The All Elite Wrestling Discussion Thread

[milamber]

It's all in the booking. I never watched WWF or WCW but how many up-and-comers did guys like Hogan put over. Not to mention his creative control clauses.

 

Never watched TNA either but didn't they go through a period where they pushed ex-WWE guys over younger talent. Same goes for WWE paying tons to guys like Goldberg, Taker and Lesnar to repeatedly beat and sometimes bury younger talent.

 

The Bucks and Omega won a lot in the 1st year of Dynamite but they didn't hog the main event scene or put themselves over other talent unless it made sense. Now their time has come to take the spotlight.

[Self]

It's all in the booking. I never watched WWF or WCW but how many up-and-comers did guys like Hogan put over. Not to mention his creative control clauses.

 

Never watched TNA either but didn't they go through a period where they pushed ex-WWE guys over younger talent. Same goes for WWE paying tons to guys like Goldberg, Taker and Lesnar to repeatedly beat and sometimes bury younger talent.

 

Omega and Bucks are in the primes of their careers and some of the biggest stars on the roster. That's the difference. They have also put younger talent over the last year. Plus, They sell a butt load of merch. Just because you don't like them it doesn't mean other people don't.

 

I don't think they've really put anyone over. They've lost, sure, but who has become a star by beating them? Private Party are a fine little tag team, but they aren't big stars. PAC's series with Omega didn't propel him to new heights. Omega and the Bucks aren't big enough stars in the mainstream for anyone to really benefit by beating them, and they had a chance to become that. They had a chance to make a first impression with a major mainstream US TV audience and they spent it winning some, losing some, just being guys on the roster. Which is commendable and gracious, and if they wanted to be permanent midcard backbones of the roster that would be awesome. Pushing themselves now feels undeserved. Especially from a kayfabe sense. They haven't been the most spectacular guys on the roster. Nor the most interesting. Nor the most deserving. And they could have been. They were so afraid of being considered 90's Hogan, that they didn't give themselves an 80's Hogan run. So afraid of the cart, they didn't even buy a horse.

 

Not that I would have wanted them to all be top guys Day One. Omega, yes. I wouldn't have revealed him as management, and pushed him as an unstoppable main event ass kicker day one. He would have had the undefeated streak, not ex-WWE veteran Jericho. At this point... I hate Omega's character. I'm already sick of him. I've seen what he can do in the ring now, that's old news. I don't want to see him on my screen, let alone on top.

[Jaysin]

After being super entertained by the Cody/Taz segment that I just watched again, I decided to read more about Taz's son Hook. Apparently he was a stand out lacrosse player in college. He was originally trained in wrestling by Pat Buck and Curt Hawkins and now is legit being trained by Cody Rhodes and QT Marshall. Interested to see how he turns out.

 

Rick Steiner's son Bronson made his indie debut in October and apparently already scored a WWE tryout. He has a very good look in my opinion. I'd rather him not go to WWE since I don't watch anymore. Maybe AEW will send out feelers his way

[Captain Kayfabe]

Leyla Hirsch

 

Yes! She would be a good fit in Team Taz.

[Mootinie]

The thing about Omega winning the title is that you have to think ahead. What if this leads to Omega vs. Hangman at AEW Revolution, in a proper blood feud where all the bitterness of The Elite breakup bubbles to the surface and the two of them get 30+ minutes to beat seven shades of crap out of one another?

 

Putting the belt on him solves two problems. Mox is running out of people to beat, Kingston wasn't even ranked and hadn't beat anybody but got two title shots. And I think Mox is due a tour of Japan since he's still IWGP US Champion. He'll need time off to go defend it so I'd rather we have an AEW champion that isn't persona non grata for a number of weeks.

[Jaysin]

Yeah I think after Mox loses, he takes a break until Wrestle Kingdom where he drops the US belt to Kenta.

[milamber]

Bucks put over Private Party, FTR and Omega/Page just off the top of my head. PAC's push to the main event after beating Omega got cut off because of COVID.

 

Who cares about mainstream appeal... there are very few guys that big in wrestling these days. All that matters is star power relative to the rest of the AEW roster. Jericho, Mox, Bucks and Omega have the biggest reputations from their previous work. Even guys like PAC and FTR, as talented as they are, had to rebuild their image after WWE mishandled them.

