Official MLB Discussion Thread

[Stennick]

With Haren off the market we need to trade for Oswalt but I'm not giving up Miller for him.

[BHK1978]

Roy Oswalt has agreed to be traded to the Phillies. Great trade for the Phils in my opinion, now if they can get their hitting going, I think they have a chance of going back to the World Series.

 

Also, Buck Showalter is going to be the new manager of Baltimore. You know I always thought Buck was a good manager and I was not happy when the Yankees fired him. All though it did bring Joe Torre to the Yankees so I guess it turned out to be all right.

 

I just felt that Buck was screwed out of a chance at a World Series title back in the strike season and then the year after he is fired (and Donny Baseball retires), the Yanks went on to win the World Series.

 

I hope Buck does good for Baltimore (obviously I do not want to see him do great because the Yankees are in the same division).

[GatorBait19]

Roy Oswalt has agreed to be traded to the Phillies. Great trade for the Phils in my opinion, now if they can get their hitting going, I think they have a chance of going back to the World Series.

 

Also, Buck Showalter is going to be the new manager of Baltimore. You know I always thought Buck was a good manager and I was not happy when the Yankees fired him. All though it did bring Joe Torre to the Yankees so I guess it turned out to be all right.

 

I just felt that Buck was screwed out of a chance at a World Series title back in the strike season and then the year after he is fired (and Donny Baseball retires), the Yanks went on to win the World Series.

 

I hope Buck does good for Baltimore (obviously I do not want to see him do great because the Yankees are in the same division).

 

you know the phil's got to be kicking themselves for trading Lee earlier this season. They wouldn't have had to trade for Roy and they would have gotten picks for Lee if he did decide to leave. Oh well I hope Roy has fun in Philly.

[BHK1978]

The rich get richer! Not that I will complain!

[Stennick]

Berkman isn't all that grand this year. He's hitting .245 with 13 homers so although the guy is dangerous their taking on 14 million for a .245 hitter and his last two seasons he missed the 30 HR mark. Maybe a change of pace may do him some good but I really think as the case with Oswalt he's a really expensive mediocre player.

 

Houston with Oswalt and Berkman gone have officially left their Killer B's legacy behind. That team was highly competitive for a few years there. I remember in 04 Beltran was just KILLING us (St. Louis). Oswalt, Pettite, Clemons, Way Ro, Lidge this team was STACKED.

 

Now those guys have either fallen of (Beltran, Berkman) or retired (Clemons). I hope Houston is being smart when taking these prospects on as both NYC and Philly have good farm clubs and lots of potential there.

[Stennick]

Cards trade Ryan Ludwick to the Padres for Jake Westbrook. With guys like Jon Jay, Allen Craig, etc just sitting in development meanwhile Luddy was due nearly six million next year with Jon putting up similar numbers pound for pound.

 

With Lohse out and frankly not worth even mentioning since he signed that over bloated, overrated contract and Penny proving to be as fragile as I feared when we picked him up we need somebody that can go out there and get the job done. Wainwright, Carp and Jamie are killing it.

 

The only concern I have is that its been our offense that has kept us from being dominant this year. Luddy was hurt, Pujols is only batting .300, Holiday just started getting hot, Rasmus is streaky at best, Ryan went from .300 to .190. Freese started out well but he's been on the D/L.

 

Really you look all across the board and there isn't one big piece of the offense that is even performing on par let alone above it. As much as starting pitching is needed especially in the playoffs I don't see our offense making it out of the first round.

[BHK1978]

Bobby Thompson the man who hit The Shot Heard 'Round The World has passed away he was 86.

[GatorBait19]

Surprised this went without word with all the great rookie Pitchers this year, But Hellickson of the Rays went 3-0 with a 2.09 ERA while with the Rays and only missed going 4-0 because of a blown lead in the 8th last night.

 

Also I don't get how Strasburg can call out Harper for taking so long to sign?

[Remianen]

Berkman isn't all that grand this year. He's hitting .245 with 13 homers so although the guy is dangerous their taking on 14 million for a .245 hitter and his last two seasons he missed the 30 HR mark. Maybe a change of pace may do him some good but I really think as the case with Oswalt he's a really expensive mediocre player.

 

Gee, I wonder how that Swisher kid is doin'.

 

Do I really have to tell you what the difference is between playing on a team with an outside shot at making the playoffs and a team heavily favored to win it all? Berkman doesn't have to hit .350 with 55 HRs to contribute to this team. This aint the Astros, y0. We don't need him to carry us like the Astros did. He can just chill and let the game come to him.

