SWF: Generation Supreme

[Bigpapa42]

[CENTER][IMG]http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k235/Bigpapa42_2006/Wrestling/Media/TV%20Shows/Alt/LegendsBase.jpg[/IMG][/CENTER] [SIZE="5"][B][CENTER]Legends Brand - Where Things were Going[/CENTER][/B][/SIZE] There were two major stories on the Legends brand. One was the DaVE-versus-DaVE "civil war" between the Vibert alliance and Tyler's group. The second was simply the world title scene. [B][CENTER]The DaVE versus DaVE Civil War[/CENTER][/B] I cannot begin to explain how much I wavered on the idea of doing a bit of editing to be able to bring Nemesis into the SWF. The addition really solidified the civil war idea, however. Until that point, it just felt like a bit of a power struggle and I didn't figure on stretching it out too far into 2009. Adding Nemesis really made it feel like this would be a war, with Nemesis as the general on one side... and Chris Morrisette on the other. With Christian Faith being concerned with keeping his title, the leadership falls to the former lobster man. The war would be more war-like than the Gen-S war, with backstage attacks, major mutli-man battles, and Tyler booking a bunch of hardcore, no-NQ matches so guys could run in. The idea runs a bit contrary to what I intended Legends to be, but I think it would work. After the introduction of Nemesis and the decision to make the whole “war” bigger, I figured I could stretch the whole deal out until at least the autumn of 2009, if not longer. My intent with Nemesis would be keep him out of the ring. Use him mainly as in a manager role. But not content to lead Tyler's troops, he starts a collection of talent of his own. The first would come quickly, as he would announce that a great tag team would be joining him at When Hell Freezes Over. After teasing that it's the New Wave, it turns out to be Valiant & Giedroyc turning heel. Wanted to make use of the Wrath of God alts, though it would just be the look and not the gimmick. Well, they will have a gimmick of being aggressive and sadistic, but that's about it. They will be joined by Payne, who is kicked off the Supreme brand by Eric Eisen. Nemesis gives Adrian Garcia the boot and proves he can control Payne through sheer force of will. He would add a fourth to his little stable, teasing that one of Vibert's group would join his. After teasing that it would be DeBones or Big Cat, it would turn out to be Caufield, who justifies it as him needing a more natural environment to truly thrive. I saw Nemesis as a very strong, forceful personality. Utterly intense. The kind of individual who would attract a cult of personality. In a hopeful bit of irony, he turns out to be the one who wants to turn the Legends brand into DaVE. I like the idea of Eric Tyler really just being a bit of an idiot in seeing Vibert trying to bring back elements of DaVE. It could come to light eventually that he was the force behind Tyler, but only after he takes over Tyler's role as GM. Nemesis would continue to push Tyler to add more hardcore and DaVE elements, justifying it as needing to have an advantage over Vibert's alliance. He slowly leeches power away from Tyler as well, which Tyler stupidly gives up willingly. Tyler will eventually be convinced to temporarily give his GM status over to Nemesis... who simply fires him. Nemesis is then the Legends brand GM, with an overt and obvious intent to bring back Danger and Violence Extreme on SWF TV. Tyler gets to disappear down to RIPW to train folks for the remainder of his contract, most likely, with one more notable appearance at least. Nemesis basically opposes the whole Sports Entertainment ideology. Its obviously residual bitterness from what happened in 1997 when he was fired. He believes wrestling should be survival of the fittest, where ones does whatever it takes to win – whether its using weapons, interference, etc. Simply proving who is best in the ring, as Vibert promotes, is not a concern. When Nemesis essentially steals Tyler's GM status, he also grabs the loyalty of The Watchmen. The trio of Holmes, Morgan, and Acid don't quite become part of Nemesis' “cult”, but they do follow his beck and call. After Caufield turns, the Vibert Alliance is basically three guys – Chris Morrisette, Big Cat Brandon, and Skull DeBones. Faith is still involved, but he has his own feud that takes up most of his attention. It pushes Morrisette into a de factor leadership role, which he honestly deserves. He's been one of my most reliable workers for a long while, and he consistently gains back any overness he loses. The likes of Pistol Pete Hall, Dan Stone Jr, Steve Flash, Robbie Retro, and Bart Biggz would help out but not become part of the alliance properly. My early plans for the DaVE versus DaVE civil war was to build up to a blow-off one-time pay per view, with the winning side taking control of the Legends brand. That was before I decided to bring in Nemesis, and make the whole deal bigger. However, it still seems like a the most likely end to the deal. Set up a series of matches on PPV between the two sides and their associates, with whoever comes out on top getting control. I figured it would be an awesome opportunity to bring back or introduce some other former DaVE workers... but there were few left. Freddy Datsun was working as a trainer for me, so he could easily be brought back for that. Beyond that, there were only the four TCW guys – Eddie Peak, Sammy Bach, Joey Minnesota, and Shawn Gonzalez. The first three are under written contract for a good long time, while Gonzalez won't sign either a written or PPA deal with the SWF while he has a position of power in FCW. So short of doing some editing, those four wouldn't work. In the end of the PPV – I was thinking a 10-man War Games match or something like that – the Vibert Alliance would triumph... with Eric Tyler makes an appearance to tip the scales and gain some vengeance on Nemesis. I figured I could use this match to move someone like Remo or Sean McFly to the Legends brand, introducing them as a surprise member of the Vibert alliance team. From that point, Nemesis would remain as GM, but having to answer to Vibert, so he really wouldn't have that much power. I did give some consideration to the possibility of creating a third brand based around DaVE and the former DaVE workers. This wouldn't be until late 2009 or early 2010 in the game. With fewer young guys being introduced by that point, there wouldn't be as much need for the Generation Supreme “B” show by that point. So switch that into SWF-DaVE. I wasn't really planning on much in the way of further roster additions, but I did have a bunch of talent still brewing in development who could move to the main roster at some point. I figured that the Supreme brand could be home for the younger side of the roster, with a Vixxen's (women's) division as the supplement. The Legends brand would be for the veteran guys, with the backbone of the tag team ranks as the supplement. The third brand would have a hardcore edge, probably with the Sky Club cruiserweight division as the supplement. It was an idea I was playing with, though its probably closer to the current layout of the WWE than I'd like. [B][CENTER]Supreme Championship Scene[/CENTER][/B] The whole point of turning Frehley heel and building him back into the animal was to have him take down Christian Faith for the Supreme Championship. I didn't expect him to produce the quality of matches as champion that Faith did, but he shouldn't be far off. Frehley has quietly gone on a winning streak. Can't recall off hand where it began and I'm too lazy to check, but its been a bit. He would continue that by beating Faith at When Hell Freezes Over, but only by disqualification. It would be a relatively one-sided match, with Faith realizing he can't beat a motivated Steve Frehley one-on-one. The result would be some unintentional interference from Emma Chase rather than Faith throwing the match. The win by Frehley results in a rematch being booked for March PPV, Awesome Impact, which is Legends brand exclusive. Over the course of the two month build, Frehley would systematically tear down everything around Faith. The champion slowly realizes just how much this belt means to him. Because of his concerns over Frehley and keeping his belt, Faith basically withdraws from the leadership role of the Vibert alliance in late January, handing the reigns to Morrisette. In the build to the rematch, I wanted to change up Frehley's character a bit. He would still be the angry loner type, but I wanted to add an edge of arrogance to him, due to the influence of Emma. Things like demanding the biggest locker room, which is reserved for the champion. When Tyler won't appease him, Frehley instead arrives at the arena ready to fight at the last minute, his limo pulling up and security escorting him inside to the ring (a touch of Goldberg). He starts doing his promos from the back of the limo as well. Not a huge thing – just thought it would be different and kinda cool. The Frehley-Chase-Diaz stable – let's call it Domination, just so it has a name – would be fairly much outside the civil war on the brand. “Above it”, in Emma's opinion. Nemesis would have a unique degree of respect for Frehley – based simply on the similar levels of intensity that both men have. At some point, this little stable would grow. One option