[BHK1978]

Just because you don't like them it doesn't mean other people don't.

 

Do you mean people are allowed to have a different opinion than me? You don't say...I learn something new every day.

 

You need new material, you've said this to me like five times already. But the thing is, I can turn it around on you. Just because you like something does not mean other people do.

 

Those other people have a right to their opinion just as much as you have a right to your opinion. Though anytime anyone says anything remotely negative about AEW in this thread you are the first person to say something along the lines of what you said to me.

 

Self pretty much said what I was going to say. In that Omega and the Middle Age Bucks have not really made any stars. Really AEW has not made many stars as a whole. Most of the people who are the stars of the company were made in TNA, WWE, ROH, NJPW.

 

I mean maybe Orange Cassidy might be considered a star that AEW made, but I would argue that AEW is such a niche market that he really is not that much of a star. MJF was already a name from MLW and I am sure there is a pretty big crossover between audiences so most knew who he was already (A good portion of the MLW roster was in AEW when it first opened up).

 

Sure Hogan did not job and yes that was a huge detriment to the company. But Hogan was also a draw at the time, once he turned heel.

 

Plus Hulk was not meant to create stars either in the WWE or WCW. Sure having a match with him might give them a shine but in order to get a match with him, they would, for the most part, already have to be stars themselves.

 

My point is Hogan was a megastar, the Bucks and Omega will never get close to that level. I did not miss milamber's point, I just made a joke about ever comparing their star quality to that of Hogan's.

 

Edited to add: This is coming from someone who hated Hulk since I was a little kid. I was a huge fan of his for a little bit, but even as a kid, I thought his stuff got old fast. I always thought the Ultimate Warrior was a joke as well. Even though both were marketed to me as someone I was supposed to like. I was a fan of the British Bulldogs, Tito Santana, George "The Animal" Steele. I was hardly ever a fan of who Vince wanted me to like.

[liontamer]

Edited to add: This is coming from someone who hated Hulk since I was a little kid. I was a huge fan of his for a little bit, but even as a kid, I thought his stuff got old fast. I always thought the Ultimate Warrior was a joke as well. Even though both were marketed to me as someone I was supposed to like. I was a fan of the British Bulldogs, Tito Santana, George "The Animal" Steele. I was hardly ever a fan of who Vince wanted me to like.

 

Are you from philly? You sound like the fans that boo santa every year

[Self]

Bucks put over Private Party, FTR and Omega/Page just off the top of my head.

 

I still think there's a difference between losing to someone and putting them over. Hulk Hogan let Billy Kidman pin him, but he didn't put him over. That's an extreme example, I know. Private Party beating them did raise that team's status from "Who?" to "Let's pay attention", but that's about it. Everything since then has proved they're aren't in the Buck's league, in kayfabe and performance.

 

Hangman I'll agree with. That tag match was excellent, and put Hangman over as the top babyface star of the company.

 

Putting the belt on him solves two problems. Mox is running out of people to beat, Kingston wasn't even ranked and hadn't beat anybody but got two title shots.

 

True. They have been awful at building challengers for Moxley. All so last minute. Cage. Brodie Lee. It was going to be Archer before COVID forced a replacement. They appear suddenly, have no real connection to Moxley (bar Kingston) and lose. The losing is great. Moxley should be running through guys, but a good rogue's gallery can reflect and bolster aspects of the hero's personality, and none of the stories (again, bar Kingston) have done that.

 

I'd be so much more interested in Moxley vs Hangman. Two brawler types. Two good guys with questionable pasts. Two guys with histories as parts of teams, that find themselves alone. Reasons to respect each other. Reasons to distrust each other. That's a match I'd be up for seeing... although I wouldn't have Hangman beat Moxley either.

[Mootinie]

AEW have done a good job with Orange Cassidy and Darby Allin and I'd argue they've made MJF because nobody really watches MLW. Ricky Starks is very much on the way, as is Sammy Guevara.

 

It's all a bit of a moot point though. The Young Bucks and Kenny Omega have to do things in AEW before they start putting others over and trying to make stars. You cannot present these guys as big deals before AEW and expect that will rub off on others. They have to be big deals here, they have to be elevated to the top of the AEW. Once that happens, we can have the discussion about how they can help to elevate others.

