Japanese Wrestling Questions

[ChicaGalesa]

I have a few questions for the more Japanese wrestling savvy members.

 

#1: What classifies someone as a 'Junior' wrestler? Is it size or style? I know what a 'super junior' is (roughly), but what I'm trying to work out is, is Junior Heavyweight limited to high flying sort of wrestlers (SJ's, CW's, Luchadores and Spot Monkeys), or is it for all lightweight workers?

 

Someone like Mokuami Maita for example, he's a lightweight, but he's not good in the air and he's a technician. So would he qualify as a Junior Heavyweight in BHOWTG and compete in the Best of the Super Juniors? Or would he fight other heavyweights but just be smaller and have to put up with that?

 

Similarly, a guy who's a high-flying style wrestler but isn't a lightweight or below, would he qualify as a Junior Heavyweight because of his style?

 

#2 in Japan the attendance is sometimes reported as No Vacancy or Super No Vacancy. What's the difference here? Is NV the equivalent of 'standing room only' while SNV is 'completely sold out'? Or is NV more like 'sold out small venue' while SNV is 'sold out large venue'?

 

#3 does the Japanese wrestling culture follow the same sort of 'rules' as Mexico when it comes to masked wrestlers? I.e, attempting to remove the mask is a DQ, you can't put the same mask back on when you're unmasked, etc? And are Hair/Mask vs. Hair/Mask type matches as prestigious in Japan as they are in Mexico?

 

#4 I know what Young Lions are (WLW doesn't use them though, luckily as my champion is 21 years old... and the guy holding the other three belts is even younger), but are really talented youngsters exempted at all? I mean if someone like Gino Montero decides to go to Japan, would he be expected to 'pay his dues' in the same way as any other newly debuted youngster? (I know it depends on Respect in the game, I'm just wondering what would happen in reality?)

[FINisher]

I have a few questions for the more Japanese wrestling savvy members.

 

#1: What classifies someone as a 'Junior' wrestler?

 

I'd say anyone from Small to Middleweight, who have aerial and/or technical skills. Mokuami Maita would be classified as 'Junior', surely. Everyone in WLW is a Junior wrestler, maybe Toyokuni Hardcore being the exception.. Can't remember if there's other workers who I wouldn't classify as 'Junior'.

 

#2 in Japan the attendance is sometimes reported as No Vacancy or Super No Vacancy. What's the difference here? Is NV the equivalent of 'standing room only' while SNV is 'completely sold out'? Or is NV more like 'sold out small venue' while SNV is 'sold out large venue'?

 

I haven't got a clue.

 

#3 does the Japanese wrestling culture follow the same sort of 'rules' as Mexico when it comes to masked wrestlers? I.e, attempting to remove the mask is a DQ, you can't put the same mask back on when you're unmasked, etc? And are Hair/Mask vs. Hair/Mask type matches as prestigious in Japan as they are in Mexico?

 

I'd say No. Mexico is in it's own class when it comes to masks and hair matches and masks in general. I vaguely remember seeing masked wrestlers getting their masks ripped off in Japan without little to no importance in the workers career. Didn't Hayabusa take his mask off as he became "H" or something like that, and then later put it back on. And I have a vague memory of his mask being ripped off during match.. Him or Thunder Liger. But hey, what restricts you from upgrading the importance and prestige of masks? Altough I must add that like Tiger Mask (And Elementals and Phoenixes in Cornellverse) the successor, whom the mask is given, holds a special importance.. Mm. I don't know how to say it, sorry my english. In that way masks are important in Japan. Not everyone will have or get to have a prestigious mask.

 

#4 I know what Young Lions are (WLW doesn't use them though, luckily as my champion is 21 years old... and the guy holding the other three belts is even younger), but are really talented youngsters exempted at all? I mean if someone like Gino Montero decides to go to Japan, would he be expected to 'pay his dues' in the same way as any other newly debuted youngster? (I know it depends on Respect in the game, I'm just wondering what would happen in reality?)

 

Yes. Anyone from F- to E+ is nothing but a jobber, and they have to pay their dues. When they reach D-, you can push them to the moon without any harm.

[angeldelayette]

I'd say No. Mexico is in it's own class when it comes to masks and hair matches and masks in general. I vaguely remember seeing masked wrestlers getting their masks ripped off in Japan without little to no importance in the workers career. Didn't Hayabusa take his mask off as he became "H" or something like that, and then later put it back on. And I have a vague memory of his mask being ripped off during match.. Him or Thunder Liger. But hey, what restricts you from upgrading the importance and prestige of masks? Altough I must add that like Tiger Mask (And Elementals and Phoenixes in Cornellverse) the successor, whom the mask is given, holds a special importance.. Mm. I don't know how to say it, sorry my english. In that way masks are important in Japan. Not everyone will have or get to have a prestigious mask.

