Official NBA Discussion Thread

[SHaynes23]

It's sounding more and more like LeBron is going to Miami. After looking into it and hearing some other sides I could see it working, but man would I hate them. I already didn't like the Heat, and this would probably put them real high up on the list of teams in all of sports I hate.

[MGreene78]

It's sounding more and more like LeBron is going to Miami. After looking into it and hearing some other sides I could see it working, but man would I hate them. I already didn't like the Heat, and this would probably put them real high up on the list of teams in all of sports I hate.

 

I think it would be interesting honestly. I like Bosh and Wade personally. Lebron gets on my nerve because I don't think he does things for the sport, but more for his brand. Lakers would still be out West and the only viable contender now. I still think the West is strong with teams like LA Lakers, and developing Clippers team, OKC if they can get a Center, and Portland. Each though has a weakness that keep them from being title contenders against the Lakers. With a lot of top players going to one team the East may not be the stronger of the two leagues because certain teams like Wizards, 76ers, Knicks, and Nets at least until they develop their players will hold the East down.

 

 

I think it is a good thing for the NBA though as well with strong teams in 4 of the five major markets people will be watching. Five major markets are Dallas, Boston, Miami, LA,and New York who could still pull out a nice offseason with the right moves.

[MGreene78]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5363055

 

Now ESPN pretty much has told people. ESPN is usually very good at making sure facts are staight before they post stuff. I also saw and article where Beasley could be traded to the Magic if they can't get good enough talent back. They would get the TPE so they wouldn't have money coming to hit their cap. I guess we will see.

[PeterHilton]

Bill Simmons makes a couple nice points in today's article about why a Lebron-Wade-Bosh trio isn't a guarantee to win a title:

 

10. Let's say LeBron signs with Miami. Can you even make the Finals with LeBron, Bosh, Wade and nine minimum-salary guys? Because that might be next year's team … and if that's what happens, the answer is "no effing way." You don't win titles just because of your top three. That belittles the meaning of guys like Derek Fisher, Robert Horry, Steve Kerr, John Paxson, Brian Shaw … you could go on for hours naming role players who swung a title. The 2008 Celts lucked out by getting James Posey, Eddie House and P.J. Brown for practically nothing; Miami wouldn't have that luxury this summer, not with so many role players jockeying for contracts one year before the possible lockout. Nobody is taking less money to showcase themselves for a summer that might not happen. Even if Miami could spin Michael Beasley for a fourth guy (say, Trevor Ariza), that's still not enough. They'd need one more rebounder, point guard, a 3-point shooter and a center. Good luck.

 

11. Another problem: You realize how many minutes these guys would log on a three-man team? 42-44 minutes for 100 games … and if anyone missed an extended stretch of games, then that would put even more pressure on the other two. Crazy. No way they win more than 50, especially with teams gunning for them every night. We've also never seen two perimeter superstar alpha dogs coexist for an NBA title -- not even when Jerry West and Elgin Baylor teamed up with Wilt Chamberlain against the aging Celtics in 1969. LeBron would have to accept becoming Mega-Pippen to Wade's Jordan. (Yeah, right.) Even during the final quarter of the 2008 gold-medal game, when everyone on the American team was staring at each other wondering who was going to step up against a red-hot Spain team, there were a few minutes of tentative, "I don't want to step on anyone's toes here" basketball before Kobe said "Screw it, get out of my way" and took over the key portion of the game.

 

That's my opinion basically. Unless they get some guys to accept far, far, far below market value, I don't see that team being a title team.

 

Gator has mentioned Jermain O'Neal and Haslem and even TMac..so maybe they can get some people around them, but that's a huge if and until those questions are answered this Heat team still has a lot of work to do.

[CQI13]

J. O'Neal went to the Celtics. We also don't know if the Big 3 are taking less than max to make room for other guys.

 

Also, Beasley needs to go.

[GatorBait19]

You know MGreene pointed out something that most are forgetting. Heat would still have the MLE and the biann. the means they have an extra 8 million pretty much to split between players.

 

They have Chalmers so they have 4 guys already since more than likely they are splitting with Beasley. That mean 9 more guys are needed.

