cappyboy Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="randomfreeze" data-cite="randomfreeze" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="31738" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> </p><p> One of the first full stories I read was <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Bone-Complete-Cartoon-Epic-One/dp/188896314X/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1310791878&sr=1-1" rel="external nofollow">Bone</a>. It's been described as a Lord of the Rings for kids, but I still enjoyed it and you can read 1300 pages of stories for under $25.</p><p> </p><p> <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Fables-Vol-1-Legends-Exile/dp/1563899426/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1310792991&sr=1-1" rel="external nofollow">Fables</a> is another very long series (100+ issues) and still ongoing. It's not hard to find your place as you can walk into any book stores and grab the first graphic novel. I suggest you nab all these comic purchases at Amazon though, if you end up buy large quantities in books it will save you in the long run.</p><p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Strikes me interesting you've mentioned these two back to back. Bone is one of those I've been meaning to pick up for years going back to when I first discovered the Essential and Showcase lines. The reason I haven't so far is bad timing. Either it has been just outside my comic budget at the moment or it's been mid to late fall when I've seen it and I've been pinching my pennies to focus on Christmas shopping. Definitely want to correct that one of these days though.</p><p> </p><p> As for Fables, I found that to be a prime example of attitude ruining what could have been a really good book. I loved the premise of the fairy tale characters coming into the real world and having to deal with it on its terms. But I couldn't read very far without storming off in disgust. It struck me like it was trying too hard to be adult for the sake of being adult. I found the characters hard, cynical and utterly unlikeable. If they'd done the same themes with a lighter, campier sort of soap opera vibe, I might be right there with you. The potential to be really special was certainly there and in my mind, they wasted it. </p><p> </p><p> In any event, I doubt two titles that are such polar opposites to me in terms of appeal will be mentioned in such close proximity at any other point in this thread.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brashleyholland Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Jaysin" data-cite="Jaysin" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="31738" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> </p><p> and I'm one of the few people to love the Clone Saga in Spider-Man <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I'm with ya. I remember picking up a Spidey comic and seeing this Ben Riley character and thinking "Say whaaaat??!?". I tried to grab as many of the following issues as I could, but I was at that age where I was too old to get away with being a kid reading comics, but too young to not care what people thought of my massive geekery. I think I've caught up with most of it over the years, but it's probably time to do the whole thing from start to finish. </p><p> </p><p> As for other stuff, I seriously cannot get enough of The Boys. Content wise there's probably not a whole lot of it that can be discussed on this forum, but if you're not easily offended and you like comic books, you need to check this out. Amazing concept, very well delivered. </p><p> </p><p> Speaking of 'not for kids' comics, Millar's 4-issue Nemesis was magnificently offensive and over the top, if you like that kind of thing. Really enjoyed Kick Ass, and Kick Ass 2 seems to be ticking along well, even if it is coming out at the grand old rate of one issue a decade.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="brashleyholland" data-cite="brashleyholland" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="31738" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'm with ya. I remember picking up a Spidey comic and seeing this Ben Riley character and thinking "Say whaaaat??!?". I tried to grab as many of the following issues as I could, but I was at that age where I was too old to get away with being a kid reading comics, but too young to not care what people thought of my massive geekery. I think I've caught up with most of it over the years, but it's probably time to do the whole thing from start to finish. <p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I have the first two trade collections of it. There's like 5 total I think?