Acidburned Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I have read quite a few graphic novels but mainly things like World War Hulk, Planet Hulk, Punisher series, Death of Superman, What if series, Marvel Zombies and a few others. My knowledge of the x-men is not that good outside of the cartoon and films. I know who the characters are and their powers and such but I was just looking for some advice on a good starting point to get into the x-men world. I did get some essential Ghostrider and Solver Surfer a while a go but the I found the black and white art not that good to read. There are also some characters that I would like to read more about they are Sabretooth, Night Crawler, Mystique and Emma Frost. Also love the idea of cross over stories and such so any one have any advice on where to start? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I would say the 70's, 80, and 90's. The quality of writing (though not the art in some cases) has gone down dratstically over the years. It's gotten all too complex for its own good. Look for the old stuff. Depending on the era, some art may not look as polished, some art may look dated, some art may lack "production values", but the writing was much better back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I would say the 70's, 80, and 90's. The quality of writing (though not the art in some cases) has gone down dratstically over the years. It's gotten all too complex for its own good. Look for the old stuff. Depending on the era, some art may not look as polished, some art may look dated, some art may lack "production values", but the writing was much better back then. This was always my problem with the X-Men. I much prefered the "Team-Ups" moreso then actually trying to read the X-Men. I read them in the 70's though, and back then, to me it was too much for one comicbook. You could follow it without too much problems though. Definately wasn't alot of cross over with them back then though, at least not that I recall. However, starting at the beginning is not a bad idea, because then at least you would understand why people get upset when they see something like "The Beast" go under a "Hulk/like" transformation when changing into his purpleness. It was a matter of litterally years in the books, as he changed little by little. People like Wolverine were NOT the main players, etc.- Although he was always a fan favorite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acidburned Posted June 5, 2011 Author Share Posted June 5, 2011 Can you start from the beginning with graphic novels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bippodrop Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I would say the 70's, 80, and 90's. The quality of writing (though not the art in some cases) has gone down dratstically over the years. It's gotten all too complex for its own good. Look for the old stuff. Depending on the era, some art may not look as polished, some art may look dated, some art may lack "production values", but the writing was much better back then. Nailed it I think. X-Men is best when (my opinion) Hellfire Club is involved. Love that group of villians. For the past 20 years Marvel seems to be spinning off every "popular" X-man into their own title. And there was a time when Wolverine "guest starred" in just about every comic Marvel ran (might still do that, as I gave up on them in the mid-90s). Pick up the black & white compilation volumes at the bookstore and start from the beginning. Or you could start at the forming of the 2nd team: Storm, Colossus, etc. Either way, once you get to the stuff written around 1993 or so it becomes such a clusterbomb it's not worth trying to follow. Eh, my two cents anyways..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Read Age of Apocalypse, just because its amazing. Easily one of my favorite story arcs of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappyboy Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I went back to the VERY begininng. To the Essentials edition with the issues from when the X-Men were considered a flop. But don't let facts like no Wolverine or changes in art style over the years scare you off. You get the origins of ideas and characters that woud come to define the Prof and his proteges. From the mutant paranoia and inner love quad, yes QUAD, over Jean to the beginnings of Magneto, Juggernaut and even the Sentinels. Yes, the Sentinels were around before the X-Men ever became characters that might have a legacy. Just as the initial X-Men title got canceled there's an existential crisis for the group which some pretty cool Beast stories spring out of including him going furry for the first time which appear at the end of Essentials Volume 3. If you prefer comics that are targeted toward older readers, this might not be the answer you want. But if you like your comics to remember they don't have to be high art, going back to Day 1 could give you a grounding for when you jump into later decades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarity Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 In my opinion, these could help Days Of Future Past - Kitty Pryde sent back in time to prevent an assassination, the rise of the Sentinels and the beginning of enslavement for all mutants. Dark Phoenix Saga - What X-Men: The Last Stand should have been. The Adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix - Right after Scott & Jean get married, and sheds more light on Cable. Fatal Attraction - Wolverine loosing his adamantium and the prelude to... Onslaught - Shows a completely different side of Xavier Those should take you up to the 90's then... E Is for Extinction - Loss of Genosha House Of M - Loss of 97% of all mutants Messiah Complex - First mutant since 'M-Day' born. Heralded as mutant messiah Second Coming - Return of Hope Summers and the end of a 5 year