The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[Rickymex]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Kitarzu" data-cite="Kitarzu" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So...<p> </p><p> basically your Survivor Series main event is</p><p> </p><p> </p><div style="text-align:center;"><p><strong>John Cena Dolph Ziggler Big Show Eric Rowan Ryback</strong></p><p> </p><p> <span>http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d105/jsilver536/NickyChampion-2.jpg</span><span>http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d105/jsilver536/DarrylDevine-4.jpg</span><span>http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii145/jtlant/TEW/BruceTheGiant_alt1jt.jpg</span><span>http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af173/ewanite/GiantRedwood-4.jpg</span><span>http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii145/jtlant/TEW/PeterValentine_alt1jt.jpg</span></p><p> </p><p> <strong>VS</strong></p><p> </p><p> <strong>Seth Rollins Kane Rusev Luke Harper Mark Henry</strong></p><p> </p><p> <span>http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d105/jsilver536/Liberty_alt2.jpg</span><span>http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d105/jsilver536/TysonBaine_alt1-1.jpg</span><span>http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af173/ewanite/th_KrusherKarloff-1.jpg</span><span>http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d105/jsilver536/JumboJackson.jpg</span><span>http://i526.photobucket.com/albums/cc347/flamesnoopy/Avalanche.jpg</span></p><p> </p><p> </p></div><p></p><p></p><p> </p><p> This is the idea made by this man,</p><p> </p><p> </p><div style="text-align:center;"><p><strong>Vince McMahon</strong></p><p> </p><p> <span>http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii145/jtlant/TEW/SamStrong_alt2jt.jpg</span></p><p> </p><p> </p></div><p></p><p></p><p> </p><p> supposed to help to get more network subscriptions.</p><p> </p><p> This is reaching epic levels of dullness.</p><p> </p><p> P.S. Sorry, because there isn't a bigger USPW black man than heavyweight, I picked Avalanche.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I would substitute Peter Valentine with Captain Atomic and Jumbo Jackson with Brown haired Brandon Smith but basically. This all just screams filler.</p><p> </p><p> The weirdest thing is how much they made Brock Lesnar disappear from TV. Lesnar won't be on every Raw and neither will Paul Heyman but why not just send a film crew to Lesnar home to film some videos and just play those to put Lesnar as a once in a blue moon monster. Push Lesnar on the website, network, app, etc. IT just seems stupid to basically ignore it making it more noticeable that he isn't there in a bad way.</p>

[Kitarzu]

<p>I would stay with Valentine as Ryback for two reasons.</p><p> </p><p>

1) They are over because pushed hard by the management.</p><p> </p><p>

2) They extremely sucks. No wait, Ryback is worse. After 2 minutes tonight against Cesaro was already gassed. 2 minutes.</p><p> </p><p>

Maybe Lesnar just want money and doesn't want to be associated with WWE more than necessary, or, that's even worse, there's still the idiotic mentality "everything that isn't under my control isn't marketable." </p><p> </p><p>

Just look what happened with CM Punk and Daniel Bryan. The first one has ties with the sci fi, comics world. Guest in Talking Dead when was WWE Champion. Now a comics writer for Marvel. The second got his chant repeated in the major American sports leagues. NBA, MLB, NFL, NHL, NCAA basket. He was invited by the NFL Network as a guest and he was rallying the San Francisco Giants in the playoffs.</p>

[Hive]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="hellboy2" data-cite="hellboy2" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>i only saw Cena once in the top ten, unless i am reading it back to front, Steamboat and Bret Hart got more in the top 10 than Cena</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Fine, top 20 then.</p><p> </p><p> But I will say that I was pleased too see how much Bret Hart, Ricky Steamboat and Randy Savage the list had.</p>

[RKOwnage]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Crychon" data-cite="Crychon" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Are there only 4 matches scheduled for Survivor Series so far?<p> </p><p> Team Cena vs. Authority</p><p> Ambrose vs. Wyatt</p><p> Lee vs. Bella</p><p> Tag Team Titles</p><p> </p><p> Is that it? That seems... Light... Considering the show's Sunday.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> You forgot about the 'new and improved' Fandango match on the pre-show <img alt=":rolleyes:" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/rolleyes.png.4b097f4fbbe99ce5bcd5efbc1b773ed6.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[milamber]

Sasha Banks tweeted that she wants a Survivor Series tag match between the NXT women and the main roster divas. Sasha, Charlotte, Bayley, Bliss & Lynch vs Paige, Natalya, Fox, Naomi & Emma would be nice. Instead we'll probably get Paige beating Fox in a squash match.

