~2002 Official Release~

[Johnny Fenoli]

Yeah you're right, I'll edit for next update, lemme know anymore you find.

 

I found more, but I didnt post them all, I just edited in game. Do a filter search of all the chicks and anyone who's a lightweight and higher, more than likely needs to be fixed.

[Sartagis]

I was adding a NJPW Dojo and then adding all the graduates and noticed that Shinya Makabe was not in the data. He debuted for NJPW in '97 in the latter part of '01 he went on an excursion to Canada, England, and Puerto Rico to bulk up. Returned to NJPW in October 2002.

 

There's a yet to debut worker named Akiyago, his picture is of former NJPW Young Lion Akiya Anzawa. I assume this is supposed to be the masked wrestler who wrestles(d?) in WLW. I'm pretty sure that is not Akiya Anzawa as he retired in 2006. May be wrong couldn't dig up much on Akiyago. When seeing this though it caused me to check what Japanese workers are set to debut. Noticed there's only 3 future Japanese workers set to debut so I figured I'd rattle off some that could be added. All NJPW Dojo grads as of now (cause that's what I was doing when i started to think about it), haven't given much thought to NOAH or AJPW guys that could be in or non dojo guys yet.

 

Class of 2002

-Toru Yano - Debut: May 18th, 2002 - Midcard lifer.

-Ryusuke Taguchi - Debut: November 22nd, 2002 - An amazing young Junior with lots of up side. Plus any wrestler with the Nickname "Funky Weapon" needs to be in. Former IWGP jr. Champ and 2 time (and current with Prince Devitt as Apollo 55)

-Naofumi Yamamoto - Debut: October 12th, 2002 - Was a Huge NJ prospect, then left to pursue a career in the WWE which he has now Started as Yoshi Tatsu.

-Shinsuke Nakamura - Debut: August 29th, 2002 - 1 of the New 3 Musketeers, 1 of the 4 Heroes of NJPW, Current and 3 time IWGP Heavyweight Champion, Former IWGP U-30 champ, Tag champ, NWF Heavyweight Champ, G1 Climax Tag winner, Ranked #10 in PWI 500 single wrestlers of 2008. Tokyo Sports ROTY in 2003.

 

Class of 2003

-Hirooki Goto - Debut: July 6th, 2003 - 1 of the 4 Heroes of New Japan, G1 Climax, New Japan Cup and Young Lion Cup winner.

-Hiroshi Nagao - Debut: February 2nd, 2003 - Bright prospect, injured knee ligaments a week or two prior to his debut match, then was sidelined after his very first match for what would be almost a year till he got back on track. Started doing well for a year or so then left out of the blue at the start of 2006, think he wrestled a bit in HUSTLE. 6'5" 250 pounds.

-Akiya Anzawa - Debut: September 21st, 2003 - A very bright NJPW talent, less then a year and a half into his tenure was already making huge strides and was starting to get over.....then suddenly retired from wrestling at 25 to pursue being a cook. Which he is apparently exceptionally good at....

 

Class of 2004

-Yujiro Takahashi - Debut: July 26th, 2004 - One half of Current NJPW Tag Champs No Limit and appeared in TNA with tag partner Tetsuya Naito. PWI 500 #166 in 2009.

 

Class of 2006

-Tetsuya Naito - Debut: May 27th, 2006 - One half of Current NJPW Tag Champs No Limit and appeared in TNA with tag partner Yujiro Takahashi.

PWI 500 #161 in 2009.

-Prince Devitt - Wrestling Debut: June, 2000; NJPW Dojo grad and NJPW debut: April 16th, 2006 - One of only 3 (maybe 4) Gaijins to graduate from the NJPW Dojo. 2 time NWA British Commonwealth champ and 3 time (and current with Ryusuke Taguchi as Apollo 55) IWGP Jr. Tag champ.

-Mitsuhide Hirasawa - Debut: January 28th, 2006 - Good young talent still looking to come into his own.

[Genadi]

I was adding a NJPW Dojo and then adding all the graduates and noticed that Shinya Makabe was not in the data. He debuted for NJPW in '97 in the latter part of '01 he went on an excursion to Canada, England, and Puerto Rico to bulk up. Returned to NJPW in October 2002.

