The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[Mattywood]

Of course they were stalling, they were about to have an Undertake entrance, at WrestleMania no less, in broad daylight. You'd have stalled too.

 

I think personally that anyone expecting Sting to win was delusional, and the backlash against Triple H is mainly of the hurting butt variety.

 

This isn't Starrcade. Starrcade ain't around any more, wonder why.

 

Firstly, unlike Sting who will probably never wrestle again, or if he does then only in Undertaker-like circumstances, Triple H still has future feuds and storylines to consider.

 

He's lost (or drawn via DQ) his last nine matches since beating Lesnar at WM29, excluding a dark match with the New Age Outlaws. This includes losing to Daniel Bryan at last year's WM. Most people seem to conveniently forget that Bryan never lost to Triple H, the return match was a no contest draw on Raw.

 

Secondly, and most importantly, the whole match was WWE vs. WCW. Nobody watches Braveheart and is pissed that the English won. WWE won, get over it. Yes, the nWo backing up Sting was a bit weird after being sworn enemies for what feels like centuries, but like I said this is WWE vs. WCW, the Monday Night Wars distilled into one match. Who else is going to represent WCW? Team Canada? The Filthy Animalz?

 

Triple H was 100% always going to win this, and what you're all ignoring is how damn fun the match was, for what it was ever going to be.

 

I like to think that Vince saw Joffrey's wedding in Game of Thrones, looked at the midget re-enactment of the War of the Five Kings and said "we're doing that at WrestleMania!". Then the creative team in unison said "no, no more midgets!", so Vince said "ok we'll use Triple H and Sting as the avatars of their respective companies instead". (There's a zero percent chance this is what actually happened, but...).

 

Thank you! I didn't have a problem with the Sting/HHH match either, and I'm pretty sure that the Klique and Hogan weren't "conspiring" to bury Sting. If anything, Sting was probably looking forward to having some fun out there with his wrestling brethren and finally getting to wrestle for WWE, and at WrestleMania no less. Besides, if this is his last match, then that's how you go out: on your back. As for why have the nWo help Sting... Sports rivalries, while sometimes can lead to utter contempt between foes, can also lead to foes building respect for one another. That's how I look at the nWo helping Sting as.

[Ashkihyena]

He's been one of the best things about WWE for nearly a year now. I just hope they find something for him post Mania and he doesn't get lost in the shuffle.

 

Oh, after being beaten by Cena's golden shovel he will.

 

And what a shocker, people defending WWE's burying of Sting and WCW. Shocker.

 

And screw JBL and his burying of WCW on commentary which was probably all Vince. Screw Vince as well.

 

As a matter of fact, this sums up both Rusev and Sting's career after last night.

 

[RKOwnage]

I agree with your post on the whole and thoroughly enjoyed Wrestlemania to be honest, but this is the only bit I don't agree with. I think it's the complete opposite, because I think it's pointless having The Undertaker just add to his record now because it's always going to be XX-1, no matter what the number eventually finishes on. The only thing more surprising than The Undertaker losing at Wrestlemania would be to lose two times in a row at Wrestlemania, and Wyatt could have played off it for years as "the new face of fear". Bray deserved it after basically carrying the feud leading into 'Mania with 'Taker not making a single appearance in the lead up. I know there were probably some good reasons for him not appearing, but that doesn't take away from the brilliant job Wyatt did.

 

I think in WWE's eyes, where does Wyatt go with a win? Probably the title picture. But with Brock, Orton, and probably even still Reigns now in the immediate title race, I think it's smart for them to temper Bray for now. "Legend Killer" Orton could have benefited greatly from a win over Taker at WMXX, and he looked strong while Taker went over. But he didn't need that win, and I think WWE feels Bray doesn't need it either. I think they're confident he's going to be successful in the long run because of his brilliant job in not only this feud, but in almost every one he's in. Time will tell, of course, but now I think you can feasibly do more with him in the immediate future since he lost. The next time there's a face champion, Wyatt will start picking up important wins. He'll get there.

[Peter.1986]

Oh, after being beaten by Cena's golden shovel he will.

 

And what a shocker, people defending WWE's burying of Sting and WCW. Shocker.

