jbergey_2005 Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 <p>Kobe is normally top 10 in win shares. His value is more as a team leader and clutch player. He doesnt rebound or get steals like many of the other stars of the league.</p><p> </p><p> Kind of goes hand in hand on why Kobe's teams werent very effective when they didnt have much around him though.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted June 21, 2010 Author Share Posted June 21, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jbergey_2005" data-cite="jbergey_2005" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><a href="http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/ws.html" rel="external nofollow">http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/ws.html</a><p> </p><p> Also I dont believe anyone was just throwing this stat out at you. <strong> It seemed you just needed a refresher on who Lebron James is if you havent seen him play</strong>.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> aw you're just so cute. I never said Lebron couldn't play..... <strong>at all</strong></p><p> </p><p> I mean please if you can point out where I said Lebron can't play, pull it up. I said Lebron isn't the best player in the league, then gave a run down of who I thought <strong><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><em>MY</em></span></strong> top 10 guys were. Then you and Lazor (of course Lazor because opinion to him are like a 1 dollar bill on the ground to gates, means nothing) decide to come in and call me crazy and that I am doing this for a reaction, when the only reaction I get is a sudden itch in my butt when Lazor speaks.</p><p> </p><p> I don't care about some win share stat that doesn't even have the best player on it. I could careless that Lebron avg 27/7/7 a game when he can't even win it all. Based off that stat, Lebron and Anderson V. were top 20 and their should have been nothing stopping the Cavs. C's didn't even have anyone on it. (talking about the wins per 48 min)</p><p> </p><p> Lebron's avg: 27/7/7 a career that's great</p><p> </p><p> Jordan's: 30/6/5 omg Michael avg more points a game but Lebron is better because he had one more rebound and two more assist so he instanly is a better player. What.... Lebron is 0-1 in finals and Jordan was 6-0.... ah that doesn't mean anything.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> Also maybe I messed up putting rose as 4th, but to compare Nash, Williams, and Rondo to him is dumb seeing how he has had a better start to his career then they did.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 <p>Edit: deleted the other stuff because I'm not going to put up with this.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Then you and Lazor (of course Lazor because opinion to him are like a 1 dollar bill on the ground to gates, means nothing) decide to come in and call me crazy and that I am doing this for a reaction, when the only reaction I get is a sudden itch in my butt when Lazor speaks.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I'm sorry, WHAT? Seriously what are you talking about? No, I didn't call you crazy, I agreed with jbergey. And I did it because evidence bears them out. And you have the nerve to post something rude, inflammatory and of zero value as though I was giving you a hard time? Seriously whaaaaaa?</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted June 21, 2010 Author Share Posted June 21, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jbergey_2005" data-cite="jbergey_2005" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Kobe is normally top 10 in win shares. His value is more as a team leader and clutch player. He doesnt rebound or get steals like many of the other stars of the league.<p> </p><p> Kind of goes hand in hand on why Kobe's teams werent very effective when they didnt have much around him though.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> 1) Saw 2 years he didn't make the top 20, also only went back to 03-04 but he highest finish was 4th</p><p> </p><p> 2) You are right Kobe doesn't steal like others, expect the last three years he's 18, 5, 12, 18 in the league in steals. Kobe acctually finished 12th, 7th, 5the last three year for defensive player of the year</p><p> </p><p> 3) Kobe since the 99-00 season has been a 25/5/5 guy</p><p> </p><p> 4) The one season Kobe didn't make it to the playoffs the team was 24-19. Then their head coach resigned and Kobe both suffered injuries (Odom missing the last 17 games of the season tanked down the strech. (they also had Caron Butler)</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbergey_2005 Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="GatorBait19" data-cite="GatorBait19" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> </p><p> I don't care about some win share stat that doesn't even have the best player on it. I could careless that Lebron avg 27/7/7 a game when he can't even win it all. Based off that stat, Lebron and Anderson V. were top 20 and their should have been nothing stopping the Cavs. C's didn't even have anyone on it. (talking about the wins per 48 min)</p><p> </p><p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Well if stats are meaningless to you unless a player wins it all your list suddenly makes even less sense. You have players on your list that have had a hard time making the playoffs some years.