The All Elite Wrestling Discussion Thread

[hailthebulldog]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="BHK1978" data-cite="BHK1978" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46243" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I caught the last half hour of the show, because there was nothing else on. I noticed something interesting in the Miro interview. Either Tony Schiavone was feeding Miro lines or Miro's promo was scripted and Tony was reading an off-camera version of it in order to get his cue on what to do. <p> </p><p> If you watch Tony during that interview he is mouthing everything Miro is saying in the promo. It was so odd.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Tony does that. It's something that you can notice if you look back at some of his NWA stuff too. It's likely from going over the promo before the show. I believe Conrad has brought that up during his podcast too.</p>

[milamber]

<p>- Omega & Nak vs Mox & Kingston was solid. "That's somebody's curtain" lol.</p><p>

- QT vs Cody was good. QT's best match ever. No pyro for Cody <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/redface.png.900245280682ef18c5d82399a93c5827.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p>

- Darby outta nowhere! I was worried about that staircase bump.</p><p>

- Dr. Britt vs Hart was an OK squash to pad her win record. Taz still salty about Christian.</p><p>

- Fatal Fourway Tag match was solid but felt rushed.</p><p>

- Hyped for Dynamite's stacked show next week.</p><p>

- Blood & Guts match was mostly great. Way more blood than I expected. The ending was well booked but the execution lacked drama. I would have had Sammy also on top of the cage and Jericho begging him not to surrender. Also bad choice of camera angle to hide Jericho's soft fall. The Stadium Stampede finish looked better.</p>

[Blodyxe]

<p>The ending of Blood and Guts was weak, but not the worst part of the match for me. </p><p> </p><p>

So many times cameras caught people with blades in their hands, especially evident when Jericho held it in his hand while in the Fujiwara. It was a good effort, but just like with Mox/Omega, the finish undoes most of the good work. </p><p> </p><p>

Jericho was walking around slowly for the entire match too... not that he has to flip and bounce, but he looked like he took a walk in the park. I think he has to be held accountable, but I doubt anyone will get on his tail backstage.</p>

[crownsy]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Matt_Black" data-cite="Matt_Black" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46243" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'm trying to rationalize the finish as this match being the Empire Strikes Back of the Inner Circle/ Pinnacle feud.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I think it's more going to get Jericho kicked out for awhile or something, since he "failed" them. I mean Chris isn't an idiot, eventually he's going to have to take a break/ go on one last solo babyface run to retire. </p><p> </p><p> I love the man, but my feeling to that finish was "this is the beginning of the end to at least the Chris Jericho version of the inner circle"</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Blodyxe" data-cite="Blodyxe" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46243" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>The ending of Blood and Guts was weak, but not the worst part of the match for me. <p> </p><p> So many times cameras caught people with blades in their hands, especially evident when Jericho held it in his hand while in the Fujiwara. It was a good effort, but just like with Mox/Omega, the finish undoes most of the good work. </p><p> </p><p> Jericho was walking around slowly for the entire match too... not that he has to flip and bounce, but he looked like he took a walk in the park. I think he has to be held accountable, but I doubt anyone will get on his tail backstage.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I didn't mind the above so much, because I knew it was going to be a blade match. I think one of AEW's strengths actually is that they have rotating M/E storylines, but sure some aren't for everyone. Like I loved Arcade Anarchy, but know people who thought it was to goofy to main event. Meanwhile I know people who really like the Moxley stuff, but it's not for me. </p><p> </p><p> What drove me off most of WWE except recaps and clips is that for about 90% of there shows, if not more it's the same match. Like yes, they have awesome guys so sometimes the formula is amazing, but I've seen all these matches and the Baby gets up/Heel Cuts off and gets the heat/ Babyface recovers and either wins or gets tricked and loses/ they just do a F finish.</p><p> </p><p> like yea, AEW swings and misses sometimes (Exploding Death Match) but at least they try stuff like Darby Allin and 10 M/E a show. Meanwhile in WWE Braum is wrestling 3 times a night.</p>

[Peppermint Rage]

They telegraphed who's going to fight for the AEW Championship so hard that the segment should have been sponsored by Western Union.

 

to me they made it even, because before orange showed up PAC seemed like the obvious winner because of the existing history with Omega in AEW, though I honestly wanna see Orange vs Omega.

