Board Effort Towards a Fictional Universe...

[Rayelek]

FINALLY found my notebook that I had all my TEW notes in, so here are the 4 future promotions that I had bios for.

 

Drake Wrestling Society

Founded by rebel billionaire and longtime wrestling fan Nathaniel Drake, the Drake Wrestling Society promotes itself as a grungey, underground company rebelling against the typical promotions of the day.

 

Hollywood Takeover Project

The Hollywood Takeover Project is an LA based company run by Saul Kodiak's Kodiak Broadcasting Company and formed as an early program for their fledgling television station, KNTV. HTP puts a lot of Hollywood influences into their product and as a result, are less respected by their counterparts in the wrestling world.

 

Highlight Reel Wrestling

A high-flying based company from the UK, Highlight Reel Wrestling places far less emphasis on quality wrestling and instead preferes to entertain simple-minded fans with spotty, flashy matches. While this will draw a consistent fanbase, without a commitment to quality, HRW will have difficulty growing.

 

Evolution Wrestling

Evolution wrestling is one of the newer companies to the wrestling world, based on mixing the high-flying, modern style that is pupping up in the world with a skilled, technical wrestling display, seemlessly transitioning from arm-drags to moonsaults. If Evolution Wrestling gets some talented workers on board, they could go far.

[aja_nyc]

TWA Banners;

 

http://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx100/aja_nyc/TEW%20LOGOS/TWAbanner.jpg

 

http://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx100/aja_nyc/TEW%20LOGOS/TWA2banner.jpg

 

http://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx100/aja_nyc/TEW%20LOGOS/TWA3banner.jpg

 

 

Possible logos for Mexicana Lucha Libre, El Mexicana II's short lived but prestigious dojo:

 

http://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx100/aja_nyc/TEW%20LOGOS/MLL2.jpghttp://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx100/aja_nyc/TEW%20LOGOS/MLL3.jpg

 

 

Possible logos for the Independent Xtreme Wrestling Alliance (IXWA), the legendary west coast indy promotion now survived by the XWA dojo:

 

http://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx100/aja_nyc/TEW%20LOGOS/IXWA.jpghttp://i745.photobucket.com/albums/xx100/aja_nyc/TEW%20LOGOS/IXWA2.jpg

[Kobe1724]

FINALLY found my notebook that I had all my TEW notes in, so here are the 4 future promotions that I had bios for.

 

Cool.

 

Rayelek here is the current EDC promotion and their distribution:

 

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/6518/edchm.jpg

 

They need ten more workers, one colour commentator, a road agent, a referee and two managers (one personality wouldn't hurt either).

 

So 16 more workers altogether.

 

If we drop them to regional (was that the intent?) then the workers are more or less covered and just a colour/road agent/ref and a couple of managers (5 workers) are needed. The guys on the roster would need to take a heavy popularity/skill dip then though.

 

If you want help making some more workers/we missed a lot of guys on your roster just let me know. ^_^

 

P.S. Kobe Falls is the user character not part of the main roster.

[Kobe1724]

Was just running through the database today doing some of my quick outlier test (passed most of them and the data looks really good as a whole) and realized that we're a bit heavy on high athlete/stamina guys.

 

We have 15 guys in the database that have both an A or better in athleticism and an A or better in stamina. That's really too high and should be closer to 7 or 8 given the dataset size and promotion sizes. It's probably a bit high on B+/B+ or better combos as well but I didn't check. Doing checks like that (and stuff like seeing how many guys under the age of 29 have a B or better in psych etc.) are just good ways to spot major issues in the data without pulling it out and looking in excel.

 

Some stuff is easier to ignore (having too many athletes won't break a dataset) while other stuff like a huge excess of guys with B or better top row stats or a bunch of youngers with over a B psych has major long term ramifications for the data. The top row stats particularly since anyone with a top row stat over a B can pull out an A* match when paired with a guy with high psychology so if you have a lot of those guys the game becomes really easy really quickly.