[RKOwnage]

That would be cool. Sami vs. Neville should have been at Survivor Series.

[CQI13]

<p>In white text, is this an accurate review of Raw?</p><p> </p><p>

<span style="color:#FFFFFF;">So Team Cena gets destroyed by The Authority and no one helps out. Cena has an improv act at The Authority's expense, and no heels attack him, only waiting until Team Cena arrives for the brawl. And Triple H had a face promo...THIS was the go home show?</span></p>

[Rickymex]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="CQI13" data-cite="CQI13" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>In white text, is this an accurate review of Raw?<p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Cena is the ultimate heel who runs the WWE in secret and everybody is beneath him.</p>

[CQI13]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Rickymex" data-cite="Rickymex" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Cena is the ultimate heel who runs the WWE in secret and everybody is beneath him.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I mean, I don't have a dog in the fight either way - I only watch the PPVs on the network, plus the odd show here and there. Don't have cable, so can't watch the weekly shows. Just seems like an odd way of booking the go home show.</p><p> </p><p> As for the NXT vs WWE divas match, that would be pretty cool. Especially the heels/faces working together - I'm sure tempers would flare, leading to developments in their respective shows. THAT would be a good way of trying to build an audience.</p>

[Crychon]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="RKOwnage" data-cite="RKOwnage" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>You forgot about the 'new and improved' Fandango match on the pre-show <img alt=":rolleyes:" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/rolleyes.png.4b097f4fbbe99ce5bcd5efbc1b773ed6.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Oh, my mistake, this show is loaded now. <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[milamber]

Raw Review:

 

Opening segment - Boring.

Ziggler vs Harper (Intercontinental Championship) - Good match. It's cool that Harper won. Shame they didn't show the highlights from Dolph's MOTY contender from Smackdown.

Rose vs Kidd - The heel turn is taking too long. We saw flashes of white skin yet the announcers speculate the Bunny might be Snuka or Simmons

Bray & Ambrose - Got the job done. Again they failed to show what happened on Smackdown.

Ryback vs Cesaro - Good match. Ryback has improved enough that he can wrestle longer matches without looking bad, against quality wrestlers like Cesaro. Another loss for the best jobber in the company.

Rusev vs Slater - Funny Lana promo. Shame the match sucked.

Big Show vs Sheamus - Solid match. Sheamus technically won but I doubt the Authority will honor their promise. I'd like to see Sheamus face Lesnar. Or they can be stupid and waste Lesnar's run on another Cena match before feeding him to Reigns.

Nikki vs AJ Brie - Worked better as an angle than a match. Brie looks hot in AJ's outfit.

The Usos & Los Matadors vs Dust Bros & Team MizDow - Solid match but they just gave it away right before the PPV. Miz & Mizdow better win the titles at SS because the tag division is in a rut.

Contract signing - Trips sounded like he was about to pass out. I strangely enjoyed Cena's smug comedy routine and his team assembling. Rowan was a funny twist (the crowd actually popped) and Harper's reaction was priceless but it made no sense. They had me with the Cesaro fake out! Shame Ryback joined Cena. They should have run with a lone wolf gimmick for a couple of months. The biggest problem is that Cena hasn't come out to help any of these guys during beatdowns, so it makes him look like a manipulative hypocrite. I expect Sheamus and Cesaro to interfere on Sunday, but it will be Orton that makes the difference. Which team he will support will depend on what result Vince has chosen, because screw logic.

 

Verdict: Mediocre go-home show. I do like the Authority's attempts to prevent Cena from having a team. It's made for a more interesting Survivor Series build even if the execution has been lacking.

