Signing workers from 'war' promotion

[Supermercado]

Can somebody give me a quick rundown of how this works. I'm #1 in both importance and influence as WWF but I can't get the WCW guys who are on PPA contracts (La Parka, Super Calo, Chavo Jr etc..) to sign for me because of my 'war'. Previously I was under the impression that they wouldn't sign for you because the 'other' company was bigger - so is there any way you can steal people like this? Otherwise I may as well go into the editor and remove the war before I start so that I can covertly declare war on them. Any help? Seems strange that midcarders wouldn't at least discuss a contract with the opposition if they were offered. I could understand Chavo not wanting to go because his brother is still under written contract, but how does Super Calo know I'm not going to offer him a million bucks and a world title run? I'd like to see them at least agree to negotiate, even if they set ridiculously high demands.

[Hyde Hill]

Personality comes into play with this as well as relations, and are you sure you are number one in reputation/influence in this mod? If not then they wil never negotiate.

[FINisher]

What are the company prestige levels? If wCw have higher promotion prestige than you, then you are in trouble :P

[Supermercado]

Definately #1 in both forms, and A* prestige apiece. Maybe they've got .0000000001% more than me and that's stopping it but the idea does my head in. If you're Silver King and you get a phone call from Vince McMahon you don't go "bad luck Vinny Mac, I'm loving the lower midcard!" For future versions I think a better way would be if he was happy enough to stay in WCW he'd say "ok, I'll come across but I want to be an upper midcarder at least with a title run within the first two months" and then you have to decide whether you really want him enough to give him a push he almost certainly doesn't deserve. Then there are some people who will just be unhappy with their lot and take the money and run. It just concerns me that with ideas like national battles being thrown into the game, the idea of a promotion 'war' is still judged on such black and white stats. P.S - Silver King hates me in every game I play, so the chances of him getting anything other than the beating of a lifetime from the entire roster if I sign him is minimal!

[Hive]

I agree that it's silly they won't at least talk to you. They shouldn't outright reject negotiating, but they should demand a lot more than what they currently get in terms of wage and status.

[Sagitta]

Perhaps (and correct me if I'm wrong) the worker is looking at your current roster and judging his chances of actually being anything but buried. Its like when TNA offered Christian a contract, he jumped on it as he's wind up higher in the card on TNA, while if WWE were to turn around and offer him one now, he'd realize odds were he'd stay stuck at the mid-to-upper levels and reject it.

[Franchise22]

but he at least was offered something. as it is now, they wont even talk to you. same thing with loyalty in game, they wont even talk to you. damn you decolts, awesome thunder and nicky champion!!!!! at least i got sean mcfly :) (im TCW)

[Verbalcody]

"Perhaps (and correct me if I'm wrong) the worker is looking at your current roster and judging his chances of actually being anything but buried." You're wrong. The programming sucks. In my 1991 mod, I cant steal Flair from WCW (flair who is P.P.A. for some god AWFUL reason.. i guess because they fell to cult he wont sign with either of the #1 promotions LOL thanks adam) Anyway, instead of listening to my offer of 50% merch bonus and 50% PPV bonus and RIDICULOUS money to make more than anyone... in the WORLD... he wont sign with me. my promotion is too small some fun

[NickC13573]

[QUOTE=Verbalcody;466499]"Perhaps (and correct me if I'm wrong) the worker is looking at your current roster and judging his chances of actually being anything but buried." You're wrong. The programming sucks. In my 1991 mod, I cant steal Flair from WCW (flair who is P.P.A. for some god AWFUL reason.. i guess because they fell to cult he wont sign with either of the #1 promotions LOL thanks adam) Anyway, instead of listening to my offer of 50% merch bonus and 50% PPV bonus and RIDICULOUS money to make more than anyone... in the WORLD... he wont sign with me. my promotion is too small some fun[/QUOTE] its not the programming if he says your too small. you are too small

[Adam Ryland]

