Thoughts: Pre-PPV Matches/Rematches/Ultimate Figher-type Shows

[SirFozzie]

A) Pre-TV/PPV "Dark matches" Unlike TEW, where you can plan your card down to the minute, MMA is weird for live TV, a MMA fight could go 3 seconds or 30 minutes (depending on your rules set). Probably would be good to set a maximum of 2-3 scheduled fights per hour of TV/PPV you have, and have just as many dark matches as you do "Real Card" matches. Might be too much work, but maybe after the "Dark match" part of a live PPV/TV Show, you can pick two or three matches to air if there's time remaining. Either that, or it would automatically air the best available fights if there's time remaining. B)Rematches Unlike Wrestling, where you can get away with putting the same wrestlers against each other 6-7 times over a couple months (it's called building a feud), in MMA, you won't see fighters go against each other more then 3 times. However, some of the most anticipated fights in MMA History were rematches (Griffin/Bonnar, anyone?) As long as there within some fairly long time frame (maybe 18 months or so), a rematch should use their last fight as a starting point for crowd reaction/PPV, ie, if the first fight was an all out barn-burner, then the initial crowd response to the rematch should be up.. if the first fight was a plodding draw (or worse yet, a quick KO/Submission), then the crowd probably won't want to see them again. Penalize each rematch after the first heavily, unless it's the MMA versions of Arturo Gatti and Mickey Ward, no one's going to want to see them fight a third time. You better have a damn good reason to see a fourth fight. Under NO circumstances should there be any fights beyond a fourth C) The Ultimate Fighter-type shows Yup, you guys probably saw this coming. I can think of three "reality TV" shows, featuring MMA Training and fighting (IFL Battleground, BodogFight St Petersburg, and of course, UFC's The Ultimate Fighter). It would be a good way to give up and comers their big break, without having to build them up slowly. Suggestions: 1) People with a High Personality (Charisma, etcetera) rating will usually get a pretty good popularity boost out of the show. This should be magnified if the person is the type who might engage in.. shall we say, self-destructive behaviour? (If you don't believe me, I have 2 words for you. Chris Leben). Of course, if someone has the personality of a wet sack, that would definitely inhibit any popularity boost 2) On a lower level, skills shown should provide a boost in popularity 3) Somehow make it show up with a brief recap each week as a note, with a variety of explanations. [b]Henry Davis got smashed and drunkenly challenged anyone on Team Domination to a fight (+5% popularity) The elimination fight was chosen to be Team Flawless Victory's Henry Davis versus Team Domination's George Mulroney (then the fight would sim out) Team Flawless Victory's Henry Davis defeated Team Domination's George Mulroney at 2:24, 1R, due to tap out (RNC). George Mulroney was eliminated from the show[/b] 3)Relationships (Dislikes, Likes, hatreds, etcetera) should fly fast and furious. 4) Be a good way to give two of your company's fighters some face time on TV as coaches (a way to sell an upcoming PPV, maybe?) what do you think?

[SpaceMountain]

I'm all for this idea if Adam can implement it in a sensible way. But we wouldn't even have control over which two fighters get to go into the elimination match if we wanted to keep it realistic, though... so basically it would just be the A.I. simming our reality show for us?

[SirFozzie]

[QUOTE=SpaceMountain;216255]I'm all for this idea if Adam can implement it in a sensible way. But we wouldn't even have control over which two fighters get to go into the elimination match if we wanted to keep it realistic, though... so basically it would just be the A.I. simming our reality show for us?[/QUOTE] In a way, yes, but in otherways, no. 1) You could choose the brackets yourself, instead of having the game determine the fighters (The Leben-Koschek fight comes to mind). probably be easier to program then dividing fighters up into teams. 2) Perhaps each week on the show, you can pick one or two fighters to focus on, and one or two fighters to de-empathize (I think that's the word I'm looking for) 3) You still get to chose the 4,8,16 fighters in each group. I think it would be a killer idea, because it would give you something to view each week (the effects of the latest show in popularity, etcetera)

[ACCBiggz]