 

Our top row stats (particularly brawling) are also way WAY too high (for example 15 guys with a B+ or better in brawling compared to the 2-3 that should actually have it in a dataset our size). This is easily the biggest issue in the database so far and one that we need to address before pre-beta. I'll pull everything out in excel and make some changes at the top in the coming days.

 

Camera skills look good and performance skills looked good from what I saw though.

[hellshock70]

 

We have 15 guys in the database that have both an A or better in athleticism and an A or better in stamina. That's really too high and should be closer to 7 or 8 given the dataset size and promotion sizes.

 

I just did a check on this part and broke it down.

 

4 are sons of main event talent between 19 & 21.

5 are in the 26-29 range including one who was a former MMA star.

1 is in his low 30's.

4 are nearing retirement and 1 actually is retired ( a road agent).

 

Figure five are dropping and 5 are nearing the top of their game and 4 are young potential breakout stars.

[Kobe1724]

I just did a check on this part and broke it down.

 

4 are sons of main event talent between 19 & 21.

5 are in the 26-29 range including one who was a former MMA star.

1 is in his low 30's.

4 are nearing retirement and 1 actually is retired ( a road agent).

 

Figure five are dropping and 5 are nearing the top of their game and 4 are young potential breakout stars.

 

Yeah, but guys under 30 just don't have brawling skills anywhere near that good. And a guy under 25 with a B or better in brawling is like a 1-2 time a generation talent.

 

For context, the real world guys in the past 25 years that could be said to have a B or better in brawling are Stone Cold, The Rock, Undertaker, Shawn Michaels and MAYBE Triple H. And aside from perhaps Undertaker none of those guys were at that level before 30. Even Cena/Hogan/Sting etc. were/are all a level below that and they are superstar or former superstar main eventers.

 

For a guy to have a B+ brawling at 21 that would basically be saying that after a few years (or less) of wrestling/wrestling training that they would be capable of having a match of the year type match if paired with a high psych guy like Ric Flair.

 

CVerse only has three guys that good - Dan Stone, Tommy Cornell and I think Sean McFly - three of the top five guys in the entire game.

 

As far as retired/near retirement guys with that sort of skill top row stats, athleticism and star quality decline with age so it typically makes sense to trend lowers than B+ if a guy is that far up in age unless they were A* level guy brawlers in their prime (think Lou Thesz or Stone Cold Steve Austin), and even then a B is probably being generous if they're retired or out of the door.

 

Just checked - there are 18 guys in the database with a B+ or higher in brawling. Of those, only Death Metal, Juuyou Papa Hiya Su, Casey Kaufman and Black Magic fit the profile of guys that would really have a brawling stat that high, and the 40 somethings (Juuyou Papa Hiya Su and Black Magic) probably really belong around a B.

 

I know no one likes dropping stats because everyone envisions their guy as a top guy but I'm not making this up. If you ask Derek/Remi/Adam/Genadi/anyone that really looks at mod balancing they'll all say the same thing.

[hellshock70]

Doing checks like that (and stuff like seeing how many guys under the age of 29 have a B or better in psych etc.) are just good ways to spot major issues in the data without pulling it out and looking in excel.

 

On Psychology: B or better

 

16-21: just 2

22-29: 14 with 11 either in a National or Cult sized company or in a develpmental fed connected to those companies. (2 of which are already main eventing National feds) or connected to respected wrestling families.

30-36 - 32 of which 27 are in the same companies or connected to families mentioned in the previous age group.

37-45 - and 47 fall into the dreaded retirement age bracket or soon to retire age bracket.

46 & up - 37 more in this group that includes retired legends, retired road agents including some that will be completely out of the game in X number of years.

[hellshock70]

Yeah, but guys under 30 just don't have brawling skills anywhere near that good. And a guy under 25 with a B or better in brawling is like a 1-2 time a generation talent.

 

For context, the real world guys in the past 25 years that could be said to have a B or better in brawling are Stone Cold, The Rock, Undertaker, Shawn Michaels and MAYBE Triple H. And aside from perhaps Undertaker none of those guys were at that level before 30. Even Cena/Hogan/Sting etc. were/are all a level below that and they are superstar or former superstar main eventers.