</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellboy2 Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 <p>i am a big fan of not so mainstream comics </p><p> </p><p> love the gore and shriek collection</p><p> </p><p> my friend Dahmer (might have a different title)</p><p> </p><p> Also love the Ghostworld comics and most things by Top Cow like The Agency and Midnight Nation</p><p> </p><p> 2000 AD and The Walking Dead are my most mainstream collections, growing a bit bored of Walking Dead at the moment but will get into it again i go through strange phases with it</p><p> </p><p> only superheroes i properly got into was Rising Stars</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hive Posted July 16, 2011 Share Posted July 16, 2011 <p>Getting all nostalgic about grand comics from my younger days, I was thinking... how much does the artistic rendering mean to you? Personally, they always meant a great deal to me. There were otherwise fine storylines that I simply couldn't appreciate as much as I probably should because I felt the drawings were sub-par. And likewise, I was far more forgiving if it was one of my favourite artists.</p><p> </p><p> Also, who are your favourite artists? I don't really know any artists post-90's, so I'm probably missing some great new talents... but my favourites back in the day were guys like Jim Lee (best ever!), Mark Bagley (a clear #2 when at his best, but his quality varied), Dan Jurgens, Todd McFarlane, John Byrne and Marc Silvestri. I absolutely loathed Sal Buscemi and thought his crappy drawings ruined Spectacular Spider-Man. Yuck.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappyboy Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Not a whit. In my mind the drawings have always been there to supplement the writing. Like picture books with text. This artist, that artist, the other artist. None of it matters to me. The artists and letterers and those guys have always been like the gaffers and best boys in movie credits. Kind of nice to know about for those few seconds I guess but nothing to get excited about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Todd McFarlane, Salvador Larroca, Erik Larsen(LOVE Savage Dragon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hive Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Jaysin" data-cite="Jaysin" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="31738" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Todd McFarlane, Salvador Larroca, Erik Larsen(LOVE Savage Dragon <3), and Alex Ross</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Meh, I always found Larsen to be a poor man's McFarlane. Though he did a kick ass Venom, I'll give him that.</p><p> </p><p> Btw, I have another comic recommendation (and of a slightly newer kind, even!): The entire run of The Exiles (106 issues in total or something like that). I have only read ~100 of them, but man did they rock. I would love to see a tv show based on this series some day (though copyrights could become an issue).</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Hive" data-cite="Hive" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="31738" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Meh, I always found Larsen to be a poor man's McFarlane. Though he did a kick ass Venom, I'll give him that.<p> </p><p> Btw, I have another comic recommendation (and of a slightly newer kind, even!): The entire run of The Exiles (106 issues in total or something like that). I have only read ~100 of them, but man did they rock. I would love to see a tv show based on this series some day (though copyrights could become an issue).</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I just love Savage Dragon A LOT, so that's how Larsen gets thrown in there. <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png"></p><p> </p><p> About to start the Exiles now</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Finished issue 1 of The Exiles...god I love it already. Especially Morph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomfreeze Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Strikes me interesting you've mentioned these two back to back. Bone is one of those I've been meaning to pick up for years going back to when I first discovered the Essential and Showcase lines. The reason I haven't so far is bad timing. Either it has been just outside my comic budget at the moment or it's been mid to late fall when I've seen it and I've been pinching my pennies to focus on Christmas shopping. Definitely want to correct that one of these days though. As for Fables, I found that to be a prime example of attitude ruining what could have been a really good book. I loved the premise of the fairy tale characters coming into the real world and having to deal with it on its terms. But I couldn't read very far without storming off in disgust. It struck me like it was trying too hard to be adult for the sake of being adult. I found the characters hard, cynical and utterly unlikeable. If they'd done the same themes with a lighter, campier sort of soap opera vibe, I might be right there with you. The potential to be really special was certainly there and in my mind, they wasted it. In any event, I doubt two titles that are such polar opposites to me in terms of appeal will be mentioned in such close proximity at any other point in this thread. Yeah, Bone and Fables are definitely at different ends of the content spectrum. I was trying to give a varied list. That's too bad you didn't enjoy Fables, at least you tried it though as I know a lot of people who won't read it because it's, "based off all those characters." I disagree with most of your grievances with it but one of the best thing about comics is there are so many you never have to read a series you don't