 

There's a yet to debut worker named Akiyago, his picture is of former NJPW Young Lion Akiya Anzawa. I assume this is supposed to be the masked wrestler who wrestles(d?) in WLW. I'm pretty sure that is not Akiya Anzawa as he retired in 2006. May be wrong couldn't dig up much on Akiyago. When seeing this though it caused me to check what Japanese workers are set to debut. Noticed there's only 3 future Japanese workers set to debut so I figured I'd rattle off some that could be added. All NJPW Dojo grads as of now (cause that's what I was doing when i started to think about it), haven't given much thought to NOAH or AJPW guys that could be in or non dojo guys yet.

 

Class of 2002

-Toru Yano - Debut: May 18th, 2002 - Midcard lifer.

-Ryusuke Taguchi - Debut: November 22nd, 2002 - An amazing young Junior with lots of up side. Plus any wrestler with the Nickname "Funky Weapon" needs to be in. Former IWGP jr. Champ and 2 time (and current with Prince Devitt as Apollo 55)

-Naofumi Yamamoto - Debut: October 12th, 2002 - Was a Huge NJ prospect, then left to pursue a career in the WWE which he has now Started as Yoshi Tatsu.

-Shinsuke Nakamura - Debut: August 29th, 2002 - 1 of the New 3 Musketeers, 1 of the 4 Heroes of NJPW, Current and 3 time IWGP Heavyweight Champion, Former IWGP U-30 champ, Tag champ, NWF Heavyweight Champ, G1 Climax Tag winner, Ranked #10 in PWI 500 single wrestlers of 2008. Tokyo Sports ROTY in 2003.

 

Class of 2003

-Hirooki Goto - Debut: July 6th, 2003 - 1 of the 4 Heroes of New Japan, G1 Climax, New Japan Cup and Young Lion Cup winner.

-Hiroshi Nagao - Debut: February 2nd, 2003 - Bright prospect, injured knee ligaments a week or two prior to his debut match, then was sidelined after his very first match for what would be almost a year till he got back on track. Started doing well for a year or so then left out of the blue at the start of 2006, think he wrestled a bit in HUSTLE. 6'5" 250 pounds.

-Akiya Anzawa - Debut: September 21st, 2003 - A very bright NJPW talent, less then a year and a half into his tenure was already making huge strides and was starting to get over.....then suddenly retired from wrestling at 25 to pursue being a cook. Which he is apparently exceptionally good at....

 

Class of 2004

-Yujiro Takahashi - Debut: July 26th, 2004 - One half of Current NJPW Tag Champs No Limit and appeared in TNA with tag partner Tetsuya Naito. PWI 500 #166 in 2009.

 

Class of 2006

-Tetsuya Naito - Debut: May 27th, 2006 - One half of Current NJPW Tag Champs No Limit and appeared in TNA with tag partner Yujiro Takahashi.

PWI 500 #161 in 2009.

-Prince Devitt - Wrestling Debut: June, 2000; NJPW Dojo grad and NJPW debut: April 16th, 2006 - One of only 3 (maybe 4) Gaijins to graduate from the NJPW Dojo. 2 time NWA British Commonwealth champ and 3 time (and current with Ryusuke Taguchi as Apollo 55) IWGP Jr. Tag champ.

-Mitsuhide Hirasawa - Debut: January 28th, 2006 - Good young talent still looking to come into his own.

 

Thanks Sartagis (Bows down!). I often neglect dojos with my mods due to the time it takes to find solid info on them. That list is perfect!

[shamelessposer]

At the time the mod starts, Chris Benoit was still on the injured list. He didn't really return to the roster until late May.

[Genadi]

At the time the mod starts, Chris Benoit was still on the injured list. He didn't really return to the roster until late May.

 

Benoit was in HWA getting into shape for his return which was only a month later. That is how it's set in the data to if you're looking for him he can be called up at anytime to the WWF main roster.