[QUOTE=SirFozzie;216249]A) Pre-TV/PPV "Dark matches" Unlike TEW, where you can plan your card down to the minute, MMA is weird for live TV, a MMA fight could go 3 seconds or 30 minutes (depending on your rules set). [B]Probably would be good to set a maximum of 2-3 scheduled fights per hour of TV/PPV you have[/B], and have just as many dark matches as you do "Real Card" matches. Might be too much work, but maybe after the "Dark match" part of a live PPV/TV Show, you can pick two or three matches to air if there's time remaining. Either that, or it would automatically air the best available fights if there's time remaining.[/QUOTE] UFC have normally 3 matches on the UFN's for a 2 hours slot. PPV depends on what they want to do. They only had 4 for UFC 68, then of course prelims, but had more for other shows. PRIDE on the other hand shows all their fights in order. [QUOTE]B)Rematches Unlike Wrestling, where you can get away with putting the same wrestlers against each other 6-7 times over a couple months (it's called building a feud), in MMA, you won't see fighters go against each other more then 3 times. However, some of the most anticipated fights in MMA History were rematches (Griffin/Bonnar, anyone?) As long as there within some fairly long time frame (maybe 18 months or so), a rematch should use their last fight as a starting point for crowd reaction/PPV, ie, if the first fight was an all out barn-burner, then the initial crowd response to the rematch should be up.. if the first fight was a plodding draw (or worse yet, a quick KO/Submission), then the crowd probably won't want to see them again. Penalize each rematch after the first heavily, unless it's the MMA versions of Arturo Gatti and Mickey Ward, no one's going to want to see them fight a third time. You better have a damn good reason to see a fourth fight. Under NO circumstances should there be any fights beyond a fourth[/QUOTE] This is all pretty much true, but there is an exception. That would be if a fighter is truely the #1 contender to a belt. Chuck could beat Tito for a third time, but if Tito wins a couple in a row and is #1 contender yet again, there isn't much of an option. That being the exception of #1 contenders. The other exception would be if each match was close. Decisive victories would also play a role on how much people wanted to see a rematch. Because if they ever did a Griffin/Bonnar II, and it rivaled #1 and was that close again, people would want them to toe the line again eventually, so it is a combination of all those factors.

[SirFozzie]

[QUOTE=ACCBiggz;216259]UFC have normally 3 matches on the UFN's for a 2 hours slot. PPV depends on what they want to do. They only had 4 for UFC 68, then of course prelims, but had more for other shows. PRIDE on the other hand shows all their fights in order. This is all pretty much true, but there is an exception. That would be if a fighter is truely the #1 contender to a belt. Chuck could beat Tito for a third time, but if Tito wins a couple in a row and is #1 contender yet again, there isn't much of an option. That being the exception of #1 contenders. The other exception would be if each match was close. Decisive victories would also play a role on how much people wanted to see a rematch. Because if they ever did a Griffin/Bonnar II, and it rivaled #1 and was that close again, people would want them to toe the line again eventually, so it is a combination of all those factors.[/QUOTE] Yeah, Griffin/Bonnar II was a GOOD fight, but not a great fight, and it killed the series, since the same guy (Griffin) won both fights (and Bonnar's steroids suspension didn't help either). Maybe a 3rd fight wouldn't be too badly looked on if the first two fights had been split

[ACCBiggz]

To be honest I just threw that out there as an example forgetting they even had a second fight. But yeah, point still stands that it also depends on how close the fights are. :P

[JMimic]

I'm surprised at how many people are wanting control over who wins...it's MMA and that's one of the joys of the sport in real life you never know whats going to happen. You're going to have to book cards on the fly say Georges St Pierre gets hurt while training 2 weeks before the fight and doesn't want to chance it (this could be a fighter attribute) some fighters will fight even if they are hurt and will have decreased attributes and some fighters won't fight if they are even a little bit hurt wanting to be 100% for their fights. I really want zero control over the fights and who wins; your job is to put on matchups people want to see. I think if you keep running Fedor out against guys like Zulinzinho and the like then your fan base should get pissed because he's not fighting anyone worth a damn and some of the people who maybe are ranked #2 and #3 for his belt should be pissed maybe a morale drop maybe if their contracts are up they'll leave looking for another place to fight. You could do the Ultimate Fighter or the Bodog Fight setup sort of like the tours on EWR were done where whoever is selected is gone for say 2-3 months while filming. The only problem is once you're eliminated on BoDog you aren't really seen again.

[ACCBiggz]

I've said that if you want fixed fights, stick with TEW. And to take it a step further, if you fix fights and get caught, which normally happens at one point or another, it's illegal and you go to jail.

[JMimic]

[QUOTE=ACCBiggz;216279]I've said that if you want fixed fights, stick with TEW. And to take it a step further, if you fix fights and get caught, which normally happens at one point or another, it's illegal and you go to jail.[/QUOTE] I've noticed you've been one of the ones against this like I have; Adam's comment in the other thread makes me believe it probably won't be in the game but if it somehow does and you do get caught that should end your career...Any promoter caught fixing fights nowadays would be done in my opinion.

[SpaceMountain]

I'm going to go with you guys' side and say it has absolutely no place being in the game, and part of the fun will be watching who wins, hoping that the fighter you hate gets wiped out.

[SirFozzie]

Did I say something wrong in my posts that would indicate I favored fixing matches? I just was suggesting that if a lack of control bothered folks, we could set the inital tournament brackets. *shrugs*

[JMimic]

[QUOTE=SirFozzie;216303]Did I say something wrong in my posts that would indicate I favored fixing matches? I just was suggesting that if a lack of control bothered folks, we could set the inital tournament brackets. *shrugs*[/QUOTE] No not you; I thought someone implied it earlier but maybe I was wrong. Not trying to bite anyones head off. I don't have a problem with us being able to set up the way the tournament starts but after that we shouldn't have any control.