 

 

 

Let's say T-Mac, Mike Miller each take 2 million each, that leaves 6 million left or 1.8 million of your MLE left and still the 2.5 of the biann. Now say they can convine shaq, Haywood, or Brad Miller to come for the Biann, half of it or the last 1.8 of the MLE, that would leave the anywhere from 1.5 to 2.5 left to spend 5 more players.

 

Most teams only uses a 10 man rotation so they could spend the rest of the biann on two more players and convince the 10th player to take the vet mim so they can win a title.

 

I know that seems like a lot and almost impossible, but in a dream world it could happen.

 

I personallu don't believe Beasley needs to go. I think he could still develop into a great player with the big three playing right next to him, but we will see how this happens.

[GatorBait19]

Think the Magic are a little more undergun to get Chris Paul or something now?

 

Also I think we should remember that the more ESPN hypes this up, the more people are going to watch it. That man could have been camped out in Ohio all day and ESPN is just running stuff to hype everything up. Now that I think about it I find it weird that less than 24 hours before he announces anything stroy comes out that he is in Miami. Bosh was in Houston or somewhere else outside of Miami when he made his choice. So we could all be speculating for nothing.

[PeterHilton]

Heywood signed with the Mavs already.

 

I think its "possible" to put a decent team around these guys ( I mean the Heat's last title came with guys like Gary Payton and Antoine Walker and Zo all clinging on for the ride). You could possibly get TMac or AI or hell call Stephon Marbury and see what he's up to.

 

But until I see the complete roster I don't think signing Lebron guarantees the Heat anything more than being a 2 or 3 seed in the East.

[PeterHilton]

Don't think the fact he was "in Miami" was what generatd the speculation. I mean..he's got a private jet. He attended his camp in Cleveland and the studio he's doing the show from is 7 minutes from the Knicks practice facility. So it's not his location.

 

Apparently the Buchers and Broussards of the world are getting info from in his camp and from teams that have already admitted they're out of the running.

[GatorBait19]

I have been hearing reports all day at work talking about Beasley being traded to the Wolves for the TPE, then after the big three are signed and sealed trading the TPE back to the T'Wolves for Kevin Love.

[PeterHilton]

I have been hearing reports all day at work talking about Beasley being traded to the Wolves for the TPE, then after the big three are signed and sealed trading the TPE back to the T'Wolves for Kevin Love.

 

That would be awful and stupid for the TWolves. But since it's David Kahn that's pretty believable.

 

Love would be a perfect fit. Hed rebound, play D, hit open jumpers, and is a terrific passer to start the break. Like a younger Brad Miller.

 

I think you HAVE to dump Beasley because he's valuable to teams looking to re-build and there are quite a few reports that paint him as a total jack ass that can't get along with teammates.

[CQI13]

Heywood signed with the Mavs already.

 

I think its "possible" to put a decent team around these guys ( I mean the Heat's last title came with guys like Gary Payton and Antoine Walker and Zo all clinging on for the ride). You could possibly get TMac or AI or hell call Stephon Marbury and see what he's up to.

 

But until I see the complete roster I don't think signing Lebron guarantees the Heat anything more than being a 2 or 3 seed in the East.

 

Did you call a So. Fla station yesterday and get berated by the host? Because that's what a caller said and the host was "Is this a prank call? Because bringing up those 3 players is making it so difficult for me to take you seriously." He even closed by saying that the Heat don't even know who those guys are.

 

Mike Miller got offered 5 years, $27-30 million, fueling speculation that the Heat will lose out on LeBron OR that the Big 3 will be taking less than max in order to ensure they get better pieces around them.

 

Also, Gbait...Magic getting rid of Nelson? I mean, they already got Duhon, and you want Paul...that leaves Nelson out. It's not like this is the Knicks, who like to load up on a position while overpaying.

[GatorBait19]

Did you call a So. Fla station yesterday and get berated by the host? Because that's what a caller said and the host was "Is this a prank call? Because bringing up those 3 players is making it so difficult for me to take you seriously." He even closed by saying that the Heat don't even know who those guys are.

 

Mike Miller got offered 5 years, $27-30 million, fueling speculation that the Heat will lose out on LeBron OR that the Big 3 will be taking less than max in order to ensure they get better pieces around them.

