The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[djthefunkchris]

Internet fans and the male demographics (teen and above) have always treated John Cena as a heel.

 

And the WWE never books for the internet fan. If they did that, they would be in the same spot as ROH (if they started listening to the internet fan at the start of the IWC). You book for your audience and the internet fan has quite different taste as a casual fan. Notice when the WWE took out the word "wrestling", did the casual fan react negatively as the internet fan?

 

I don't think CM Punk will slip down the card. Unless you believe a potential Stone Cold/CM Punk match at WrestleMania is slipping down. This is like majority of people in the IWC reacted to Christian losing his first World Heavyweight Champion to Orton back in April 2011. The reaction you get online is exaggerated. But damn, the WWE drop the ball with Christan. It wasn't like Christian won the title in a ladder match and force to defend it against another Super-Top WWE Face couple days later. If you were a patient internet fan, you could tried to look at the bigger picture. Edge injury change his heel turn and i personally like the route they went.

 

CM Punk loses at SummerSlam, he's going to be screwed by Triple H. Whoever wins, there will be something flaky about it, which is why they added HHH into the match. If Cena does get pinned cleanly tonight, then kudos because i want to see that personally. But based on the WWE history on booking their number one men, highly unlikely.

 

I didn't say that the WWE was booking for the internet fans. I said what Punk and Cena has been saying to each other lately is directed at them, since it's exactly the things the internet fans talk about... Cena mentioned his five moves of doom, his workrate, etc... Punk's been bassically acting as the "Voice" of the Internet fans. This doesn't mean WWE is going to book it for them, but these two guys are intentionally bringing up topics from the internet fans.

 

Just look at what Arrows said, he believes exactly what Cena said. That's meant for him to believe. He (Cena) has Arrows acting exactly like he wants him to act.

[Arrows]

Lashley was going to win the WWE title or World Heavyweight Championship. But Michael Hayes conduct in the backstage during 2007 put an end to that.

 

Lashley had the look. But you put him down base on the way he spoke.

 

If Mike Tyson was a dominant professional wrestler than a dominant boxer, would you use your analysis on Lashley on Tyson? Based on your "interpretation of a tough guy", Tyson voice sounded like he was below average guy.

 

And what's to say he gets drafted to SmackDown and dominates their roster in 2008? He definitely had the size McMahon craves. He was far more talented in-ring than a Kozlov and Ezekial Jackson. If he didn't have that appeal, the looks, the amateur background, StrikeForce wouldn't take their chances on him.

 

Obviously Brock Lesnar was on a higher plateau, to use your words Arrows, he was white.

 

If Tyson was a wrestler, I'd feel the same way I do about Lashley. Tyson beat people up. Tyson WAS the baddest man on the planet. Lashley beat...Umaga...in a wrestling match. Lashley also was NEVER going to win the WWE title.

 

He might've won the World Title, but he was never going to win the WWE title, because, like you brought up, he's not white.

[Arrows]

They were definately setting him up to win the Smackdown Title there for a while. I truly believe he would have eventually. The whole reason they put the ECW title on him in the first place, was to give ECW a good solid Main Event Champion.

 

His MMA record isn't bad either, 6 and 1 now I believe.

 

6-1?

 

Better than I figured he'd do. Thought he got off to a rockier start than that.

[SaySo]

Yeah, cause not doing anything for Sept, Oct, Nov, Dec, Jan, and Feb. That's not slipping down the card. Cause after ALL that time doing nothing, you get to wrestle a guy who's not done anything in....how long? Oh boy!

 

Let's not forget that's nowhere near a confirmed match by any means. It's okay though, cause that one match makes up for having your entire character wrecked again and then going back to doing nothing at all after that match.

 

It's going to happen. Cena -vs- Rock was once doubted because why would The Rock wrestle when he makes millions doing movies. Well, anything is possible. Stone Cold -vs- CM Punk will happen. Stone Cold just did a season with Tough Enough. From that show, Booker T and Trish have made in-ring wrestling appearance. And Stone Cold -vs- CM Punk have a good background story to play since one is a beer guzzler and the other one is straight edge.

