iDOMINATION 2023 - The Ashes of an Empire

[AboardTheArk]

44 minutes ago, Chikbot said:

Alright. Probably the top question I feel like most are going to have is this. What happened to Okada in 2018 that caused him to retire? I'm assuming serious injury. But that's a massive loss for NJPW. Least Nakamura didn't leave but I'm assuming Ibushi was slotted in as the "new ace" instead? 

This was actually a @diamondium idea first to retire Okada and I relished the challenge. Their roster is much deeper to compensate, guys like Shibata and Ishii get their runs in, but as 2023 rolls on the roster has started to reach the end of the curve age-wise. I would say that in terms of "ace" position, Nakamura is the most famous person in the company, a consequence of being huge from Inokiism era to the 2020's throughout but the spot is rotating depending on who's healthy enough to carry the year. Arguably, this is what NJPW was doing since 2019 lol.

[The Lloyd]

12 hours ago, Chikbot said:

Also there was one thing I saw that really made me lose it in both a comedic and in a enjoyment sort of way that only an alternate timeline can give you. Don't want to spoil it for people though so I won't talk about it openly. But you'll know once you see it.

 

Dying to know what this is  

[Chikbot]

Just now, The Lloyd said:

Dying to know what this is  

There's a multitude of these sorts of small little touches, but check WCCW for the one I'm talking about, someone very unexpected married into a famous family and is getting pushed off of it.

 

I also like how ECW basically was our WWE in a sense ITTL with Punk being Austin

 

Also one more question for @AboardTheArk, is Minoru Suzuki just not as big of a deal ITTL? Is he still considered the "rotten fruit" he was pre Suzuki-Gun?

[The Lloyd]

24 minutes ago, Chikbot said:

There's a multitude of these sorts of small little touches, but check WCCW for the one I'm talking about, someone very unexpected married into a famous family and is getting pushed off of it.

I wrote that  Haha!! I did all the bios for WCCW and TWE - they were a lot of fun. Charles Robinson might be one you'd like  And Brian Hebner  Haha!

[Chikbot]

2 hours ago, The Lloyd said:

I wrote that  Haha!! I did all the bios for WCCW and TWE - they were a lot of fun. Charles Robinson might be one you'd like  And Brian Hebner  Haha!

Hah, just checked those too. That's great

[eriatarka]

done a bit of writing for this behind the scenes & it's nice to finally see it come together into something more tangible, diamondium has been very responsive and helpful throughout the whole process.

On 2/14/2024 at 4:48 AM, AboardTheArk said:

Feel free to ask any questions on the Japan side of things! The answer will most probably be "I wasn't organized enough to look into this yet" but still. Many thanks to diamondium for letting me work on this and do some silly Battlarts wish fulfillment. 

 

Joshi side lagging behind the mens' mostly because I have bigger gaps to fill in terms of active wrestlers I know of, but while I'm by no means an expert on the scene I have decent knowledge both of the current state and historically so what comes out of that process will probably be at least kind of fun.

happy to see the new direction for ZERO1 especially with Astronauts getting love. I'd actually be interested in pitching in ideas for the joshi side of things since it's a relatively blank canvas. 

re: Okada - he was actually an AJPW guy in the 2010 data. the idea of an early retired Okada is interesting - how about an Okada who never wrestled for NJPW at all?

[AboardTheArk]

3 hours ago, eriatarka said:

done a bit of writing for this behind the scenes & it's nice to finally see it come together into something more tangible, diamondium has been very responsive and helpful throughout the whole process.

happy to see the new direction for ZERO1 especially with Astronauts getting love. I'd actually be interested in pitching in ideas for the joshi side of things since it's a relatively blank canvas. 

re: Okada - he was actually an AJPW guy in the 2010 data. the idea of an early retired Okada is interesting - how about an Okada who never wrestled for NJPW at all?

ngl I like AJPW how it is for the most part, they feel the most fleshed out to me at this point but it'd be interesting to imagine Okada retiring earlier than I think 2018ish like he is in the moment (I haven't edited job histories though). 

 

And feel free to message me with any ideas for the joshi scene absolutely, I'm already starting to workshop some things.

[diamondium]

3 hours ago, AboardTheArk said:

(I haven't edited job histories though).

Oh man, I didn't even begin to realize until I was knee-deep in the data how much of a hassle job histories would be haha. I just naively assumed I'd be able to mass-delete them all down the line from the IRL data then start fresh as part of a future update, only to find that's one that can't be mass deleted and has to be manually done on a worker by worker basis. I suspect job histories will never quite be perfect.