[shamelessposer]

Benoit was in HWA getting into shape for his return which was only a month later. That is how it's set in the data to if you're looking for him he can be called up at anytime to the WWF main roster.

 

Fair enough. I'd put him on the injured list to prevent him from coming in before May, or default him to developmental, but that second one might have some unforeseen effects if the WWF is left in the hands of the AI.

 

A couple of other weird things I noticed: The APW Boot Camp refers to "the late Crash Holly," and Harley Race's camp says "come to" rather than "go to" Japan.

 

Also, one worker that I have to dispute ratings on is Mick Foley. Much as I love the guy, giving him a B Brawling and an A Hardcore seems like overkill. He's more of a performance guy than a top row guy, and in fact his performance skills are so high (and deservedly so) that he would probably produce good enough ratings if you dropped his Brawling and Hardcore by a full letter grade each. The only reason I see for them to be so high is if you're trying to offset his low Physical stats.

 

Another thing, and please chalk this up to constructive criticism rather than active dickery, is that I think you might be going overboard on relationships. Less is definitely more in this area, as too many friendships can lead to a 100% Backstage rating with no input from the player. Mick Foley's relationships, for example, could probably be pared down to:

 

Al Snow: Strong Friendship

Marc Mero: Strong Dislike

Mil Mascaras: Strong Dislike

Ric Flair: Strong Dislike

Vince McMahon: Loyalty

 

A lot of what you would consider "friendships" are in game terms better replicated by just making the worker a positive backstage influence. Foley has traveled with Austin, Regal, and Mikey Whipwreck, but sharing a few road stories about someone does not indicate a lifelong friendship. In The Hardcore Diaries, Foley even goes out of his way to mention how rare real, lasting friendships are in the world of wrestling.

[shamelessposer]

Some other thoughts, regarding playability and other issues:

 

It would be a good idea to make Sting an Extremely Conservative worker. He's gone on record many times as having a problem with the WWF product, so anyone booking the WWF should really have to work to win him over.

 

World Wrestling All-Stars looks like it's set to collapse under its own weight within a year. This is what we call "working as intended."

 

With the exception of Hardcore, which is on the high side by ten-ish points, Shawn Michaels' stats are right where they should be. A smart booker should have no trouble pulling A ratings out of him. Remember that in the Cornellverse, Christian Faith can pull an A rating against an equally skilled opponent. While Faith is a Performance skill god, he's no Shawn Michaels.

 

If anyone deserves an A* Stiffness, it's probably Vader.

 

Kane's mask is set to 0% prestige.

 

Booker T could probably use a C- or C in Brawling. He's not world-class or anything, but at this stage in both men's careers he should probably be a step or two ahead of John Cena.

 

Andrew "Test" Martin should simply be Andrew Martin or Test.

 

Is there any real utility in having Howard Finkel and Lilian Garcia in this data set? The Cornellverse doesn't include ring announcers, and the game doesn't include any use for them, so I'm inclined to think they might as well be deleted.

 

The Amazing Red's performance skills are awfully high for this stage of his career. This is debatable, but didn't he only just recently upgrade from Spot Monkey to Cruiserweight?

 

The Holly Family didn't really exist at this point.

 

Stevie Richards' microphone skills seem a little on the low side. He was a very effective manager for the Right To Censor and most of his really great work in ECW was in interviews or backstage vignettes, but as he's statted in the game it's hard to see Richards as much of a mouthpiece.

 

I'd bump up almost all of Val Venis' top row skills by a few points each. Venis was one of the WWF's "almost" guys, the sort of worker who could have been a perpetual upper-midcarder or better, if only the stars had properly aligned themselves. His current stats don't really reflect that.

 

Again, arguable, but Raven's Brawling stats seem a little too high and his Entertainment stats seem a little too low. Personal preference, of course, but I'd rather see his Brawling weighted average at C+ and his Entertainment at B+. I'll admit that the Brawl nerf is probably a more valid point than the Entertainment buff.

 

Tommy Dreamer is a similar sort of guy. I'd drop all of his Brawl stats by a couple of points and up his Entertainment by a couple of points. Dude spent half a decade as one of the top faces of a Cult-ish promotion, and was extremely sympathetic the whole time. It's hard to see him in that position with sub-C Entertainment skills.