</p><p> </p><p> You make one argument that Lebron is overrated because he cant win it all while having Durant and Rose as your 3rd and 4th best players and they havent even made it out of the first round.</p><p> </p><p> Its like saying Tom Brady is a better QB than Peyton Manning because he has won more Super Bowls then turning it around and saying Donovan McNabb is better than Ben Roethlesberger because he puts up better numbers. It doesnt make sense.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted June 21, 2010 Author Share Posted June 21, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lazorbeak" data-cite="lazorbeak" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Oh Jesus, what on earth brought on this? No one is "throwing a stat at you." You said things that weren't supported by data and then what, you want to question the data? You know, there's even more data that it's based on, right? I mean, there is no way to attack common sense arguments in a way that makes you look good.<p> </p><p> But bringing up the limitations of the stat to argue something no one was trying to prove, and bringing up tangential points from weeks ago (that you apparently didn't understand then, since they absolutely do not support your position now) just makes it seem like you want to get in a fight for no good reason.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> </p><p> Oh yes, common sense certainly bears out that George Hill, Antonio McDyess, and Richard Jefferson are elite players(???). Duncan was 4th in the league in double doubles and is statistically among the very best at his position, anchoring a defensive team. Without Duncan, the Spurs are maybe a 40 win team, but they wouldn't make the playoffs. With Duncan, they have never failed to win 50 games (exempting the strike year). I mean what are you even trying to argue here?</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> You both did throw the stat at me. You even came out and said look Duncan is still elite based off this stat, which meant their were other players who were elite that just aren't even elite or close to it.</p><p> </p><p> I did understand the point, Jefferson has proved that he can play and no one has doubted that. Now you want to come and say the only reasons his stats are so high is because he is on a horrible team. Tell me how a player being on a horrible team automaticly makes him a bad player with inflated stats? McGrady was a great player on a crappy team with inflated stats.</p><p> </p><p> You are an idiot though it's clear, I never said those three players were elite. Maybe it's that whole reading comprehension thing you were trying to explain once. I said the Spurs were a team with great talent behind Duncan, then I went on to name the talent. I never said they were great talent individually, or just those three. I named off a group of 5 with those three involved.</p><p> </p><p> Also it's funny how you also said that the Bulls aren't a woeful team when a couple weeks ago you said Deng, Noah, and Rose were the only pieces the Bulls really had.</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> And yes I said that about you <img alt=":eek:" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/eek.png.0e09df00fa222c85760b9bc1700b5405.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" />. (All I did was agree with jb) which means you agree with him that I am crazy. You truly need to calm down, you seem to cry the moment someone disagrees with you. You don't respect what anyone says, and 99.9% of the time you cut it down. Why, well it's simple, because Lazor only follows the rules of lazor. Funny thing is he wrote these rules while on a toliet taking a Lazor. You cry about a bunch of stuff and then try to discredit people, because to you (and your pin pal Hilton) it doesn't go along with your ideas of your life.</p><p> </p><p> You don't get it doesn't matter if you believe Coco Jordan is the next best think for suntan lotion or Albert Pujols would make a great Center..... why because it's your <strong><em><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Belief</span></em></strong>. </p><p> </p><p> Plus it is true, you don't care about anyone's opinion and often time (which I mean all the time if they don't agree with King Lazor) you cut them down because they believe in something else. Get off your high horse dude, no cares. I don't see how that first comment was rude or inflammatory. I also believe it did add value, because of the fact it adds you don't care what anyone thinks. It's your word or no word at all.