[milamber]

I think OC will beat PAC but a part of me wants PAC to win via interference so we can get Omega vs PAC and OC vs Fenix

[Mootinie]

I did have a passing thought that a good finish would have been Jericho getting trapped in the Salt of the Earth and Inner Circle being unable to reach him to intervene, thus surrendering to save Jericho from further injury. You could do it by having Jericho and MJF in one ring and everybody else in the other. I suppose you could make MJF look like a dick by refusing to relinquish the armbar even after the bell has been called. Just an idea I had.

 

But I can understand why they did the finish and Jericho is like 50 so it makes sense that it was hella safe. The match was still pretty tremendous and worked as a War Games in terms of it resembling a fight more than a wrestling performance. I'm sure people think it fell apart after Jericho entered but I think War Games matches are supposed to be like that.

 

QT vs. Cody was a very neat match too. I enjoyed it.

 

I'm hoping Miro takes the TNT title next week but I wonder if Kip will cost him the match.

[Jaysin]

The ending just made Sammy, Santana, and Ortiz look dumb. Santana and Ortiz were climbing the cage and had plenty of time to get up there but stopped randomly to go by Sammy on the opposite side of the cage.

 

It's not the fall I have a problem with, the ending was just dumb from an in character point of view. Surely Sammy knows MJF is a scumbag and would throw Jericho off anyway in a kayfabe sense. The fall would have looked better from other camera angles, but the ones they used showed the crash pad and clearly spray painted cardboard. It looked bush League. Obviously I don't want Jericho getting legit hurt, but don't have camera aimed at the crash pad and close ups of the cardboard.

 

Hopefully Jericho is gone for awhile to sell the fall at least. People in AEW have "gotten hurt" or taken nasty falls and come back super quick like nothing happened.

 

The actual match was tremendous and maybe the finish will grow on me. War Games was always one of my favorite matches and they killed it other than a couple botches.

 

Sammy and Hager were mega over and it was the best Jake has looked since his team with Cesaro. Hopefully Jake gets a push at some point.

[Mootinie]

I think perhaps they stopped climbing because the thinking is that Max will definitely throw him off if they try and intervene. Loaded gun and holding a hostage kind of scenario, if you catch my drift?

[crownsy]

I think perhaps they stopped climbing because the thinking is that Max will definitely throw him off if they try and intervene. Loaded gun and holding a hostage kind of scenario, if you catch my drift?

 

yea that was my take.

 

The finish could have been shot from another angle but honestly I didn't have much of a problem with it

 

It's not like every other company doesn't use freaking crash pads.

[Blodyxe]

People judge the match very differently of course, but it highlights some points for me.

 

a) When you decide to do a hardcore match, you better underpromise and overdeliver. AEW did the opposite at least two times now. They did not shy away from hyping this match as something extra violent, and so they have set some big expectations they couldn't realistically live up to. Big-event-lurkers don't have the same tolerance and patience as regular AEW viewers

 

b) Camera work in AEW is not the best, to say the least. They film the action without knowing how to hide the weaknesses of their performers. I don't know why they stayed with MJF and Y2J at the top of the cage for so long, ignoring what was happening in the rings. Switch between two levels, don't film Jericho slicing his forehead so close, sheesh

 

c) There's nobody who would criticize top guys backstage, nobody to point out the mistakes. They created an echo chamber where their duds don't smell, and that's a big issue. If nobody is held accountable, these underwhelming finishes will continue. I can't envision anybody stepping up to Jericho and saying "Chief, this ain't it" or him even acknowledging an opinion where he's criticized.

 

It's not that AEW is bad or the match was terrible - no. It's that they could be so much better... it's like booting up a TEW save, booking a big main event for the pay-per-view, where people get B and B+ perfrormance... only for it to get a C+ match rating. You know the feeling

[Jaysin]

yea that was my take.

 

The finish could have been shot from another angle but honestly I didn't have much of a problem with it

 

It's not like every other company doesn't use freaking crash pads.

 

Again, the crash pad isn't the problem we know he's obviously going to fall onto one, but it being blatantly on camera is the problem. They want us to suspend our belief but go out of their way to show how phoney it is. If the camera had been far away it would have looked less tacky and lame. Kudos to Jericho for taking the fall and I'm glad he fell safely, but as said elsewhere you could see people blading the whole match and cameras didn't cut away at all.

 

As for the loaded gun and hostage situation, Santana and Ortiz were behind MJF and in a legit situation could have snuck up on him no problem.