story arc These should get you caught up to speed on current events Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acidburned Posted June 5, 2011 Author Share Posted June 5, 2011 Thanks for all the advice people, gives me some great ideas on when to start. Cable has always been one of my favourites from cartoons, video games and the odd comic here and there. What are the main stories worth getting to find out more about him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Nailed it I think. X-Men is best when (my opinion) Hellfire Club is involved. Love that group of villians. For the past 20 years Marvel seems to be spinning off every "popular" X-man into their own title. And there was a time when Wolverine "guest starred" in just about every comic Marvel ran (might still do that, as I gave up on them in the mid-90s). Pick up the black & white compilation volumes at the bookstore and start from the beginning. Or you could start at the forming of the 2nd team: Storm, Colossus, etc. Either way, once you get to the stuff written around 1993 or so it becomes such a clusterbomb it's not worth trying to follow. Eh, my two cents anyways..... I'd agree, except I gave up only fairly recently, with their "Civil War" Saga. It just rubbed me the wrong way, how the whole thing went down. A lot of hype, not a lot of substance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarity Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I'd agree, except I gave up only fairly recently, with their "Civil War" Saga. It just rubbed me the wrong way, how the whole thing went down. A lot of hype, not a lot of substance. I kinda liked Civil War, but then im a Captain America fan.. X-Men's Civil War storyline was a little week featuring the 198 and O.N.E but it does path the way towards Messiah Complex. I do however prefer X-Men stories that don't feature Wolverine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 The problem with the Civil War was it was all hype, not a lot of substance. Everything that has happened since then has reversed the Civil War storyline, pretty much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarity Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 The problem with the Civil War was it was all hype, not a lot of substance. Everything that has happened since then has reversed the Civil War storyline, pretty much. Such is the way of comics though. Every massive comic event is usually retconned somewhere down the line to make room for another massive comic event Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Such is the way of comics though. Every massive comic event is usually retconned somewhere down the line to make room for another massive comic event That's a fair point, except that a lot of the better elements are kept. Except this time, not much was kept, because a lot of it was pretty dull or bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoisonedSuperman Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Oh no!! I'm reading "road to the civil war" currently and then civil war and I have two other civil war books... this doesn't sound too good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Oh no!! I'm reading "road to the civil war" currently and then civil war and I have two other civil war books... this doesn't sound too good. Damn, did I just spoil it for you? No more Civil War talk from me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoisonedSuperman Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Damn, did I just spoil it for you? No more Civil War talk from me. No sir, but reading that it is dull is never a good thing!! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 No sir, but reading that it is dull is never a good thing!! LOL To be fair, that's the best thing I have to say about it. At worst, it's bad. At best, it's not very interesting. Clarity is correct in teh basics, but each huge comic "war" indicates a semi-permanent shift in thought, if not in practice. With Civil War, it didn't really change the general direction of comic books. Actually, this isn't uniquely a Marvel issue-DC comics is having this problem as well. Nothing in Mainstream Comics interest me these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 To be fair, that's the best thing I have to say about it. At worst, it's bad. At best, it's not very interesting. Clarity is correct in teh basics, but each huge comic "war" indicates a semi-permanent shift in thought, if not in practice. With Civil War, it didn't really change the general direction of comic books. Actually, this isn't uniquely a Marvel issue-DC comics is having this problem as well. Nothing in Mainstream Comics interest me these days. LOL. I really don't understand why people would believe a comicbook company would actually kill of very popular character, and make it stick. Ok... well, Batman might be actually dead, but I don't think he is. Captain America, Superman, Spiderman, Hulk, Batman, Etc... Or even Wolverine for that matter. I just don't see any common scense to kill one of these off (as they have their own franchise's) permanantly. In a movie, sure..... Kill off Cyclops (I don't understand it at all though), but in the comics... Its just a matter of time before they come back. A bunch of characters that don't do anything but "filler"... Sure, they can kill them off, but then again, you never know down the line... What if someone likes them a year from now? Time to re-animate them, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 LOL. I really don't understand why people would believe a comicbook company would actually kill of very popular character, and make it stick. Ok... well, Batman might be actually dead, but I don't think he is. Captain America, Superman, Spiderman, Hulk, Batman, Etc... Or even Wolverine for that matter. I just don't see any common scense to kill one of these off (as