I think Marquardt has the better victorys especially if you factor in how if you factor in how convincingly he beat all of them. Hendo's best win Franklin is a highly disputable decision. Im not trying to hate on Hendo he's been one of favorite fighters for years but i'd like to see him get one more good win before fighting Silva again. I know we cant agree on this but I respect your opinion ACCBiggz you make a good argument for Hendo I just prefer a Marquardt rematch right now over a Henderson one. But either way I hope the guy that doesnt get the shot has to fight Okami for the number one contenders spot ( if Okami beats Sonnen of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 but I think Marquardt has done more to deserve the title shot now. He lost a fight he shouldve won if not for the point deductions to Leites, He destroyed Kampmann who was 4-0 in the UFC at that time, he dominated Gouvia, and just knocked out the undefeated Maia in seconds. Rich Franklin, Rousimar Palhares, and Michael Bisping are better than the collective Marquardt fights. I put Palhares and Maia in the same boat, they are even to me - just that Palhares didn't get the build and hype that Maia got, and was thrown in the deep end. Henderson just decided to pick him apart and even did a little GnP. Nate had a decently tough fight with Leites, beat a glorified 170 pound Kampmann, and Gouveia is easily beatable past 45 seconds. Bisping's only loss was a tough close fight to Rashad Evans. I do agree he is overrated, but he is more well rounded than most and a decent fighter. And as for the Franklin fight I had that a clear decision for Henderson. So I value Henderson's over Marquardt's. And I couple that with Henderson being the only man in the UFC to compete effectively against Anderson. While we'll have to agree to disagree --- I agree with Okami. The man should totally get a chance to fight in a contender's bout or have his name mentioned with Dan and Nate. Sure it was a DQ win, but he was the last to "beat" Anderson and is on a three fight win streak just like them. However, I don't give him much of a chance either. >_> Regardless of what fight they make, I won't complain as they'll all be justified and fun to watch. Us debating which deserves it more is splitting hairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RennikKain076 Posted August 30, 2009 Share Posted August 30, 2009 Yes im pretty sure Silva will victimize all three of them so we are kinda wasting our time lol. It's actually nice that we can debate between two very qualified contenders like this when just a few months ago it looked like Silva had cleaned out the division. But how do you see some of the other guys from this event being matched up in the future? I'd like to see Thiago Silva matched up with Brandon Vera or Luis Cane later this year. Randy Couture has several options i'd like to see a fight with Rich Franklin later this year or early next year assuming Franklin gets past Belfort with out injury. Jardine seems like a good fight for Jon Jones at this point if the UFC doesnt mind risking him to lose three in a row. I think Maia has a few options as well Yoshiro Akiyama, Alan Belcher, and the winner of Kang vs Bisping all seem like good fights to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Thiago Silva needs a fight before the year is out, although I don't view him as a top contender he'll be solid guy who is dangerous and pushes the fight. A fight against Vera wouldn't be bad. Randy can do just about what he wants. I think Superfights are the only thing we should see really. Cro Cop vs. Randy or something else we wanted in the past and haven't got. Or Randy against a good youngster at 205 or something along those lines. Jardine - It's hard to tell, he'll probably beat someone they are trying to put over him and then lose the next fight after that. He is really a strange guy. If he had a stronger chin imagine the wars we could have had... oh well. Maia should get someone who challenges him on the feet, but has decent enough wrestling to try and keep it standing. Sonnen wasn't a strong enough striker to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RennikKain076 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 I agree if Cro Cop loses to Dos Santos a Couture fight would be great but if he wins i'd like to see a rematch with Nog for the next title shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capelli King Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 thing is, is this the end of the line for Randy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris caulfield Posted August 31, 2009 Author Share Posted August 31, 2009 thing is, is this the end of the line for Randy? In the sense that he won't be a title contender ever again I think yes. In the sense of fighting then no as there are still plenty of super fights left for him, plus he just signed a new six fight deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Yeah, 6 fights and I believe 18 months. I think he could be a title contender again depending on who he gets matched up with. If he goes to 205 against someone who is a contender, picks up the victory - it's possible we could get something like Machida/Couture. It really just depends on who he is matched up with and if he stays there. But I'm inclined to believe we'll only see "Superfights" from here on out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RingofHonorGuard Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Nogueira/Couture was better than I expected it to be. That fight had the potential to be one of the most boring fights in MMA history. Thankfully both guys were coming off of losses and put it all on the line. Saw a lot of classic Couture with the Greco clinch and powerful dirty boxing. Saw some shades of Frye/Takayama. I had Couture to win the fight based on the fact that he trains with some very high level jiu jitsu fighters(Drysdale, Maia, and Jacare). I was fairly sure Nog couldn't submit him, though I did sweat a bit when Nogueira had that Anaconda set up. He never rolled into it, which is why Couture survived. Position from Couture saved the win. However, I thought Nogueira should have won by TKO in the third round. Couture took a **** load of unanswered shots after getting rocked. And even though he was throwing his arms up in defense, he still wasn't technically "intelligently defending". Jardine is back to being a gatekeeper, plain and simple. I had him to win by decision, and once again his inconsistency shines through. Congrats to Thiago, nonetheless. Rosholt has looked pretty one-dimensional in the fights of his I've seen. I expected him to be looking to force the takedown almost all the time. But he did well standing with Leben, and that Arm Triangle he pulled off was one of the prettiest I've seen in a long time. I picked Maia to win by submission in the third after Nate got tired... I was way the hell off on this one. However, I'm still not sold on Nate. He has new found aggression, but that's not what's going to beat Anderson Silva. If anything that's how Marquardt will find himself defeated quicker. Vera produces another "win" if you want to call it that. For someone that has aspirations of winning titles in two weight classes, he's pretty uninspiring. Todd Duffee should have won KO of the night, regardless of Marquardt. Duffee came out, and flattened a pretty decent prospect in 7 seconds. I don't think Duffee is quite ready to fight contenders yet, though. I'd give him Mike Russow next. It'd be a bigger test, due to the experience factor, and it'll show us where the kid is at in terms of ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RingofHonorGuard Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Yeah, 6 fights and I believe 18 months. I think he could be a title contender again depending on who he gets matched up with. If he goes to 205 against someone who is a contender, picks up the victory - it's possible we could get something like Machida/Couture. It really just depends on who he is matched up with and if he stays there. But I'm inclined to believe we'll only see "Superfights" from here on out. I think his next fight will be at 205(or heavyweight) versus Anderson Silva. Silva wanted to move up to HVY to fight Mir, but Mir is already on Cheick Kongo's plate. Think Couture vs. Silva is their best possible money maker, and it's a fight I'd certainly be interested in seeing. If he manages to beat Anderson, he'd obviously challenge Machida. 14/16 fights in the UFC being title fights speaks for itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RennikKain076 Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Randy's loss to Nog was probably to decisive for him to matched up with Anderson Silva right away they'll probably match him up with someone more managable first. I could see Rich Franklin, the winner of Coleman-Ortiz, the loser of Rashad-Rampage, and if we are all lucky maybe even a fight with Wanderlei Silva. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris caulfield Posted August 31, 2009 Author Share Posted August 31, 2009 Yeah, 6 fights and I believe 18 months. I think he could be a title contender again depending on who he gets matched up with. If he goes to 205 against someone who is a contender, picks up the victory - it's possible we could get something like Machida/Couture. It really just depends on who he is matched up with and if he stays there. But I'm inclined to believe we'll only see "Superfights" from here on out. Actually I think the contract is 28 months long as if you think about it 6 fights in 18 months would be insane for someone like Couture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCBiggz Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 Yes, 28. But regardless it's just a contract even if it were 18 they'd simply renew the deal. Don't pay attention to months or fights in a contract really --- thinking of it logically isn't the proper way to think about such deals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoNdOn Posted August 31, 2009 Share Posted August 31, 2009 I am a big Maia fan, but the way he got dropped by Marquadt made me laugh my arse off at the scary, yet humorous nature of the finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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