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The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*


Adam Ryland

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I don't think they need to unify any more titles, because they shouldn't have unified the WWE/World Heavyweight Championships in the first place. There is far too much talent in the 'E to half the amount of championships. Whereas I can see the plus of it because it adds a certain amount of prestige and it'll obviously double it's activity, it leaves a lot of people treading water like the World Championship unification has done to the likes of Dolph Ziggler, Sheamus, Alberto Del Rio and to a lesser extent the likes of Big Show, Mark Henry, The Miz and Christian. The list of names I could supply would be doubled if I was to list the number of midcarders who would be left in a similar position if both the midcard titles were unified, especially with the intake of NXT guys. The problem is with a lack of coherent booking in the midcard, not the titles themselves...
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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Mammoth" data-cite="Mammoth" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I don't think they need to unify any more titles, because they shouldn't have unified the WWE/World Heavyweight Championships in the first place. There is far too much talent in the 'E to half the amount of championships. Whereas I can see the plus of it because it adds a certain amount of prestige and it'll obviously double it's activity, it leaves a lot of people treading water like the World Championship unification has done to the likes of Dolph Ziggler, Sheamus, Alberto Del Rio and to a lesser extent the likes of Big Show, Mark Henry, The Miz and Christian. The list of names I could supply would be doubled if I was to list the number of midcarders who would be left in a similar position if both the midcard titles were unified, especially with the intake of NXT guys. The problem is with a lack of coherent booking in the midcard, not the titles themselves...</div></blockquote><p> I tend to disagree here. There was no need for a WWE Championship and a World Championship, especially when it has been painfully clear the last couple of years how the company ranks them. Add to the fact there is no longer a brand split and therefore having two titles of each level just isn't logical.</p><p> </p><p> The guys you listed are upper midcarders, but not main eventers. The main event scene in WWE is actually quite slim, in my opinion. A handful of guys are true main eventers and then they'll throw in someone like Shemus or Big Show for a throw away storyline every now and then. They should be gunning for the IC title in my opinion.</p><p> </p><p> As for uniting the IC and US titles, I agree to uniting them. They are meant to be on par, and again with no split, it's not logical to have both. Add to the fact that I literally don't remember the last time the US title was defended, it just doesn't make sense to have it anymore. Ambrose hasn't even had it on tv the last few weeks. If the champion doesn't take it seriously enough to hold it, why should I?</p>
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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="RayW" data-cite="RayW" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I tend to disagree here. There was no need for a WWE Championship and a World Championship, especially when it has been painfully clear the last couple of years how the company ranks them. Add to the fact there is no longer a brand split and therefore having two titles of each level just isn't logical.<p> </p><p> The guys you listed are upper midcarders, but not main eventers. The main event scene in WWE is actually quite slim, in my opinion. A handful of guys are true main eventers and then they'll throw in someone like Shemus or Big Show for a throw away storyline every now and then. They should be gunning for the IC title in my opinion.</p><p> </p><p> As for uniting the IC and US titles, I agree to uniting them. They are meant to be on par, and again with no split, it's not logical to have both. Add to the fact that I literally don't remember the last time the US title was defended, it just doesn't make sense to have it anymore. Ambrose hasn't even had it on tv the last few weeks. If the champion doesn't take it seriously enough to hold it, why should I?</p></div></blockquote><p> No, I actually agree, a lot of/all those guys should be upper midcarder at best but unfortunately they've all been pushed higher in the last two years and that's where the problem lies in my opinion. Alberto Del Rio had a pretty lengthy run as WWE Champion <em>and</em> World Heavyweight Champion, it was only two Wrestlemania's ago that Sheamus beat Daniel Bryan for the World Heavyweight Championship in 18 seconds, Dolph Ziggler was highly popular as the World Heavyweight Champion, granted, Big Show and Mark Henry have been in-and-out of main event status pretty much their whole careers and the other two have probably settled into that upper midcarder role pretty well these days. The lack of another main event title still leaves them in something of a limbo as they aren't going to compete with the likes of John Cena and Randy Orton on a regular basis but they're also too good/credible for the Intercontinental/United States Championship in my opinion, that's why having another title regularly appearing on the "B" show like the World Heavyweight Championship was doing before they were unified was perfect. I don't think it necessarily needs a brand split to work, it just needs to be booked better.</p><p> </p><p> If you unite the Intercontinental and United States Championships, you'll have a select few competing for the title on a regular basis with almost half the roster with nothing better to do, and even worse than the predicament they're in now, the (lower) midcarders aren't going to get their own storylines to occupy their time likes those guys who are "upper midcarders" will do.</p><p> </p><p> In my perfect fantasy booked world, the WWE would still have a brand split though because I think they have a large roster (and increasingly so) with a lot of talent and not enough time in the week to showcase it all, which is why so many guys are left by the wayside. You see, I'd agree with you if they had a smaller roster, without a brand split two midcard titles wouldn't make sense but with the roster size that they have I don't think they can afford to unify them right now. I don't have a clue why they don't utilise the Intercontinental Championship and Big E. more, but I can see why the United States Championship has fallen to the wayside because unfortunately it's around the waist of Dean Ambrose who as part of The Shield is obviously preoccupied; especially now with The Authority feud about to break out. Hopefully they'll have someone else take it off him soon and with a new year ahead of them now with Wrestlemania out of the way and with the NXT guys coming through, they'll throw a bit more attention towards the way of the midcard.</p>