 

The Okada being an AJPW guy in the 2010 data is an interesting note - I can take blame for him being in NJPW in the first place, that first version of the Japan data was really sketch on the details, and ATA was surely just building on what I provided, putting out my fires as he went. I think as I've made more and more changes in America and whatnot, I've knowingly conflicted with the history on the 2010 data a few times elsewhere on a couple details, so I'm just assuming at this point that this version of the universe has a point of divergence from the canon data that's somewhere pre-2010, with the 2010 data being 'basically the same universe' but with a few small differences. So I'll leave it out of my hands how Okada is handled, if that stays at it is and conflicts with 2010 at this point that cat's already out of the bag so all good there.

[TheWho87]

42 minutes ago, diamondium said:

Oh man, I didn't even begin to realize until I was knee-deep in the data how much of a hassle job histories would be haha. I just naively assumed I'd be able to mass-delete them all down the line from the IRL data then start fresh as part of a future update, only to find that's one that can't be mass deleted and has to be manually done on a worker by worker basis. I suspect job histories will never quite be perfect.

HAHAHA.... no!

The best and quickest way to remove all job histories is to import the entire database into a new database, that's the quickest way I've found.

[Adelwolf]

I started a game with Project X, loved the roster and the whole backstory, however all of the roster seem really behind on pop as their major guys like Cena and Hardy are only "well known" and most of their roster are unimportant. Also within the first few days I lost most of my guys to rival promotions so maybe that's something to check. I really think most of these changes have been positive and add to the universe! Hope to see this going on

[diamondium]

On 2/24/2024 at 7:31 PM, Adelwolf said:

I started a game with Project X, loved the roster and the whole backstory, however all of the roster seem really behind on pop as their major guys like Cena and Hardy are only "well known" and most of their roster are unimportant. Also within the first few days I lost most of my guys to rival promotions so maybe that's something to check. I really think most of these changes have been positive and add to the universe! Hope to see this going on

Thanks for the note! That's partly intentional, partly an area to look at.

As far as the intentional parts, PX is one of the companies barely into the threshold of Medium - with how TEW20 handles perceptions based on company size and not relative to the roster, companies on the low-end of their particular size I see as being expected to lack lots of the top-end there. Having no stars or major stars is 100% intentional with that being said, especially with 'talent being stretched extremely thinly across the American companies in particular' being one of the themes of the database. PX in its current state very much intentionally lacks a true major draw and that's one of their built-in limiting factors as things stand holding them back from being on par with the other biggest American companies at the start.

Having said that, having the majority being low pop enough to be tagged as unimportant is an area to look at - the low end should be boosted a bit for companies of that size to avoid that, especially with the penalty TEW gives for having multiple people unimportant in a match. So that's an area I'll definitely add to the list to go over - PX is one of the companies which I've still got marked as 'in progress' so that's an area to be somewhat expected.

Regarding losing guys to rivals - The data was built to have the majority of guys for most companies on PPE contracts outside of a few top stars, even for the big companies, mostly as a continuation of the contract structures from previous idom mods, but I've noticed through playing as well that most companies, some more than others, could definitely use a few extra exclusive written deals. I'll add that as a note to address for the next update as well.

Edited February 26 by diamondium

[Adelwolf]

Thanks for the reply, I get your idea now about the company struggling with having a "major draw" and it makes sense, but as you say balancing the undercard popularity and securing some of the guys that you can build (like Killshot or Rush for example) would be good to allow the player the feel of the initial roster without having to resort to multiple outside hires that alter the core roster.