 

And screw JBL and his burying of WCW on commentary which was probably all Vince. Screw Vince as well.

 

As a matter of fact, this sums up both Rusev and Sting's career after last night.

 

 

Are you an old WCW fan by any chance?

 

Again like I said earlier vince would have no benefit from burying wcw. As he owns that (or what's left) so anything wcw he makes money from.

 

To be fair sting has been treated extremely well. Not wrestling ever for Wwe and his debut match at wrestlemania

 

If sting joined back when Goldberg did he would have had a good run.

[Ashkihyena]

Are you an old WCW fan by any chance?

 

Again like I said earlier vince would have no benefit from burying wcw. As he owns that (or what's left) so anything wcw he makes money from.

 

To be fair sting has been treated extremely well. Not wrestling ever for Wwe and his debut match at wrestlemania

 

If sting joined back when Goldberg did he would have had a good run.

 

Uh no, there's a reason why Sting didn't join way back when, and Vince buries WCW cause they dared to compete with WWE and they made Vince pull his head out of his ass for a change and put on a decent product.

 

Take a look at the product now. It's garbage, particuarly compared to back when WCW and WWF were in their prime and drawing in the ratings. Now WWE can't even draw a 3 in the ratings.

 

And if Vince has no reason to bury WCW, why does he have his commentators trash it every chance he gets? JBL during that match was doing nothing but trashing WCW. Sorry, but no, Vince is still butthurt that WCW dared to compete with him and he continues to take potshots any chance he can get.

[Peter.1986]

I think in WWE's eyes, where does Wyatt go with a win? Probably the title picture. But with Brock, Orton, and probably even still Reigns now in the immediate title race, I think it's smart for them to temper Bray for now. "Legend Killer" Orton could have benefited greatly from a win over Taker at WMXX, and he looked strong while Taker went over. But he didn't need that win, and I think WWE feels Bray doesn't need it either. I think they're confident he's going to be successful in the long run because of his brilliant job in not only this feud, but in almost every one he's in. Time will tell, of course, but now I think you can feasibly do more with him in the immediate future since he lost. The next time there's a face champion, Wyatt will start picking up important wins. He'll get there.

 

If taker would have lost it would have made the streak much more irrelevant. The streak is still talked about and will go down in history. Brock has the title of the only person to beat taker, taker has a streak that can't be matched and 1 loss is significant. Add another loss in there and the streak with 2 losses becomes much more irrelevant, and something that will go down in the history books will have a lot less significance to it.

 

 

Plus Look at the difference between Brock then and wyatt now, wyatt is not at that level to justify making undertakers streak become irrelevant

[Peter.1986]

Uh no, there's a reason why Sting didn't join way back when, and Vince buries WCW cause they dared to compete with WWE and they made Vince pull his head out of his ass for a change and put on a decent product.

 

Take a look at the product now. It's garbage, particuarly compared to back when WCW and WWF were in their prime and drawing in the ratings. Now WWE can't even draw a 3 in the ratings.

 

There's a reason in stings head.

 

Look at all former wcw wrestlers, Jericho, guerrero, big show, Booker t, even Goldberg was uncooperative but still got win over the Rock and others, hulk hogan, loads out there have gone on to do wells

 

Sting saw the the rock turn round to Booker t and say who are you and that was the reason he didn't want to join to have to start from scratch. What sting didn't realise was the rock said that to everyone at the time it wasn't a burying the wcw thing.

 

I donagree about the product been rubbish I don't really watch it at all.

 

But don't forget vince has buried himself and his family on many occasions, he does what he thinks is right for the company, letting sting debut at wrestlemania is what's good for the company. Nobody else would have got that opportunity.

[Ashkihyena]

There's a reason in stings head.

 

Look at all former wcw wrestlers, Jericho, guerrero, big show, Booker t, even Goldberg was uncooperative but still got win over the Rock and others, hulk hogan, loads out there have gone on to do wells

 

Sting saw the the rock turn round to Booker t and say who are you and that was the reason he didn't want to join to have to start from scratch. What sting didn't realise was the rock said that to everyone at the time it wasn't a burying the wcw thing.