 

Sex Appeal for males doesn't comply with the standards set by the Cornellverse. Looking at a few of the major offenders, like Buff Bagwell, Chris Mordetzky and Mark Jindrak, suggests that this is a holdover from a 2007 version of the mod back when Sex Appeal was Looks. Possible effect of this mod: Rene Dupree T-shirt cannon angles.

 

Remember, everything I've provided to the thread thus far is intended as constructive criticism. For the most part I'd say you've got a pretty good thing going.

[Genadi]

Fair enough. I'd put him on the injured list to prevent him from coming in before May, or default him to developmental, but that second one might have some unforeseen effects if the WWF is left in the hands of the AI.

 

He's in HWA dude, his contract is set as "Get Into Shape" because that's exactly what he was doing at the time (What an awesome feature!). Every sim and every feedback we've had there's been no problems. WWF calls him up maybe a few weeks early but overall works perfectly.

 

A couple of other weird things I noticed: The APW Boot Camp refers to "the late Crash Holly," and Harley Race's camp says "come to" rather than "go to" Japan.

 

Ahh thanks, that would be because I imported alot of the dojos from H-Verse.

 

Also, one worker that I have to dispute ratings on is Mick Foley. Much as I love the guy, giving him a B Brawling and an A Hardcore seems like overkill. He's more of a performance guy than a top row guy, and in fact his performance skills are so high (and deservedly so) that he would probably produce good enough ratings if you dropped his Brawling and Hardcore by a full letter grade each. The only reason I see for them to be so high is if you're trying to offset his low Physical stats.

 

I really do disagree. Mick Foley is one of the greatest brawlers to ever step into the ring IMO. I'm obviously not the only one who thinks that as he's won more Bruiser Brody Memorial Awards (Best Brawler Awards) then even Brody (granted his career was tragically cut short), the last win being only 1 year earlier (He won the award for 2000). I don't try to offset any stats, I set them to as close to the consensus I feel possible while keeping TEW's mechanics very much in mind. I actually think Foley set at B brawling is underated but as always was trying to find middle ground.

 

Another thing, and please chalk this up to constructive criticism rather than active dickery, is that I think you might be going overboard on relationships. Less is definitely more in this area, as too many friendships can lead to a 100% Backstage rating with no input from the player.

 

First off I don't chalk any of your comments to active dickery You've always given constructive feedback and been a great contributor to my mods and the boards.

 

I agree with you on that point and alot of the relationships are left over in the data from previous versions. We'll probably give them an overhaul for next release.

 

 

Edit - Just saw your second batch of feedback thanks!!! We'll defintitely look over everything you mentioned for next version, except probably Sting being ultra conservative I think he says that but angles and matches he's been invlolved with even recently prove his conservatism isn't what kept him back. The biggest reason I don't think he signed with WWF was what he stated himself as being the major factor... he saw Booker T's debut and thought he got buried. Same reason Bret didn't want to go to WCW, they didn't want to go from being the big kid in the playground who's earnt his spot to the new kid who gets buried. That's my opinion based on facts as are yours but it's something I don't wanna change

[shamelessposer]

He's in HWA dude, his contract is set as "Get Into Shape" because that's exactly what he was doing at the time (What an awesome feature!). Every sim and every feedback we've had there's been no problems. WWF calls him up maybe a few weeks early but overall works perfectly.

 

That's strange. The version I'm using is from bobinc.net, and in it Benoit starts on the main roster.

 

I really do disagree. Mick Foley is one of the greatest brawlers to ever step into the ring IMO. I'm obviously not the only one as he's one more Bruiser Brody Memorial Awards (Best Brawler Awards) then even Brody (granted his career was tragically cut short), the last win being only 1 year earlier (He won the award for 2000). I don't try to offset any stats, I set them to as close to the consensus I feel possible while keeping TEW's mechanics very much in mind. I actually think Foley set at B brawling is underated but as always was trying to find middle ground.

