Official NFL Discussion Thread

[PeterHilton]

I'm sorry I don't share your logic of *there athletes they can't be nice*

 

I feel the same way about a random person on the street if they do the same stuff. I don't give anyone anything special because they are a PRO. If anything they ones in the spotlight should be more so held responsible for what they do. Sorry if you think I'm wrong, but that's your opinion.

 

I don't think you're wrong. I think you're kidding yourself.

 

We've built a society where gifted athletes are incredibly privileged and entitled.

 

They're scouted in middle school, recruited in high school, treated lie gods in college, and then given millions of dollars in the pros. And all the while no one at any time rewards them for being a "good person."

 

School officials cheat to get them good grades and lie to allow them to attend 'private academies.' Women of all ages throw themselves at them for the right to be taken care of for the rest of their lives (and those same women continue to throw themselves at pro jocks even knowing that they're married..even after there have been 'charges' in the past). Sponsors, coaches, and the press rush to get their attention...

 

Seriously, unless you're hopelessly optimistic there's just no reason to think these guys are going to be well behaved after living a life like that. The truly nice guys (the ones who don't cheat on their wives, don't cheat in school, don't take money from boosters) in professional sports are the exception, not the rule.

[moon_lit_tears]

I don't think you're wrong. I think you're kidding yourself.

 

We've built a society where gifted athletes are incredibly privileged and entitled.

 

They're scouted in middle school, recruited in high school, treated lie gods in college, and then given millions of dollars in the pros. And all the while no one at any time rewards them for being a "good person."

 

School officials cheat to get them good grades and lie to allow them to attend 'private academies.' Women of all ages throw themselves at them for the right to be taken care of for the rest of their lives. Sponsors, coaches, and the press rush to get their attention...

 

Seriously, unless you're hopelessly optimistic there's just no reason to think these guys are going to be well behaved after living a life like that. The truly nice guys in professional sports are the exception, not the rule.

 

I'm not kidding myself. I just don't see why it's *oh there pros lets not push it*. Not saying it happens all the time, but it's there.

 

I'm not taking what they do in the game to what they do out of it. I get the spirit they need IN GAME. Football players above most because without the drive you're not going to do good. I have no problem with that. Hockey players fight. Go for it. It's part of the game, but if the same dude went and tackled a woman and beat her with a hockey stick. I'm not gonna say oh they built his ego so it's ok.

 

See what I mean?

[PeterHilton]

As an athlete, there's a difference from being mean on the field/court/whatever and then presenting yourself appropriately otherwise. The fact is, a highly successful athlete IS going to be a role model, whether they want to or not. You're the all-pro, starting QB for the Denver Broncos? Guess what: a bunch of young kids in Colorado freakin' adore you.

 

 

Meh..that's not really the athlete's responsibility, though.

 

it's fine to adore someone for what they do on the field. You just have to know not to look to them for anything else

 

Or to flip it on it's head: let's look at Tim Tebow. Fantastic guy. Fantastic human being. If he's not a legit NFL QB within 3 seasons, he's a bust.

 

And no one in the NFL is going to save him because he's a saint.

[PeterHilton]

I'm not kidding myself. I just don't see why it's *oh there pros lets not push it*. Not saying it happens all the time, but it's there.

 

I'm not taking what they do in the game to what they do out of it. I get the spirit they need IN GAME. Football players above most because without the drive you're not going to do good. I have no problem with that. Hockey players fight. Go for it. It's part of the game, but if the same dude went and tackled a woman and beat her with a hockey stick. I'm not gonna say oh they built his ego so it's ok.

 

See what I mean?

 

Yes, but you're holding them to higher standard then that when you say you're 'shocked' by their behavior or that Ben should've been banned for what he did in the club even though no charges were filed.

 

They're athletes. That's all. I don't see them as deserving any kind of special treatment or expectations because they're in the public eye.