like. There are tons of comic readers who refuse to stop buying a book even if they don't enjoy it anymore and that drives me crazy. Either they're a completist who has to own an entire run or they buy all of their favorite characters books and are surprised when some of the nine monthly Deadpool books are subpar. But I haven't heard many say bad things about Bone, so I hope you enjoy it when you get to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Random question. I just remembered a character that did a guest spot in a Ninja Turtles comic from back in the day. He was some weird animal and had a sword? I think he was a barbarian of sorts? Not really sure, its been awhile. *edit* Was thinking of Cerebus the Aardvark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappyboy Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 That's too bad you didn't enjoy Fables, at least you tried it though as I know a lot of people who won't read it because it's, "based off all those characters." I disagree with most of your grievances with it but one of the best thing about comics is there are so many you never have to read a series you don't like. You're definitely right about the range of material. That's one of the things I love about comicdom. When I was a kid, I piggybacked on what my older brother was reading and that would range from Sad Sack to superheroes. When I dabbled in the 90's, I did both TV crossovers like the Family Channel's version of Zorro and Ren Stimpy along with the heros. Last decade it was mostly TV spin-offs like The Powerpuff Girls and Scooby Doo because that's what I could find most easily. As for the Fables thing, I'm glad I sampled it too. The reason you say a lot of people won't bother was one of the things that got me to try it. I may have my comfort zones and be extremely conventional at times but I love dabbling in oddball stuff. I feel like it keeps me in balance. And Fables wasn't my first foray into fairy tale characters joining us in reality. I'd also been a big fan of the sitcom The Charmings back in the late 80's. So I knew the premise held the potential to be incredibly entertaining. Unfortunately for Fables, in-your-face attitude and I don't get along too well. But the cool thing is I found out on my own. The letdown would have been even more annoying if I'd waited for scores of misguided recommendations to come in before I learned that it wasn't a title for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Getting all nostalgic about grand comics from my younger days, I was thinking... how much does the artistic rendering mean to you? Personally, they always meant a great deal to me. There were otherwise fine storylines that I simply couldn't appreciate as much as I probably should because I felt the drawings were sub-par. And likewise, I was far more forgiving if it was one of my favourite artists. Also, who are your favourite artists? I don't really know any artists post-90's, so I'm probably missing some great new talents... but my favourites back in the day were guys like Jim Lee (best ever!), Mark Bagley (a clear #2 when at his best, but his quality varied), Dan Jurgens, Todd McFarlane, John Byrne and Marc Silvestri. I absolutely loathed Sal Buscemi and thought his crappy drawings ruined Spectacular Spider-Man. Yuck. Art makes a world of difference to me in something like comic books, since it's pretty much the core difference between a comic and a book. It's what I'm paying extra for in exchange for shorter stories and often weak prose. My favorite current artist is JH Williams III, who worked on Promethea with Alan Moore and has been doing work on Batwoman for DC. I'm also a big fan of David Mack, Jae Lee, Steve Epting, and there's probably a few more I'm forgetting. My favorites from the 90's included Mike Wieringo (RIP) and Mark Bagley, plus standards like Jim Lee. From the "old school" I always liked George Perez, Jim Steranko, Steve Ditko, and Wally Wood. Plus I'm sure there's a lot more I haven't remembered. Not a whit. In my mind the drawings have always been there to supplement the writing. Like picture books with text. This artist, that artist, the other artist. None of it matters to me. The artists and letterers and those guys have always been like the gaffers and best boys in movie credits. Kind of nice to know about for those few seconds I guess but nothing to get excited about. Wow, I just can't imagine thinking like this. Comics are not an illustrated plot delivery system (or at least, not only that). For that matter, neither are movies. They're told visually, in pictures. To say the pictures don't matter is just incomprehensible to me. Exiles was a really fun little comic, although the quality really dropped off after McKone (the penciler) and the original writer left and Chuck Austen was left handling the writing for awhile. Things pick up later when Paul Pelletier takes over as penciler. McKone also did the art for the first 12 issues of Avengers Academy, which has been one of the best books Marvel's been putting out for the past year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hive Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Jaysin" data-cite="Jaysin" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="31738" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Finished issue 1 of The Exiles...god I love it already. Especially Morph</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Yeah it's pure gold indeed. It's a chance to see people you don't often see (or who are dead) as well as well-known people in new surroundings.