How Do You Burn Out A Crowd? (Perfect Show Theory Discussion)

[Shadowsong]

Really confused after booking my most recent show, here were the results:

 

Opening match - Rated 74

Match - Rated 44

Match - Rated 60

Match - Rated 64

Minor Angle - Rated 59

Semi Main event - Rated 81

Main Event - Rated 89 - Burnt out crowd

 

Also had a few pre show matches, with the highest one being rated 61.

 

Where did I go wrong...? All my matches except for the opener, semi main and main event were average so how did I get a burnt out crowd? I don't understand.

[Jennie Bomb]

I think the best real life thing to help guide your thinking in terms of Perfect Show Theory is to look at how WWE utilizes Divas matches on PPV. Often, they will be the second or third match from the top, strategically designed to give the crowd a buffer between hot main event level matches to go to the bathroom or get refreshments and generally get a bit of a break. In this buffer capacity, the length is important - generally, they'd take up something in the range of ten minutes give or take, so that they give the crwod enough time to do their thing whilst not being long enough to kill the momentum of the event. This is the kind of thinking you need to utilise to manage your crowds.

[Shadowsong]

Except it doesn't work that way in practise. No matter what the rest of the card is like, if my semi main event scores a B or higher then I seem to end up with a burnt out crowd in my main event.

 

I've started playing with Perfect Show Theory turned off because it just doesn't make sense to me...

[liontamer]

I was directed to this post a few weeks ago and have been playing with my order some more. A few things I've noted to add to the discussion after a combined 140 shows with two promotions....

 

With my umbrella fed I run 2 hour shows with a rotating roster of 20-35. It's regional with shows in the 60s, sometimes low 70s. The Other is also regional, running mid 60s to upper 70s in mostly three hour shows.

 

I run very similar to this from Belton earlier in the post

 

C(working the crowd, a solid match to get the crowd pumped)

F(all out if the guys can handle it to bring the grade up, otherwise protect etc.)

D(work the crowd to warm them back up)

E(same as the F)

B(all out, get the crowd pumped for the main)

A(slow build between 2 workers with good psych)

 

If I have more matches, I basically extend out the formula. I like to mix it up in terms of slow build vs all out depending on who's going and my storyline. I have noted that if I do a semi main and main that both are slow build, I seem to need more angles between and it would look something like one of these

 

semi main slow build

Angle: brawl between semi main workers 4+ min

Optional angle: interview on the main (person cutting the promo on ent, and the subject overness, if I want to lower the hype angle, I also run it with a highly rated announcer to boost the chances it will lower the score of the hype). This is anywhere from 1-4 min, and usually is used if the next angle is short

Angle: hype video, anywhere from 1-4 min

Optional Angle: if there is still any chance the prior segments would be too high or out-rate the match itself, I do a 1-2 min segment that will rate poorly, often with mid card workers, Sometimes I do this before the semi main as well (or if I'm afraid of the semi-main outshining a main, I'll put a good angle in front of it)

Main slow build

 

 

As for before the semi main, it could just be my big roster (80 wrestlers presently the second fed mentioned), but I'm finding

card position may make a difference. If 2 segments are rated 50 and one is mid carders and the other is upper mid carders or contain a main eventer, it seems to lead to more burnout and lower match ratings.

 

 

Now the 80 man fed just got a 1 hour TV show that is live, a few things I've noted with that.....

pre show matches to not seem to carry any heat to the main show. I can go straight from a good crowd to 'not much in the way of heat' even if the rating goes up. If the comments were meant to reflect the TV audience I'd get it, but they seem to be intended for the live audience so I'm stumped

 

I tend to fit in only three matches and often it's upper mids, followed by upper mids with main eventers, or just main eventers, and then main eventers only for the main. Seem to do fine as long as I get my angles in as above, particularly between the main and semi-main. If I shortened my main (usually a 20 min slow build), then I'd try sticking a hot followed by cool angle before the opening and another angle between the opening and semi-main. Think that it could help both.

 

I've also never found any discernible benefit for post show matches at events, haven't tried them for TV.

 

There does seem to be a limit as to how low the angles/match before the semi main can be as if I stick a 30 in there, the crowd will be cold with no heat for the semi.

 

I'm finding the TV show much easier too get high show ratings for, likely due to the relative lack of low segments affecting the average.

[scorpion]

Perfect example of burning out a crowd and perfect show theory- tonight's NXT. They completely burned out the crowd before the semi/ME with no cool down. both singles title matches came off terrible because of it

[Lucas]

Originally Elias Sampson and Crews were probably going to do that, I imagine but it didn't happen.