would be adding Sin Inc, which would make for some fun. Another would be to keep it more serious and add the likes of Rex if he breaks off with the Golden Faction. Frehley would face Faith at Awesome IMpact, which would a Legends brand exclusive. Frehley would cleanly defeat the super-babyface for the title. After losing the belt, Faith would disappear off TV for a while. Not out of necessity, just figured it would freshen things up on the brand for a bit and have a nice storyline of him “considering his future”. Probably use him as a trainer at RIPW during that time. It says something about the number of very over workers I had on the roster that I could take an A* over worker of Faith's caliber off-screen for no good reason without any real concern about it. He would make a triumphant return somewhere down the road, possibly the DaVE PPV. A heel turn was possible even, though not likely. Frehley's main rivalry would be with Dan Stone Jr. Still Legends champion, Stone would not have lost in the SWF yet up to this point. Frehley is on a winning streak though 2009. They would build towards an epic meeting of the undefeated, which would be at The Supreme Challenge. Stone would be stripped of the Legends title in the build up, as he is given the choice of defending the belt at The Supreme Challenge or being stripped of the belt so he can face Frehley. Its basically a way to get the Legends belt off of him without having him lose. I was still undecided on the outcome of this match. On one hand, I preferred Stone winning and elevating to the very top of the card. But on the other hand, it would mean Frehley would only get a title reign of about four months. Which feels like hot-shotting to me. Could have Frehley retain in some cheap manner, leading to a rematch down the road and a Stone win then. From that point on, the main event scene on Legends would begin to change a bit. Some of the guys from the Supreme brand would probably start to move over in the later part of 2009 and early 2010, to open top spots for the younger talent. Given that this was a good 9 months into the future, my plans were still a bit fluid. The likes of Remo, Sean McFly, and perhaps Jack Bruce were likely to move over to the Legends brand and get involved in the title scene if they weren't already there. [B][CENTER]Golden Faction[/CENTER][/B] I was a bit torn with what to do with the Golden Faction. I like the idea of an entire group of people who are featured prominently, talk and act like they are successful, but really aren't. But I figured it was starting to get a bit old, so some things were going to change. Bloodstone was definitely leaving the group. Golden was slated to face Dan Stone Jr at the When Hell Freezes Over PPV, where he would obviously lose. However, he flips out afterward and attacks Bloodstone, who was supposed to interfere. Out of respect to Stone, Bloodstone doesn't and pays for it. He ends up turning face, joining Stone's “House of Stone” and having a nice feud with Golden. I think Rex would leave the Faction before too long, but I'm not sure about Pete. He could leave as well, or stay as the new 2nd in the faction. Some new blood would be added, with Sin Inc being an less likely possibility than the Upper Class (John Greed and Paul Huntingdon) or a similar team. I like the idea of the second major incarnation of the Faction having Golden and maybe Pete really playing the bully roles over a couple of younger workers, who eventually learn to stand up for themselves. In retrospect, Golden is one guy I shouldn't have signed. He hasn't done anything of note (beyond having Faith drag him to an unlikely A* match) and probably won't anytime soon. He's been near the top of the card since he joined and A* overness for good long while. I've had some fun with the “all talk, no outcome” approach but he's a bit of a pain. He's not good enough at this point to be trusted as a true top worker and seems unlikely to get there anytime soon. He also complains faster than almost anyone on the roster about “losing too much” - like after 5 wins in a row, one loss to another A* over guy, then several more wins. I guess a stint in RIPW should have been an option after the feud with Stone is over. I can't see resigning him at the end of 2009 – job him out so he doesn't have as much value to TCW and let him walk. [B][CENTER]Sky Club Division[/CENTER][/B] The Sky Club division was a mess. It was started up with good intentions, but probably without enough planning and experimentation. There were two fundamental problems with the Sky Club Division. The first is that the cruiserweights don't seem to do that great in the SWF. The second is that few of the cruiserweights are over. This created an obvious problem. Sky Club Division matches, whether singles or tag team, often graded fairly poorly when using workers who were solidly in the midcard. Though I can't claim I did a fully study on it, this didn't seem to be the case when the workers were Regular Wrestlers, Entertainers, etc. I got some pretty awful (my SWF standard) grades using the likes of the Samoans, Mainstream, Jett, etc. It was disappointing and meant I featured it less than I intended. I went with the Sky Club division initially hoping it could become like the "vanilla midgets" and luchadores in WCW in the mid 90s, providing fantastic undercard matches. Unfortunately, I just don't think that would work in the SWF, not without those workers being pretty over anyway. Which isn't to say I was giving up on the idea, just that it was taking longer to come to fruition than I intended. I was to the point where I might have one Sky Club Division match per Legends show, and it could grab anywhere from a B- down to a D. Those Sky Club guys were more likely to be featured in a match against an upper midcard or main event guy, a pseudo-squash match. Those seemed far more effective in terms of grades (obviously) and gaining them popularity (linked to the grades). Nothing wrong with "losing your way to the top" in a basic sense, but I did have concerns that it would create a question of legitimacy for these guys in the minds of the readers if they lose that way for a good long time. Until guys like Mainstream Hernandez and Jacob Jett managed to build up the overness to really be on the same level, the Shooting Star title would likely stay between Bart Biggz and Acid. Which really made it an upper midcard title, but those are really the only two I could count on to deliver consistent decent grades with other high fliers. [B][CENTER]Sky Club Tag Team Division[/CENTER][/B] This was even more of a mess than just the singles action of the division. The problem was that not only were most guys not over enough, but most of the teams don't have much tag experience either. Two most experienced teams on the brand were canned - The Biggz Boys because Brett didn't have his contract renewed due to an oversized degree of suckitude, and Death Row due to combined suckiness, despite getting up to A* experience. I did have several yet-to-properly-debut who were dark match and B show jobbing their way to a bit of experience. But since they were almost all low to none in terms of overness, they wouldn't help too much. I'll list a few of the yet-to-debut teams in a bit. The solution to help out the tag scene on the Legends brand is to bring a couple of the Supreme brand teams over. Valiant & Giedroyc were scheduled to move in January after the When Hell Freezes Over pay per view, part of Nemesis' stable. Sin Inc were likely going to move in about February, losing a "loser leaves town" match against The New Wave. Tired of being "held back" by the restrictions on the Supreme brand, the Black Label Fight Club (aka The Dirty White Boys) would choose to switch brands as the anarchy of the civil war would suit them better. The problem is that none of these teams are really suited for the Sky Club Division tag ranks. Which made for a couple options.... One would be to keep them separate from the division and the belts. Two, change the Sky Club Division tag belts to just the Legend brand tag belts and open up the weight classes. Or three - and this is most likely - have someone like Sin Inc win the Sky Club tag belts, proclaiming themselves to be “high fliers” to get the chance. Its a bit more Sports Entertainment than I intended the Legends brand to be, but this is still the SWF and I thought it could be fun. As I started previously, moving Marquez and Montero over was a serious consideration. [U]Un-debuted Teams[/U] [B]Avengers [/B]– American Elemental & Ultimate Phoenix [B]Canadian Wolve[/B]s – Ryan Powell & Trent Shaeffer [B]Los Technicos [/B]– El Leon & Axxis Jr [B]Melbourne Playboys [/B]- The Melbourne Blondes [B]Technical Excellence[/B] - Dean Waldorf & Marv Statler [B]The Wrecking Crew[/B] - “Bulldozer” Brandon Smith & “Steam Shovel” Greg Rayne – Supreme brand [CENTER][B]Overall[/B][/CENTER] The honest truth is that my plans on the Legends brand were always a bit less solid than for the Supreme brand. When I first formed the brand, my only real plans were to make Christian Faith the first champion on the brand and to add the Sky Club Division. Somehow things would just seem to fall together, like Eric Tyler retiring and becoming the General Manager and so on. That just seemed to work better on the Legends brand. Again, I'm open to comments or questions.