 

I can remember a match I watched on youtube between Jushin Thunder Liger and The Great Muta. Muta ripped off Liger's mask and Liger shot the mist into Muta's face and went wild throughout the match though he eventually lost and that look was like an anti-Muta look.

[BurningHamster]

I have a few questions for the more Japanese wrestling savvy members.

 

#1: What classifies someone as a 'Junior' wrestler? Is it size or style? I know what a 'super junior' is (roughly), but what I'm trying to work out is, is Junior Heavyweight limited to high flying sort of wrestlers (SJ's, CW's, Luchadores and Spot Monkeys), or is it for all lightweight workers?

 

#2 in Japan the attendance is sometimes reported as No Vacancy or Super No Vacancy. What's the difference here? Is NV the equivalent of 'standing room only' while SNV is 'completely sold out'? Or is NV more like 'sold out small venue' while SNV is 'sold out large venue'?

 

#3 does the Japanese wrestling culture follow the same sort of 'rules' as Mexico when it comes to masked wrestlers? I.e, attempting to remove the mask is a DQ, you can't put the same mask back on when you're unmasked, etc? And are Hair/Mask vs. Hair/Mask type matches as prestigious in Japan as they are in Mexico?

 

 

Juniors in Japan are really just a weight class, although many use aerial or technical styles, it isn't a prerequisite.

 

No Vacancy and Super No Vacancy from what I can tell mean the same thing, super no vacancy seems more like goofy Japanese hyperbole than anything else. Attendance figures are almost always worked anyway.

 

No, Mexico as was stated is in a class of it's own in terms of masks.Some promotions do Mask versus Mask matches but they are mainly the lucha influenced groups like I think Osaka Pro had one not that long ago I believe. Hayabusa's mask drama was part of FMW's entertainment era which really cannot be applied to the rest of Japan as FMW operated outside the mainstream and were far more WWF inspired around this time.

[Moderndaywarrior]

1.In a way it is both: I believe in the strictest sense, "Junior" would be a reference to weight(i.e. Cruiserweight/Light Heavyweight in WCW/WWF);however at some point "Super Junior" also became the name of the more high-flying,Lucha/Strong style hybrid style that many smaller wrestlers use(i.e.Tiger Mask,Dynamite Kid,Liger,etc.).So,a smaller wrestler who is a brawler,or mat wrestler,or what have you what still be a Super Junior when it came to weight classification for title belts,tournaments,etc....however, they would not be a Super Junior in a stylistic sense.

 

 

2.I don't really know,sound to me like both are sell-out crowds,just could be the "Super" version would be a sell out at a really large venue.

 

 

3.I don't think so,as you don't see mask vs mask often in Japan,or even the old "try to pull the mask off" spot. For masked workers that are very well known and over,it would probably work as a selling point for a match though,if done right.

 

4. Seems to me in Japan everyone has to "put their time in" to some degree,although those with potential would obviously get a good push after earning some respect.Non-Japanese wrestlers would be a different case altogether though,I think,as they tend to be handled differently than Japanese wrestlers.

[Greg McNeish]

#1: What classifies someone as a 'Junior' wrestler? Is it size or style? I know what a 'super junior' is (roughly), but what I'm trying to work out is, is Junior Heavyweight limited to high flying sort of wrestlers (SJ's, CW's, Luchadores and Spot Monkeys), or is it for all lightweight workers?

 

Someone like Mokuami Maita for example, he's a lightweight, but he's not good in the air and he's a technician. So would he qualify as a Junior Heavyweight in BHOWTG and compete in the Best of the Super Juniors? Or would he fight other heavyweights but just be smaller and have to put up with that?

 

Similarly, a guy who's a high-flying style wrestler but isn't a lightweight or below, would he qualify as a Junior Heavyweight because of his style?

 

There is a difference between "Junior" and "Super Junior". One is a measure of physical size, and the other is a style of wrestling. Although the two largely overlap, they are not interchangable.

 

Someone that is bigger than a Junior can still have the Super Junior style, but that does not include them in the lower weight class.

 

Someone can be a Junior, but not fight in the Super Junior style. Personally, I wouldn't include them in the Super Junior tournament, because they're not in that style. That would be your call, though.

 

Cheers!

[BurningHamster]

2.I don't really know,sound to me like both are sell-out crowds,just could be the "Super" version would be a sell out at a really large venue.

 

Nah, Super No Vacancy is often used referring to relatively small venues.

[Moderndaywarrior]

Nah, Super No Vacancy is often used referring to relatively small venues.

 

Hmm.....wonder if that is like our "Standing Room Only"?

[mattman1624]

I went searching about the attendance vocabulary of Japanese wrestling and it seems that No Vacancy is at least 80% of tickets sold, Super No Vacancy is at least 90% sold, and Super No Vacancy Full House is a sell out.