 

And we're not sweatin' Cliff Lee. We'll get him after the season. Check out the 2011 rotation:

 

Sabathia

Lee

Burnett

Hughes

Webb (on the cheap! otherwise, Moseley)

 

Nice to have both the cash to go out and get exceptional talent and a fertile farm system in case the talent isn't out there. Rays have one but not the other, which makes them more dangerous than they otherwise would be.

[BHK1978]

<p>Did anyone else see the brawl between Washington and Florida? </p><p> </p><p>

It was awesome, I loved it when Sanchez clothes-lined that punk Nyjer Morgan.</p><p> </p><p>

Also, it looks like Stephen Strasburg will need Tommy John surgery. Which is a shame, because I think he may be the cornestone of that team. However, now that he will have TJ surgery who knows how good he will be when he comes back. To me if he comes back and is not that good, it will be a major blow to baseball in Washington.</p>

[Stennick]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Remianen" data-cite="Remianen" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26724" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Gee, I wonder how that Swisher kid is doin'.<p> Do I really have to tell you what the difference is between playing on a team with an outside shot at making the playoffs and a team heavily favored to win it all? Berkman doesn't have to hit .350 with 55 HRs to contribute to this team. This aint the Astros, y0. We don't need him to carry us like the Astros did. He can just chill and let the game come to him.</p><p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> So Berkman was hitting .245 when he came to the Yankees and since becoming a Yankee (13) games he's hitting .200. Hows that "letting the game come to you" strategy working out for him? </p><p> </p><p> You obviously don't have to tell me what its like to be on a winning club. Guys like Will Clark, Larry Walker, Woody Williams, Jeff Suppan, Ryan Franklin, Joel Pinero, Julio Lugo and COUNTLESS others have enjoyed either revitalized success in a Cards uniform or success for the first and only time in our uniform partly because we're always in the playoffs and partly because of our staff being able to pick out the guys that work well with the team.</p><p> </p><p> My point was 14 million for a guy that is batting .200 is just a waste of money. And now they got the guy DHing. Do I have to tell you what the purpose of the DH is? Its not to hit .200 thats for sure.</p><p> </p><p> Let me guess you'll come back with "the seasons isn't over he'll improve on those numbers" even though you just stated earlier that just by being in the Yanks uniform he would play better when he's hitting 45 points BELOW what he was hitting before he got into that uniform. </p><p> </p><p> Or you'll come back with "he was hurt" and while he was hurt he didn't play. It still had nothing to do with his .200 average. Even IF the guy gets back up to .245 in a Yank's uniform I bet there are four guys on that bench with a higher average that could have been used in that slot. </p><p> </p><p> Or you'll come back with "who cares we got the money to waste on a guy like that". Which is correct but your point was he would play better in your uniform than he did in Houston due to not needing to be THE MAN, and clearly your thinking wasn't correct unless of course you call a D.H hitting .200 and zero home runs in 40+ at bats a solid D.H hitter.</p><p> </p><p> I guess maybe you DO need to explain baseball to me because here I was thinking spending 14 million on a guy that showed no signs of being his former self wasn't a smart move when their were better and less expensive options at the deadline (see Ryan Ludwick, cheaper option, more productive). </p><p> </p><p> But hey atleast you SOUNDED like you knew what you were talking about thats half the battle right?</p>

[BHK1978]

I agree with Stennick, your DH has to be more productive than .239. I know he was hurt and I hope he can do better (That double he hit last night was sweet). However, having a DH hit that low is just horrible. I mean they are basically just a professional hitter and so therefore they should you know...hit.

[GatorBait19]

I agree with Stennick, your DH has to be more productive than .239. I know he was hurt and I hope he can do better (That double he hit last night was sweet). However, having a DH hit that low is just horrible. I mean they are basically just a professional hitter and so therefore they should you know...hit.

 

The DH is the exact opposite of a pitcher in the NL. NL a pitcher is considered a free out. In the AL the DH is cosidered an extra run. That's how GM's have always looked at DH's. That's why you don't see a speedy person who can't hit play that position. A good DH can hit .280 with 20 HR's and 90 RBI. A great one goes out and does .300, 30 HR, and 100RBI and they don't play Defense, if they can then plus.

 

Berkman is a great hitter, his career stats prove that. In saying that he is having an offseason and like in the past the Yankees took him not caring, but the Yanks can do that and not care.

[BHK1978]

Yes they can afford to not have him hit and they probably will not miss a beat. I would just rather have a more productive player in at DH. I think Marcus Thames is doing a great job right now. But if for some reason they were looking for someone else to DH, I would rather have Austin Kearns or Francisco Cervelli do the job over Lance.