[Kitarzu]

Raw Review:

Ryback vs Cesaro - Good match. Ryback has improved enough that he can wrestle longer matches without looking bad, against quality wrestlers like Cesaro. Another loss for the best jobber in the company.

 

I have to disagree. The match was decent, because of Cesaro. Ryback looked bad. He was gassed after two minutes, botched a few times and he was moving really slowly. He's very limited in his ring work and pairing with Cesaro resulted in a better match, probably Ryback's best match since the one with Daniel Bryan, but this exposed clearly his limits.

 

He's worthy of the position he was just before the injury, lower midcard, not main event.

[milamber]

I have to disagree. The match was decent, because of Cesaro. Ryback looked bad. He was gassed after two minutes, botched a few times and he was moving really slowly. He's very limited in his ring work and pairing with Cesaro resulted in a better match, probably Ryback's best match since the one with Daniel Bryan, but this exposed clearly his limits.

 

He's worthy of the position he was just before the injury, lower midcard, not main event.

 

I like most hoss fights (so long as Big Show and Kane aren't involved). And I enjoy almost all of Cesaro's matches. He could wrestle Hornswoggle or a Diva in a comedy match and I'd probably still find something to praise.

 

I agree Ryback is a midcarder but stamina aside I believe he's improved his moveset this year. And this was a rare Ryback match that was scripted as more than just a sqash. I think he's good enough to earn a temporary main event push. Ryback vs Lesnar in a TLC match would be cool.

[Kitarzu]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="milamber" data-cite="milamber" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I like most hoss fights (so long as Big Show and Kane aren't involved). And I enjoy almost all of Cesaro's matches. He could wrestle Hornswoggle or a Diva in a comedy match and I'd probably still find something to praise.<p> </p><p> I agree Ryback is a midcarder but stamina aside I believe he's improved his moveset this year. And this was a rare Ryback match that was scripted as more than just a sqash. I think he's good enough to earn a temporary main event push. Ryback vs Lesnar in a TLC match would be cool.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I don't care if they are midget or giants, cruiser or heavyweight. I prefer instead people who are capable of what they are doing. People like Cesaro. In my personal vision should be the indestructible, aggressive wrestling machine. The association with Paul Heyman could have created a new, worthy main eventer for the next five years. Instead they destroy his momentum, just like every wrestler who got over by himself, using him just as a workhorse and a troll.</p><p> </p><p> You just said it, Ryback's match wasn't a squash, but just because of a capable wrestle you carried him. Next time you'll see the usual sloppy match. We already have Ryback stinking the main event in 2012 and 2013. I just see his current push as an emergency strategy for all the injuries WWE has in the babyface side of the roster.</p><p> </p><p> Lesnar is the special attraction of WWE. Using him against an emergency main eventer could be cool for some, could be a disaster for others, but basically is a non sense.</p>

[Rone Rivendale]

<p>You have to consider the fact that, despite his shortcomings, Ryback is OVER with the crowd.</p><p> </p><p>

He was stuck in bad tag limbo with Axel for what seemed like forever, he comes back one day as himself again doing the old intro and instantly the crowd was there. He has 'it'.</p><p> </p><p>

If putting on good matches equaled main event, Hogan wouldn't be the biggest wrestler of all time.</p>

[Kitarzu]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Rone Rivendale" data-cite="Rone Rivendale" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>You have to consider the fact that, despite his shortcomings, Ryback is OVER with the crowd.<p> </p><p> He was stuck in bad tag limbo with Axel for what seemed like forever, he comes back one day as himself again doing the old intro and instantly the crowd was there. He has 'it'.</p><p> </p><p> If putting on good matches equaled main event, Hogan wouldn't be the biggest wrestler of all time.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> It's easy to get over, when on the opposite side you go against the most over heel of the federation, The Authority. He's over because of the situation, not because of his work.</p><p> </p><p> I don't think Ryback has much of "it". He has some looks, it was packaged to be an unstoppable force and it worked. Probably better than they thought. So WWE used him as a cannon fodder for main event, first with CM Punk, than John Cena. After that he went to his natural position, a midcard act who will rise up into the card when needed. WWE booking went back to the Feed Me More character and he repeats the same things he did it before.</p><p> </p><p> Hogan was capable of doing good main event matches. Just look his NJPW matches before his first WWF title win. Vince McMahon didn't need good matches, just his iconic star on top.</p>