</p><p> </p><p> Now if you want to think this was rude and inflammatory, I am quite fine with it.</p><p> </p><p> Also AB only Bosh, Paul, and Durant (before he got talent in OKC) have troubling making the playoffs (but each has made the playoffs). I never said it had anything to do with winning or stats. You brought a stat up that had everything to do with winning which I think is pointless when you have a player like Nene, Varejao, and Redick on it with out a single C's player or Kobe Bryant. Out of the top 20 only one played in the Finals.</p><p> </p><p> I do believe Lebron is overrated and to point that stat out that say (wins) to me and is based off a teaming winning is pointless. Lebron has shown he can't push a team with talent around him (and yes Lazor, Cavs have talent..... wait I mean Wonder, Great, Best Ever). Do I think he is a talent player who could prove the overrated tag wrong..... yes, but then again I have said that before as well <img alt=":rolleyes:" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/rolleyes.png.4b097f4fbbe99ce5bcd5efbc1b773ed6.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbergey_2005 Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 There really isnt a need to get defensive GB. You apparently see something in Rose that I dont I was kind of hoping you'd explain it a little bit. He does have some great skills and does seem to have the ability to step up his game in tough situations however he seems to drift a lot as well for some reason. Perhaps it is because he is young. I really dont think Lazor was being very tough on you about this. I'm sure you admit that it may seem odd to some people that you would have Rose ranked higher than King James without much explanation about it. I'd honestly like to hear more about it without you being on the defensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek B Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 While discussion of sports generally inspires passion, keep this thread civil or it WILL be closed. Forum rules are being broken and if they continue to be broken then warnings will be handed out and posting priveleges will be temporarily revoked. This applies to EVERYONE. Seriously, don't make me read about basketball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbergey_2005 Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 <p>I guess that topic went terribly bad.</p><p> </p><p> People may not like Lebron or think he gets by easy because he is Lebron. He may not even be able to up his game when the game is on the line. Even though I remember that game against Detroit where Lebron scored something like 30+ straight points to end the game. Its way too early to judge Lebron or Rose at this point and I guess that is why we may have strong opinions on this.</p><p> </p><p> I just know some of the same things were said about Jordan when he was younger and it didnt take long for him to put all his critics to rest.</p><p> </p><p> Perhaps we should talk about how bad the Twolves will mess up their draft again this year.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astil Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jbergey_2005" data-cite="jbergey_2005" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I guess that topic went terribly bad.<p> </p><p> People may not like Lebron or think he gets by easy because he is Lebron. He may not even be able to up his game when the game is on the line. Even though I remember that game against Detroit where Lebron scored something like 30+ straight points to end the game. Its way too early to judge Lebron or Rose at this point and I guess that is why we may have strong opinions on this.</p><p> </p><p> I just know some of the same things were said about Jordan when he was younger and it didnt take long for him to put all his critics to rest.</p><p> </p><p> Perhaps we should talk about how bad the Twolves will mess up their draft again this year.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> They really need to pick a PG.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Astil" data-cite="Astil" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>They really need to pick a PG.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> They drafted two PGs a year ago. If they ever get Rubio to play in the US they'll be in solid shape. Then again, if I were Ricky Rubio I'd rather stay in Europe than head to Minnesota.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astil Posted June 21, 2010 Share Posted June 21, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lazorbeak" data-cite="lazorbeak" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>They drafted two PGs a year ago. If they ever get Rubio to play in the US they'll be in solid shape. Then again, if I were Ricky Rubio I'd rather stay in Europe than head to Minnesota.