[doctorjones]

#2 in Japan the attendance is sometimes reported as No Vacancy or Super No Vacancy. What's the difference here? Is NV the equivalent of 'standing room only' while SNV is 'completely sold out'? Or is NV more like 'sold out small venue' while SNV is 'sold out large venue'?

 

Actually, if I recall correctly, No Vacancy is actually used when about 90-99% capacity is filled, and Super No Vacancy is used when it's is a sold out crowd.

[KingJoel]

Actually, if I recall correctly, No Vacancy is actually used when about 90-99% capacity is filled, and Super No Vacancy is used when it's is a sold out crowd.

 

Exactly. Though Super No Vacancy rarely happens.

[Steviec2k8]

I have a few questions for the more Japanese wrestling savvy members.

 

#1: What classifies someone as a 'Junior' wrestler? Is it size or style? I know what a 'super junior' is (roughly), but what I'm trying to work out is, is Junior Heavyweight limited to high flying sort of wrestlers (SJ's, CW's, Luchadores and Spot Monkeys), or is it for all lightweight workers?

 

Someone like Mokuami Maita for example, he's a lightweight, but he's not good in the air and he's a technician. So would he qualify as a Junior Heavyweight in BHOWTG and compete in the Best of the Super Juniors? Or would he fight other heavyweights but just be smaller and have to put up with that?

 

Similarly, a guy who's a high-flying style wrestler but isn't a lightweight or below, would he qualify as a Junior Heavyweight because of his style?

 

#2 in Japan the attendance is sometimes reported as No Vacancy or Super No Vacancy. What's the difference here? Is NV the equivalent of 'standing room only' while SNV is 'completely sold out'? Or is NV more like 'sold out small venue' while SNV is 'sold out large venue'?

 

#3 does the Japanese wrestling culture follow the same sort of 'rules' as Mexico when it comes to masked wrestlers? I.e, attempting to remove the mask is a DQ, you can't put the same mask back on when you're unmasked, etc? And are Hair/Mask vs. Hair/Mask type matches as prestigious in Japan as they are in Mexico?

 

#4 I know what Young Lions are (WLW doesn't use them though, luckily as my champion is 21 years old... and the guy holding the other three belts is even younger), but are really talented youngsters exempted at all? I mean if someone like Gino Montero decides to go to Japan, would he be expected to 'pay his dues' in the same way as any other newly debuted youngster? (I know it depends on Respect in the game, I'm just wondering what would happen in reality?)

 

I haven't read through the entire thread, so I'm sorry if these have been answered already! ^^;;

 

1. A "Junior Heavyweight" in real life is any wrestler under 100kg (220lbs.) In TEW terms, it would probably be anybody categorized as a "Lightweight" wrestler. Being a "Junior" has nothing to do with styles, as they come in a wide array of styles.

 

2. There are three classifications.

 

No Vacancy - This essentially means there are anywhere between 50% to 80% seats available. It's often used as a way of simply saving face publicly. Sort of like calling a sell out when you really haven't sold out.

 

Super No Vacancy - Most often used, when most of the seats are sold. Usually 95% or so.

 

Super No Vacancy Full House - Used when every possible seat has been sold.

 

3. It depends on the promotion. In the bigger, heavyweight oriented promotions the DQ rule is usually ignored. However, in more lucha oriented groups like Michinoku Pro and DRAGON GATE, they do DQ wrestlers for removing masks.

 

Regarding the second part, stipulations in Japan are not enforced by outside bodies like they are in Mexico. In Mexico, lucha libre is sanctioned just like professional boxing. When a wrestler loses his mask, he is strictly forbidden from wearing it again. There are obvious exceptions, such as Rey Mysterio, however. In Japan, there's nothing like that. However, most wrestlers who lose their mask don't typically just put the mask back on. The closest thing I've seen to it is when Darkness Dragon lost his mask to Dragon Kid in 2003. After turning heel a few weeks later, he changed characters, and began wearing a different mask.

 

Mask/Hair matches aren't really that common in Japan. They have some prestiege in groups like DRAGON GATE, but no where near the amount they have in Mexico.

 

4. In the bigger groups, the rules are you have to pay your dues from anywhere to three to five years. In New Japan, there really hasn't been any exceptions other than Shinsuke Nakamura, who was elevated quicker than normal after winning a mixed martial arts fight. Young Lions usually aren't pushed until they are sent overseas for training. They usually return with new "enhanced" bodies and are then given pushes.

 

All Japan has had occasional exceptions due to their limited roster. They were quick to push Kohei Suwama after he debuted, as he was a highly touted amatuer wrestler. Ryota Hama was also pushed quickly after debuting due to his enormous girth and pedigree as a sumo wrestler.

 

Foreigners are usually treated the same way. Chris Benoit was considered to be part of the New Japan Young Lion system. Prince Devitt in New Japan today has been treated similarly.