 

I donagree about the product been rubbish I don't really watch it at all.

 

But don't forget vince has buried himself and his family on many occasions, he does what he thinks is right for the company, letting sting debut at wrestlemania is what's good for the company. Nobody else would have got that opportunity.

 

And Sting was right, and last night just proved it.

 

And yes, the product is garbage, and the ratings show that, particuarly compared to way back when. It's trash and Vince continuing to bury WCW any chance he can get is trash.

 

But then I don't expect WWE fans to realize that. Professional wrestling fans, yes, but not WWE fans.

[kipfizh]

And Sting was right, and last night just proved it.

 

And yes, the product is garbage, and the ratings show that, particuarly compared to way back when. It's trash and Vince continuing to bury WCW any chance he can get is trash.

 

But then I don't expect WWE fans to realize that. Professional wrestling fans, yes, but not WWE fans.

 

You saying that lines are drawn between WCW and WWE and that leads Vince to trash everything to do with WCW is somewhat ironic when you go on to trash all WWE fans like that. Broad strokes, indeed.

 

Ratings don't tell you everything - wrestling goes through boom and bust periods and that leads to peaks and troughs in ratings. Of course ratings are way lower than they used to be, but if that was purely down to WWE being 'trash' then it would be relatively straightforward for a competitor to blow them out of the water.

 

Not saying for a moment that the product is perfect - some of it is extremely painful. I like some of it, I dislike other parts. But that is also true of every era, and every company.

[Peter.1986]

And Sting was right, and tonight just proved it.

 

And yes, the product is garbage, and the ratings show that, particuarly compared to way back when. It's trash and Vince continuing to bury WCW any chance he can get is trash.

 

He hasn't been buried by losing to triple h at wrestlemania, triple h has won how many wwe titles? Sting has 0, sting hasn't won a Wwe match, sting has been given a great deal by been paid and afforded a wrestlemania appearance without earning it in the Wwe.

 

The reason I think the product is garbage is because of the times we live in, the big tv companies dictate and they can't get away with what they could, plus they are making more money away from the show they can't afford to go down that route, in the past they needed to do it to make people buy into it. I can't see it ever going back to the level it was without them starting to lose money and drop on the commercial side

 

Parents won't buy their kids stuff if they are having people like slaughter sympathising with who they're at war with, or sexual content like the attitude era. It's such as shame because wrestling is about people fighting each other, and it feels like where watching children in the playground arguing

[Peter.1986]

And Sting was right, and last night just proved it.

 

And yes, the product is garbage, and the ratings show that, particuarly compared to way back when. It's trash and Vince continuing to bury WCW any chance he can get is trash.

 

But then I don't expect WWE fans to realize that. Professional wrestling fans, yes, but not WWE fans.

 

And wcw was brilliant for pro wrestling fans having celebs coming in winning the title, people poking people in the eyes to finish a title match etc, they were just a poorer version of the wwf. It's entertainment, wrestling is in the Olympics, wrestling based entertainment is what the Wwe was and wcw tried to be, Wwe in fact are now the new wcw

[Ashkihyena]

He hasn't been buried by losing to triple h at wrestlemania, triple h has won how many wwe titles? Sting has 0, sting hasn't won a Wwe match, sting has been given a great deal by been paid and afforded a wrestlemania appearance without earning it in the Wwe.

 

The reason I think the product is garbage is because of the times we live in, the big tv companies dictate and they can't get away with what they could, plus they are making more money away from the show they can't afford to go down that route, in the past they needed to do it to make people buy into it. I can't see it ever going back to the level it was without them starting to lose money and drop on the commercial side

 

Parents won't buy their kids stuff if they are having people like slaughter sympathising with who they're at war with, or sexual content like the attitude era. It's such as shame because wrestling is about people fighting each other, and it feels like where watching children in the playground arguing

 

And yet they were making millions and millions back in the attitude era.

 

All this "oh, they'd lose money cause of the soccer moms" is bullcrap and you damn well know it.

 

As I said, I don't expect a WWE fan to get that and the product will continue to be stale, crappy and garbage cause of people watching like zombies.