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I was joking about the run of PGs they took a couple years back <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted June 22, 2010 Author Share Posted June 22, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lazorbeak" data-cite="lazorbeak" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>And the next two guys after him are probably Steve Nash and either Jason Kidd or Rondo. Rose doesn't put up the assists of any of those players and is not a great perimeter shooter.<p> </p><p> Rose was the 3rd leading scorer and averaged 6 assists on a team that also featured Ben Gordon, John Salmons, Deng, a healthy Brad Miller, and Kirk Heinrich. No idea how that's <strong>"woeful"</strong> or how CP3 is unproven, since he lead the Hornets to 56 wins and a division title, accomplishments Rose hasn't even approached with the Bulls. On the subject of "not proven," Rose is pretty much exhibit A. He's never actually accomplished <strong>anything</strong>.</p><p> </p><p> QUOTE]</p><p> </p><p> You stated it right here when telling everyone that the Bulls were not woeful because they had this talent (so you could discredit my point of having Rose at 4).</p><p> </p><p> So when I pointed out that you said they were dreadful a couple weeks ago, it now became irrelevent. </p><p> </p><p> Also it did go with what you are saying now (or at least then when we were talking about it). I said Rose was 4th gave my reason with one being the talent around him not being the best, but he makes them better. Then you came, "Oh, but they have him, him, and him. No idea how that is woeful" (Which none of those names were Deng or Noah). So I then stated how can you say that, but a couple weeks ago they were a dreadful at the 2 and 4 and undercut others. </p><p> </p><p> Also Ben Gordon was an inconsisent player, Kirk has always been a PG/SG so hence he's played out of position his whole career, Ben Miller (Brad?) still plays on the team, and Salmons was traded at the deadline. So he still played with 3 of the 4 players</p><p> </p><p> So once again, I never said "what do you think of the bulls". The arguement was about Rose, you questioned how his team could be woeful with those players (even though they won 8 more games with Rose, made the playoffs, and almost knocked the C's out), then I stated you said they were dreadful. They had Salmons on the team this year, they got rid of Gordon and they still had the same record with players you said were dreadful. So to sit here and say they had talent last year but not this year is dumb. They had all the same player minus Gordon (once again inconsisent and not worth the money). I want you to explain to me how a team with all the same pieces (minus one) can go from being talented, to dreadful with the same record.</p></div></blockquote> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 <p>I'm honored to be thrown in with guys like lazorbeak and Remi</p><p> </p><p> Gator, you've sucked the life out of every sports related thread on these boards. I kind of hope they all get closed just so you have less of a forum to speak in</p><p> </p><p> Everyone is entitled to their opinions. But whenever someone challenges or disagrees with your it turns into something like the last few pages. </p><p> </p><p> EVERY. TIME.</p><p> </p><p> EDIT: That being said, the Bulls aren't a terrible team. And Rose IS an incredible talent but he's nowhere near the 4th best player in the league. If Lebron goes to Chicago they aren't much more of a title contender than Cleveland is right now.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted June 22, 2010 Author Share Posted June 22, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="PeterHilton" data-cite="PeterHilton" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'm honored to be thrown in with guys like lazorbeak and Remi<p> </p><p> Gator, you've sucked the life out of every sports related thread on these boards. I kind of hope they all get closed just so you have less of a forum to speak in</p><p> </p><p> Everyone is entitled to their opinions. But whenever someone challenges or disagrees with your it turns into something like the last few pages. </p><p> </p><p> EVERY. TIME.</p><p> </p><p> EDIT: That being said, the Bulls aren't a terrible team. And Rose IS an incredible talent but he's nowhere near the 4th best player in the league. If Lebron goes to Chicago they aren't much more of a title contender than Cleveland is right now.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Wow, well first Remi isn't as bad as you or Lazor. Remi at least tries to understand someones reasoning.</p><p> </p><p> Second, you and Lazor (espically you) have this freakin god complex where you think your word is everything and that's it.</p><p> </p><p> Third, besides and agruement with you, Lazor, and Remi (even Remi and I don't get like this) please show me where I complete just attack someone because I don't agree with their view?</p><p> </p><p> I mean serious Peter, get over yourself. You didn't even start a single sports, wrestling, or MMA thread on this forum and barely talked in a sports thread. All of a sudden you announce you're getting married and then lay out who runs the threads?????????? Why, are you special? Are you a mod? Does anyone give a crap?