 

Like I said, they want us to suspend our beliefs and then go out of their way to do stupid stuff.

 

I love AEW more than any promotion I've seen besides 90s WCW and want them to succeed. I also watched TNA from the beginning until the Aces & Eights crap. AEW is making a lot of the same mistakes WCW and TNA did and that bothers me because I really do love 90% of the product. I love Jericho. He's a top five favorite for me. There's times where he's my GOAT. I think there could have been a better finish. The fall off the cage wasn't even needed. It also bothers me that any time there's a ceiling on a cage now people feel the need to fight on top of it. It's played out and unoriginal.

 

Blood and Guts was fantastic outside of the finish and obvious blading shots and the undercard was fun too.

 

If in a movie a dragon was going to burn a town down, obviously you don't want that, but if the scene looks like ass, you're going to have an opinion.

 

It's okay if you enjoyed it and it's okay that others didn't enjoy it.

 

I know I'm rambling so I better stop

[Peppermint Rage]

Hopefully Jake gets a push at some point.

 

couldn't disagree more, he's painfully dull, and would love for his time to be given to the laundry list of far more interesting talent on AEWs roster

[Jaysin]

couldn't disagree more, he's painfully dull, and would love for his time to be given to the laundry list of far more interesting talent on AEWs roster

 

He's showed a lot of fire since the Inner Circle face turn. If you follow him or his wife on social media, he's a very cool dude with a lot of personality. I have never been his biggest fan outside of his team with Cesaro, but if AEW let's him show the personality he shows on social media I think he could be a big name for them. Not saying I want him in the world title picture or anything, but I do like that he's being allowed to show personality.

[BlueStar]

Loads of fun in AEW. I still can't see any fun in (this time heel) Omega (he's a fat Flair rip-off now, including a manager but can't talk his way into a decent promo)....or the Old Bucks (Gallows/Anderson just outshadow them while being in their corner). The big danger of AEW is history repeating, and I think this will be the case: owners becoming bookers becoming champions....

[Mootinie]

Agree. Every week, Omega, The Good Bros. and The Bucks are my least favourite thing on the show.

[Big Roguey]

It's the whole Elite package for me including the hanger ons like Cutler and Nakazawa. I'm sure they're nice enough people (and they are in relatively minor roles in fairness) but it's just past the point of caring whenever they're on screen be it on AEW TV or BTE or whatever. Hoping they pull the finger out with Santana & Ortiz and give them a proper run post Inner Circle.

[milamber]

Elevation was good but Tony needs to learn the correct move names. LOL at Mark Sterling trying to sign Jade Cargill.

 

Weekly reminder that Kingston is an incredible promo -

[Jaysin]

Pretty sure Eddie Kingston is the most consistently entertaining male talent in all of wrestling right now. Easily the best promo in the game.

[crownsy]

Pretty sure Eddie Kingston is the most consistently entertaining male talent in all of wrestling right now. Easily the best promo in the game.

 

I still feel bad about that crap explosion, that should have been such a huge babyface turn moment for him.

 

He did the best he could with it with the PTSD story after. I told my wife, also a huge Eddie fan, "lets just let Eddie have the mic for 5 minutes and see" when she was like "man, he looks like such an idiot off that ending"

 

he did not disappoint, he saved it as best he could.

[Jaded]

Yeah, Eddie saved that angle and I'm not sure more than a couple of people could have done that - just an incredible promo.

 

Some cool stuff on Dark/Elevation this week - really enjoyed Acclaimed vs Sonny/Joey, Mox and Eddie had a quick squash win, loved Eddie's promo, and always fun to see Pretty Picture get a backstage segment. Plus, Julia Hart added to the Varsity Blonds is a nice grouping, always fun to see Britt, Leyla and Tay in action, and I actually thought the Ethan/Scorpio promo was pretty decent. Elevation's backstage stuff was good overall - Thunder and Britt always deliver, and I liked the Danny Limelight sit-down with Paul Wight, as well. Are Danny and Madi All Elite now? I'm assuming the sit-down is a good sign, and she's got an entrance video now which I don't think that many of the non-roster people on Dark/Elevation have? (Or maybe a bunch do and I'm just bad at noticing it!)

 

Super-excited for tonight, really hoping we're going for OC/Omega at the PPV, but PAC/Omega and presumably Orange against maybe Penta is a hell of a good 'worst case' scenario.