[moon_lit_tears]

Yes, but you're holding them to higher standard then that when you say you're 'shocked' by their behavior or that Ben should've been banned for what he did in the club even though no charges were filed.

 

They're athletes. That's all. I don't see them as deserving any kind of special treatment or expectations because they're in the public eye.

 

 

See you don't know me IRL (not saying that to sound snobby either)

But I am a huge believer in punishing folks who do stuff like this.

 

Heck In my neighborhood we had a guy try to snatch a woman walking into her front door. I thought they should have castrated him on the spot. Even though she didn't file charges.

 

I'm holding them to higher standards to a point BECAUSE they ARE in the spot light. You say you won't let you kids look at them as role models, but I'm sorry to say that most kids look to celebs as role models. Athletes, actors, actresses, singers, and the like. It happens.

 

I

[PeterHilton]

I'm holding them to higher standards to a point BECAUSE they ARE in the spot light. You say you won't let you kids look at them as role models, but I'm sorry to say that most kids look to celebs as role models. Athletes, actors, actresses, singers, and the like. It happens.

 

 

That's society's fault, not the athletes.

 

And celebrities, actors, singers, and politicians are probably 100 times worse. So where would you like to start?

[moon_lit_tears]

That's society's fault, not the athletes.

 

And celebrities, actors, singers, and politicians are probably 100 times worse. So where would you like to start?

 

Personally I'd like to start by hitting Chris Brown in the face with a shovel, but I'm not that type of person.

 

Anyway sorry for derailing the thread. I would really enjoy this conversation with you, but don't need Mr Ryland yelling at me for not keeping the thread ontopic.

 

So if you really want my opinions I'll give them to you via PM. I'll warn you now I can be harsh and cruel.

[GatorBait19]

So the big argument with the new 18 game schedule is that it will shorten a career by at least a year.

 

Then someone I was talking to today brought up a good point. What if a player who would have played 9 years, only played 8, would he that really cut his career down?

 

I came back with, it's not the players caring about playing less games, it's the less years they would play that they are complaining about. Same games you can put up the same numbers. Less years means less money.

[GatorBait19]

Personally I'd like to start by hitting Chris Brown in the face with a shovel, but I'm not that type of person.

 

Anyway sorry for derailing the thread. I would really enjoy this conversation with you, but don't need Mr Ryland yelling at me for not keeping the thread ontopic.

 

So if you really want my opinions I'll give them to you via PM. I'll warn you now I can be harsh and cruel.

 

Very harsh and cruel, she has whips Peter!

[moon_lit_tears]

Very harsh and cruel, she has whips Peter!

 

Geez whip a guy once and your branded for life. Even if you did ask for it.

[PoisonedSuperman]

So the big argument with the new 18 game schedule is that it will shorten a career by at least a year.

 

Then someone I was talking to today brought up a good point. What if a player who would have played 9 years, only played 8, would he that really cut his career down?

 

I came back with, it's not the players caring about playing less games, it's the less years they would play that they are complaining about. Same games you can put up the same numbers. Less years means less money.

 

More games = more game checks = more money.

[GatorBait19]

More games = more game checks = more money.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=fleming/100930&sportCat=nfl

 

funny read.

 

Also poisoned, more games= more games checks= same amount of money they would have earned with 16 games.

 

You are right that will see an increase in money when it comes to the split of rev. they share with owners, but if the owners are able to convince them to drop their current % they take it could equal all together the same amount of money they get now. So it's kind of like here is your paycheck (for a player like Brady who just signed a contract extension). "Wait this is only 1,000 more than my paychecks from last year." owner says "You're right, but also remember you have two extra games to play."

 

Also if that's what it was really about more money per season then players wouldn't be so against this. When Hines Ward comes out and says you will probably never see another 10 year vet (outside of a kicker) it's looks pretty bad. Plus players have other options, you don't think players wont go to the UFL to earn money. The only reason the NFL is the top dog is because the players who are playing the sport. If they all moved to the UFL 99.9% of the fans would follow them.