[Stennick]

There is a difference between being a great hitter and you USED to be a great hitter. It happens all the time, look at Ortiz, look at Man Ram, etc and the list goes on. Guys were great hitters and eventually they fall off.

 

Berkman will be 35, he's not nearly as young as he used to be. Even last year he posted a 274 average which was the lowest he had hit EVER in his entire full season career. he's got a 290 something career average so he hit about 25 points BELOW his career average and 40 points off of what he hit the year before.

 

Even if you combine last year he's hitting 259. Berkman was a guy that had some very good years during the Stro's playoff run and he's been a great 300 hitter but looking at his stats last year and this year its not a case of an "off" year when this is the second year you've hit well below you're career average

 

Now obviously the Yankee's have the money they can do whatever they want. My argument was and still is that this was a bad move on the Yankees who were taking a 14 million dollar gamble on a guy that was clearly on the downtrend when there were several options out there that were cheaper and more effective.

 

You can't call it an off year when in your last TWO years you're hitting .259 which is 37 points below your career average all the while pushing 35. Maybe it was the case of the talent not being there, maybe it was a case of nagging injuries catching up with the guy but my entire point was and is that this was a 14 million dollar donation to the Astros organization and that he's going to offer them nothing that someone on their bench couldn't have offered for 14 million less.

[GatorBait19]

There is a difference between being a great hitter and you USED to be a great hitter. It happens all the time, look at Ortiz, look at Man Ram, etc and the list goes on. Guys were great hitters and eventually they fall off.

 

Berkman will be 35, he's not nearly as young as he used to be. Even last year he posted a 274 average which was the lowest he had hit EVER in his entire full season career. he's got a 290 something career average so he hit about 25 points BELOW his career average and 40 points off of what he hit the year before.

 

Even if you combine last year he's hitting 259. Berkman was a guy that had some very good years during the Stro's playoff run and he's been a great 300 hitter but looking at his stats last year and this year its not a case of an "off" year when this is the second year you've hit well below you're career average

 

Now obviously the Yankee's have the money they can do whatever they want. My argument was and still is that this was a bad move on the Yankees who were taking a 14 million dollar gamble on a guy that was clearly on the downtrend when there were several options out there that were cheaper and more effective.

 

You can't call it an off year when in your last TWO years you're hitting .259 which is 37 points below your career average all the while pushing 35. Maybe it was the case of the talent not being there, maybe it was a case of nagging injuries catching up with the guy but my entire point was and is that this was a 14 million dollar donation to the Astros organization and that he's going to offer them nothing that someone on their bench couldn't have offered for 14 million less.

 

Didn't mean to strike a bad note, if I did then I am sorry. Now while Berkman did hit .274 last year he also jacked 25 HR with 80 RBI in only 140 games and 460 AB which comes to about 3.2 AB a game, a HR every 18.4 AB, and a RBI every 5.1 AB. still while walking as much as he Strikeouts. That's not that bad of a year for most people and even Berkman who was 34 at the time with only Carlos Lee as his back-up .

 

I think we have to remember one thing about the Yanks and it kind of helps Remi case ( me helping Remi in an arguement, how the world changes lol)

 

Berkman is a typical Yankee player, he will have down years and his avg might suck, but he is a .400 OBP guy who can play in the field as well and get on base with walks. The Yanks are known for their ability to work the count and work pitchers. Berkman does that. If Berkman SO 100 times a year, you better bet your butt he is getting walked just as much, which is what the Yanks like about him.

 

Now off year yes, two in a row no. Berkman had a down year last year in the AVG department and a horrible one this year. Dumb move....... probably, but did they really give up a bunch for a player that will net them a draft pick this year come free agent time?

 

This is a tough arguement for both sides. The best way to handle this one is wait and see what Berkman does the rest of the season and playoffs. Last point Berkman's salary may be 14 million, but the Yanks are only paying a certain amount of that as long as the Astro who wanted him gone didn't take some just to make him more desirable to teams. Also he has a 2 million dollar buy-out, so he is just a rent a player.

[BHK1978]

What the heck is going on with the Padres? I know they won today but they went into one hell of a tailspin over the last week or so.

[Stennick]

Same thing with the Braves, both teams sort of spiraled out of control. Its a shame the Braves collapsed so quickly as the Phillies just got their "A" team back so now was not the time for the Braves to be losing games.

 

Should be an interesting wild card in the NL with the Braves and the Phillies battling for first and the other a wild card and the same in the west with the Padres and Giants. The only safe bet at this point are the Reds. Also with these other teams having to fight down to the wire to get in, the Reds may be able to rest some of their starting pitching down the stretch and it might give them an edge over a likely tired rotation coming out of the east or west. Now it might not mean anything and they might still get crushed in the first round, or it might get them and "upset". Although looking at their pitching staff I think the Reds are more contender than pretender as far as the long term goes (several seasons of playoffs, etc.)

