TsuMirren Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I think one aspect of promotion's dying off is that with the size of salaries, you can't compete at local, small or entry level regional level for a sustained period of time. DOTT does work, but there's still a number of promotions dying off. Difference is that the database has around 30, T-Zone has 56 to start with. For the UK, you have some absolutely ludicrous salaries/appearance fees. You would, therefore, need to adapt every promotion's money to fit. So, let's say WZW start with 50,000 and they need D cards to develop, well they need D talent and therefore end up paying say 350+ on their talent and much more for decent higher level guys. Suddenly, because they're set to start as small, they lose everything in order to run a 3 hour show. I've always felt that the ticket prices are set too low, remember we're talking dollars here. Most UK promotions charge say £8, then it goes up in stages. There's no option to stagger, so you can't price different seating plans or even have staged pricing for a few ringside seats. Even without that, prices are still rather low. I've barely gotten past February 07 in my auto sim, left it on auto clicker for an hour and a bloody half last night. So, as soon as I've lost around a day of my life i'll be able to look at a year properly and dig into reasoning for promotions dying off. It is worrying though, as I'm assuming none of the other testers have edited the affluence and population %'s for the game world. I set mine to DOTT levels, plus edited the UK ones as I felt suited. I may find my year run loses more, as the population is less and not as affluent as in other tests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consrvtve Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 TY Adam for offering to help and responding so quickly to your customers in need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rams Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Beyond any issues with the game itself I think there [U]may[/U] be a problem with the way real world mods are created. TEW 07 intentionally doesn't simulate the real world perfectly. Creating data based solely on the real world environment might not be the best approach. The data should be based on the real world but altered to work in the game environment. That may ultimately mean unrealistic stats but playability in my mind is more important. That said I'm confident Adam and Forlan will make the necessary changes. Both work hard and I appreciate their efforts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viggo Vickers Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I can't believe after so long T-Zone is still going! Though I very much look forward to the release of the mod. As for the data, if this is the same data from back to the first release of TEW, there is bound to be issues, here, there and somewhere. I remember back as one of the releases I gave up working on it, was it was so HUGE, its crazy to be able to balances out that much data in your free time and call it a hobby. And I only did the Japanese data. Things do get overlooked a lot, from one worker's selling, to another's brawling skill. I downloaded one "localized" mod of a certain region, which is reasonable small compared to other mobs, and even that had some (you could call) silly mistakes or overlooked subjects of data. I don't know who is working on the update now, but I'm pretty sure Forlan is there somewhere. Kudos to you all. CHEERS! //Viggo Vickers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HugeRockStar760 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I offered to help with the project, but was flatly refused. This is what happens when you limit the testing to friends instead of people that can help. Like the previous posters with experience in gaming have already stated, it's not the game that's the problem. The fact is, the game is only going to go so far in simulating an accurate wrestling industry. You'd need a supercomputer to do that. But you can definitely get close if you know how to tweak the stats. And Forlan, if you are giving up on the project (for a lack of a better word), it would be quite unfair to everyone that followed the thread if you didn't release what you had. Maybe other people can help you figure this thing out. I just don't get talking about this for weeks, only to say, "Oh don't want to release something that might be unplayable." Unplayable to who? You? The testers? That's a small percentage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panix04 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Forlan hardly chose his friends, at the risk of airing dirty laundry me and Forlan have had severe dis-agreements in the past. Thats all in the past now but i certainly wouldn't say we are friends just yet. Anyway just my tuppenceworth, im just a little ofended you are seemingly questioning my ability as a tester! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbergey_2005 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 DOTT and CV are very similiar in terms of workers, promotions and ratings therefore I am sure it is a great chance that DOTT will be a great mod as always. TZones approach is basically set up with (WWE) being a wrestling monopoly. I think this is what causes the problems, they basically through the AI decisions decide the future of wrestling. Its possible starting out the WWE as a B instead of an A for overness would be benefitial to gameplay and fun factor(yet probably not realistic). Of course making the adjustments to the other organizations so WWE can keep their higher prestige. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forlan Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 Wow...Tim Vickers, long time no speak my cornish amigo, yes i am very much still in the thick of things indeed. DOTT might work better in theory but like someone said all promotions were smaller then anyways so it might be that is the reason why. I agree with Tsumirren on the wages thing as sometimes the wages are ludicrous and i cant really tell how the game works them, i start a game anc Castagnoli costs 100, Hero 350 then Larry Sweeney and others sometimes 1300 plus per appearance, it cripples the little fed. I had a though opposite to jbergey,how about raising wwe overness, because at the moment in the USA they are 80, maybe 90 or something might make them "more global" although i'm just clutching at straws in fairness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panix04 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 [QUOTE] agree with Tsumirren on the wages thing as sometimes the wages are ludicrous and i cant really tell how the game works them, i start a game anc Castagnoli costs 100, Hero 350 then Larry Sweeney and others sometimes 1300 plus per appearance, it cripples the little fed.[/QUOTE] i wouldn't quote me on this, but i think that wage's is dictated by overness and years of service. Just because in my own mod all the monsters in the 'destroy all monsters' fed have about 35 years service for the fed and they are all on sky high wage's. Just a guess though, i can run a few experiments if you like to see what effects wage's and what doesn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forlan Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 I cant back that up (sorry) as no matter where i hire Sweeney etc hes always pretty high, maybe cos of the amount of roles maybe, colour/manager/wrestler etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panix04 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 its certainly a possibility, i will do some tinkering tonight and see what i can come up with, it'll be like algebra - only funner! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The-gamE Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 what brand is Daivari on (is no longer listed on ECW) i think he is moving to smackdown... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ransik Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Yes, I went to sleep, I do that once in a great while. ;) Anyway, I'll send my data to Adam if forlan wants to send what he has too so maybe he can see what I've done on my end compared to what forlan has updated and see what he can figure out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forlan Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 I already sent mine to adam as i figured timezones etc you might be in bed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Ryland Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 [QUOTE=TsuMirren;189745]remember we're talking dollars here.[/QUOTE] We're not talking US dollars if that's what you mean. The money in TEW is a fictional universal dollar so that all promotions from around the world can use the same system, as it'd be a nightmare having everything converted between dollars, pounds, yen, etc, nobody would know what on earth was going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Ryland Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 [QUOTE=forlan;189820]I already sent mine to adam as i figured timezones etc you might be in bed[/QUOTE] edit - It arrived now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forlan Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 I'll send it to your hotmail, must of sent it to your gds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ransik Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I sent mine, too. It sucks... I spent 3 hours tweaking around WWE and TNA workers so the shows would go to a bare minimum of B-... and they all still got Cs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberkitten01 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Hurray for progress! Not hurray for the return of the gobby one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ransik Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Don't ask me how I did it... but the data I sent to Adam is sustaining TNA's popularity and prestige... but it's still cancelling the shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Ryland Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I have taken an initial look at the data. My first thoughts are that the stats of the wrestlers are actually pretty accurate in terms of fitting to the game, so that's a good start. I think you're probably a little off on the Brawling stat for most of the big name wrestlers, but nothing too serious. I have only taken a fairly quick look at the WWE so far, I will go into more depth with them and TNA tomorrow. This post is merely a "first glance" report. The main problem that I can see, which is the one I believe Ransik was reporting, is more of a conceptual issue than anything. You have it set up with WWE being Global with a three-way brand split. I believe that's it's 5 or 6 main eventers per brand at that level, so you are putting a requirement on the roster of between 15 and 18 main event level talents, and to maintain their current overness you really need the shows to be doing about a B grade, certainly no less than a B-. The problem is quite simply that the WWE does not have 18 workers capable of headlining a show while maintaining that level of quality, and definitely does not have the depth to also put on decent undercards. I think this is highlighted by the fact that Johnny Nitro ends up as a main eventer under the current conditions. So, in short, the current situation stretches the WWE resources far beyond what they can match. You can see this for yourselves by removing the brand split; they have the resources to do that, and you'll see their show quality improve. The second issue is the breakdown of the non-wrestling members of the roster, as that is triggering mass firings due to the amount of people vying for a couple of positions. The third issue is not related to the WWE as such, but is just a general observation - the relationship file provided is impressively complete, but has a lot of redundant data. In regard to the first issue, whoever owns the mod has some hard decisions to make. The fact is that the real-life WWE does not have the resources to do three strong brands either, which is why ECW has become a "lower level" brand and the other two are struggling for main eventers, so the simulation is actually accurate. As I see it, you either need to improve the workers to fill the requirements, or lower the promotion to lessen the requirements. Personally I think you've been to generous with the WWE; I don't think they really warrant a Global rating anymore, and would be much better suited to an International or National level. Dropping them down a size (which I can help you with) would lower the requirements, meaning you'd need less main eventers. This would in turn improve the midcard, and thus improve their show quality. The second issue I can help with by providing you with some concrete figures as to requirements and current levels. I will look into creating these figures for you, once you have made a decision as to changing the company size or not. In regard to the third issue, I would strongly advise that whoever owns the mod takes an executive decision and cuts out a lot of the redundant data. My belief is that at the moment the relationship section has lost its focus, and moved away from "does this make the game better" and slipped into "does this make the database look more impressive". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr T Jobs To Me Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 I honestly wouldn't set Spike as a big network, as you mentioned in your other thread. I'd probably have it as a medium network with Risky/Cult programming, as it appeals only to a target audience of redneck men. SciFi would be exactly the same. USA.... It's a tough call, but maybe USA should also be medium with Mainstream programming. It's not like they're ratings juggernauts or anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ransik Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Sounds like a plan. Forlan will have to work with you Adam cause it's his data. After reading what you put though I'm still curious as to why with Sci-Fi being a Small network... why would it can ECW after a few months when it's geting C and C+ shows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masterded Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 just remember that USA should be the biggest of the cable channels. Hell you can't watch USA for more then 10 min without them reminding you now, and if you look it up it is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrKain Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Yeah, USA has actually garnered a huge following due to producing shows like Monk and Psych, and has come way far in terms on cable television... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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