 

But yeah, the whole "making stars" thing in wrestling is tiresome. WWE can't do it and they have an audience that dwarfs AEW's. I know we often think they shoot themselves in the foot with their booking but it says it all that Sasha Banks was discovered and hired for The Mandalorian after the producer saw her on Hot Ones, not because they had seen her on RAW or Smackdown.

[Jaysin]

Just read Chris Hero is only receiving offers to be a road agent/producer/coach.

 

I'd love if AEW brought him in as a wrestler AND coach.

 

Would also love if AEW brought in Lance Storm.

 

Jimmy Rave just announced his retirement because he had his left arm amputated. Such a shame. He still has a lot to offer wrestling though. He'd make a great coach/trainer.

[BHK1978]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="liontamer" data-cite="liontamer" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="46243" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Are you from philly? You sound like the fans that boo santa every year</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Nope.</p><p> </p><p> I would not boo Santa either, now Mike Schmidt I would boo the hell out of because screw that guy.<img alt=":D" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p> </p><p> On a serious note, that sucks to see that happen to Jimmy Rave. I might have been one of his only fans in TNA but I always thought he did a great job there.</p>

[milamber]

BTE -

 

Road to Winter is Coming -

[Mootinie]

The BTE title match on the most recent episode was inspired.

[milamber]

The triple threat tag match on Dark was pretty crazy.

[Jaysin]

Zicky Dice announced on Twitter that his NWA contract expires in 30 days. I know AEW has a loaded roster, but hopefully they find a place for him.

[Peppermint Rage]

I expected Omega to win. I did not expect that.

[milamber]

- Diamond Battle Royale was fun. Miro was booked strong. They put a few story beats in there like Sky/Spears, Hangman/Dark Order and Hardy/Private Party. The Sammy/Jungle Boy sequence was cool. Cassidy vs MJF is going to be great.

- Kazarian vs Jericho was solid. I liked the dissension in the Inner Circle.

- The Acclaimed getting the rub on Dynamite with a non-PG diss rap.

- Dr. Britt vs Hirsch was solid and so was the brawl.

- Darby & Cody vs Starks & Hobbs was solid except one of Ricky's shoulders wasn't on the mat for the 3 count. The Sting reveal was well done, his theme is fire and the announcers tried their hardest to sell it as a big deal... but if he were 15 years younger and hadn't already shown up in WWE it would have had more impact.

- I'm glad they didn't forget about Shida.

- Omega vs Mox © was a MOTY Contender. I was so engrossed I started rooting for Mox to win even though Omega made more sense from a booking perspective. Callis you dirty dog!

 

Average show focused more on storylines than quality wrestling but the main event was a banger.

 

Sting's theme - https://youtu.be/XNv4FWr1ylo

[Jaysin]

<p>It's neat AEW is working with both NWA and Impact. I love Don on commentary. I guess I'll have to find a way to watch Impact next week.</p><p> </p><p>

Also, I don't care how old he gets, I will always mark out for Sting. He's literally the reason I became a wrestling fan and he's my favorite of all time. </p><p> </p><p>

I really, really like Hobbs and Starks together. Kinda hope they become a regular tag team. I wish Starks would start wearing orange and black though to match Cage and Hobbs</p>

[milamber]

Sting mentoring Darby would be cool.

 

[Jaysin]

The shirt Sting debuted on Dynamite set a new record on prowrestlingtees for most shirts sold in 24 hours.

 

I'm still giddy as a child over the Stinger

[Mootinie]

Best thing about Sting showing up was Tony going ape on commentary. So much history there. <3

[Jaysin]

Best thing about Sting showing up was Tony going ape on commentary. So much history there. <3

 

Yeah, Tony really added to the segment. Ross did too, but Tony and the legacy of Sting on TNT was just amazing.

 

I loved that they pointed out that the last match on TNT before Dynamite debuted was Sting vs Ric Flair. Really hit home for this WCW faithful.

[milamber]

They kept it secret from Tony so it was a legit reaction

 

Omega is confirmed to appear on IMPACT next week.