[praguepride]

I've never had time to start reading a new diary, especially one as lengthy as this one, but I've recently converted the first 400 posts to .PDF's and started reading them. To be completely honest, the format of the shows (grey/white) kinda turned me off, but turning it to printable views cleared that up so with the distractions of formatting turned off, I'm really digging it. derek_b's was the first SWF diary I really got into, but after the first show I'm pretty hooked.

[ampulator]

Of all ideas, I think the Sky Club was the least thought out. Yes, it did seem WCWish... the thing was, though, SWF's style is more akin to WWF's Attitude Era (or a version of it) than to WCW's in any era. Having popularity rating MUCH more than performance didn't help. You would have had to beef up Lucha Libre, Modern, and/or Daredevil to get your desired results, and probably made it less popularity-based.

[randomfreeze]

Just saw this update, as the most vocal Sin Inc. fan I would of loved them claiming to be lightweights and faceoff in the Sky Club division. Even though you said the Legends brand how more of a Sports Entertainment feel than you originally wanted, I think I enjoyed reading the Legend shows more. The Sky Club wasn't pulling in the grades you wanted, but they were still really interesting characters in spotty matches I enjoyed reading. Most of those guys were fresh to see in the SWF, so it was cool. Also, seeing how you used Golden was fun, because it seemed like you were always ragging on him and amazed that he wasn't terrible lol so I liked seeing how you used the Golden Faction. And then with Faith as the figurehead who is probably my favorite SWF wrestler after Sexy, I thought all the shows came off really well....and that's not even getting into the potential DAVE standoff. As a random question, who did you have in development that would of surprised us the most? When T-Rex popped up he caught me off guard, but he made sense after thinking about it. Any crazy Dusty Bins down there?

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=praguepride;736724]I've never had time to start reading a new diary, especially one as lengthy as this one, but I've recently converted the first 400 posts to .PDF's and started reading them. To be completely honest, the format of the shows (grey/white) kinda turned me off, but turning it to printable views cleared that up so with the distractions of formatting turned off, I'm really digging it. derek_b's was the first SWF diary I really got into, but after the first show I'm pretty hooked.[/QUOTE] Doing it into a pdf is a pretty interesting approach - think JamesCasey mentioned doing that with his. Might have to see about a crash course in PDF and see about hosting it somewhere, just in case others might like that... Glad to still be grabbing readers, praguepride. Hopefully you enjoy the read. [QUOTE=ampulator;736730]Of all ideas, I think the Sky Club was the least thought out. Yes, it did seem WCWish... the thing was, though, SWF's style is more akin to WWF's Attitude Era (or a version of it) than to WCW's in any era. Having popularity rating MUCH more than performance didn't help. You would have had to beef up Lucha Libre, Modern, and/or Daredevil to get your desired results, and probably made it less popularity-based.[/QUOTE] It was. No problem at all admitting that. I never properly considered the difficulty in trying to work a "division" of midcard talent into something worthwhile. The WCW "vanilla midgets" were a bit of my inspiration for it, along with the idea that Vibert was indirectly bringing a DaVE influence... and that DaVE wasn't just some hardcore promotion but one that offered a bit of everything in the wrestling world. But I don't think a WCW style approach would really work in the SWF within the constraints of the game. Part of the problem was that I didn't plan things out enough in advance. The Sky Club Division was something of a "long term thought" that got pushed forward when I did the brand split. The brand split was not a plan from the beginning, as I've mentioned a couple of times. It was a response to my lovely inability to control the size of my roster. I liked how it worked out in many ways, but it did complicate matters. I thought the Sky Club Division would be a good way to try to differentiate the product between the brands. Another basic problem is that there are not that many good high fliers who are very over in the US to start with. A number of them are unavailable for various reasons, and others I had other uses for. There was also a lot of talent - some of it fairly popular - on the Supreme brand that could have helped out the division a lot. While not all are true high fliers, the likes of Marc DuBois, both Bumfholes, Champagne Lover, Gino Montero, Darryl Devine, and a few others could have helped out a lot. But with the Gen-S storyline on the Supreme brand, they were more a part of that and I kept them there. To redo it (assuming I kept the brand split), I would introduce the division slower. I would also use the B-show more carefully. While the Sky Club division talent featured quite often on the B show - many of them tended to get most of their wins there - it was just in matches. I would feature them in storylines, and not just with each other, but also with some of the more over talent, to give them a rub. I never really did storylines exclusive to the B show much, and gave most of the Legends show time to workers who I knew would pull better ratings in angles. The simple reason that I never adjusted the product to better suit the Sky Club division was that it wasn't worth it. The default SWF product obviously worked very well for good grades once I had the talent very over. I didn't want to sacrifice that for a division which was never going to be a primary focus. Yeah, it would've added to the challenge a bit... but it was never challenge or lack thereof which really affected the game for me. If I was looking for a challenge, I wouldn't have started with Supreme in the first place.