[QUOTE=Verbalcody;466499]"Perhaps (and correct me if I'm wrong) the worker is looking at your current roster and judging his chances of actually being anything but buried." You're wrong. The programming sucks. In my 1991 mod, I cant steal Flair from WCW (flair who is P.P.A. for some god AWFUL reason.. i guess because they fell to cult he wont sign with either of the #1 promotions LOL thanks adam) Anyway, instead of listening to my offer of 50% merch bonus and 50% PPV bonus and RIDICULOUS money to make more than anyone... in the WORLD... he wont sign with me. my promotion is too small some fun[/QUOTE] The programming doesn't "suck", it's doing exactly what it's meant to do. The system is very clear, wrestlers judge who they'll sign for based upon their stats vs the promotion's stats vs other opportunities. Giving "ridiculous" money won't overcome the natural barriers of what sized promotions a worker will sign for for gameplay reasons, as otherwise any small promotion could simply buy up everyone with big money contracts and become virtually unstoppable. I'm sorry if you don't consider the current way fun, but I don't think that the strategy you appear to want - easy results because you throw money at a problem - is particularly fun either. You seem determined to complain about every feature that doesn't fit your particular vision of what the game should be, but perhaps you could try playing with the game's structure and maybe you'd actually enjoy it. For example; you can't get Flair - so try developing new stars instead. That's part of the challenge.

[Verbalcody]

Im not a 'small' promotion as the above above user says... what is small to you? i have the most TV deals, Im on Pay Per View.. I'm the WWF... I have the most popular workers in the world... I have an endless budget.... so yeah i'm small right? Im the #1 promotion. in the WORLD. #1. I dont care if its CULT or otherwise, I am the top ranked promotion, offering top dollar and a DREAM contract to a worker... who will not sign with me How can you explain that ?! [QUOTE=Adam Ryland;466516]The programming doesn't "suck", it's doing exactly what it's meant to do. The system is very clear, wrestlers judge who they'll sign for based upon their stats vs the promotion's stats vs other opportunities. Giving "ridiculous" money won't overcome the natural barriers of what sized promotions a worker will sign for for gameplay reasons, as otherwise any small promotion could simply buy up everyone with big money contracts and become virtually unstoppable. I'm sorry if you don't consider the current way fun, but I don't think that the strategy you appear to want - easy results because you throw money at a problem - is particularly fun either. You seem determined to complain about every feature that doesn't fit your particular vision of what the game should be, but perhaps you could try playing with the game's structure and maybe you'd actually enjoy it. For example; you can't get Flair - so try developing new stars instead. That's part of the challenge.[/QUOTE]

[Verbalcody]

and OK develop new stars right but the same crap applies to ANY wrestler... hell Owen Hart wont wign a written contract with me even if I pay him the max amount i can possibly pay him... ok i'm throwing money at a problem but this is the wrestling business and thats the way it has historically sorted out its problems! SO not even OWEN HART, who is established no where, will sign with me... because im cult. I want to have fun with that system but I can't. All my wrestlers from now on will have to work somewhere else as well? unheard of :(

[Adam Ryland]

[QUOTE=Verbalcody;466519]Im not a 'small' promotion as the above above user says... what is small to you? i have the most TV deals, Im on Pay Per View.. I'm the WWF... I have the most popular workers in the world... I have an endless budget.... so yeah i'm small right? Im the #1 promotion. in the WORLD. #1. I dont care if its CULT or otherwise, I am the top ranked promotion, offering top dollar and a DREAM contract to a worker... who will not sign with me How can you explain that ?![/QUOTE] I already have explained it. [I]You[/I] may not care that you're Cult, but the game does - each size of promotion limits certain things, that's part of the way the game works. If you're Cult - regardless of whether you're #1 or #101 in the world - you can't do certain things until you rise to National. Think of it as a "rule of the game", a restriction. So, your course is clear - you need to build your promotion up to the next level and then you can get him. I think the issue is that you seem to want the game to do exactly what you want, but you're forgetting it's a computer game - there are always going to be rules and restrictions. Bitching about them isn't going to change that! Your job, as booker \ player, is to play around those restrictions.

[Adam Ryland]

[QUOTE=Verbalcody;466521]and OK develop new stars right but the same crap applies to ANY wrestler... hell Owen Hart wont wign a written contract with me even if I pay him the max amount i can possibly pay him... ok i'm throwing money at a problem but this is the wrestling business and thats the way it has historically sorted out its problems! SO not even OWEN HART, who is established no where, will sign with me... because im cult. I want to have fun with that system but I can't. All my wrestlers from now on will have to work somewhere else as well? unheard of :([/QUOTE] Which is it? On the one hand you talk about wanting fun, on the other hand you're talking about realism. If you want historical accuracy, I'm afraid that you're arguing against yourself - cult-sized promotions always had to contend with the fact that they couldn't tie people down to contracts and so got raided for talent. That's why the system works the way it does. So it's not "unheard of", it's pretty much a standard part of wrestling - ECW being the last example. In your game you've dropped WWE down to a smaller size, so you have to face the problems a promotion of that size would in reality. If you're looking for a purely "fun" game, one where you can simply buy every good worker and have a dream roster and not have anything bad happen...well, you've got the wrong game I'm afraid. Something extremely simple like EWR is what you want. The point of TEW is that it does offer a challenge and complexity, and you do have to deal with drawbacks if you fail - like in your game, you dropped a level due to poor booking and now you have to face the consequences. I don't really have any interest in doing a game like EWR where anybody can succeed without any effort just by throwing money around, I just don't see how something that easy is fun.