 

Also, Gbait...Magic getting rid of Nelson? I mean, they already got Duhon, and you want Paul...that leaves Nelson out. It's not like this is the Knicks, who like to load up on a position while overpaying.

 

Yes in fact. Nelson is a offensive first type PG. He shoots before he thinks pass. Paul can create his own shot, plus create shots for other players.

 

The deal that's been talked about is pretty much the Magic sending Nelson and Carter plus others, for Paul and others.

 

The Magic's biggest weakness, no matter what people say is a PG who can dish the ball night in and night out. That have depth on the team, they have shooters, they have players who can play defense. All they need is a true starting pg. Duhon isn't a starter, he's a backup. Nelson to me is a nate robison clone. He's score, but 4 to 5 assist is all you can really depend on from Nelson along with him missing 10 to 15 games a year and giving up the ball about 2 times a game. Chris Paul may give up the ball .3 more times a game, but he is also going to give you 20 points, 10 assist, and 2.5 steals a game.

 

 

It's okay, because those players and the Heat don't even know who he is. That's a host doing his job, hyping up people and getting things stirred up. People on the radio will do anything and say anything to make people go, YEAH!!! Trust me the Heat would rather have T-Mac, AI, and Marbury then Beasley and Chalmers. T-Mac is only 31 and has now had a full year removed from his injury. If he's coming off the bench for 15 to 20 minutes a night that would be perfect for him and the Heat. AI maybe 35, but Riley has done things with older players before and AI can still contribute. He has shown the ability to get you 7 assist a game and would come cheap. Plus the fact that you could slot him into the PG position to start and have Chalmers come off the bench.

 

 

I understand why the annoucer said this stuff, but also he's crazy to think that T-Mac, AI, and Starbury would be worse then 9 other vet mim guys. I'd rather take 3 guys who have playoff experince and have scored over 20 points more than once in their life over names like vet mim 1,2,3,4,5

[Johnny Fenoli]

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/7313/miar.jpg

 

 

MIA... the new new new world order of the NBA.... Shopped by yours truly.

 

 

take 2?

 

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/8786/mia2ao.jpg

[PeterHilton]

Did you call a So. Fla station yesterday and get berated by the host? Because that's what a caller said and the host was "Is this a prank call? Because bringing up those 3 players is making it so difficult for me to take you seriously." He even closed by saying that the Heat don't even know who those guys are.

 

 

Naw..I was being facetious (shoulda thrown a winky face in there)

 

The point I'm making is that they are going to have to fill in the cracks with some pretty questionable names. Any 'talent' that comes to Miami to chase a ring are going to be broken down vets or headcases no one else will touch (ie "hey...wonder what Steve Francis is doing these days???")

[Remianen]

I think this is much ado about nothing, mostly. In the end the most likely 'big name' moves are Amare to the Knicks - which... bwahahahaha. I like Amare but the Knicks are a shambles of an organization. Credit Isiah Thomas for that. And Bosh to the Heat. And again the Raptors get hurt.

 

Deal. Toronto's always going to be a hard sell and they're always going to be a dumping ground. Canada's tax laws coupled with the team's status as a major market in a minor country (relatively speaking) means the true superstars aren't going to want to play there and anyone the Raptors manage to trap...err, draft, that's worth a quarter is takin' the first flight outta town as soon as their deal expires.

 

And the Knicks organization isn't a shambles since someone with a clue (Donnie Walsh) took over.

 

It's sounding more and more like LeBron is going to Miami. After looking into it and hearing some other sides I could see it working, but man would I hate them. I already didn't like the Heat, and this would probably put them real high up on the list of teams in all of sports I hate.

 

Ooooo, lemme guess one of the others. The Yankees?

 

You could possibly get TMac or AI or hell call Stephon Marbury and see what he's up to.

 

Marbury's under contract in China. His buyout would be about the same amount as the vet minimum.

 

Also, Gbait...Magic getting rid of Nelson? I mean, they already got Duhon, and you want Paul...that leaves Nelson out. It's not like this is the Knicks, who like to load up on a position while overpaying.