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=randomfreeze;736748]Just saw this update, as the most vocal Sin Inc. fan I would of loved them claiming to be lightweights and faceoff in the Sky Club division. Even though you said the Legends brand how more of a Sports Entertainment feel than you originally wanted, I think I enjoyed reading the Legend shows more. The Sky Club wasn't pulling in the grades you wanted, but they were still really interesting characters in spotty matches I enjoyed reading. Most of those guys were fresh to see in the SWF, so it was cool. Also, seeing how you used Golden was fun, because it seemed like you were always ragging on him and amazed that he wasn't terrible lol so I liked seeing how you used the Golden Faction. And then with Faith as the figurehead who is probably my favorite SWF wrestler after Sexy, I thought all the shows came off really well....and that's not even getting into the potential DAVE standoff. As a random question, who did you have in development that would of surprised us the most? When T-Rex popped up he caught me off guard, but he made sense after thinking about it. Any crazy Dusty Bins down there?[/QUOTE] I honestly probably would've ended up doing the Sin Inc as Sky Club Division tag team champions bit. I didn't have a lot of set direction for those belts, and Sin Inc would have brought better grades to the division for certain. I was struggling a bit with the fact that it would contradict the intended direction for that brand, but at the same time, it still the SWF and it is still entertainment. And I think that would have been entertaining. I had also given some small thought to having Rocky Golden win the Shooting Star belt. Basically, he gets desperate to hold some SWF gold so he gets himself into a match against Biggz and wins the belt. Again, I was struggling with the fact that it was a comedy approach to the "serious" brand and it would kind of devalue the Sky Club Division as a whole... but there is just something fun about imagining Rocky Golden having to defend his belt in ladder matches and such... I hired a ton of people into development and many of them got released when they didn't show much improvement (taking advantage of the free release from development bug when it was still there). I thought Dusty Bin might have even been one of them - just for the fun of it - but his history in the game says no so I guess not. As for who was still in there and developing, with an actual chance to get called up, I doubt there is anyone who would shock people. A lot of rather expected talent - Des Davids, Primus Allen, Sayeed Ali, El Fuerza, Gargantuan, Nathaniel Ca$ino, Nathan Callum, and Matt Hocking. Davids and Allen were pretty ready to make the jump but I didn't have any real use for them yet. Fuerza improved quite a bit, but my idea to bring him in as the third with Marquez and Montero was held back by the overness differentiation. Gargantuan improved a ton (C Rumble, C+ Entertainment, C Performance), enough to make a push possible whenever I decided to elevate him. The problem was his personality. The guy is a Class A jerkbag and a big push out the gates is not going to make that better. Beyond those, it was the likes of Ace Youngblood, Cole Taylor, Kanishioki, and The Good Ole Boys (from PSW). I loved the idea of an old school native American gimmick on the Legends brand, especially with Pistol Pete still there to have Youngblood as a sidekick, but he wasn't improving much. The Good Ole Boys struck me as potentially a new version of the Lords of War, using some of the cool alts for them... but they weren't improving that quickly. Regular Joe Benning was a relatively late addition to development but who improved a fair bit too. I doubt any of them names of those released from development would shock or awe - Danny Patterson, The Big Problem, Valentine, Animal Harker, Frankie Dee, Daniel Black Francis, Nathan McKenzie, Marc Speed, Zeus Maxamillion, and some others. Jim Force, of course, but that was addressed in the diary.

[Phantom Stranger]

Just had a thought. What was the deal with the East Coast War DVD mini-arc and press release? Was this going to tie into DaVE vs. DaVE?

[praguepride]

[QUOTE=Bigpapa42;736754]Doing it into a pdf is a pretty interesting approach - think JamesCasey mentioned doing that with his. Might have to see about a crash course in PDF and see about hosting it somewhere, just in case others might like that... Glad to still be grabbing readers, praguepride. Hopefully you enjoy the read. [/QUOTE] Firefox has a builtin app for that (seriously, it's like the iPhone). I switched it to printable view and then File -> Save as .PDF bam. Done.

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=Phantom Stranger;736771]Just had a thought. What was the deal with the East Coast War DVD mini-arc and press release? Was this going to tie into DaVE vs. DaVE?[/QUOTE] See, this is part of the reason I love people asking questions. There are so many little things I had going or planned that I forgot to include in the wrap-up posts... The DVD series mini-storyline was definitely going to be part of the DaVE civil war on the Legends brand. The initial idea of Vibert doing it this was really just a throwaway idea, showing how "business saavy" Vibert was, despite DaVE's failure. This was intended to be a subtle contradiction to the "your bad decisions killed DaVE" accusations that would come from Tyler (and though I didn't know it at the time, Nemesis). At that point, the DaVE storyline was more of a small conflict than the bigger civil war idea it would become, so it was a minor point then. As the DaVE storyline got bigger, to the point that it would become the primary storyline on the brand and included Nemesis, I figured to use the DVD release as a calalyst. I meant to make some off-hand mentions of it in the lead up - casual mentions in the Avatar backstage stuff, or even commentators pimping it during shows - but kept forgetting. But my plan was to have the DVD set released in about late January or early February and it would basically cause a bit on an uproar. Former DaVE and East Coast Wars guys complaining about everything from how they were portrayed in the documentary to what matches were chosen. Basically, Vibert put it together and he takes a ton of flack for it. I was thinking it could be a catalyst for Caufield turning heel and joining up with Nemesis - part of it is that he's unhappy with the way his friend "minimzes his contributions" and partly that he knows he will do better if the brand becomes more hardcore, as Nemesis is pushing for. I had briefly thought about even using the storyline as a reason for the Silverbacks (aka The Machines) to become less mercenary, as they focus on taking down Vibert due to perceived slights. More on the Silverbacks and their new addition at some point later... I wanted to tie some of the DVD content into your PPPW diary, and intended to go back and read through that great work to gleen some stuff to use. I love the idea of combining stuff from there with some CV cannon, to the point where the reader might have started to question whether Vibert's stuff was an accurate history or a revisionist look at the whole East Coast War and DaVE. I also liked the aspect of tying the big DVD release together with the storyline for the simple fact that it would make for great marketing. It would also bring up the through of whether the whole storyline was done to sell DVDs... [QUOTE=praguepride;737052]Firefox has a builtin app for that (seriously, it's like the iPhone). I switched it to printable view and then File -> Save as .PDF bam. Done.[/QUOTE] Really? That simple? I'll have to take a look later. If its easy enough to combine the separate pdf's into one big document, I'll just have to find somewhere to host it. Thanks for the idea, PP.