[Verbalcody]

You're missing my point. I am only a Cult sized fed because the game says so... I am the #1 PROMOTION IN THE WORLD. what does that mean to the workers?? NOTHING?!? Im not asking for a dream roster. ECW could have signed a lot of talent if they had 20 million though I'll say that... and they did have a lot of big names come through that company A cult promotion shouldnt mean the workers wont sign contracts for the right amount of money. Nothing in the WORLD will stop a man from making the most money this is the most realistic scenario. period. You seem to think I want the game easy, I don't. I want it to make sense to me :confused: Its NOT fun... at all... to have people turning downt he #1 promotion in the world REGARDLESS of their 'status' which is a parameter... should have nothing to do with the common sense of Im #1 and offering the most money. Even to Ric Flair but damn man, ESPECIALLY to Owen Hart

[scorpion]

[QUOTE=Verbalcody;466545]You're missing my point. I am only a Cult sized fed because the game says so... I am the #1 PROMOTION IN THE WORLD. what does that mean to the workers?? NOTHING?!? Im not asking for a dream roster. ECW could have signed a lot of talent if they had 20 million though I'll say that... and they did have a lot of big names come through that company A cult promotion shouldnt mean the workers wont sign contracts for the right amount of money. Nothing in the WORLD will stop a man from making the most money this is the most realistic scenario. period. You seem to think I want the game easy, I don't. I want it to make sense to me :confused: Its NOT fun... at all... to have people turning downt he #1 promotion in the world REGARDLESS of their 'status' which is a parameter... should have nothing to do with the common sense of Im #1 and offering the most money. Even to Ric Flair but damn man, ESPECIALLY to Owen Hart[/QUOTE] You forget, wrestler don't live in a vacuum. You don't star in a Hollywood blockbuster, then start doing community theatre. Owen Hart, in the game, would rather not take the bumps working for a company your size. Look at WCW after it closed. Any stars who weren't picked up by WWE or TNA, have for the most part, left the business.

[Adam Ryland]

[QUOTE=Verbalcody;466545]You're missing my point. I am only a Cult sized fed because the game says so... I am the #1 PROMOTION IN THE WORLD. what does that mean to the workers?? NOTHING?!?[/QUOTE] I'm not missing your point - in fact, I have already answered you on this point once. You shouting does not change the answer. I will repeat what I said: [QUOTE]If you're Cult - regardless of whether you're #1 or #101 in the world - you can't do certain things until you rise to National. [/QUOTE] I don't really know how to make this any clearer for you. The fact that you are number one in the world is completely meaningless to the game in this situation, what you can and can't achieve is based upon your size. There is common sense; if there was only one promotion in the world and it was a backyard fed, would you expect Flair to sign for them? No. Because the fact that they're number one in the world doesn't change the fact that they're too small to realistically get him. Same applies to your situation. You dropped a size and are now a cult promotion. You now have to deal with not being able to sign certain top level stars. Sorry if that doesn't make sense to you, but I have (repeatedly) done my best to explain it to you as well as I can. Perhaps you should try starting your game again and putting on better shows so that you don't fall in size, then you wouldn't have this issue.

[Hyde Hill]

And as I understand it they are willing to negotiate with you then why not just sign em to exclusive ppa´s thats what they are there for! Then if you get back to national you can start givivng written deals. Guys who won´t even negotiate with you because you are not big enough wil fall in popularity due to lack of exposure and eventually negotiate with you. What these guys are doing is biding there time to see who comes out to national level first and doing other non wrestling stuff in the meantime and enjoying a nice rest.