 

As for CM Punk not doing anything for all those months, can you show me the script?

[Teh_Showtime]

But if he loses then the storyline will continue likely as a feud with HHH. How is that a step down?

[Arrows]

I didn't say that the WWE was booking for the internet fans. I said what Punk and Cena has been saying to each other lately is directed at them, since it's exactly the things the internet fans talk about... Cena mentioned his five moves of doom, his workrate, etc... Punk's been bassically acting as the "Voice" of the Internet fans. This doesn't mean WWE is going to book it for them, but these two guys are intentionally bringing up topics from the internet fans.

 

Just look at what Arrows said, he believes exactly what Cena said. That's meant for him to believe. He (Cena) has Arrows acting exactly like he wants him to act.

 

Cena's doing a GREAT job with this feud. The promos these two have had with each other have been brilliant. I believed what I believe before Cena said it, but Cena's right.

[djthefunkchris]

Agreed. Entirely.

 

 

 

Yeah, cause not doing anything for Sept, Oct, Nov, Dec, Jan, and Feb. That's not slipping down the card. Cause after ALL that time doing nothing, you get to wrestle a guy who's not done anything in....how long? Oh boy!

 

Let's not forget that's nowhere near a confirmed match by any means. It's okay though, cause that one match makes up for having your entire character wrecked again and then going back to doing nothing at all after that match.

 

He's not going to slip down the card, at least not permanantly. Depends on the PPV buy rates more then likely (this one coming up). It also depends on other factors, such as if someone comes along that is better, and more interesting. If that happens, it will be a good thing though, because CM Punk has cemented his name on people's mind. He's of interest, no matter where he goes on the card, people will know what he's capable of and the interest will always be there. Unless something really screwy happens, he won't be looked at as a one time fluke.

[Fantabulous]

Based on Monday, the obvious assumption is that Triple H costs Punk the match in some fashion, as an outright heel or not, and we start the official build towards Punk/HHH. I mean, the one thing that segment did on Monday was make you want to see that match. Now, whether that is the current plan or it was a swerve to set up something else remains to be seen. Of course, even if that was the direction intended they could always do something else entirely just so they can surprise the people who figured it out.

 

Punk/HHH wouldn't necessarily be a step backwards or even a lateral move, but it wouldn't be a positive move at all if it just winds up with HHH beating Punk and the feud ending there. If Punk/HHH do have a feud or a continued interaction, how that plays out will be the clearest indication of whether Punk is someone they want as a top player or is just a glorified Heel of the Month getting a few extra months of air time.

[Arrows]

It's going to happen. Cena -vs- Rock was once doubted because why would The Rock wrestle when he makes millions doing movies. Well, anything is possible. Stone Cold -vs- CM Punk will happen. Stone Cold just did a season with Tough Enough. From that show, Booker T and Trish have made in-ring wrestling appearance. And Stone Cold -vs- CM Punk have a good background story to play since one is a beer guzzler and the other one is straight edge.

 

As for CM Punk not doing anything for all those months, can you show me the script?

 

You DO realize, Miz/Austin have the start to a feud set up, yea? The plan was for Miz vs. Austin, not Punk vs. Austin. Who says it's gonna be Punk's spot?

[Fantabulous]

There's no plan for Austin doing anything right now. And even if there was, it's going to change a million times between now and the event itself.

[SaySo]

If Tyson was a wrestler, I'd feel the same way I do about Lashley. Tyson beat people up. Tyson WAS the baddest man on the planet. Lashley beat...Umaga...in a wrestling match. Lashley also was NEVER going to win the WWE title.

 

He might've won the World Title, but he was never going to win the WWE title, because, like you brought up, he's not white.

 

If he wasn't going to win the title, did Cena squash him in their PPV match? When Cena DVD comes out, i bet that match is on it.

 

And damnit dude, Umaga was one of my favorite and rest his soul. At least Umaga got to main event shows and have entertaining matches with Cena and Jeff Hardy of all people.