 

For a guy to have a B+ brawling at 21 that would basically be saying that after a few years (or less) of wrestling/wrestling training that they would be capable of having a match of the year type match if paired with a high psych guy like Ric Flair.

 

CVerse only has three guys that good - Dan Stone, Tommy Cornell and I think Sean McFly - three of the top five guys in the entire game.

 

As far as retired/near retirement guys with that sort of skill top row stats, athleticism and star quality decline with age so it typically makes sense to trend lowers than B+ if a guy is that far up in age unless they were A* level guy brawlers in their prime (think Lou Thesz or Stone Cold Steve Austin), and even then a B is probably being generous if they're retired or out of the door.

 

Just checked - there are 18 guys in the database with a B+ or higher in brawling. Of those, only Death Metal, Juuyou Papa Hiya Su, Casey Kaufman and Black Magic fit the profile of guys that would really have a brawling stat that high, and the 40 somethings (Juuyou Papa Hiya Su and Black Magic) probably really belong around a B.

 

I know no one likes dropping stats because everyone envisions their guy as a top guy but I'm not making this up. If you ask Derek/Remi/Adam/Genadi/anyone that really looks at mod balancing they'll all say the same thing.

 

Thats not brawling...... thats athleticism and stamina that I broke down.

[hellshock70]

Thats not brawling...... thats athleticism and stamina

 

I just now looked at the guys you're talking about for brawling and most shouldn't be there for brawling instead they should be edited for being heavy hitters.

 

Anyone know how to do that?

[Kobe1724]

There are seven guys over 40 with a B+ in brawling:

Three guys in their mid 30's with a B+ brawling

Seven guys under 20 with a B+ brawling

- 18 total

 

For context I opened Genadi's 2002 real world mod (one of the best balanced real world mods available):

 

679 active workers that work as wrestlers:

There are two workers with a B+ or better in brawling

Austin - 37

Benoit - 34

 

If we add the workers with a B+ in puro or hardcore as well we get 9 instances (8 workers) total with a B+ in a brawling stat (all between 31-37). That's 1.3% of workers that wrestle.

 

In contrast, our data has 989 active workers and 25 workers (29 instances minus the retired worker who should have a lower stat given his age but isn't hurting anything really) that have a B+ or better in a top row brawling stat. - 3%.

 

CVerse has 10 workers (11 instances) amongst 1151 wrestlers for a less than 1% total. The database is actually known for having a glut of talent compared to the real world and it has less than half the top row brawlers our dataset has and our data is only 86% of its size.

 

^^^ Between 31-39 years of age with one exception: a 43 year old Jeremy Stone who had A or better in all the tech stats plus a B+ in puro: He's basically Brett Hart in his prime.

 

97 rw mod had 12 workers (14 instances) amongst 563 workers - 2% total. All are between 30-39 years of age.

 

A common trend is that across three datasets (three of the five best in the community imo, including the default one) we have a total of 31 workers with a B+ or better in a top row stat, none of which are under the age of 30 and only one of which is over 40.

 

That's 2393 workers across three datasets with 31 workers with a B+ or better in brawling. We have 25 across a number of wrestlers only 41% of that size.

 

I didn't check technical/aerial yet but I imagine a similar trend exist.

 

That said, we may need to trend a bit higher simply because we have a unique data distribution, but as it stands our top row stats are just too high - particularly amongst younger workers. Under the age of 30 even a B is extremely rare.

[Kobe1724]

On Psychology: B or better

 

16-21: just 2

22-29: 14 with 11 either in a National or Cult sized company or in a develpmental fed connected to those companies. (2 of which are already main eventing National feds) or connected to respected wrestling families.

30-36 - 32 of which 27 are in the same companies or connected to families mentioned in the previous age group.

37-45 - and 47 fall into the dreaded retirement age bracket or soon to retire age bracket.

46 & up - 37 more in this group that includes retired legends, retired road agents including some that will be completely out of the game in X number of years.

 

Our psychology actually looks really good for the most part. I was just noting that it's something I always check as I'm going through the data.

 

Thats not brawling...... thats athleticism and stamina that I broke down.