 

As for the order of the show and PST with NXT tonight, I think that was definitely true of Bayley v Asuka being hurt by that, but the main event was more hurt by the cut to Joe. So don't think this is a perfect example of Perfect Show Theory at all.

 

I disagree with Perfect Show Theory because its based on ratings and order of segments and doesn't seem to account for length, which can play a massive part in how an overall show gets rated. A one hour show that is always hot would be received very well. Any more than that and then it would begin to get hurt by burn out. At least from my own testing on PST thats what its showed me, and seems to pigeon hole too much into the sports entertainment way of booking shows rather than being innovative and doing something different that can still work.

[kingjames]

I disagree with Perfect Show Theory because its based on ratings and order of segments and doesn't seem to account for length, which can play a massive part in how an overall show gets rated. A one hour show that is always hot would be received very well. Any more than that and then it would begin to get hurt by burn out. At least from my own testing on PST thats what its showed me, and seems to pigeon hole too much into the sports entertainment way of booking shows rather than being innovative and doing something different that can still work.

 

Not that it helps with 2013, but the change to the Semi-Main being the second best match of the night no matter when it comes during the show seems like it will make a major change in how cards are structured in TEW 2016. It won't change a crowd burning out for hot matches all night, but you can hit a cool down match right before the main and not tank your score, at least that's what it seems from dev journal entries.

[Oregano Jensen]

Yeah, it sounds like that plus match aims will constitute a change to the entire crowd management system.

[Blackman]

I think the perfect show theory is no longer valid, as people are treating a wrestling program more as a segmented series instead of one whole. Look at all the people who watch shows in several sittings. The WWE Network and recent TV tech in general made this possible, and people are doing it more and more. This is not some game show where you need to stick around, or a TV series that constantly follows up on past interactions. As a result, the relevance of the main event solely lies in selling the event as a watchable product, instead of serving as the performance highlight. Therefore, there is no more need for functional booking to create a crescendo-effect culminating in the main event, as the whole thing will be missed by many and will subsequently not have the desired effect.

 

Look at NXT shows. How often do they serve a main event that is inferior from a quality standpoint, featuring talent that isn't in the main event scene. Whenever I booked like that in TEW10, I got severely penalized. Yet, after watching the show, I feel fulfilled. It was a good show. I've seen what I wanted to see.

 

Now people probably still tune in at the last hour of RAW like they used to, but I'm just pointing out more and more just slide through the show and see the segments they want to see (at least in the WWE network).

[d12345]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Blackman" data-cite="Blackman" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="35173" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I think the perfect show theory is no longer valid, as people are treating a wrestling program more as a segmented series instead of one whole. Look at all the people who watch shows in several sittings. The WWE Network and recent TV tech in general made this possible, and people are doing it more and more. This is not some game show where you need to stick around, or a TV series that constantly follows up on past interactions. As a result, the relevance of the main event solely lies in selling the event as a watchable product, instead of serving as the performance highlight. Therefore, there is no more need for functional booking to create a crescendo-effect culminating in the main event, as the whole thing will be missed by many and will subsequently not have the desired effect.<p> </p><p> Look at NXT shows. How often do they serve a main event that is inferior from a quality standpoint, featuring talent that isn't in the main event scene. Whenever I booked like that in TEW10, I got severely penalized. Yet, after watching the show, I feel fulfilled. It was a good show. I've seen what I wanted to see.</p><p> </p><p> Now people probably still tune in at the last hour of RAW like they used to, but I'm just pointing out more and more just slide through the show and see the segments they want to see (at least in the WWE network).</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I think you're missing the point of PST here. It's not necessarily for television or online. It's for the event itself and how the live crowd takes it in. The live crowd doesn't have the luxury of choosing which segment they watch when. Nothing has changed from that regard of putting on a show.</p><p> </p><p> Furthermore NXT doesn't put on the best possible show every week. That's not the goal. They are a dev territory. If their main event gets dinged for involving jobbers they don't care. In TEW terms all they would care about is the skill gains and pop gains of the workers involved.</p>

[Blackman]

You're right. I just hope we get to reproduce it in TEW16 (maybe it was already in TEW13, didn't play that much).

 

And I did miss the live crowd's part. Looking back at 'Mania 18 - one of the best examples irl - I assume I wasn't the only one to actually fall asleep during the main event BOTH times I watched it.

 

But it just feels weird to rate an event based on the live crowd's perception, which is just a minor (though not quite marginal) part of the worldly perception of it.