[GatorBait19]

Geez whip a guy once and your branded for life. Even if you did ask for it.

 

didn't say I didn't like it

[moon_lit_tears]

didn't say I didn't like it

 

Well I took the beating this past Sunday.

[GatorBait19]

Well I took the beating this past Sunday.

 

lol you lost by like 3

[moon_lit_tears]

lol you lost by like 3

 

 

I wasn't talking about the game.

[GatorBait19]

I wasn't talking about the game.

 

Sorry I was drunk

[moon_lit_tears]

Sorry I was drunk

 

 

Well in that case lets head to the store to buy some more.

[GatorBait19]

Well in that case lets head to the store to buy some more.

 

okay

[GatorBait19]

Congrats to the Rams.

[Stennick]

Moss was just traded to the Vikings for a third round pick.

 

This gives the Patriots two picks in each of the first four rounds of the draft.

 

A lot of people are making a big deal about this trade and on one level it will affect their team as in Welker will be getting a lot more double coverage without Moss' deep threat.

 

That being said Randy is not the same dominant receiver he was in 08 and even to a degree in 09. I truly believe he's lost a lot of that speed and he won't be the shot in the arm people think he will for the Vikings.

[NoNeck]

I don't buy into the "this trade ruins Wes Welker's value" school of thought that has been so prevalent on the ESPN message boards. Moss or no, a guy doesn't catch one hundred balls for two or three years running and just sneak up on defenses. They know all about him and have been trying to stop him just the same.

 

And while Brandon Tate may not have the pedigree (or the HOF numbers that Randy has) he can run streaks, fades, and posts with anyone, which is the real reason Welker can come free underneath, clear out routes. That's not going to change minus Moss.

 

It means more balance, more of the Gronkowski/Hernandez double tight and YY wing set, and more touches for Tate and Edelman.

 

Remember, this is a team that won the bowl with Troy Brown, Deion Branch, and David Patten. Not exactly the big three, right?

 

But, as a fan, it's sad to see it end this way. I bought that he was "changed" and, as it turns out, he's still the same 'me first' diva that he was in Minnesota and Oakland.

 

Does anyone else find it ironic that source of his crabbiness with the Patriots was not having a new contract and the Vikiings have already said that they'll talk to him about an extension after the season is over?

[The Final Countdown]

I agree that Moss probably won't have the impact some people seem to expect. I've read several posts elsewhere from people who think this move will put the Vikings in the Super Bowl, and I just don't see that happening.

 

But, being the selfish jerk that I am, I am focusing on how this impacts me. As someone who drafted Tom Brady in the 3rd round of my fantasy draft, I'm worried about the effect this will have on my fantasy team.

[MattitudeV2]

I agree that Moss probably won't have the impact some people seem to expect. I've read several posts elsewhere from people who think this move will put the Vikings in the Super Bowl, and I just don't see that happening.

 

But, being the selfish jerk that I am, I am focusing on how this impacts me. As someone who drafted Tom Brady in the 3rd round of my fantasy draft, I'm worried about the effect this will have on my fantasy team.

 

It won't effect your fantasy team Brady will throw more touchdowns to Welker, Tate,Woodhead, Green-Ellis and so on.

[PeterHilton]

He's definitely lost a step, which is why he's tradeable.

 

NE's offense doesn't "need" a big target but it ran at an incredibly high level when Moss was at his best.

 

The worst part of this - for Moss - is that he did EVERYTHING a WR could do that first season in NE, helped that offense break all kinds of records, as one of the big reasons they went 16-0 in the regular season, caught what should have been the game winning TD in a Super Bowl to cap a 19-0 season ( a perfect milestone for his HOF career) and then it all goes away on that wacky Eli Manning drive to give the Giants the win.

 

Moss will probably never win a SB and now NE looks like they'll be reloading for next year and beyond