 

Yeah, my mistake. I figured I was making an error in understanding your post since our counts of brawlers with a B+ or better (15 against 18) was off.

 

I just now looked at the guys you're talking about for brawling and most shouldn't be there for brawling instead they should be edited for being heavy hitters.

 

Anyone know how to do that?

 

^^ When you say heavy hitter do you mean stiffness?

[BHK1978]

Kobe you can change any of my wrestler's stats as you see fit. Most of my wrestlers just had place holder stats because I was trying to be more of a bios guy. So like I said if lowering the stats on any of my workers makes for a more balanced mod by all means do so.

 

You will not hear a complaint from me, heck I probably will not even realize that you did it. I would ask that you do not touch the popularity stats as each worker has the popularity that they are supposed to have.

[Kobe1724]

Kobe you can change any of my wrestler's stats as you see fit. Most of my wrestlers just had place holder stats because I was trying to be more of a bios guy. So like I said if lowering the stats on any of my workers makes for a more balanced mod by all means do so.

 

You will not hear a complaint from me, heck I probably will not even realize that you did it. I would ask that you do not touch the popularity stats as each worker has the popularity that they are supposed to have.

 

Popularity is the one thing I haven't looked at in the data so far, and honestly have no intention of doing anything with it. Popularity (unlike dispersal of wrestling talent) is heavily era/situation dependent and so if it works within the context of the game world I see no problem with it. ^_^

 

The guys with popularity above a B- aren't going to stick with those regional feds once their contracts run out (unless they are loyal), but I don't see that as a problem, really.

 

As far as stat edits are concerned, I know for most people it isn't an issue and only mention it for three reasons:

 

1. So if there is a reason/someone wants a certain stat kept where it is I can make sure to work around it unless it makes no sense within the game world.

 

2. Because some people don't like their characters being messed with so if I explain the rationale their are less issues.

 

3. It allows people to point out flaws in my logic in case I'm making a huge mistake in some context. ^_^

[Kobe1724]

P.S.

 

I'm not attacking anyone for whatever they made their stats for their workers. I actually think it makes sense to make ones stats higher to begin with when working in a community mod like this one so that a guy that's meant to be a top talent doesn't get lost in the shuffle during stat balancing.

[Kobe1724]

Concerning athleticism/stamina in the CVerse no one over 40 has an A/A in stamina+athleticism in the nine instances and only three workers over 40 have at least a B+/B+ combination of the two stats in the 37 instances where it's prevalent.

 

There are 17-18 workers (lost count) with at least a B+/B+ that are over the age of 38. Dropping 80% of them by around 8-15 points plus a drop of 20% of the remaining workers (under 38's) in this dimension would largely erase the outliers in the data.

 

Anyway, I'm exhausted. Going to bed will post more tomorrow. I hope I didn't upset anyone with my evil talk of stat dropping. ^_^

 

P.S. This was a good exercise for me because it made me realize that Indiana Ford (49) is overrated in my own mods (The Roryverse) data set in chain wrestling, brawling and hardcore.

[Rayelek]

Cool.

 

Rayelek here is the current EDC promotion and their distribution:

 

Image Removed to save space

 

They need ten more workers, one colour commentator, a road agent, a referee and two managers (one personality wouldn't hurt either).

 

So 16 more workers altogether.

 

If we drop them to regional (was that the intent?) then the workers are more or less covered and just a colour/road agent/ref and a couple of managers (5 workers) are needed. The guys on the roster would need to take a heavy popularity/skill dip then though.

 

If you want help making some more workers/we missed a lot of guys on your roster just let me know. ^_^

 

P.S. Kobe Falls is the user character not part of the main roster.

 

By my estimation, they're missing the 3 workers previously mentioned, and that's it. So I'm not sure where I miscalculated, but they definitely do need staff to be filled out and I'm not too picky about that. As for the remaining 7 workers, I imagine those would be filled by touring contracts in the game, or does it not work like that?

[hellshock70]

 

^^ When you say heavy hitter do you mean stiffness?