[BHK1978]

Same thing with the Braves, both teams sort of spiraled out of control. Its a shame the Braves collapsed so quickly as the Phillies just got their "A" team back so now was not the time for the Braves to be losing games.

 

Should be an interesting wild card in the NL with the Braves and the Phillies battling for first and the other a wild card and the same in the west with the Padres and Giants. The only safe bet at this point are the Reds. Also with these other teams having to fight down to the wire to get in, the Reds may be able to rest some of their starting pitching down the stretch and it might give them an edge over a likely tired rotation coming out of the east or west. Now it might not mean anything and they might still get crushed in the first round, or it might get them and "upset". Although looking at their pitching staff I think the Reds are more contender than pretender as far as the long term goes (several seasons of playoffs, etc.)

 

Well my mom will be happy with the Reds winning as they are her favorite team. The AL Wild Card should be pretty interesting as well, because which ever team wins the AL East will probably get homefield throughout. The other team will probably end up as the wild card and it will be road games for them.

 

And that is part of the reason why I hate the wild card. The Yankees could end up with the second best record in the American League (heck maybe in the entire MLB) but if they get the wild card they could end up playing on the road against a team that has more losses than they do. The same goes for the Devil Rays or any team that is put in that position.

[Stennick]

That is true but the other alternative is that they don't get in at all. Ya know, you have to reward the division winners and just them getting in is a reward. It sucks I agree but I barely like having more than two teams in the playoffs the way it is so I have pretty old school thoughts.

[BHK1978]

That is true but the other alternative is that they don't get in at all. Ya know, you have to reward the division winners and just them getting in is a reward. It sucks I agree but I barely like having more than two teams in the playoffs the way it is so I have pretty old school thoughts.

 

Oh I hate the Wild Card. Despite the fact that the Yankees were the first A.L. team to win it. I have always hated it, I know why it is there but that does not mean I have to like it.

 

My main problem with it is, a good portion of the time hot teams will win the Wild Card and said hottness will carry over to the playoffs. Therefore, you could end up with a wild card team that is just over .500, and they could end up getting to and winning the World Series. And yes I know the same can be said of weak division winners as well. To me the Wild Card seems to negate the regular season to a certain extent.

 

Like in 2003 and 2004. Nobody can tell me the Marlins and Red Sox were the best team in Baseball those years (And I am not a bitter Yankees fan, I truly believe that neither team was the best in the year that they won.). They both got hot at the right time, and other better teams got cold at the same time. Those are the breaks I guess.

 

One more thing I will admit to being bitter about the 2001 World Series. That was just bull crap losing to the Diamondbacks whose entire team seemed to be made up of just two pitchers.

[Stennick]

Like in 2003 and 2004. Nobody can tell me the Marlins and Red Sox were the best team in Baseball those years (And I am not a bitter Yankees fan, I truly believe that neither team was the best in the year that they won.). They both got hot at the right time, and other better teams got cold at the same time. Those are the breaks I guess.

 

You're right neither of you were WE were. Or we were supposed to be, the Sox proved they had the better team I guess. We won like a 104 games, we had the best team we've had in a lifetime. Pujols, Edmonds, Rolen, Larry Walker, Carp, Yadi, Renteria, Matt Morris, Woody Williams, Jeff Suppan (when those guys were good), Izzy, Ray King, Steve Kline (all sub 2.5 ERA's).

 

Ugh what a fun/horrible year 2004 was. Battling the Astros in one of the best playoff series' I've ever seen just to get swept by the Sox.

[GatorBait19]

I just saw Pete Roses speech after getting roast and I think this man has finally seen where he screwed up. I don't know if Pete will ever be let back into baseball, but I think it's about time it is strongly considered.

[BHK1978]

I just saw Pete Roses speech after getting roast and I think this man has finally seen where he screwed up. I don't know if Pete will ever be let back into baseball, but I think it's about time it is strongly considered.

 

Though call, I mean I know that we talked about this before in this thread (I think it was this thread). He belongs in there, and there is no doubt about it. I am just not sure they will lift his ban. And if they do, what about Joe Jackson?

[GatorBait19]

Though call, I mean I know that we talked about this before in this thread (I think it was this thread). He belongs in there, and there is no doubt about it. I am just not sure they will lift his ban. And if they do, what about Joe Jackson?

 

we talked about Joe being let back in and you threw Pete into it. I have always though joe should be let in.