 

Put Lashley up to Tyson without knowledge of their "FABLED careers", people will think Lashley will kick Tyson all over that ring. Just by looks, not Tyson dominant boxing career.

 

Then have them speak, Lashley will win again because Tyson sounds like Michael Jackson backup singer.

[SaySo]

You DO realize, Miz/Austin have the start to a feud set up, yea? The plan was for Miz vs. Austin, not Punk vs. Austin. Who says it's gonna be Punk's spot?

 

That could be the case. But I'll put a bet right now that it will be Austin / CM Punk. It's a match i want to see. I'm sure there are other people like me.

 

As for the Miz, Austin would choose Punk over Miz in a return bout. Maybe they can get Miz to fight The Situation or something.

[Arrows]

If he wasn't going to win the title, did Cena squash him in their PPV match? When Cena DVD comes out, i bet that match is on it.

 

And damnit dude, Umaga was one of my favorite and rest his soul. At least Umaga got to main event shows and have entertaining matches with Cena and Jeff Hardy of all people.

 

Put Lashley up to Tyson without knowledge of their "FABLED careers", people will think Lashley will kick Tyson all over that ring. Just by looks, not Tyson dominant boxing career.

 

Then have them speak, Lashley will win again because Tyson sounds like Michael Jackson backup singer.

 

Agreed, all around. Now, let's stick em in a parking lot in their primes.

 

Lashley'll be on the ground.

[Fantabulous]

If I'm putting money on what WWE want, it's Miz/Austin.

[djthefunkchris]

Cena's doing a GREAT job with this feud. The promos these two have had with each other have been brilliant. I believed what I believe before Cena said it, but Cena's right.

 

That's my point.... I've seen everything he said stated before as if it were a fact. This is his way of enticing, making the Internet fans think they are right, etc.

 

The truth of the matter is this though, Cena wouldn't have said it if he actually thought it was right. He wouldn't do that on purpose to anyone if he actually thought they were in that position. He (and Punk) are using that platform to create more static, more friction, etc. It only hypes the match up for tonight (the goal is to sell).

 

The fact that Cena said your fear, should probably be a comfort that it will NOT happen. In all reality, Cena could win, only to have Mysterio beat him Monday (because of injuries "kafabe" from tonight), and Punk get his re-match with Mysterio, and we will be right back where we are now.

 

It's not going to happen that way, because I'm not six, lol.

[SaySo]

If I'm putting money on what WWE want, it's Miz/Austin.

 

Yeah, if HHH/CM Punk is going to happen, then that would be the next choice.

 

If CM Punk/Austin happens, Situation -vs- Miz will be my pick.

[Arrows]

That's my point.... I've seen everything he said stated before as if it were a fact. This is his way of enticing, making the Internet fans think they are right, etc.

 

The truth of the matter is this though, Cena wouldn't have said it if he actually thought it was right. He wouldn't do that on purpose to anyone if he actually thought they were in that position. He (and Punk) are using that platform to create more static, more friction, etc. It only hypes the match up for tonight (the goal is to sell).

 

The fact that Cena said your fear, should probably be a comfort that it will NOT happen. In all reality, Cena could win, only to have Mysterio beat him Monday (because of injuries "kafabe" from tonight), and Punk get his re-match with Mysterio, and we will be right back where we are now.

 

It's not going to happen that way, because I'm not six, lol.

 

Every time Cena gets in the ring and beats someone in five moves, he does that to the other person. He knows 90% of the people he's wrestling are never going to be taken serious afterwards. The burial still happens. What's he gonna do, NOT bury Punk and get management pissed at him?

 

Cena also doesn't have Kayfabe injuries. He instantly heals the second he hits a shoulder block. He even no sold a REAL f'n injury to show up months early and win the Royal Rumble.

[SaySo]

Agreed, all around. Now, let's stick em in a parking lot in their primes.

 

Lashley'll be on the ground.

 

So would Austin, Cena, and any immortal force in sports entertainment.