[Bigpapa42]

I had actually thought about throwing some more "thoughts" about where things were going on here last week and just random stuff, but felt like it might seem a cheap bump. Since praguepride was kind enough to make a comment. Plus PS' question got me thinking about some stuff. So I figured I'd do it now. -I said in my 2008 year review that my greatest disappointment in this project was that I had not created a single "unlikely" star. Pretty much everyone who came in and got anywhere close to star status - Darryl Devine, Acid, Eric Tyler, Chris Caufield, Davis Wayne Newton, Antonio Marquez, Gino Montero, Troy Tornado, Rocky Golden, Steven Parker, Joss Thompson, The New Wave, Pistol Pete Hall, Dan Stone Jr, Sean Deeley, Ray Diaz, Bryan Holmes - were pretty much all likely to based on talent or Star Quality. Is getting Holmes or Acid or even Steve Flash over in the SWF impressive just because they lack Enterrtainment skills? Well, they are still quite skilled in the ring, and if you associate them with already-over talent... To me, its cool and fun to get the likes of them over in the SWF, but particularly impressive... Maybe Flash would've been.... So I end up feeling like I failed to take advantage of one the coolest aspects of the SWF, which is the basic ability to get [I]anyone[/I] over. I recently started to consider who would have been impressive - to my mind, at least - and I honestly came up blank. I was looking through the CV on a recent SWF start-up and trying to find some talent who I could've felt as though I accomplished something by getting them over. Someone like The McWade's, Larry Wood, or even The Big Problem has an obvious hook - Menace, in those cases - that makes reasonably possible to gain them popularity. The truly challenging ones would be those with almost no redeeming qualities or talent - someone like Dusty Bin. But what's the point? Beyond being able to point at an A* over Dusty, what does it add? Unless I had some way to make it relevant, it would just seem like an obvious "look what I can do!!!" ploy. So I end up looking at some of those "in-between" talents... guys who have a bit of skill but don't really have a hook or an obvious reason they would garner a place in national promotion. The names that jump at me are the likes of Travis Century, Jack Griffith, Johnny Martin, Titan, and so on. A few of them don't get too much use in many diaries, but I still don't know how impressive it would have been to get one of them over. Maybe I'm overlooking some obviously possible names... So while I still feel like its something I would've liked to do, I can't point at any one worker and think they would've been a challenge and yet added something... -my other major regret from the diary was the brand split. Which seems to weird to say, as I like how it worked out in so many ways. Considering I didn't plan the split from the start and my plans for the Legends brand were continually evolving, it worked out very well. I never planned on Eric Tyler becoming the GM until just a few weeks (game-time) before the Supreme Challenge when I found out he'd be retiring right after... and it worked out very well, in my opinion. The DaVE storyline was always evolving a bit but it eventually became what I wanted it to be... though that was right where I ended things, so it never did play out as I wanted to see. Without the split, I never could've built towards the Money-Faith blockbuster champion-versus-champion Christmas main event (though some readers were clearly unhappy with the result of it...). Yet while it worked out well, it did double the amount of work the diary took to write. Which then halved the speed of progress. So while the result was satisfying in one sense, it created a mess of problems in another. I would definitely do it again for a non-diary game, but I think i would try to keep things more under control in terms of my roster for another diary game. -I had roster size problems on previous games (shocking, I know), whether it was SWF, TCW, CGC, or basically anyone. So I started up the diary game with a clear plan in terms of roster additions - only add those workers that I have fairly specific plans for. I broke that in a few cases for talented youngsters, who I figured I would find something for after they spent a significant amount of time in development. But for the most part, I stuck to that goal. There was a fairly simple problem with that approach - just because I can think of a specific use for that worker does not make it necessary or mean that it will work. There is only so much talent you can fit on TV, especially when you want to heavily feature your top guys to protect the show grades. Its that old booking adage - you can't push everyone. Which is why many guys that I had plans and "use" for ended up floating. They jobbed on TV, won on the B show, and I didn't want to trim them off the roster as I still had that idea of them having "use". Its weird to clearly recognize that you have a problem and yet be unwilling to correct it... In future diaries, I am going to have set more stringent parameters on signing talent. -there was really one notable talent coming up on written contract through the first part of 2009 that interested me... Ricky Dale Johnson. Stealing one of TCW's biggest names was obviously appealing by itself... but I couldn't do it without good reason. And try as I might, I couldn't find one. No natural role for him to fall into, no natural feuds... except maybe Tyson "Paine" Baine, who was never acknowledged as a former TCW star once he joined. A tag team with Pistol Pete seemed natural - the two vets, the cowboy and the street fighter. But to what end? They would just be another inexperienced tandem, despite the talent. RDJ is just a pretty good in the ring, not quite great (when compared to guys like Flash, Hall, Holmes) so I doubt I would want to use him as a trainer, either on-screen or at RIPW. All things considered, I would not likely have signed him... and I'm pretty sure I would have earlier in the game. So I guess I do learn, albeit slowly. -one new name I did want to sign was William Hayes. His contract with PGHW was up in April and he wasn't loyal to them, so I think I would've been able to land him. He was going to be the third member of the Silverbacks. Well, I guess Mr. Jackson was kinda the third member, but he never got in the ring and was never intended to. With "Mr. Hayes" on board, it would allow some trios matches and I would look to build up some tag experience between him and John Anderson, so if Hill retires before too long, it would still work. -one thing I didn't do that I regret to some degree is re-branding talent. This was intentional, as I felt re-branding new talent was a very "WWE thing" to do. I didn't want to have my vision of the SWF to completely emulate the E, so I decided to avoid re-branding for the most part. I looked at the starting roster and guys who had worked elsewhere, and it seemed like most came in with the same name and maybe just a somewhat changed gimmick. So I tended to stick with existing names or alter egos, as well as mostly existing alt images. Why do I regret this approach? For the simple fact that I took away an opportunity to be creative. I know I can come up with some interesting (to me, at least) unique characters visions in other games, and I didn't do that much at all in the diary. Looking back, I should have mixed it up a bit. Now, since obviously hasn't gotten long enough yet, a look at who I regret signing to some degree! [B]Texas Pete[/B] - I was jumping on any talent from TCW that became available in hopes of hurting them... but letting them keep Pete may have hurt more. He's a decent talent and a good locker room guy, but as a few readers complained, pretty much totally generic. His role in the Golden Faction could've gone to any number of other possibilities. [B]Payne [/B]- I liked the Vader-ish gimmick but I just didn't need a monster heel at the point he came in. So he floated. And he lost some matches. And he lost the monster heel aura. Flipping him to the Legends brand and aligning him with Nemesis may have brought it back a bit, but never did anything near what I could've with him. Should've let him stay in TCW on a PPA until I could really make use of him. [B]Tana [/B]- this will probably make Zeel cry. I've explained before, I had dancing visions of a fun Samoan stable and that crashed. Tana was going to get some backstage segments in the near future at least, due to a request from Zeel after winning the final PPV prediction contest. But as a whole, I should have left him to stink up the TCW midcard. [B] Jay Chord [/B]- this is a tough one. Talented kid, but his massively negative personality makes it unlikely he'll ever get a push. So talent and major family name or not, he just really wasn't a worthwhile addition. [B]Art Reed[/B] - not quite talented enough to get over on that alone and that simple fact kind of kept him floating. I had one nice plan for him - when Dan Stone Jr joined and created his "House of Stone", Reed was going to get a big rub by tagging with Stone. Until that was scuttled by awful tag chemistry. Crap. [B]Chris Caufield, Eric Tyler, and Phil Vibert[/B] - weird thought, but if I was going to do a 2008 SWF diary over again and try to avoid the brand split, I might avoid singing this trio. For the simple fact that I think it would be tough to add all three without having some type of DaVE overtones. Maybe sign Caufield by himself, and possibly eventually use Vibert just as a manager.