they have their own franchise's) permanantly. In a movie, sure..... Kill off Cyclops (I don't understand it at all though), but in the comics... Its just a matter of time before they come back. A bunch of characters that don't do anything but "filler"... Sure, they can kill them off, but then again, you never know down the line... What if someone likes them a year from now? Time to re-animate them, lol. That's another fair point. But I have a great counter-argument to that. Don't kill them off in the first place. I feel that Mainstream Comics try to "kill" characters, then to bring them back just to get "emotion" out of it. If you are going to "kill" a character, you either make it permanent, or don't do it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_w_w Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 That's another fair point. But I have a great counter-argument to that. Don't kill them off in the first place. I feel that Mainstream Comics try to "kill" characters, then to bring them back just to get "emotion" out of it. If you are going to "kill" a character, you either make it permanent, or don't do it at all. That's not a great counter-argument - unless by great, you mean in reference to your personal preferences. I suspect we generally agree about the state of comics, but Civil War and the death of Cap (which I found wholly unsatisfying) was popular, sold well, and seemed (in my limited experience hanging around my friend's comic shop) to draw in folks that had largely given up on comics. Same general things happened with the death of Superman. Killing characters provides temporary sales boosts. For better or worse, the current mainstream comic book audience needs crossovers, deaths, resurrections, and big events to keep their interest. Edit: Of course, the counter-side to this is that if the big events/crossovers are unsatisfactory or riddled with publication problems (read: delays), it might push readers away (following a poor conclusion). I've heard this argument in reference to Civil War and it might be true (though, I wonder how much of the drop in readership can be attributed to the folks that temporarily jumped back into comics to read that story and stopped when it was over). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoisonedSuperman Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Sorry to jack this thread from the original poster but I have a question. I just finished road to civilwar, obviously civil war is next but what comes next? I have both of the civil war frontline books, but does anything come inbetween frontline and civil war? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ampulator Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 That's not a great counter-argument - unless by great, you mean in reference to your personal preferences. I suspect we generally agree about the state of comics, but Civil War and the death of Cap (which I found wholly unsatisfying) was popular, sold well, and seemed (in my limited experience hanging around my friend's comic shop) to draw in folks that had largely given up on comics. Same general things happened with the death of Superman. Killing characters provides temporary sales boosts. For better or worse, the current mainstream comic book audience needs crossovers, deaths, resurrections, and big events to keep their interest. Edit: Of course, the counter-side to this is that if the big events/crossovers are unsatisfactory or riddled with publication problems (read: delays), it might push readers away (following a poor conclusion). I've heard this argument in reference to Civil War and it might be true (though, I wonder how much of the drop in readership can be attributed to the folks that temporarily jumped back into comics to read that story and stopped when it was over). Does it really boost sales that much anymore? Sure, in the past, I would have completely agreed with you. But that was then, and this is now. It's overdone. That being said, a lot of things are overdone in comic books these days. You also didn't address this, but I guess I should explicitly stated it - killing off characters have lost their emotional impact. It's a two-fer when it comes to negatives-it pisses people off because you just killed, and it makes very little impact because people most likely expect the character to be resurrected. On one hand, it angers people. On the other, people also snicker at the attempt because they know if they complain enough, they will bring them back. But does it drive sales as much as did anymore? Probably not. They kill off whoever, it will just anger one segment of fans, and the other segment will just snicker and complain at the attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acidburned Posted June 6, 2011 Author Share Posted June 6, 2011 Sorry to jack this thread from the original poster but I have a question. I just finished road to civilwar, obviously civil war is next but what comes next? I have both of the civil war frontline books, but does anything come inbetween frontline and civil war? These are the sort of things I would like to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 These are the sort of things I would like to know. Frontline runs concurrently with Civil War and is honestly not particularly necessary to enjoy Civil War. Does it really boost sales that much anymore? Sure, in the past, I would have completely agreed with you. But that was then, and this is now. It's overdone. That being said, a lot of things are overdone in comic books these days. Fantastic Four Sales, December 2010 and January 2011 Fantastic Four #586: 38,108 Fantastic Four #587 (death of Johnny Storm): 115,448 And that's from Johnny Storm's death, a character that hasn't supported his own comic in about 35 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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