[djthefunkchris]

If he wasn't going to win the title, did Cena squash him in their PPV match? When Cena DVD comes out, i bet that match is on it.

 

And damnit dude, Umaga was one of my favorite and rest his soul. At least Umaga got to main event shows and have entertaining matches with Cena and Jeff Hardy of all people.

 

Put Lashley up to Tyson without knowledge of their "FABLED careers", people will think Lashley will kick Tyson all over that ring. Just by looks, not Tyson dominant boxing career.

 

Then have them speak, Lashley will win again because Tyson sounds like Michael Jackson backup singer.

 

Your being totally ludicrous.

[SaySo]

Every time Cena gets in the ring and beats someone in five moves, he does that to the other person. He knows 90% of the people he's wrestling are never going to be taken serious afterwards. The burial still happens. What's he gonna do, NOT bury Punk and get management pissed at him?

 

Cena also doesn't have Kayfabe injuries. He instantly heals the second he hits a shoulder block. He even no sold a REAL f'n injury to show up months early and win the Royal Rumble.

 

Cena admits to playing a super hero in TV. It's not like he's playing Samuel L. Jackson character in Unbreakable. He's the Bruce Willis character.

 

Well, you can call the five moves = signature moves. Did you know, one of Austin five moves was a middle finger then a stunner.

[Fantabulous]

So would Austin, Cena, and any immortal force in sports entertainment.

 

Except Scott Hall's contract.

[Arrows]

So would Austin, Cena, and any immortal force in sports entertainment.

 

And that's why I take Tyson serious, and never did Lashley. Tyson was, yanno.

 

Real.

[Arrows]

Cena admits to playing a super hero in TV. It's not like he's playing Samuel L. Jackson character in Unbreakable. He's the Bruce Willis character.

 

Well, you can call the five moves = signature moves. Did you know, one of Austin five moves was a middle finger then a stunner.

 

The difference between everyone else's five moves and Cena's five moves:

 

Everyone else: Uses the five moves to END the match.

 

Cena: (Until recently) ONLY uses five moves the ENTIRE match.

[djthefunkchris]

Every time Cena gets in the ring and beats someone in five moves, he does that to the other person. He knows 90% of the people he's wrestling are never going to be taken serious afterwards. The burial still happens. What's he gonna do, NOT bury Punk and get management pissed at him?

 

Cena also doesn't have Kayfabe injuries. He instantly heals the second he hits a shoulder block. He even no sold a REAL f'n injury to show up months early and win the Royal Rumble.

 

Kind of makes the "kafabe" injuries look more real, although I never thought about that before.

 

You already know my stance about his match's... but these guys are not burried. He's beaten PUNK himself this way before. He's beat several guys that were Main Eventers, and still are. Heck, he's done worse, he's done it to two or three at time (although the third guy fell off). It didn't hurt their status, didn't make them any less of a threat. Edge, Kane, Big Show, Angle, Mysterio, Jericho, the list goes on and on... The match did NOT hurt them, and they didn't slip into the midcard for it. Get that fear out of your system. IF someone slips down, it's because they aren't getting over (their fault), or someone in the back don't like them...

 

From what I've heard, Punk's just about being worshipped in the back, right now. Everyone is "High" on him, and there are people taking notes (meaning, other's are wanting to follow in his footsteps). This is a good thing, I feel.

[SaySo]

The difference between everyone else's five moves and Cena's five moves:

 

Everyone else: Uses the five moves to END the match.

 

Cena: (Until recently) ONLY uses five moves the ENTIRE match.

 

Can you list me Stone Cold move set in 1998. Lou Thesz Press, Suplex, Punch, Mudhole stomp, Stone Cold Stunner...okay, he used six, the middle finger. Okay i may have missed something but on average, you'll see all six of that in a match.

 

To add on losing to John Cena and how it sends them back down in the card, how's Randy Orton doing? Orton lost a zillion matches to Cena and even Triple H. Look at his reaction at MITB, second only to CM Punk that night.