[SpaceMountain]

It was maybe me you misunderstood. And my point was that with a reality show, although I heavily favor the feature, there would be NOTHING to control with it. It would just be randomly simmed by the A.I., considering that if it remained true to life, we wouldn't even get to book who fights who, the fighters would. Either way, I'd still like to see it as an option. I was in NO way suggesting that we fixed matches. I'll play TEW for that.

[SirFozzie]

and maybe that's a great thing, I mean, who thought at the beginning of the first season of the Ultimate Fighter that Forrest Griffin would become such a megastar? It'd be something like starting a major feud in TEW, times 8. Will the group that you've selected get along disgustingly well, have boring fights and not launch any new stars? Or are you going to have multiple messy incidents, grudges up the wazoo, great fights, and compelling television? You'd probably want a few High Personality/High Risk guys in with a good base of solid fighters, to provide a technical/reality balance (God, can you imagine a reality show with 8 Chris Lebens? :D) edit: I just thought of what an Ultimate Fighter with 8 Chris Lebens would be. A MMA version of The Real World made with nothing but Puck Clones (yeah, I dated myself with that reference, didn't I?)

[Capelli King]

[QUOTE=SirFozzie;216249]A) Pre-TV/PPV "Dark matches" B)Rematches Unlike Wrestling, where you can get away with putting the same wrestlers against each other 6-7 times over a couple months (it's called building a feud), in MMA, you won't see fighters go against each other more then 3 times. However, some of the most anticipated fights in MMA History were rematches (Griffin/Bonnar, anyone?) As long as there within some fairly long time frame (maybe 18 months or so), a rematch should use their last fight as a starting point for crowd reaction/PPV, ie, if the first fight was an all out barn-burner, then the initial crowd response to the rematch should be up.. if the first fight was a plodding draw (or worse yet, a quick KO/Submission), then the crowd probably won't want to see them again. Penalize each rematch after the first heavily, unless it's the MMA versions of Arturo Gatti and Mickey Ward, no one's going to want to see them fight a third time. You better have a damn good reason to see a fourth fight. Under NO circumstances should there be any fights beyond a fourth what do you think?[/QUOTE] I agree that in real life rematches are exremely rare but the big question is, we are going to need a huge roster and allot of new talent constantly pouring in. In TEW you could get away with running a global promotion of 100 fighters or maybe less with rematches taking place weekly. Imagine running a MMA promotion with a WWE scheduel, where rematches are unheard of we will need maybe 300 fighter half of which are new guys constantly coming in. Take in count the injuries as well. Actually i like the idea of big rosters and a lot of new faces, the only problem is if they develop as slowly as TEW, we will have a load of dead wood around! 80% of the roster will be total loosers. Just some thoughts.....

[SirFozzie]

You shouldn't be running more then 1-2 shows a month, as a small guy, anyway (BTW Adam, you better put in a "SIM WEEK" function to go with "Sim to next day" to avoid Carpal Tunnel). And remember, most of your fighters at low levels will be one-shots. "Hey, do you want to fight on my MMA Card Next month? I got a spot open for a LHW" "Sure..." If you have more then 15-20 folks on more then one-shot deals, then you're nuts, even as a big company. Look at UFC. The top 6-8 guys in each weight class are on 1-3 fight deals.

[ACCBiggz]

UFC has A LOT of fighters on 3 fight deals, that is seemingly the norm for any fighter coming in. Eric Shaffer, Sean Salmon, etc. are all on three fight deals now.

[SpaceMountain]

[QUOTE=SirFozzie;216324](BTW Adam, you better put in a "SIM WEEK" function to go with "Sim to next day" to avoid Carpal Tunnel).[/QUOTE] I'll second that suggestion!

[MaxxHexx]

[QUOTE=SirFozzie;216249]Some of the most anticipated fights in MMA History were rematches (Griffin/Bonnar, anyone?)[/QUOTE] You don't know how much I want that!

[SirFozzie]

they already had it, UFC62 :)

[Romdawg88]

[QUOTE=SirFozzie;216324]You shouldn't be running more then 1-2 shows a month, as a small guy, anyway (BTW Adam, you better put in a "SIM WEEK" function to go with "Sim to next day" to avoid Carpal Tunnel). And remember, most of your fighters at low levels will be one-shots. "Hey, do you want to fight on my MMA Card Next month? I got a spot open for a LHW" "Sure..." If you have more then 15-20 folks on more then one-shot deals, then you're nuts, even as a big company. Look at UFC. The top 6-8 guys in each weight class are on 1-3 fight deals.[/QUOTE] Like ACCBiggz mentioned the UFC signs most in not all the fighters to multiple fight contracts. The thing that the UFC does is that their contracts allow them to terminate them at any time so if a fighter loses or puts on a bad show the UFC can simply let them go and move on. I would like to see that added into the game.