 

Seriously, as much a critic of the Cablevision Clippers as I am, I'm still amazed at how people won't let go of a previous era in a team's management structure. Tell me, when has Donnie Walsh loaded up on a position while overpaying? Amare Stoudamire is an example but that was a means to a (questionable) end. All the man has done since taking over the team is SELL OFF, dumping all those contracts that were the franchise's albatross. That's why the Knicks had so much cap space coming into free agency. How do you do that if you're overpaying while loading up on the same position?

 

I understand why the annoucer said this stuff, but also he's crazy to think that T-Mac, AI, and Starbury would be worse then 9 other vet mim guys. I'd rather take 3 guys who have playoff experince and have scored over 20 points more than once in their life over names like vet mim 1,2,3,4,5

 

Wait, so you think bringing in a cancerous personality who is better in his head than he is in reality (yes, I'm talkin' about Marbury), half asses it regularly, and sulks when he's not the center of attention is better than a vet minimum player who's going to know his place, keep his mouth shut, and work his ass off on the court? Agree to disagree, I guess.

[PeterHilton]

http://web20.twitpic.com/img/126939975-7825614065beeb412acc485bd13f09ba.4c365168-scaled.jpg

 

 

He should do the announcement wrestling style:

 

Lebron James walks to the podium. After a few tearful words, he announces that he's staying at home with his friends and family. Lebron James has re-signed signed with Cleveland!!!

 

Cleveland owner Dan Gilbert appears from the crowd and hands Lebron a jersey. but just as Lebron is about to put the jersey on...

 

JR: BAHGAWD IT'S D-WADE AND CHRIS BOSH!!!

 

'Welcome to Miami' plays and the two stars walk down the aisle towards the podium. The are accompanied by Pat Riley, wearing a blonde and black beard/fu-macnhu moustache combo

 

JR: BUSINESS IS ABOUT TO PICK UP!

 

Gilbert and Riley begin trading insults..when out of nowhere...LEBRON BLASTS DAN GILBERT WITH A STEEL CHAIR!!!

 

Lebron steps into the aisle, throws the Cavs jersey aways, takes off his dress shirt and...HE WAS WEARING A HEAT JERSEY THE WHOLE TIME!!!

 

JR: DAMMMMNNN YOU LEBRON!! DAMMMNN YOU TO HELLLLL!!!

[Johnny Fenoli]

He should do the announcement wrestling style:

 

Lebron James walks to the podium. After a few tearful words, he announces that he's staying at home with his friends and family. Lebron James has re-signed signed with Cleveland!!!

 

Cleveland owner Dan Gilbert appears from the crowd and hands Lebron a jersey. but just as Lebron is about to put the jersey on...

 

JR: BAHGAWD IT'S D-WADE AND CHRIS BOSH!!!

 

'Welcome to Miami' plays and the two stars walk down the aisle towards the podium. The are accompanied by Pat Riley, wearing a blonde and black beard/fu-macnhu moustache combo

 

JR: BUSINESS IS ABOUT TO PICK UP!

 

Gilbert and Riley begin trading insults..when out of nowhere...LEBRON BLASTS DAN GILBERT WITH A STEEL CHAIR!!!

 

Lebron steps into the aisle, throws the Cavs jersey aways, takes off his dress shirt and...HE WAS WEARING A HEAT JERSEY THE WHOLE TIME!!!

 

JR: DAMMMMNNN YOU LEBRON!! DAMMMNN YOU TO HELLLLL!!!

 

Would be.... amazing...

 

Isn't scott norton, buff bagwell, konnan, etc... the equivalent to the scrubs theyd have to sign form a team? A bunch of over the hill past their prime guys, some guys who never made their full potential, and some guys who just wouldnt cut it elsewhere.

[SHaynes23]

Ooooo, lemme guess one of the others. The Yankees?

 

I actually love the Yankees. They are my favorite team other than my hometown Cardinals. It's not that I'm against stacking teams if you are able to, I already disliked the Heat, this would just push them over. I'm a Magic fan, and those two teams don't get along.

[Jaysin]

Wow, I heard on the news that they are preparing for violence breaking out in Akron and Cleveland tonight after he makes his announcement.

 

I think I'm one of ten people near Cleveland that want Lebron gone.

[Johnny Fenoli]

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/7313/miar.jpg

 

 

MIA... the new new new world order of the NBA.... Shopped by yours truly.