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<p>I agree with others that it makes more sense if they're going to keep the WHC unified, they might as well make the IC belt worth something, and have the RVD's and Alberto Del Rios of the world competing for it, since the WHC has been at about the IC level since 2012 or whenever the brand split ended. </p><p> </p><p> The US belt should probably just be merged or retired, as it's really just an inferior IC belt at this point. Yes, it'd be nice if there was another "TV Title" level belt for Xavier Woods or whoever to compete for, but I don't see WWE taking the time to set something like that up.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>In my perfect fantasy booked world' date=' the WWE would still have a brand split though because I think they have a large roster (and increasingly so) with a lot of talent and not enough time in the week to showcase it all, which is why so many guys are left by the wayside.[/quote']<p> </p><p> I know everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but I disagree with both halves of that opinion! WWE's roster of full-time guys they actually use isn't really all that big. Wikipedia lists 70 guys on their roster, and that includes JTG, William Regal, The Rock, and the Undertaker. When you take guys like that out, you're left with maybe around 50-55 full time guys. WWE has Raw (3 hours), Smackdown (2 hours), Main Event (1 hour), and Superstars (1 hour). That's 7 hours of programming, and that's not even counting NXT (1 hour), which regularly features WWE talent. In addition to that, they've got a platform to have other types of content via the network to help get their talent over. If WWE really had any interest in building guys up, they have the platform to do it, with or without a brand split. But the brand split just doesn't make sense at a time when Raw is clearly the only show that matters.</p></div></blockquote>
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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lazorbeak" data-cite="lazorbeak" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I know everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but I disagree with both halves of that opinion! WWE's roster of full-time guys they actually use isn't really all that big. Wikipedia lists 70 guys on their roster, and that includes JTG, William Regal, The Rock, and the Undertaker. When you take guys like that out, you're left with maybe around 50-55 full time guys. WWE has Raw (3 hours), Smackdown (2 hours), Main Event (1 hour), and Superstars (1 hour). That's 7 hours of programming, and that's not even counting NXT (1 hour), which regularly features WWE talent. In addition to that, they've got a platform to have other types of content via the network to help get their talent over. If WWE really had any interest in building guys up, they have the platform to do it, with or without a brand split. But the brand split just doesn't make sense at a time when Raw is clearly the only show that matters.</div></blockquote><p> That's cool, I only ever post in this thread hoping someone will counter my opinion. xD </p><p> </p><p> I always discount Main Event and Superstars because (correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't watched either show since their respective inceptions) they have maybe one or two matches with not much in the way of their own storylines and therefore character development and the rest of the show is made up of highlights from either Raw and/or Smackdown. I'd potentially discount the WWE Network too because I imagine they're going to be predominantly replays/highlights and reality type shows where the midcarders can gain popularity without the necessary pushes, à la Zack Ryder with his webseries a couple of years ago. In theory, Raw and Smackdown should be enough, but with the way it is now Raw is where everything happens and as Smackdown has become more and more match orientated, it's become more and more of a continuation of Raw rather than a show in it's own right. That's why when I mentioned the draft split, I said I'd <em>still</em> have it because the shows would still be their own entities; I actually whole heartedly agree with you that it would be very difficult to implement a brand split with the way things are right now. </p><p> </p><p> I do still think they have more than enough talent though, because I always consider a brand split almost like turning one promotion into two so to half the 50-55 you came up with, I imagine a lot of independent promotions would be more than happy with 25-30 people on their roster, especially with the talent some of the WWE guys have. No, the WWE aren't an independent promotion but what I'm trying to say is that if they were limited to one show, each show could almost be treated as such and could run quite well in my opinion. It'll also allow room for good turnover, bringing new guys in when and if they need them without struggling with the numbers.</p><p> </p><p> The only thing I wouldn't change is NXT, but that's because NXT is awesome. xD I'd simply implement - especially with the viewing figures NXT gets on the WWE Network - an annual tournament/match where the winner gets a spot on Raw or Smackdown, maybe even having two of them with one winner going to Smackdown and the other to Raw. It'll allow easy implementation to the main roster, be good for NXT and also allow room for storylines surrounding the tournaments/matches. Again though, this is just fantasy booking which would have started years ago so I'm completely cool with the fact that you may or may not agree. <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png"></p>
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<p>The roster really needs a massive clean out to make room for the new stars coming through. I've not seen people like JTG and Curt Hawkins since, well I don't know when. There is room for both the US and IC titles in my opinion, they just need to bring the IC title back up to where it was years ago and have those in the Upper Midcard spot fighting for it like it used to be, the final step before the Main event. The US title can be used for those in the midcard to give them something to fight over rather than bringing in a Television title.</p><p> </p><p>