 

The problem, I think, is that you're looking at the Mick Foley of 2000 and I'm looking at the Mick Foley of around 2004. Based on his books Foley would probably be the first to agree that he really toned down his... everything, in the off period. I'm thinking of post-comeback Foley and you're thinking of pre-retirement Foley.

 

First off I don't chalk any of your comments to active dickery You've always given constructive feedback and been a great contributor to my mods and the boards.

 

Thanks!

 

I agree with you on that point and alot of the relationships are left over in the data from previous versions. We'll probably give them an overhaul for next release.

 

The Cornellverse is, as always, a good model here. I'd probably try and cut down the relationships to about a third or even a quarter of where they are now. Working on my 2000 mod I ran into the same problem, with positive relationships and friendships all over the place, and it was about the time I got to the Terri Runnels/Ray Traylor "Strong Friendship" that I backed away and figured out I wasn't using the feature as intended.

 

Edit - Just saw your second batch of feedback thanks!!! We'll defintitely look over everything you mentioned for next version, except probably Sting being ultra conservative I think he says that but angles and matches he's been invlolved with even recently prove his conservatism isn't what kept him back. The biggest reason I don't think he signed with WWF was what he stated himself as being the major factor... he saw Booker T's debut and thought he got buried. Same reason Bret didn't want to go to WCW, they didn't want to go from being the big kid in the playground who's earnt his spot to the new kid who gets buried. That's my opinion based on facts as are yours so it's something I don't wanna change

 

The point remains, however, that to keep the game working in a historically interesting fashion it should be very difficult for the WWF to get Sting. Aside from setting him as extremely conservative, is there any other way to get this to happen?

[Genadi]

That's strange. The version I'm using is from bobinc.net, and in it Benoit starts on the main roster.

 

Hmm must be an older version that the latest then, check the link in the main post. Benoit should be in HWA under development getting into shape. He usually has a few matches against Haas which is awesome because that's who he had a few with in RL at the time, then he's called up if the AI are running WWF.

 

The problem, I think, is that you're looking at the Mick Foley of 2000 and I'm looking at the Mick Foley of around 2004. Based on his books Foley would probably be the first to agree that he really toned down his... everything, in the off period. I'm thinking of post-comeback Foley and you're thinking of pre-retirement Foley.

 

The mod is set in early 2002, Foley had only retired two years earlier and I think the only stats of his that were decreasing were his drive for the business. Take a guy like Nemesis in C-Verse for example, even though he's long retired due to injury and hasn't been active for years he's still got a B rating for both hardcore and brawling. I think Adam may have tweaked this to because I thought in '07 he still had an A for hardcore.

 

Even when Foley came back after a long time off he put on one of the best brawls the WWF had seen in years on two occasions against guys (Edge & Orton) who were at the time good but not excellent at brawling.

 

We may have to agree to disagree on that stat.

 

The point remains, however, that to keep the game working in a historically interesting fashion it should be very difficult for the WWF to get Sting. Aside from setting him as extremely conservative, is there any other way to get this to happen?

 

You may be right, if Sting signs to WWF after or even before WCW fold I'll investigate but I haven't had one report of that yet.

[misfit103]

The problem with changing Sting to ultra-conservative is that it could affect his choice of matches he's willing to participate in, IIRC (Am I remembering that's how it works correctly?)

[Jaysin]

The problem with changing Sting to ultra-conservative is that it could affect his choice of matches he's willing to participate in, IIRC (Am I remembering that's how it works correctly?)

 

If that's true, he'd probably object to the story line he did with Vampiro(now that was a kick ass story that no one gives credit) or the one he did with Abyss in TNA where it ended in the Last Rites match.

[Genadi]

If that's true, he'd probably object to the story line he did with Vampiro(now that was a kick ass story that no one gives credit) or the one he did with Abyss in TNA where it ended in the Last Rites match.

 

Exactly, they were actually the two matches/angles I was talking about earlier.

[misfit103]

Genadi, I banged out the NWA Title histories if you want the file. Might make your life a bit easier.