[hellboy2]

I am not keen on the new stipulation for Survivor Series, it means that Team Cena will win now, unless Cena pulls a Hogan and goes heel

 

Also means Rusev has to lose somehow, hopefully by countout or DQ, but i imagine Cena will get that honour

[Teh_Showtime]

There are always count out and DQ eliminations so I wouldn't be worried about Rusev. It's why so many matches never reach their potential

 

And yes. Cena is ending the Authority and he's the conquering hero at the end of the day which solidifies his push. I thought they were hesitant on him after the Lesnar and Rock feuds and subsequent victories but I guess not.

[Rone Rivendale]

It's easy to get over, when on the opposite side you go against the most over heel of the federation, The Authority. He's over because of the situation, not because of his work.

 

I don't think Ryback has much of "it". He has some looks, it was packaged to be an unstoppable force and it worked. Probably better than they thought. So WWE used him as a cannon fodder for main event, first with CM Punk, than John Cena. After that he went to his natural position, a midcard act who will rise up into the card when needed. WWE booking went back to the Feed Me More character and he repeats the same things he did it before.

 

Hogan was capable of doing good main event matches. Just look his NJPW matches before his first WWF title win. Vince McMahon didn't need good matches, just his iconic star on top.

 

Ryback went back to the 'big guy' BEFORE he became involved in the Authority angle. And the first time he had a 1 on 1 match with his old entrance, the crowd was into it like he never left the main event scene.

[CQI13]

There are always count out and DQ eliminations so I wouldn't be worried about Rusev. It's why so many matches never reach their potential

 

And yes. Cena is ending the Authority and he's the conquering hero at the end of the day which solidifies his push. I thought they were hesitant on him after the Lesnar and Rock feuds and subsequent victories but I guess not.

 

Would it be better to have Reigns v Cena at WM? The rumor was that they might not sign Lesnar when his deal is up, which might mean Cena beats him at the Rumble, and passing the torch to Reigns at WM...

[Teh_Showtime]

Absolutely. It would not only mean something for Reigns but a Cena loss would also force him to do something new since his gimmick as of late has been that he's the face of the company.

 

The only issue with that is that if you use the Cena match to make Reigns a star then a match in the future has less appeal. Their first meeting happening when Reigns is a giant star would mean much more so I can understand that part.

 

Also assuming Bryan isn't back, there would be nobody for Brock to face at WM if Cena fought Reigns. I don't think a rematch with Taker would accomplish anything and minus Bryan nobody else can really be on the level to fight a guy like Brock at WM unless they strap the rocket to Ambrose or Ryback.

[Kitarzu]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Rone Rivendale" data-cite="Rone Rivendale" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Ryback went back to the 'big guy' BEFORE he became involved in the Authority angle. And the first time he had a 1 on 1 match with his old entrance, the crowd was into it like he never left the main event scene.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> The big guy thing started before his injury, the Feed Me more restarted after his return.</p><p> </p><p> The crowd was into it because he received the return pop and went against a cocky heel like Bo Dallas. Main event scene because the two of the biggest babyface star, Daniel Bryan and Roman Reigns, are out for injury. After they, or at least one of them, will return, Ryback will move down in the pecking order.</p><p> </p><p> Consider also someone called Randy Orton is still missing...</p>

[milamber]

NXT Review:

 

Bayley vs Lynch - OK match. Too short for them to showcase their talent.

The Vaudevillians vs Lucha Loompas - A midget match is what you'd expect on Raw. The Vaudevillians made it semi-entertaining with airplane spins but a run-in from the Champs is what this feud needed to kick it into life.

Kevin Owens Promo - Echoed Balor's "Future of NXT" promo from last week but with a heelish vibe. Debut confirmed for the PPV!

Corbin vs Sampson - 22 seconds. Not his quickest win.

Bull vs Cutler - Bull got boos and "Corbin's better!" chants when he couldn't beat Corbin's squash time. I'd love to see Corbin hit his STO on Bull.