Just my quick thoughts on the titles.</p>

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<p>Hands down this has to be the best wrestling doc I've seen so far. Was this really released during Bret's time in WCW? I find it hard to believe, considering all of the WWF/E footage, it shouldn't have seen the light of day if Vince had a say in it.</p><p> </p><p>

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQm5dhyPKv4" rel="external nofollow">"Hitman Hart Wrestling With Shadows</a></p>

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Hands down this has to be the best wrestling doc I've seen so far. Was this really released during Bret's time in WCW? I find it hard to believe, considering all of the WWF/E footage, it shouldn't have seen the light of day if Vince had a say in it.

 

"Hitman Hart Wrestling With Shadows

 

The documentary was released during the tail end of Bret's run in WWE just a few month's prior to the Montreal Screwjob. He was still employed with WWE when it was released because if he wasn't it wouldn't have seen the light of day.

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The documentary was released during the tail end of Bret's run in WWE just a few month's prior to the Montreal Screwjob. He was still employed with WWE when it was released because if he wasn't it wouldn't have seen the light of day.

 

:confused: I'm confused, a few months prior would mean before, this documentary shows footage of the Montreal Screwjob and the aftermath however. Even shows some footage backstage where Bret's wife confronts HHH to see if he was in on it the shortly after it had happened. Near the end of the vid at the 1:32:20 mark it says "Bret now works for Ted Turner's WCW", so that seems to clarify he was in WCW at the time of documentary's release. Maybe there was something in his contract we were not aware of between Bret and the WWE that allowed the footage to be released despite his departure. :confused:

 

Nonetheless, still the best wrestling doc I've watched by far, I can't think of any others where the wrestler allowed you to get such a deep and personal look into his/her life.

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NXT Review:

 

Rose vs Burch - OK match. It's hard not to like Adam Rose. I really hope he gets over on the main roster.

Bayley vs Sasha - Solid match. Bayley has the potential to be one of the best female wrestlers in WWE.

Leforte vs Mojo - Squash match. Mojo is over but his ass-based offense needs to go. Leforte should be cut from the roster. Brodus "Main Event Playa" Clay attacked Leforte after the match and challenged the Champ again. Neville got in his face and called him a whinger and an opportunity waster.

Bo Dallas - He tried to occupy NXT with his Bo Movement to get a title shot (after taking a pot-shot at Bryan). When his Bo-lievers didn't join him in the ring he threw a tantrum. Funny segment. JBL came out, dissed Bo and set up a match.

Dallas vs Gabriel - Solid match. Dallas used McIntyre's Futureshock DDT as a finisher, which is at least an improvement.

 

Verdict: Average show thanks to the recent roster turnover. Still no Kalisto or Crowe debuts.

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The documentary was released during the tail end of Bret's run in WWE just a few month's prior to the Montreal Screwjob. He was still employed with WWE when it was released because if he wasn't it wouldn't have seen the light of day.