[Zeel1]

[QUOTE=Bigpapa42;737491][B]Texas Pete[/B] - I was jumping on any talent from TCW that became available in hopes of hurting them... but letting them keep Pete may have hurt more. He's a decent talent and a good locker room guy, but as a few readers complained, pretty much totally generic. His role in the Golden Faction could've gone to any number of other possibilities. [/QUOTE] You know, I know there isn't much love for Pete in general, but really, I don't hate the guy. As you said, great locker room guy and he really isn't that bad - I mean in my TCW game, he's gotten B matches with both Rick Law and Ricky Dale Johnson, and his popularity really hasn't risen that much. If he can get good grades in TCW, then there's no reason he can't get them in SWF. As for "generic"..I don't really think that's fair to say, because pretty much everyone in the C-Verse is a blank slate to be filled out. He doesn't [i]have[/i] to be nothing but a silent hulking hoss with a cowboy hat. I've presented him as much more of a James Storm-type cowboy then a 70's rough heel cowboy, which I feel helps him stand out a good bit more. I can totally get people thinking both cowboys and hosses are generic, but I'm just saying, they are what you make them out to be. Although I may be a bit soft on Pete because I actually like the render pose, it kinda gives you a wide variety of ways to go about him without needing a pic change.

[Self]

Never feel bad about posting these epilogue commentaries. I'm totally digging them. MORE! [quote=Bigpapa42;737491]-I said in my 2008 year review that my greatest disappointment in this project was that I had not created a single "unlikely" star.[/quote] I hear you on this. I often feel my own work is over-loaded with pre-made stars, when the true challenge of any booker is taking someone from nothing and creating the perception that he is a big deal. Beyond proving you can get them over in-game, the big challenge is getting them over to the readers. Getting the smarks (term used with love) who frequent the boards to forget about Dusty Bin's stats and think "He's a killer!" would be an awesome and satisfying challenge. The fatal flaw being "Why use Dusty Bin, when Dan Stone Jr. will get you better grades?" Especially as SWF, it's too tempting to take the path of least resistance. I seriously empathise. I fall into that groove myself.

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=Zeel1;737653]You know, I know there isn't much love for Pete in general, but really, I don't hate the guy. As you said, great locker room guy and he really isn't that bad - I mean in my TCW game, he's gotten B matches with both Rick Law and Ricky Dale Johnson, and his popularity really hasn't risen that much. If he can get good grades in TCW, then there's no reason he can't get them in SWF. As for "generic"..I don't really think that's fair to say, because pretty much everyone in the C-Verse is a blank slate to be filled out. He doesn't [i]have[/i] to be nothing but a silent hulking hoss with a cowboy hat. I've presented him as much more of a James Storm-type cowboy then a 70's rough heel cowboy, which I feel helps him stand out a good bit more. I can totally get people thinking both cowboys and hosses are generic, but I'm just saying, they are what you make them out to be. Although I may be a bit soft on Pete because I actually like the render pose, it kinda gives you a wide variety of ways to go about him without needing a pic change.[/QUOTE] You absolutely are correct that any C-Verse worker is whatever you make them. I do, however, think that is far easier in a diary game than in just a regular game, simply because you have to figure something out for a worker to write them. Maybe I'm alone in this, but I've never put anywhere near the amount thought and work into characterizations and stories for regular games as I have for the diary projects. In a regular game, I'm much more willing to say "Jack Bruce = Chris Jericho" and leave a bland worker bland. I do like the Texas Pete render. Quite a bit. There's just something about it. That said, its also part of what makes him bland - he's just a hat and a chin. But its not the only thing. Pretty much nothing about him really stands out - he's a big hoss who isn't overpoweringly strong or overtly menacing, isn't a great brawler, like to party, and uses a powerbomb finisher. The "likes to party" bit is a bit of a hook, at least for writing, but most cowboys I've ever met (and its a fair few) like to party, so that's almost an expectation in my mind. I look at Pete and I look at Marshall Dillon and beyond the talent difference, I don't see too much difference. Whether its the the interesting history, the lariats, or the obvious connection to Stan Hansen, Pistol Pete Hall seems far less bland to me. Why I've come to think he's bland is simply that there is nothing about him that stands out. Nothing to make him different from the endless big strong hosses that have been used throughout wrestling history. And yes, you can most certainly come up with something that will - as you've done quite well in your TCW diary - but its all up to you. I think a lot of CV characters give you plenty to work with. I just don't think Pete does. [QUOTE=Self;737664]Never feel bad about posting these epilogue commentaries. I'm totally digging them. MORE! I hear you on this. I often feel my own work is over-loaded with pre-made stars, when the true challenge of any booker is taking someone from nothing and creating the perception that he is a big deal. Beyond proving you can get them over in-game, the big challenge is getting them over to the readers. Getting the smarks (term used with love) who frequent the boards to forget about Dusty Bin's stats and think "He's a killer!" would be an awesome and satisfying challenge. The fatal flaw being "Why use Dusty Bin, when Dan Stone Jr. will get you better grades?" Especially as SWF, it's too tempting to take the path of least resistance. I seriously empathise. I fall into that groove myself.[/QUOTE] Thanks. Good to know its being enjoyed, as I should be putting the time into my WWE project and I'm messing with this instead. As far pushing someone who really lacks the talent to get over and trying to get them over regardless, the problem is that its a basic contradiction. Its always a goal to book strong shows. Maybe the storylines are the major concern, but at the very least, you want to book strong enough matches to not regress as a promotion. Not that one poor worker - even Dusty Bin - is likely to do great harm to a promotion, not if you are careful. Still, its hard not to have that "this is contrary to my goals" thought about it. For me, at least. Its definitely something I'll put more consideration into if I were to do another SWF diary at some point in the future.