Now talking about Mexico
ILLA seem great maybe I'd recommend signing some "big" names that would feel right at home at this promotion like LA Park, Dragon Rojo (he had a cartoon with CN a few years back so it would be cool to see if in this universe this led to him being a bigger star), Negro Casa, Sam Adonis, Dr. Wagner Jr. or maybe even unretire Marco Corleone and make him being the top guy with his telenovela background. 
FMLL as the "traditional lucha" option looks good however I don't know if Blue Demon and Vampiro are a good choice as the owner and booker (especially the latter) as they have done more "american" style things in their careers... Maybe  Demon could still work for them but I would suggest adding Chavo Lutteroth III (Current owner of CMLL) or, if you want to shake things up, maybe Sofía Alonso, Chavo Lutteroth's niece who was in charge of CMLL for a while before being removed a couple of years ago. Sofia could be a good fit for LLF too if you want to play the Lutteroth family drama in this universe ad well (maybe Chavo III kicked Sofia out of FMLL) 
For AULL maybe Vampiro would be a better choice for owner/booker? seeing how it plays to the hardcore style. A luchador like Pagano or maybe Ludark Shaitan would thrive here (also you could maybe play with this promotion allowing intergender matches)
ELL seem very low on budget for the roster they have, also Rey sr. doesn't seem like a good fit for the more "entertainment" style I would recommend Dorian Roldán or maybe Marisela Peña (widow of the founder of AAA) as owners here as they play to that kind of more sports entertainment product. Also a wrestler like Blue Panther who is known as a more "classic technical guy" would maybe feel more at home at a promotion like FMLL.. If you want a luchador to be in charge maybe look at Ultimo Guerrero who is unemployed here and has been known as a more of a political player in lucha universe... maybe he got tired of being mistreated by Konnan and started his own promotion?
LLF feels right, it has a good mix of talent. Maybe add some american wrestlers that have been involved with lucha companies? As Mexico loves to book the classic USA vs Mexico matches? Some good choices could be Lady Frost, Alex Gracia, Ivelisse or maybe some Japanese workers like Mei Suruga or Tsukasa. Also Princesa Sugehit needs to be hired to this or some promotion as she's one of the top referents in women's lucha libre. Oh also maybe add the Chilean wrestlers that have been having some success on CMLL like Stephanie Vaquer and Catalina García (La Catalina)

This are all suggestions, hope they help a little. 
 

[diamondium]

2 hours ago, Adelwolf said:

Thanks for the reply, I get your idea now about the company struggling with having a "major draw" and it makes sense, but as you say balancing the undercard popularity and securing some of the guys that you can build (like Killshot or Rush for example) would be good to allow the player the feel of the initial roster without having to resort to multiple outside hires that alter the core roster.

Now talking about Mexico
ILLA seem great maybe I'd recommend signing some "big" names that would feel right at home at this promotion like LA Park, Dragon Rojo (he had a cartoon with CN a few years back so it would be cool to see if in this universe this led to him being a bigger star), Negro Casa, Sam Adonis, Dr. Wagner Jr. or maybe even unretire Marco Corleone and make him being the top guy with his telenovela background. 
FMLL as the "traditional lucha" option looks good however I don't know if Blue Demon and Vampiro are a good choice as the owner and booker (especially the latter) as they have done more "american" style things in their careers... Maybe  Demon could still work for them but I would suggest adding Chavo Lutteroth III (Current owner of CMLL) or, if you want to shake things up, maybe Sofía Alonso, Chavo Lutteroth's niece who was in charge of CMLL for a while before being removed a couple of years ago. Sofia could be a good fit for LLF too if you want to play the Lutteroth family drama in this universe ad well (maybe Chavo III kicked Sofia out of FMLL) 
For AULL maybe Vampiro would be a better choice for owner/booker? seeing how it plays to the hardcore style. A luchador like Pagano or maybe Ludark Shaitan would thrive here (also you could maybe play with this promotion allowing intergender matches)
ELL seem very low on budget for the roster they have, also Rey sr. doesn't seem like a good fit for the more "entertainment" style I would recommend Dorian Roldán or maybe Marisela Peña (widow of the founder of AAA) as owners here as they play to that kind of more sports entertainment product. Also a wrestler like Blue Panther who is known as a more "classic technical guy" would maybe feel more at home at a promotion like FMLL.. If you want a luchador to be in charge maybe look at Ultimo Guerrero who is unemployed here and has been known as a more of a political player in lucha universe... maybe he got tired of being mistreated by Konnan and started his own promotion?
LLF feels right, it has a good mix of talent. Maybe add some american wrestlers that have been involved with lucha companies? As Mexico loves to book the classic USA vs Mexico matches? Some good choices could be Lady Frost, Alex Gracia, Ivelisse or maybe some Japanese workers like Mei Suruga or Tsukasa. Also Princesa Sugehit needs to be hired to this or some promotion as she's one of the top referents in women's lucha libre. Oh also maybe add the Chilean wrestlers that have been having some success on CMLL like Stephanie Vaquer and Catalina García (La Catalina)

This are all suggestions, hope they help a little. 
 

Those are great suggestions all around! Thank you very much! The insight is huge, especially for a region like that where I've mostly been working somewhat blind.