</p><p> </p><p> I just find it funny that you say that everyone is entitled to their own opinion ha, you're a riot Peter. The moment something is said or someone says something you don't understand, they're an instant idiot.</p><p> </p><p> I remember when CQ and I were talking about players who were max type players (<strong>TO US</strong>). We already stated that players who weren't would still get their money because GM's are dumb. We didn't care if people agree with us or not. Then he comes Peter on his glowing white horse two tell us we are idiots. Then you go to say what we have already agreed upon and stated.</p><p> </p><p> So Peter..... <strong><em><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><span style="font-size:18px;">SHUT UP</span></span></em></strong></p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="GatorBait19" data-cite="GatorBait19" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Wow, well first Remi isn't as bad as you or Lazor. Remi at least tries to understand someones reasoning.<p> </p><p> Second, you and Lazor (espically you) have this freakin god complex where you think your word is everything and that's it.</p><p> </p><p> Third, besides and agruement with you, Lazor, and Remi (even Remi and I don't get like this) please show me where I complete just attack someone because I don't agree with their view?</p><p> </p><p> I mean serious Peter, get over yourself. You didn't even start a single sports, wrestling, or MMA thread on this forum and barely talked in a sports thread. All of a sudden you announce you're getting married and then lay out who runs the threads?????????? Why, are you special? Are you a mod? Does anyone give a crap?</p><p> </p><p> I just find it funny that you say that everyone is entitled to their own opinion ha, you're a riot Peter. The moment something is said or someone says something you don't understand, they're an instant idiot.</p><p> </p><p> I remember when CQ and I were talking about players who were max type players (<strong>TO US</strong>). We already stated that players who weren't would still get their money because GM's are dumb. We didn't care if people agree with us or not. Then he comes Peter on his glowing white horse two tell us we are idiots. Then you go to say what we have already agreed upon and stated.</p><p> </p><p> So Peter..... <strong><em><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><span style="font-size:18px;">SHUT UP</span></span></em></strong></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> The boards worked just fine without the "official" threads for years. The fact that you started any kind of thread here doesn't really mean anything, tbh. </p><p> When the sports calendar changes those threads disappear and re-appear. Unless Adam or a mod creates and/or pins them no one is actually obligated to stay in those threads. </p><p> </p><p> I've posted here forever basically, so when I made my thread about who was in charge of what, it was totally a joke. And the people I was speaking to knew it was. </p><p> </p><p> And I said you were "retarded." I didn't realize you would take it so personally. 'Retarded' being one of those words that I use without thinking it's actually an insult, like "lame" or "high." CQ didn't and we had a totally calm exchange. </p><p> </p><p> Honestly, this seems like you are taking these things far far too seriously. </p><p> </p><p> Re-read this thread:</p><p> </p><p> You listed your top guys. A couple of people challenged your list. You lost your sh*t. </p><p> </p><p> That's not a conversation. </p><p> </p><p> I'm sorry you feel so attacked but the way you express your opinions can be illogical and (because you've said you don't care about diction or grammar) a little confusing. </p><p> </p><p> Take that for what it's worth. But before you started posting here regularly we discussed sports a lot and we rarely had these kinds of flame wars.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted June 22, 2010 Author Share Posted June 22, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="PeterHilton" data-cite="PeterHilton" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>The boards worked just fine without the "official" threads for years. The fact that you started any kind of thread here doesn't really mean anything, tbh. <p> When the sports calendar changes those threads disappear and re-appear. Unless Adam or a mod creates and/or pins them no one is actually obligated to stay in those threads. </p><p> </p><p> I've posted here forever basically, so when I made my thread about who was in charge of what, it was totally a joke. And the people I was speaking to knew it was. </p><p> </p><p> And I said you were "retarded." I didn't realize you would take it so personally. 