[Self]

To me, it's a case of allowing personal feelings to get the better of me. I like the idea of being Vince McMahon and simply saying "[I]He just complimented my hair. I like this guy. I'm going to push him.[/I]" For example, I inexplicably like Calvin Dark. I like his render. I find his hatred of Christmas adorable. Much like in my real life enjoyment of wrestling, actual wrestling skill is largely irrelevant when it comes to who I like. I love the idea of bringing in Calvin Dark, and trying to make him a star. I would have hired Calvin for FCK, if the Owner Goals weren't already frowning at me. A point of difference between us is that, in my diary at least, I don't really book to have strong shows. My primary goal is to write entertaining television. Getting good scores on TEW is a secondary concern. So if I have two guys competing for a spot, for example, Calvin Dark and Steve Flash, I'm more likely to go for the one I can write the best character for. Calvin is more interesting to me. The Black Mark would get the nod. ... but then, looking at my Main Event scene, they're all the usual suspects. Popular Canadian guys (Stone, DeColt, DaLay, Edd) or talented folks from around the world (Raul Hughes, Christian Faith). Harry Allen's perhaps the only 'unlikely star' I've really pushed. Note to Self; Follow own advice.

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=Self;737747]To me, it's a case of allowing personal feelings to get the better of me. I like the idea of being Vince McMahon and simply saying "[I]He just complimented my hair. I like this guy. I'm going to push him.[/I]" For example, I inexplicably like Calvin Dark. I like his render. I find his hatred of Christmas adorable. Much like in my real life enjoyment of wrestling, actual wrestling skill is largely irrelevant when it comes to who I like. I love the idea of bringing in Calvin Dark, and trying to make him a star. I would have hired Calvin for FCK, if the Owner Goals weren't already frowning at me. A point of difference between us is that, in my diary at least, I don't really book to have strong shows. My primary goal is to write entertaining television. Getting good scores on TEW is a secondary concern. So if I have two guys competing for a spot, for example, Calvin Dark and Steve Flash, I'm more likely to go for the one I can write the best character for. Calvin is more interesting to me. The Black Mark would get the nod. ... but then, looking at my Main Event scene, they're all the usual suspects. Popular Canadian guys (Stone, DeColt, DaLay, Edd) or talented folks from around the world (Raul Hughes, Christian Faith). Harry Allen's perhaps the only 'unlikely star' I've really pushed. Note to Self; Follow own advice.[/QUOTE] Yeah. The funny thing is that I always intended the diary to be about the stories and characters, with the show grades not really meaning much. But it never worked out that way. I read about so many people having trouble with the SWF in the early going and falling to cult, so I was overly (and probably needlessly) worried about that. I wanted to maximize grades so I wouldn't drop back. And once I had that mindset in my booking approach, I found it almost impossible to adjust. I can't explain why... Its basically like once I found what was successful for me, I could adjust that mindset. I adjusted my booking somewhat, as I did go away from using angles rated on what would work best to a more realistic approach of rating based on what they're doing (didn't change the grades much, but still....). Maybe I've learned my lesson a bit in that regard, as for my current WWE project, I've managed to basically not worry much about the gades. That could be down to the shows grading a bit too high (I messed with the mod) or the decision not to even post the grades in the diary, but I'm fairly happy so long as the grades in that one are enough to keep the promotion at its current level. As for picking talent, yeah, performance became a foremost concern. Not the only concern, but a fairly notable one. What I ended up looking for and pushing most frequently was talented workers with a "hook" - something I could use to get them over. I know thats not entirely necessary when it comes to the SWF, but it helps and its tough to lose that mindset.

[foolinc]

[QUOTE=Bigpapa42;737888]Yeah. The funny thing is that I always intended the diary to be about the stories and characters, with the show grades not really meaning much. But it never worked out that way. I read about so many people having trouble with the SWF in the early going and falling to cult, so I was overly (and probably needlessly) worried about that. I wanted to maximize grades so I wouldn't drop back. And once I had that mindset in my booking approach, I found it almost impossible to adjust. I can't explain why... Its basically like once I found what was successful for me, I could adjust that mindset. I adjusted my booking somewhat, as I did go away from using angles rated on what would work best to a more realistic approach of rating based on what they're doing (didn't change the grades much, but still....). Maybe I've learned my lesson a bit in that regard, as for my current WWE project, I've managed to basically not worry much about the gades. That could be down to the shows grading a bit too high (I messed with the mod) or the decision not to even post the grades in the diary, but I'm fairly happy so long as the grades in that one are enough to keep the promotion at its current level. As for picking talent, yeah, performance became a foremost concern. Not the only concern, but a fairly notable one. What I ended up looking for and pushing most frequently was talented workers with a "hook" - something I could use to get them over. I know thats not entirely necessary when it comes to the SWF, but it helps and its tough to lose that mindset.[/QUOTE] Don't beat yourself up for finding a successful booking strategy. I'm in the same boat as you. I try to book interesting storylines between different characters I like, however at the same time I'm going to be trying to be the best promotion I can be (trying to win each and every regional battle and the like).

[jesseewiak]

I think it's interesting you basically grabbed guys simply to destroy TCW. It's sort of like WCW during the mid-90's. Except well booked.

[Zeel1]

[QUOTE=jesseewiak;737911]I think it's interesting you basically grabbed guys simply to destroy TCW. It's sort of like WCW during the mid-90's. Except well booked.[/QUOTE] You know, that's a pretty good comparison, because around that time, WCW just greedily signed every single available worker with potential they could find..similar situation. :p