 

There is a difference in stiffness. I work stiff which means a headlock is a little tighter. Or I can give you a stiff punch which can result in a return shot. Also, taking a move I can be stiff..... you go for a suplex and I don't give you a boost by jumping.

 

And to check heavy hitters you have no further to look than the Stan Hansen & Big Van Vader match that resulted in Vader having to pop his eye back in the socket.

 

An event mirrored by Bokudou denting Death Metal's original helmet without the eye-popping experience.

[hellshock70]

I just did a massive breakdown comparing our guys to the c-verse and my determination is we will have younger, faster, stronger guys with less technical expertise then the C-verse.

 

Our guys brawl better, they have a slight advantage in High flyers until you drop to b-.

 

The C-verse is more technical, 29-18 increasing to 56-41 when adding in B-.

 

Somehow our guys can chain their more limited technical knowledge better.

 

And also somehow despite having a higher MMA style number of workers 31-10 (does not include those with MMA skill just those with the Crossover style) they have better submission guys.

[Prophet]

By my estimation, they're missing the 3 workers previously mentioned, and that's it. So I'm not sure where I miscalculated, but they definitely do need staff to be filled out and I'm not too picky about that. As for the remaining 7 workers, I imagine those would be filled by touring contracts in the game, or does it not work like that?

 

If you want, I can offer up some staffers I have written up. Depending on what you're looking for.

[hellshock70]

Interesting breakdown

 

We have an advantage of 5 over the C-verse right now in Star Quality overall.

 

They have a 22 man advantage when its broke down to active male wrestlers.

 

And we have a 2 woman advantage among active women wrestlers.

 

(B rating and up)

 

And I forgot to mention I'm working from a database that now has 1,320 workers (50 FA's from Aja were added earlier today)

[BHK1978]

I just did a massive breakdown comparing our guys to the c-verse and my determination is we will have younger, faster, stronger guys with less technical expertise then the C-verse.

 

For a minute there I thought you were doing the opening of the Six Million Dollar Man. But yeah we need more older folk in the mod especially if we are going to do that other thing.

[hellshock70]

For a minute there I thought you were doing the opening of the Six Million Dollar Man. But yeah we need more older folk in the mod especially if we are going to do that other thing.

 

I double checked and we're not really that much younger...... just stronger, faster with less technical skill.

 

Truthfully our advantages over C-verse are offset by our disadvantages, SO FAR.

 

I do think we are bigger as most of those brawlers were big heavyweights (with some Super & Heavies) with a lot of power. Oddly enough, none of the giants were in there.

[MJStark]

I double checked and we're not really that much younger...... just stronger, faster with less technical skill.

 

That makes sense, our data has a lot more flyer based promotions than cverse does

[hellshock70]

That makes sense, our data has a lot more flyer based promotions than cverse does

 

Also right now our data which is incomplete boasts 361 workers Light Heavyweight and up compared to the C-verse with around that same amount.

 

The C-verse has a little over 1100 Middleweight and less compared to 716 for BEM. Now the interesting thing is most of the C-verse's numbers are of course males in the next two lower weight classes.

 

Small weight class is BEM - 20 males, 87 femalesto C-verse 64 males, 66 females

Very Small - BEM - 35 females, C-verse - 2 males, 14 females

 

And this is just active wrestlers

 

Right now we have an advantage in Giant, Super and Light Heavyweight Men

 

And also outnumber the C-verse in extremely tiny women. LOL

[hellshock70]

That makes sense, our data has a lot more flyer based promotions than cverse does

 

And the guys with high brawling? The majority are big raw boned strikers with little technical or flying skills but a lot of power. A good portion lack entertainment skills. The MMA guy is a pure power striker as well with very little tech skills.

 

It's actually kinda fitting with EDC in the data and several combat/hardcore styled feds in the mix to have an advantage in brawling over the c-verse.

 

AHC is Realism, Hyper-Realism, Hardcore and Daredevil as Key Features. Every thing else is set to none.

 

It's profile:

 

Australian Hardcore Combat is another move in the Full-Contact MMA direction that was taken to the extreme. The only existing rules are to not break any man-made or god-given laws.

 

Other then that, everything is fair game.