'Retarded' being one of those words that I use without thinking it's actually an insult, like "lame" or "high." CQ didn't and we had a totally calm exchange. </p><p> </p><p> Honestly, this seems like you are taking these things far far too seriously. </p><p> </p><p> Re-read this thread:</p><p> </p><p> You listed your top guys. A couple of people challenged your list. You lost your sh*t. </p><p> </p><p> That's not a conversation. </p><p> </p><p> I'm sorry you feel so attacked but the way you express your opinions can be illogical and (because you've said you don't care about diction or grammar) a little confusing. </p><p> </p><p> Take that for what it's worth. But before you started posting here regularly we discussed sports a lot and we rarely had these kinds of flame wars.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Lol</p><p> </p><p> 1) Doesn't matter if it's was here before or not, you acted as if you were (pun not intended) a watcher (the official threads)</p><p> </p><p> 2) You still aren't showing me where I blew up on other people. (how do you have no idea here?)</p><p> </p><p> 3) I don't care about my gammar, but when someone repeated attacks it.... it gets kind of annoying (same as 2)</p><p> </p><p> 4) I didn't lose my sh*t, I lost it on Lazor. JB and I finished our conversation through PM. Where I told him if it seemed like I was going bat sh*t for coco puffs on him, I wasn't and that I was sorry if he took it that way.</p><p> </p><p> 5) I never said me starting the thread was me being all mighty and powerful. I just said you need to get over yourself about you being god and your word is final. (same as 2)</p><p> </p><p> 6) The fact that the sports threads seems to run smoothly when you and Lazor don't post is another thing. (Same as 2)</p><p> </p><p> 7) Peter, I didn't get mad over the fact that you called CQ and I a retard. Hell, I have said it to people at times as well (in a joking matter much like you). What got me mad was the fact that we were retarded because you were agreeing with something that you agreed with. You just came into the the discussion like you were there the whole time and didn't even make sure to read back from the start of our talk. (this one is quite easy, you agree with yourself, was agreeing with what CQ and I already stated)</p><p> </p><p> 8) I have tried to be nice to you and Lazor, I really have. My mom always told "People who live in glass houses don't throw stones" (or something like that). You and Lazor talk about how I freak out because someone doesn't agree with me. In reality you and him come into these boards to cut people down and throw personal insults yourself (when someone says something you guys go, geez calm down I was only joking). If someone doesn't agree with your opinions you guys don't go "You know, you could be right, but that is your opinion and I am just having trouble seeing it that way"</p><p> </p><p> (once again don't see where you're not understanding)</p><p> </p><p> No, instead you guys feel you need to discredit everything anyone says that doesn't go with your word. I am not the only one who feels that way about the both of you. Only reason I don't trash Remi during this, is while Remi can take it over the top he also understands it's an opinion. You two just dont, it's your way or the highway.</p><p> </p><p> (Yep still don't get it)</p><p> </p><p> So you can continue to sit here and say I suck the life out of the sports threads and whatever, but I don't. You and Lazor coming in acting like the here all know all is what does it. The fact that most of the time when you to post a comment, most posters drop out is the funny part. People actually reply back to my post, but when you two talk most just stop because they know it will start an arguement that they wont win. Why? well simply because, even when you two lose the arugement, you will beat the arguement to death or say something else to tie into another arguement. Then a couple weeks later you'll say something completely different and it will be irrelevent to the arguement if someone stats "hey you said this a couple weeks ago"</p><p> </p><p> </p><p> EDIT: Now Peter tell me what you aren't understanding.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 I have no idea what you're talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbergey_2005 Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 <p>Im not sure why this interesting thread has to turn into this every couple of weeks but I think we need to get a little more "thick skinned."</p><p> </p><p> Remi, Peter, and Lazor are some of the more educated sports fan in this forum. They may have opinions but isnt that part of what makes interesting discussions? You shouldnt be insulted every time they dont agree with you Gator. I am sure I have had some good discussions with them as well and it wasnt because I felt insulted because they didnt agree with me.</p><p> </p><p> You obviously love sports so you should stick to that topic and stay away from the battles and discuss what you enjoy IMO.