[Supermercado]

[QUOTE=Adam Ryland;466571]I'm not missing your point - in fact, I have already answered you on this point once. You shouting does not change the answer. I will repeat what I said: I don't really know how to make this any clearer for you. The fact that you are number one in the world is completely meaningless to the game in this situation, what you can and can't achieve is based upon your size. There is common sense; if there was only one promotion in the world and it was a backyard fed, would you expect Flair to sign for them? No. Because the fact that they're number one in the world doesn't change the fact that they're too small to realistically get him. Same applies to your situation. You dropped a size and are now a cult promotion. You now have to deal with not being able to sign certain top level stars. Sorry if that doesn't make sense to you, but I have (repeatedly) done my best to explain it to you as well as I can. Perhaps you should try starting your game again and putting on better shows so that you don't fall in size, then you wouldn't have this issue.[/QUOTE] Point understood there, but what about when you're a global company at A* prestige and top of the rankings all over the place. Surely some workers will at least entertain the prospect of joining you.

[scorpion]

[QUOTE=Supermercado;466785]Point understood there, but what about when you're a global company at A* prestige and top of the rankings all over the place. Surely some workers will at least entertain the prospect of joining you.[/QUOTE] Some workers will, it depends on their personality. If you both have A* prestige and are both global, the workers, in general, aren't looking to jump. (In real life people don't make lateral moves in their careers very often because there's too many risks.) It doesn't mean it won't happen. In my game I had 3 top talents from TCW jump to my promotion, then all of sudden everyone was turning me down. Thats life. The game wouldn't be fun or challenging if you could just sign whoever you wanted by offering ungodly amounts of money to them. And, if you did happen to sign Super Calo for a million dollars, I can guarantee your promotion would go bankrupt. Once you give that kind of money to a lower card guy, everyone else wants more money.

[Supermercado]

And so it should go bankrupt in that case, but what I'm saying is that it's not a lateral move if you go from being an opener in one company on $10k a month, to being a midcarder at another on $20k.

[shamelessposer]

[QUOTE=Supermercado;466861]And so it should go bankrupt in that case, but what I'm saying is that it's not a lateral move if you go from being an opener in one company on $10k a month, to being a midcarder at another on $20k.[/QUOTE] There's hardly anybody who can go from one company to another and make twice the money while retaining the same position. Anyone who gets an offer like that is going to be extremely suspicious.

[gmsubzer]

I think Adam has explained this quite easily. have you thought that maybe its the mod that you're playing as well? I mean by the sounds of it, whomever made the mod didn't take the games programing into full account. ALA what DOTT is doing with its mod right now in the Beta Tests. From what I can gather in this post. It sounds like this mod you are using toned down the sizes of the federations probably to there appropriate sizes for the time. But when making the workers, they have the skills and popularity as if they are National stars or International or whatever the ranks are that high up. I mean if the biggest promotion in the world is Cult sized, does it make sense to have wrestlers as National and International stars? So based on that, I think the only way you can go and blame the programing of this game is to say that this game wasn't made dummied proof for modders who can't balance out the size of federations and the popularity of the workers. Or the fact that wrestlers base there choices on size of federations and not what place a federation is in the rankings.

[Supermercado]

[QUOTE=gmsubzer;466871]I think Adam has explained this quite easily. have you thought that maybe its the mod that you're playing as well? I mean by the sounds of it, whomever made the mod didn't take the games programing into full account. ALA what DOTT is doing with its mod right now in the Beta Tests. From what I can gather in this post. It sounds like this mod you are using toned down the sizes of the federations probably to there appropriate sizes for the time. But when making the workers, they have the skills and popularity as if they are National stars or International or whatever the ranks are that high up. I mean if the biggest promotion in the world is Cult sized, does it make sense to have wrestlers as National and International stars? So based on that, I think the only way you can go and blame the programing of this game is to say that this game wasn't made dummied proof for modders who can't balance out the size of federations and the popularity of the workers. Or the fact that wrestlers base there choices on size of federations and not what place a federation is in the rankings.[/QUOTE] Given that my initial post was about Global federations with A* prestige I'd say that's a no. For the record I'm not "blaming the game's programming", rather just asking for a more accurate simulation of the insanity of an industry war between two closely matched groups. What's the point of having a "War" option if you can't do anything about it?

[SuperOwens]

I think that we all like to see some improvement in the way the War works to make it more like the Monday night battle we all know and loved. I understand what Supermercado is saying, realistically workers would listen to offers. Now im completely in agreement with Adam saying there has to be some 'gaming rules' Obviously MAW shouldn't throw money at the Stone family and they come running. There are advantages and disadvantages to every size level I do think though that two similar sized companies at war should be able to poach each others workers. At the moment its done on prestige so the downfall is that a 0.1% swing for either company makes them the top dog. Id say be patient, its not going to happen in this version but maybe it will in the next. Look at the improvements from 07 - 08.