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=foolinc;737899]Don't beat yourself up for finding a successful booking strategy. I'm in the same boat as you. I try to book interesting storylines between different characters I like, however at the same time I'm going to be trying to be the best promotion I can be (trying to win each and every regional battle and the like).[/QUOTE] I don't know that its being hard on myself so much as being honest and open in a retrospetive asessment. Going back and doing the 2008 review really made me realize and acknowledge some things - some I was already aware of some to some degree and some were a bit of a surprise. When I talk to about what I would change or do different, or what I regret, its meant in a fairly figurative sense. Because I do like how the project came out. It wasn't perfect by any means, but it was fun for me as a the writer and seems to have been enjoyed by you readers. On this type of project, what more can you ask for? [QUOTE=jesseewiak;737911]I think it's interesting you basically grabbed guys simply to destroy TCW. It's sort of like WCW during the mid-90's. Except well booked.[/QUOTE] Taking down TCW was one of my main goals from the start. I saw Richard Eisen as someone who wouldn't admit to TCW legitimately being competition, but if he felt they were, he would go out of his way to hurt them however possible. That was basically what was behind it. Continually hoping for Total to fail was a weird feeling, I have to admit. TCW was and probably remains my favorite CV promotion. Despite the duration of this SWF game, I've probably enjoyed the non-diary TCW games on 2008 more than the other SWF games I played (many of which were, admittedly, just "practice runs" for the diary). Signing everyone possible from TCW obviously wasn't the best approach. Being selective in who you steal and take only those who can not only help you but actually do hurt your rivals - like The New Wave and The Machines, Troy Tornado, and probably even Rocky Golden. Did losing Texas Pete and Tana really hurt them? I doubt it. As for the "well-booked" part, I had my moments. Good and bad. When I did the 2008 review, the number of storylines that were started and then just completely abandoned make me wonder... [QUOTE=Zeel1;737915]You know, that's a pretty good comparison, because around that time, WCW just greedily signed every single available worker with potential they could find..similar situation. :p[/QUOTE] Yes, and I'm surprised people didn't mention that more often. I figured people would be outting me as a cheap Bischoff knockoff. Good thing I held off on my plans for a "newer World order" stable and the triumphant re-branding of Tana into The Shockmaster.

[ampulator]

You know, reading your diary has given me ideas on what to do for my own SWF diary that I'm going to do. I can't do the exact same thing as you, and since there are certain things you refused to do, I think it makes easier for me to do them. :p

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=ampulator;738070]You know, reading your diary has given me ideas on what to do for my own SWF diary that I'm going to do. I can't do the exact same thing as you, and since there are certain things you refused to do, I think it makes easier for me to do them. :p[/QUOTE] Hey, I'm always happy to provide an inspiration. Even when its of what not to do...

[Guest cmdrsam]

You dont give yourself enough credit. You did alot right and well.

[tristram]

It's not very often I tune into a show to hear commentators, but I've been going back and reading your shows mate, and your use of Jerry Eisen is hella funny. One of my favourites: Phil Vibert: Why do I get the feeling that you daddy has been up to no good, Jerry? Jerry Eisen: Daddy does that sometimes...

[ampulator]

[QUOTE=Bigpapa42;739330]Hey, I'm always happy to provide an inspiration. Even when its of what not to do...[/QUOTE] There's a lot to be learned from your SWF on what to do, to be sure. :) But what I mean is, not necessarily inspiration. What I meant was, like, for example, you never expictly changed the product, even in ways that could have helped some of your (decidedly more minor) goals, such as keep Phillip Roberts and Enygma up. I think I have stated before, that I felt that Phillip Roberts would do much better in a non-popularity-based promotion, and the fact that his style is of a Technician hurts his chances of moving higher when combined with his lack of Entertainment Skills. He could have adjusted to being a Regular Wrestler (Sidenote: As a test, using the in-game editor, I changed his style from a Technician to a Regular Wrestler. He jumped from Midcard to Upper Midcarder after I did an Auto-Push), which also suits his skills. However, it would have still been difficult with his lack of Entertainment Skills. I wasn't necessarily asking for a major product change, but I was somewhat surprised that you didn't explicitly (to us, at least) some of the products, that weren't already on Medium or more, to at "Low" over time, considering your diverse set of workers.

[Bigpapa42]

[QUOTE=cmdrsam;739425]You dont give yourself enough credit. You did alot right and well.[/QUOTE] Yeah, I realize... But its natural for me to be self-deprecating. But I do think I made a ton of mistakes. That doesn't change what I do manage to do right, but I really don't think its accurate or realistic to only look at the "good". [QUOTE=tristram;739490]It's not very often I tune into a show to hear commentators, but I've been going back and reading your shows mate, and your use of Jerry Eisen is hella funny. One of my favourites: Phil Vibert: Why do I get the feeling that you daddy has been up to no good, Jerry? Jerry Eisen: Daddy does that sometimes...[/QUOTE] Jerry was fairly fun to write at times. But it got tiring after awhile and started to feel repetitive. I was quite looking forward to the Tug Slowman color commentator - some young punk kid channeling Bobby Heenan and Jesse Ventura... [QUOTE=ampulator;739534]There's a lot to be learned from your SWF on what to do, to be sure. :) But what I mean is, not necessarily inspiration. What I meant was, like, for example, you never expictly changed the product, even in ways that could have helped some of your (decidedly more minor) goals, such as keep Phillip Roberts and Enygma up. I think I have stated before, that I felt that Phillip Roberts would do much better in a non-popularity-based promotion, and the fact that his style is of a Technician hurts his chances of moving higher when combined with his lack of Entertainment Skills. He could have adjusted to being a Regular Wrestler (Sidenote: As a test, using the in-game editor, I changed his style from a Technician to a Regular Wrestler. He jumped from Midcard to Upper Midcarder after I did an Auto-Push), which also suits his skills. However, it would have still been difficult with his lack of Entertainment Skills. I wasn't necessarily asking for a major product change, but I was somewhat surprised that you didn't explicitly (to us, at least) some of the products, that weren't already on Medium or more, to at "Low" over time, considering your diverse set of workers.[/QUOTE] I think part of the reason that I never adjusted the product much was partly that it felt like editing - and I didn't want to do any more of that than I already. That was the reason I didn't adjust the wrestler type in the editor for wrestler's like Roberts and High Concept, who didn't fit that well. It would've felt like going in and making Jay Chord less of an ass or setting Big Smack Scott to reformed on his steroid usage. I did consider adjusting the product, but its not something I've played around with much and that made me hesitate. I always felt like adjusting something was as likely to do as much harm as good. I had plenty of talented workers, but a lot of the guys at the top graded well in matches based on their popularity more than their talent. So adjusting things to take away from that, even a bit, seemed like a bad trade to me. I didn't want to skim from the top to help the middle. Yeah, it meant that the Sky Club Division would never be a top attraction unless I got those guys way over, but I was okay with that when it came right down to it. Roberts is a guy who I definitely underused, but there was a reason behind that (which I don't think I've ever actually mentioned before). When I started the game, there were two workers on the Time Decline List - Enforcer Roberts and Runaway Train. Roberts was listed as 11 years past his prime and I really expected him to retire at pretty much any point. Train was also in terminal decline, so he was held back by that as well. Even when I signed Tyler, who retired after about 5 months, Roberts was still top of the list. I was quite surprised when Tyler said he was retiring before Roberts. JD Morgan eventually became #1 on the Time Decline list when I signed him, but Roberts remained at #2. I should've taken the risk and actually done something with Roberts and Train, but that was the biggest reason I didn't want them doing anything notable in the ring.