 

:confused: I'm confused, a few months prior would mean before, this documentary shows footage of the Montreal Screwjob and the aftermath however. Even shows some footage backstage where Bret's wife confronts HHH to see if he was in on it the shortly after it had happened. Near the end of the vid at the 1:32:20 mark it says "Bret now works for Ted Turner's WCW", so that seems to clarify he was in WCW at the time of documentary's release. Maybe there was something in his contract we were not aware of between Bret and the WWE that allowed the footage to be released despite his departure. :confused:

 

Nonetheless, still the best wrestling doc I've watched by far, I can't think of any others where the wrestler allowed you to get such a deep and personal look into his/her life.

 

Yeah, the movie came out a full year after the Screwjob, and includes footage from it. What did happen was after giving the filmmakers permission to go backstage and break kayfabe and all that, Vince got nervous and tried to rescind the permission he had already given, but when WCW's legal department said they'd be willing to finance a lawsuit forcing Vince to honor the deal, Vince backed down and the film got released.

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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Truly" data-cite="Truly" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Nonetheless, still the best wrestling doc I've watched by far, I can't think of any others where the wrestler allowed you to get such a deep and personal look into his/her life.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Have you seen Beyond the Mat? It's also really personal. It looks fairly closely at Mick Foley, Terry Funk, and Jake Roberts. </p><p> </p><p> Card Subject to Change is also really good. It looks at Kevin Sullivan(nowadays), Trent Acid(RIP), Rhett Titus, and Kamala. </p><p> </p><p> I think both are on Netflix, or at least they were.</p>
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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="bigtplaystew" data-cite="bigtplaystew" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So "classy" how the WWE is dealing with The Ultimate Warrior's death. It's almost like they haven't spent 25 years besmirching his name to anyone who will listen. But one nice little Raw tribute should make it all good.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> That thought process and belief is completely unjustified in my opinion.</p><p> </p><p> The Self Destruction of the Ultimate Warrior only happened because Warrior flat out refused to be involved and has bad mouthed the company and employees for years. He made him self look like a lunatic with his nonsensical blogs, his insane political standings and beliefs. I'm not saying Vince and company are completely free of blame, but it's not like he was the easiest guy to work with or even a nice guy for most of his career/life. Sting, who never really bad mouths anyone, said in his shoot interview that when they split the Blade Runners, he was so glad to be away from him. It wasn't until later that they buried the hatchet. </p><p> </p><p> Before Warrior even agreed to be in WWE2K14, they started acknowledging his place in the company's history and considered him a legend. They tried to make peace far earlier than he did.</p>
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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="bigtplaystew" data-cite="bigtplaystew" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So "classy" how the WWE is dealing with The Ultimate Warrior's death. It's almost like they haven't spent 25 years besmirching his name to anyone who will listen. But one nice little Raw tribute should make it all good.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Except, they did mend fences with him and signed him to an ambassador deal this past year? That's the part that should make it "all good"?</p>
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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="bigtplaystew" data-cite="bigtplaystew" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So "classy" how the WWE is dealing with The Ultimate Warrior's death. It's almost like they haven't spent 25 years besmirching his name to anyone who will listen. But one nice little Raw tribute should make it all good.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> What would you believe be the classy (without quotations) thing to do? There will always be people offended no matter what WWE would do over Warrior's death.</p>
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<p>I've just been reading lots of blogs and reports about all the nice things WWE is doing after his death with the word "classy" in it. That's why I put it in quotes. It pisses me off as a longtime fan of the character the way they treated him over the years. Actually, they treated him like crap up to and including his very last appearance on WWE tv.</p><p> </p><p>

Linda took a shot at him AT HIS INDUCTION SPEECH.</p><p> </p><p>

Are they<em> wrong </em>to honor the man? Not in any way, shape, or form. But do I see the company or especially Vince as "classy"? Not even a little bit.</p>