</p><p> </p><p> Speaking of artists, I forgot someone on my list... a guy that never really seemed to get much love: Alex Saviuk.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappyboy Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lazorbeak" data-cite="lazorbeak" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="31738" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> Wow, I just can't imagine thinking like this. Comics are not an illustrated plot delivery system (or at least, not only that). For that matter, neither are movies. They're told visually, in pictures. To say the pictures don't matter is just incomprehensible to me.</p><p> </p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Oh, the pictures matter. Like you said, it is a visual medium. And some of the stuff they do in the comics just wouldn't translate as well in dead text. But I've never seen a comic I felt was so poorly drawn it chased me away. So I don't care who did the drawing. I can't draw worth a lick so I don't feel it's my place to judge whether this guy or that guy or the other guy drew the world well or not. The worst comic artist any of you have ever seen and could name can draw millions of times better than I can. </p><p> </p><p> On the other hand, I have seen comics seemingly TOO well drawn. Especially since the change in centuries. That is to say the comics look like every panel was meant to be framed and hung on the wall. Spare me. These are the comics. Not the Guggenheim. Form should follow function. The artwork is there to tell and expand the story. The only readers who should be spending days on a single page are those who wish to follow in your footsteps and NEED to sweat the technique. If you make a comic that's so pretty I feel guilty turning the page, I'm not going to buy it. I'm there to escape into the character's world. To kill a few empty minutes or to cool down before bed at night. Not ponder every stroke and line of how you created said world. I can go to art galleries to do that. Sometimes for free no less. I don't need to spend a month's worth of my childhood allowance for each issue of over-stylized "brilliance".</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 20 issues into the Exiles Great read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackman Posted July 18, 2011 Author Share Posted July 18, 2011 Blackman, I get the feeling we move in vastly different hemispheres. Are you confusing Identity Crisis with Crisis on Infinite Earths, or some other book with the word "Crisis" in it? At least Hush has Jim Lee drawing all your favorite Bat-characters. I'm talking about THE Identity crisis mini series (2004)? http://www.comicvine.com/identity-crisis/49-18438/ Like I said, only heard good things about it. Never actually read it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazorbeak Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 I'm talking about THE Identity crisis mini series (2004)? http://www.comicvine.com/identity-crisis/49-18438/ Like I said, only heard good things about it. Never actually read it. Like I said, we must not talk to the same people. I thought it was plodding and unnecessary, and my LCS guy, who worked in the industry in the 90's and actually cared about some of the characters, thought it was awful. And it's not like we're the only ones who have ever thought that. Here's a quote from Jason Michelitch of Comics Alliance, from its list of worst comics of the decade: "Everything in Identity Crisis is designed as an excuse for adults who are secretly embarrassed by their love of superheroes. "Sure," it says, "We know superhero comics used to be all Biff Bam Pow, but here are very serious and adult reasons why they seemed that way, and all the serious and adult things that were going on behind the scenes. Serious. Adult." Read More: http://www.comicsalliance.com/2009/12/17/the-15-worst-comics-of-the-decade/#ixzz1SSeKiMZa I brought up other Crisis books because they have actual plots, not complicated explanations for why 40 year old comics for kids were actually cover stories for a group of amoral psychopaths, and are generally all better than Identity Crisis. So I don't feel like I'm being too negative, let me also take a moment to recommend Alan Moore's ABC comics. You've probably heard of League of Extraordinary Gentleman, but check out Top Ten, Moore's police procedural comic in a city where the entire population has super powers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Asaemon Posted July 19, 2011 Share Posted July 19, 2011 I read that i'm not the only one here reading the amazing The Walking Dead. I also like The Last Zombie, Crossed and 28 Days Later and similar comics. Besides the above i also like Lone Wolf and Cub, Samurai Executioner, Lady Snowblood, Path of the Assassin and Vagabond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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