 

 

take 2?

 

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/8786/mia2ao.jpg

 

 

 

reupped this for anyone who missed it, the link messed up

[Beeker]

Except Jermaine O'Neal is only 31.

 

Oh, that O'Neal. He's been a journeyman center at best. He should have gone to college. He might have become a star if he did.

 

Also Jordan's assist numbers were better before they won all those championships.

 

Before first championship: 6.0 assist a game

After first title: 4.8 assist a game

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html

 

The Bulls won Championships because they put people around Jordan so Jordan wasn't doing everything by himself. Names like Pippen, Rodman, Kerr, and Horace Grant. The reason the Bulls didn't win before these guys is because it was Jordan and then the Bulls like you said.

 

That is also much different then what the Heat would have. They would have three All-Stars in their primes with Beasley and Chalmers still developing. Beasley has been the second man in the Heat's offense for two years now, if Beasley stays then he would essentially become the fourth or fifth option which isn't a bad thing considering he is a 46% shooter.

 

We'll see. So far Bosh is a regular season numbers beast but has done nothing in the post season. How much of that is him, how much the players around him I'm not sure about. But make no mistake, Miami will remain D-Wade's team. If LeBron goes there... he's be Uber-Pippen so... Bosh is Horace Grant? Which is probably the best place for him.

 

Sorry if this seems like I am being mean it's just I don't understand how the two situations are the same.

 

I'm guessing you are a Raptors fan?

 

Not mean, I'm an adult, it's a difference of opinions. Until Miami plays an actual game, they're still just a team. A potentially great team, but they aren't the NBA Champs, the Eastern Conference Representatives in the Finals or anything but a team.

 

And no, I was a Vancouver Grizzlies fan but David Stern crippled that team from the outset and 'gifted' them with the worst GM in the history of pro sports. Thank you Stu Jackson for being nothing but talentless.

 

Deal. Toronto's always going to be a hard sell and they're always going to be a dumping ground. Canada's tax laws coupled with the team's status as a major market in a minor country (relatively speaking) means the true superstars aren't going to want to play there and anyone the Raptors manage to trap...err, draft, that's worth a quarter is takin' the first flight outta town as soon as their deal expires.

 

And the Knicks organization isn't a shambles since someone with a clue (Donnie Walsh) took over.

 

Oh, I know why Toronto's going to be a hard sell. I don't think there's a bigger jump personal taxes in North America than Ontario to Florida, except maybe British Columbia or Quebec to Florida.

 

As for the Knicks, Walsh has things moving in the right direction but he started from a very deep hole.

 

Starbury. TMac. Francis... JR Rider?

 

Anyone who thinks locker room cancers like Starbury or Francis would be a benefit to slapping a jersey on a Miami homeless person are crazy. Starbury would still demand 20 plus minutes, a share of the revenue, his own locker room. Francis might not be much better. I don't know about TMac.

 

*IF* LeBron goes to Miami I think that will be the biggest issue; other than the back-up 9... is how do three major egos co-exist? Also, what happens if one player (or two) get hurt for an extended period?

 

This Heat-Wave guarantees Miami exactly... nothing.

(Other than merchandise sales.)

[Candyman]

Mike Miller got offered 5 years, $27-30 million, fueling speculation that the Heat will lose out on LeBron OR that the Big 3 will be taking less than max in order to ensure they get better pieces around them.

 

They have to take less so the Heat can sign Chris Paul in 2012.

 

(If you think I'm joking, I'm not. There's been reports floating that the Big 3 and Paul had so much fun playing together in the 2008 Olympics that they made a pact to get on the same team in the NBA. And I don't mean recent reports, these were coming out at the 2008 Olympics...but at this point, if LeBron does indeed go to Miami, it's too much of a coincidence for those reports not to be true. Bill Simmons has a great article on this on ESPN.)

[Astil]

 

*IF* LeBron goes to Miami I think that will be the biggest issue; other than the back-up 9... is how do three major egos co-exist? Also, what happens if one player (or two) get hurt for an extended period?

 

This Heat-Wave guarantees Miami exactly... nothing.

(Other than merchandise sales.)

 

I'd lol. Hard.

[GatorBait19]

Miami Heat!!!!!!!!!!