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="PeterHilton" data-cite="PeterHilton" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> Re-read this thread:</p><p> </p><p> You listed your top guys. A couple of people challenged your list. You lost your sh*t. </p><p> </p><p> That's not a conversation. </p><p> </p><p> I'm sorry you feel so attacked but the way you express your opinions can be illogical and (because you've said you don't care about diction or grammar) a little confusing. </p><p> </p><p> Take that for what it's worth. But before you started posting here regularly we discussed sports a lot and we rarely had these kinds of flame wars.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Like I said in a post that was deleted along with most of Gator's irrational vitriol, the argument ended right around the time Gator stopped even trying to talk about the issue. Instead he went off on a rant about how much he hates me for supporting somebody else's opinion. But I'm the guy who doesn't respect <span style="text-decoration:underline;">anyone</span>'s opinions. <img alt=":rolleyes:" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/rolleyes.png.4b097f4fbbe99ce5bcd5efbc1b773ed6.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Small ironies get lost on some people I guess.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="GatorBait19" data-cite="GatorBait19" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> 4) I didn't lose my sh*t, I lost it on Lazor. JB and I finished our conversation through PM. Where I told him if it seemed like I was going bat sh*t for coco puffs on him, I wasn't and that I was sorry if he took it that way.</p><p> </p><p> 6) The fact that the sports threads seems to run smoothly when you and Lazor don't post is another thing. (Same as 2)</p><p> </p><p> 8) I have tried to be nice to you and Lazor, I really have. My mom always told "People who live in glass houses don't throw stones" (or something like that). You and Lazor talk about how I freak out because someone doesn't agree with me. In reality you and him come into these boards to cut people down and throw personal insults yourself (when someone says something you guys go, geez calm down I was only joking). If someone doesn't agree with your opinions you guys don't go "You know, you could be right, but that is your opinion and I am just having trouble seeing it that way"</p><p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Gator, stop talking about me. Seriously. Stop it, unless it includes an apology. Your "trying to be nice," includes throwing a childish temper tantrum apropos of absolutely nothing because again, I agreed with someone else's assessment based on the facts they presented. I didn't throw personal insults, I didn't call you names, and you were 100% wrong in your behavior. So I don't want to hear about how I'm the one that gets upset when people don't agree. You are the one who threw a hissy fit and acted like you were a victim for people bringing "logic" and "facts" to a discussion.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="GatorBait19" data-cite="GatorBait19" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="27836" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Why? well simply because, even when you two lose the arugement, you will beat the arguement to death or say something else to tie into another arguement. Then a couple weeks later you'll say something completely different and it will be irrelevent to the arguement if someone stats "hey you said this a couple weeks ago"</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> You continually pull out things said weeks ago, apply them incorrectly, and then attempt to pull a "gotcha" as though it will somehow convince anyone of anything. It is irrelevant to act as though it's a massive contradiction that I said the Bulls team 2 years ago was talented but that the Bulls of today are bad at two positions, since those things are not the same, especially when <span style="text-decoration:underline;">no one</span> is talking about the quality of the Bulls franchise but the ability of one player on the Bulls. Instead of bringing in evidence to support your opinion of Rose, your whole goal seemed to be impeaching my character. But even if you managed to succeed, you still haven't defended your opinion in any meaningful way: all you've done is attack mine.</p><p> </p><p> Seriously Gator, you're the one that needs to learn to respect other people's opinions without telling them to "shut up" in great big font. I think you'll find that strategy almost never works.