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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Jaysin" data-cite="Jaysin" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>That thought process and belief is completely unjustified in my opinion.<p> </p><p> The Self Destruction of the Ultimate Warrior only happened because Warrior flat out refused to be involved and has bad mouthed the company and employees for years. He made him self look like a lunatic with his nonsensical blogs, his insane political standings and beliefs. I'm not saying Vince and company are completely free of blame, but it's not like he was the easiest guy to work with or even a nice guy for most of his career/life. Sting, who never really bad mouths anyone, said in his shoot interview that when they split the Blade Runners, he was so glad to be away from him. It wasn't until later that they buried the hatchet. </p><p> </p><p> Before Warrior even agreed to be in WWE2K14, they started acknowledging his place in the company's history and considered him a legend. They tried to make peace far earlier than he did.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Well put, couldnt say it any better myself.</p>
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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="bigtplaystew" data-cite="bigtplaystew" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I've just been reading lots of blogs and reports about all the nice things WWE is doing after his death with the word "classy" in it. That's why I put it in quotes. It pisses me off as a longtime fan of the character the way they treated him over the years. Actually, they treated him like crap up to and including his very last appearance on WWE tv.<p> </p><p> Linda took a shot at him AT HIS INDUCTION SPEECH.</p><p> </p><p> Are they<em> wrong </em>to honor the man? Not in any way, shape, or form. But do I see the company or especially Vince as "classy"? Not even a little bit.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> So does this just ignore everything that he has done to cause reactions like that? An entire DVD destroying him probably wasn't justified, but they had more than enough reason to not feel good about him due to things that he has said and did himself.</p><p> </p><p> Let's not act like Warrior was a saint and it wasn't a two way street</p>
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While trying to go to sleep I came up with my dream feud/ Cesaro vs Swagger vs Barrett with Heyman, Colter, and Regal managing one of them each. The matches would be fantastic, the three managers going against each other on the mic would be magic, and there's so many combinations for them. Plus all three of them would have a fanbase. Cesaro has those who are impressed with his skills, Swagger has the people who like to chant "We The People" and Barrett has the fans who like him being a dick to everyone else.
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Guest codey
<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Rickymex" data-cite="Rickymex" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>While trying to go to sleep I came up with my dream feud/ Cesaro vs Swagger vs Barrett with Heyman, Colter, and Regal managing one of them each. The matches would be fantastic, the three managers going against each other on the mic would be magic, and there's so many combinations for them. Plus all three of them would have a fanbase. Cesaro has those who are impressed with his skills, Swagger has the people who like to chant "We The People" and Barrett has the fans who like him being a dick to everyone else.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Anything to get Barrett some spotlight. They have him working as a heel, but he looks like he's having so much in the ring that you can't help but get behind him. Plus, he's getting the legit, non-cheap type of wins that Cesaro does, which will get him very over.</p>
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<p>Ya i wasn't looking for some dumb fight. The WWE spent a long time ripping Warrior a new one. I never claimed Warrior was some innocent, soft spoken victim in all of this. I don't even know where some of that stuff has come from. I guess some people insist on finding arguments where there is none so they bring up points that weren't made and fight them as if they were.</p><p> </p><p>

I will say that if any of you have seen "The Self Destruction of The Ultimate Warrior" the words "classy" and"WWE" shouldn't be used in the same sentence regarding this situation. That was a despicable piece of work. Of course Warrior wasn't the pillar of dignity in all of this but no one's really ever said this guy was the consummate gentleman either. Couple that DVD with how they were taking thinly veiled shots at him right up until and including his induction speech... I really don't think WWE has handled themselves with much "class" regarding Ultimate Warrior until the day after he died. Too little too late from a lifetime fan of the guy. All I'm trying to say. Not trying to create an argument.</p>

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<p>Am I the only one who's extremely excited (yet also somewhat fearful) to see what WWE will be doing with Sting?</p><p> </p><p>

I hope he gets a high-profile match at WrestleMania next year, even though Undertaker is likely out of the picture. I used to think that it was really cool that he was the only big guy to refuse the lure of McMahon; but nowadays, I just think th at he deserves at least a small run in the biggest wrestling company there is before retiring.</p>

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<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Hive" data-cite="Hive" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Am I the only one who's extremely excited (yet also somewhat fearful) to see what WWE will be doing with Sting?<p> </p><p> I hope he gets a high-profile match at WrestleMania next year, even though Undertaker is likely out of the picture. I used to think that it was really cool that he was the only big guy to refuse the lure of McMahon; but nowadays, I just think th at he deserves at least a small run in the biggest wrestling company there is before retiring.</p></div></blockquote><p> Has there been any <strong>official</strong> word that he has signed? I've seen people talking but haven't seen a dead cert confirmation from either him or the WWE.</p><p> </p><p> Although, if it's true, then I'm also super excited. Sting was my idol as kid, and even though he isn't getting any younger, I'd love to see a small run in the WWE.</p>
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