Kidd vs Parker - Solid match. Strange pairing. Were they trying to turn Kidd babyface?

Enzo & Cass vs Dawson & Wilder - OK squash match. The tag division is filling out nicely. The Ascension laid waste to both teams then cut a typically poor promo on Itami & Balor.

Closing Segment - Sami cut a heart-felt promo and called out Neville, asking for one more match. If he loses he's going to quit. Neville tried to talk him out of it but Sami got fired up and stuck to his guns. Regal made the match official for the clunkily titled NXT Takeover: Our Evolution.

 

Verdict: A huge drop in quality from last week. This show was about giving as many wrestlers screen time as possible. I wish NXT were 15 minutes longer so they could pull it off better.

 

Kevin Owens 1st Promo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qACQvOOyoHQ

[lazorbeak]

The big guy thing started before his injury, the Feed Me more restarted after his return.

 

The crowd was into it because he received the return pop and went against a cocky heel like Bo Dallas. Main event scene because the two of the biggest babyface star, Daniel Bryan and Roman Reigns, are out for injury. After they, or at least one of them, will return, Ryback will move down in the pecking order.

 

Consider also someone called Randy Orton is still missing...

 

So, a post ago, Ryback was over because he's up against the Authority, but now he's over because he's up against "a cocky heel," aka the lowest heel on the totem pole not named Fandango? Maybe he's just over? Even when he was stuck in a useless tag team with Curtis Axel, he was clearly the one the crowd cared about. With Kane being completely neutered, Henry and Show both being a million years old, etc., I don't see why Ryback belongs in the "lower midcard" when he's a big guy that can actually get reactions.

[TakerNGN74]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="milamber" data-cite="milamber" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><strong><span style="text-decoration:underline;">NXT Review:</span></strong><p> </p><p> <strong>Bayley vs Lynch</strong> - OK match. Too short for them to showcase their talent.</p><p> <strong>The Vaudevillians vs Lucha Loompas</strong> - A midget match is what you'd expect on Raw. The Vaudevillians made it semi-entertaining with airplane spins but a run-in from the Champs is what this feud needed to kick it into life.</p><p> <strong>Kevin Owens Promo</strong> - Echoed Balor's "Future of NXT" promo from last week but with a heelish vibe. Debut confirmed for the PPV!</p><p> <strong>Corbin vs Sampson</strong> - 22 seconds. Not his quickest win.</p><p> <strong>Bull vs Cutler</strong> - Bull got boos and "Corbin's better!" chants when he couldn't beat Corbin's squash time. I'd love to see Corbin hit his STO on Bull.</p><p> <strong>Kidd vs Parker</strong> - Solid match. Strange pairing. Were they trying to turn Kidd babyface?</p><p> <strong>Enzo & Cass vs Dawson & Wilder</strong> - OK squash match. The tag division is filling out nicely. The Ascension laid waste to both teams then cut a typically poor promo on Itami & Balor.</p><p> <strong>Closing Segment</strong> - Sami cut a heart-felt promo and called out Neville, asking for one more match. If he loses he's going to quit. Neville tried to talk him out of it but Sami got fired up and stuck to his guns. Regal made the match official for the clunkily titled <em>NXT Takeover: Our Evolution</em>.</p><p> </p><p> <strong><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Verdict:</span></strong> A huge drop in quality from last week. This show was about giving as many wrestlers screen time as possible. I wish NXT were 15 minutes longer so they could pull it off better.</p><p> </p><p> <strong>Kevin Owens 1st Promo: </strong><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qACQvOOyoHQ" rel="external nofollow"><strong>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qACQvOOyoHQ</strong></a></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> If my WWE Logic or in this case NXT Logic serves me correctly they formatted this show with two squash matches to build to a match between Corbin and Dempsey for Takeover Evolution. I'm fine with it as long as Corbin wins. Corbin has a great look and although I haven't seen him wrestle for more than thirty seconds he doesn't need to in a company like WWE because he has the look they want. Bull Dempsey on the other hand is boring and looks like a scumbag that I just can't get behind. I see a better upside and a brighter future for Corbin where in a few years Dempsey will probably be somewhere else that's not WWE's main roster because I doubt he will get there.</p>