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GatorBait19 Posted June 22, 2010 Author Share Posted June 22, 2010 Tired..... that's past tense. I tired to be nice to you. It didn't work out so there is no point in ever trying again. Second, you really need to get over the apology angle. Apology is an expression of regret, in which I feel none. Welcome to the real world Lazor where not everyone is nice and people aren't going to apologize just because you demand it. Also for the last time, I wasn't trying to play gotcha. You stated the Bulls had talent a year ago. Then I questioned how that same talent, minus one player and then a trade of Salmon. Yet you call them dreadful this year. You thought that was me saying "Ha, gotcha". What it really was, was me wondering how the level of talent can drop so much with the deduction of so little. Instead you took it as I am bringing up irrelevent stuff, which still wasn't irrelevent seeing how it all involved Rose. I said Rose was a great player on a woeful team and helped carry them while helping the players improve. That's a fact. 1) Ben Gordon's ppg went up by 2, 2) Noah became something of a threat, 3) Salmon had a good season before being traded, 4) They improved by 8 games with him, 5) Even with the lose of Gordon and Salmon they still kept their record at 41-41. Then you tried to discredit me by saying they had this player, this player, and this player 2 years ago and that wasn't woeful. Yet two weeks ago a team with all the same players, minus 1 for the full season and the other being traded; you stated they were dreadful. I didn't do a gotcha, I wanted you to explain to me how a team can go from being talented to being dreadful yet still match their record of last year? You never did that, you went on to say it was irrelevent to the arugement which it still wasn't seeing how I was trying to point out my defense of why Rose is 4th. He went from a talented team to a dreadful team, yet he still produced better numbers and the same record. Also, I have only freaked out on you. Now, because of this I instantly don't know what respect is. Yet a couple of weeks ago you cutdown BHK because he didn't agree with Jackson being the best head coach. You then went on to misread it, along with mine, and question how we could think Phil is a bad coach. You cut down both of us because we disagreed with you. You cut down the fact that the East is the more dominate conf. throughout the history of the NBA, just so you could be right about the last 10 years of the West being dominate. You don't care for peoples opinions and once again I am not the only one who agrees with that. You sit here and cry because I decide I was fed up with you jerkish attitude and acted childish. Well guess what, it worked. You saw the jerk I can be and now you are pouting for an apology. You read peoples stuff wrong and take it the wrong way, I wanted to make sure my words were loud and clear. You are still a Jerk Lazor and that will never change, but maybe now you will respect the fact that people get fed up with you having to always be right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbergey_2005 Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 Seriously dude, Who cares? Move on. The Bulls are the 8th best team in the East and are a Lebron James, Dawyne Wade, or Dwight Howard away from being relevent again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stennick Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 So I tried to follow a sports discussion but this turned into several pages of people shouting back and forth with their "opinions". That being said I have to admit the Celts gave the Lakers more trouble than I ever imagined, I didn't think they would make it to game six, let alone be leading game 7 in the 4th. Also please tell me somebody didn't say Rose was the 4th best player in the NBA. I'm all for opinions but there has got to be a line between opinion and delusional right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CQI13 Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 Having a discussion with a friend: Does LeBron figure into Top 10 players of ALL time if he never wins a title (or if he only wins 1 or 2)? He said no, considering you'd have multiple people ahead of him (at least 10 in his opinion). Obviously Jordan, Kobe, Shaq (for a while he was absolutely dominant), Wade, Olajuwon, Duncan (as a quietly, yet consistently great PF/C), Magic, Bird. Who else would be in that list (again, considering LeBron is ring-less)? He said he heard a comparison of LeBron to Karl Malone or Barkley. Great players with no rings. What statistical benchmarks would have have to hit to be considered best ever (if he never gets a title) -- much like Marino is certainly in the discussion as best QB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHilton Posted June 22, 2010 Share Posted June 22, 2010 Just to clarify, was your friend saying Wade is top 10 all time? Beyond that, I think you kind of have to win at least ONE title to even be mentioned in that company. That particular list skews a bit too much to players in recent eras for my taste (no West, Oscar, Wilt etc) but if Lebron wins a title, wins a few more MVPs, and continues his statistical dominance itd be hard to argue Gotta win one though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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