[milamber]

Safe to say Limelight is signed. Madi as well given the amount of spotlight they have given her. She even had a quick cameo on BTE this week in a skit with Avalon.

[Jaysin]

God damn I love Yuji Nagata. Super fun match up. Hopefully more New Japan guys chase Mox. Also hope Mox keeps using Wild Thing.

[Jaysin]

Dynamite was fun this week.

 

Mox vs Nagata was real good as expected.

 

Cody had a fantastic promo.

 

SCU vs Bucks was one of the Bucks better matches. Daniels lost so much friggin blood. Interested in seeing where they go from here. I know CD is getting up there in age, but I've been watching him for 20 years, so it'd be real hard saying goodbye.

 

Pac and OC was meh. Triple threat at DoN provides a chance at an actual good match. Omega is not a good heel at all and isn't entertaining in the slightest to me. At least as a dorky face, he was mildly entertaining, but as a dorky heel, I want to stop watching. Don Callis really needs to teach Omega how to cut promos too. His promo last week burying OC was abysmal.

 

I think it's way too soon for Jericho to return and saying Santana got arrested instead of admitting he got hurt was dumb. I did like the Austin/Angle throwback with the champagne firehose though. Stadium Stampede 2 should be fun given the talent involved. I really hope Santana & Ortiz finally get out of the Inner Circle's shadow following DoN. They're in the running for best tag team in the world and haven't been able to showcase that very often in AEW.

 

Rosa vs Jazmin was meh. Obviously it was going to be a squash, but just didn't really stick out to me.

 

I love Jade, but her promos are all the same. I like the "I'm that bitch" line, but she's just spinning her wheels.

 

Miro vs Darby was fun as hell. Darby obviously had an out by being "injured", but man, Miro looked like a savage monster. Thank god too because Miro has had one of the most luckluster runs in recent wrestling history with the awful "best man" and video game crap. I love Miro. I love video games. I like Kip and Penelope, but man, that was so bad.

 

Double or Nothing is shaping up to be a hell of a show. The world title match is the match I'm invested in the least, but at least with Pac and OC involved we might get some cool spots.

 

Also looking forward to Serena Deeb's return next week against Red Velvet.

[hailthebulldog]

Dynamite was fun this week.

 

Mox vs Nagata was real good as expected.

 

Cody had a fantastic promo.

 

SCU vs Bucks was one of the Bucks better matches. Daniels lost so much friggin blood. Interested in seeing where they go from here. I know CD is getting up there in age, but I've been watching him for 20 years, so it'd be real hard saying goodbye.

 

Pac and OC was meh. Triple threat at DoN provides a chance at an actual good match. Omega is not a good heel at all and isn't entertaining in the slightest to me. At least as a dorky face, he was mildly entertaining, but as a dorky heel, I want to stop watching. Don Callis really needs to teach Omega how to cut promos too. His promo last week burying OC was abysmal.

 

I think it's way too soon for Jericho to return and saying Santana got arrested instead of admitting he got hurt was dumb. I did like the Austin/Angle throwback with the champagne firehose though. Stadium Stampede 2 should be fun given the talent involved. I really hope Santana & Ortiz finally get out of the Inner Circle's shadow following DoN. They're in the running for best tag team in the world and haven't been able to showcase that very often in AEW.

 

Rosa vs Jazmin was meh. Obviously it was going to be a squash, but just didn't really stick out to me.

 

I love Jade, but her promos are all the same. I like the "I'm that bitch" line, but she's just spinning her wheels.

 

Miro vs Darby was fun as hell. Darby obviously had an out by being "injured", but man, Miro looked like a savage monster. Thank god too because Miro has had one of the most luckluster runs in recent wrestling history with the awful "best man" and video game crap. I love Miro. I love video games. I like Kip and Penelope, but man, that was so bad.

 

Double or Nothing is shaping up to be a hell of a show. The world title match is the match I'm invested in the least, but at least with Pac and OC involved we might get some cool spots.

 

Also looking forward to Serena Deeb's return next week against Red Velvet.

 

Apparently, OC was legit hurt and they were forced to call an audible. Apparently, the triple threat was always the plan but the finish to this match was on the fly. Other than that I really enjoyed the show, and I loved Moxley coming out to Wild Thing. Hopefully that is a permanent thing.