[mrallan]

I already did the NWA Title histories for Genandi about a month ago just an FYI not saying he won't use yours

[misfit103]

Eh, I don't plan on downloading the update really, so it doesn't matter.

 

I would suggest adding Kim Neilson aka Desire to the database though. She was a pretty big part of TNA in 2003.

[Genadi]

Thanks guys, I don't mind who's NWA title history we use but not sure about how I'd go about importing it? I really appreciate you guyd going to the trouble but it's probably easiest if I add it from my end to make sure you've all got the most recent data.

 

I did listen to you mrallan, not sure if you've tried the MA mod yet but it has both the NWA World Heavyweight and NWA Tag Titles plus I added the AWA belt for anyone wanting to use. If you want me to add other NWA titles lemme know and I prob will.

[mrallan]

I know you listened to me man I was just telling misfit that I had sent you the title history for the nwa titles a while ago. As far as importing I thought you said you would start with my data as a base since you hadn't started updating when I had sent you the title history file.

 

Also I nkoticed you had them in the ma mod but you already told me before the mod was released that you had added the nwa titles

[Genadi]

I appreciate that mrallan, I did forget to add them with all the editing I was doing at the time If there are any other titles you guys think are worth adding lemme know.

[The Final Countdown]

Hey, Genadi, remember that problem I ran into in my diary game using the 2008 version of this data, where CMLL started hiring people only to fire them within days? I think I might have worked out what the problem was. Hovering between Cult & National, they were obviously more than ready for a TV show. But, at least in the version I was using, the only TV networks with coverage in Mexico were Big or above. I'm thinking that, if there had been a Medium-sized Mexican network that they could have gotten on, they would have been able to make some money, and wouldn't have fallen into that hiring/firing pattern. Not sure what your data looks like these days, since I'm still using whatever version I had when I started my diary over a year ago. But, if you haven't added some additional, smaller networks in Mexico, it might be something to think about.

 

Anyway, can't wait until I get TEW2010 in a couple months, and use your latest data to continue with my diary.

[Kobe1724]

Is there an update forthcoming? ^_^

 

I want to play once any kinks are worked out.

[Genadi]

I have to appologise again to any fans of my mods. Lots of stuff on atm I have been trying and failing to get time to update both this and MA. Hopefully I will get to it this wkd but I would load up a game as it is for now for anyone waiting. Both are far from broken imo and I've had alot of fun playing them

[Genadi]

Hey, Genadi, remember that problem I ran into in my diary game using the 2008 version of this data, where CMLL started hiring people only to fire them within days? I think I might have worked out what the problem was. Hovering between Cult & National, they were obviously more than ready for a TV show. But, at least in the version I was using, the only TV networks with coverage in Mexico were Big or above. I'm thinking that, if there had been a Medium-sized Mexican network that they could have gotten on, they would have been able to make some money, and wouldn't have fallen into that hiring/firing pattern. Not sure what your data looks like these days, since I'm still using whatever version I had when I started my diary over a year ago. But, if you haven't added some additional, smaller networks in Mexico, it might be something to think about.

 

Anyway, can't wait until I get TEW2010 in a couple months, and use your latest data to continue with my diary.

 

Just saw this thanks TFC I'll definitely add it for next update has to be better then what's happening at the moment. Also I'll make some adjustments to hiring rules for some promotions. I learnt a lot from modding this years MA which should prevent even Rey Mysterio Jr. signing with TNA every game, something that's annoyed me since the mod was created.

[Kobe1724]

Just saw this thanks TFC I'll definitely add it for next update has to be better then what's happening at the moment. Also I'll make some adjustments to hiring rules for some promotions. I learnt a lot from modding this years MA which should prevent even Rey Mysterio Jr. signing with TNA every game, something that's annoyed me since the mod was created.

 

What have ypu learned tp prevent stuff like this?

[Genadi]

Mainly utilising hiring rules for each promotion and Owner business stats, preferences etc. I have no idea about coding or whatnot but from modding this years TEW seems to be the biggest improvement to the series as far as how AI works etc. Alot of stuff Adam has added really helps historical mods in ways that sometimes don't seem very obvious but over long term are fantastic.