 

And yes, they're like WCW, and look where WCW is, out of business, and I don't usually say this about companies, but I won't shed a tear if WWE goes out of business cause of all the politics they do and burying what's left of WCW like guys like Sting and such.

[Peter.1986]

And yet they were making millions and millions back in the attitude era.

 

All this "oh, they'd lose money cause of the soccer moms" is bullcrap and you damn well know it.

 

As I said, I don't expect a WWE fan to get that and the product will continue to be stale, crappy and garbage cause of people watching like zombies.

 

And yes, they're like WCW, and look where WCW is, out of business, and I don't usually say this about companies, but I won't shed a tear if WWE goes out of business cause of all the politics they do and burying what's left of WCW like guys like Sting and such.

 

Lol I havnt watched a full show (apart from older ones on YouTube) since 2001 so really your judgement of me is invalid, if it was the same as back then I would watch every show.

 

It's not just a one man company it's on the stock market and everything they won't go down that route

[Ashkihyena]

Lol I havnt watched a full show (apart from older ones on YouTube) since 2001 so really your judgement of me is invalid, if it was the same as back then I would watch every show.

 

It's not just a one man company it's on the stock market and everything they won't go down that route

 

Cause they're nothing but a bunch of cowards who don't want to take any risk and it's making the product garbage.

 

And if you think they didn't have sponsors back then then you're deluding yourself.

[mad5226]

Uh no, there's a reason why Sting didn't join way back when, and Vince buries WCW cause they dared to compete with WWE and they made Vince pull his head out of his ass for a change and put on a decent product.

 

Take a look at the product now. It's garbage, particuarly compared to back when WCW and WWF were in their prime and drawing in the ratings. Now WWE can't even draw a 3 in the ratings.

 

And if Vince has no reason to bury WCW, why does he have his commentators trash it every chance he gets? JBL during that match was doing nothing but trashing WCW. Sorry, but no, Vince is still butthurt that WCW dared to compete with him and he continues to take potshots any chance he can get.

 

I won't disagree that the announce team buries WCW, but for the sake of making it seem "real" why wouldn't they? I was a pretty hardcore WCW fan back in the day and I won't disagree to some level that yes Vince "punished" a lot of the WCW guys for crossing him, but I don't think that is the case any more.

 

Think about it for a minute from Sting's perspective, you don't think he knew he was going to lose before he ever signed on for the match? I would almost guarantee the entire storyline and match was scripted before he signed on the dotted line because he was so worried about "getting buried" and how he would be handled. He was booked incredibly strong from start to finish, every segment he was in (with the exception of the actual match) he came out looking better than Triple H.

 

Again, I would have loved to see Sting win, but they booked him incredibly strong, and the man had an amazing match at Wrestlemania, let's be happy about that. Like people said earlier, Sting will probably never be on TV again whereas Triple H is still involved in storylines, it just made since for H to go over.

[Ashkihyena]

I won't disagree that the announce team buries WCW, but for the sake of making it seem "real" why wouldn't they? I was a pretty hardcore WCW fan back in the day and I won't disagree to some level that yes Vince "punished" a lot of the WCW guys for crossing him, but I don't think that is the case any more.

 

Think about it for a minute from Sting's perspective, you don't think he knew he was going to lose before he ever signed on for the match? I would almost guarantee the entire storyline and match was scripted before he signed on the dotted line because he was so worried about "getting buried" and how he would be handled. He was booked incredibly strong from start to finish, every segment he was in (with the exception of the actual match) he came out looking better than Triple H.

 

Again, I would have loved to see Sting win, but they booked him incredibly strong, and the man had an amazing match at Wrestlemania, let's be happy about that. Like people said earlier, Sting will probably never be on TV again whereas Triple H is still involved in storylines, it just made since for H to go over.

 

They could've still had him win. Sting's first and quite possibly only match in WWE as a loss because Vince is still bitter. Yeah, sorry, I don't play that Vince still doesn't bury WCW, particularly after JBL's trash commentary.

 

Or at the very least, if you're going to have Sting lose, don't bury WCW on commentary.

 

Or better yet, don't bury WCW anymore. All this Sting is a big fish in a small pond BS. No, WCW was not a small pond Steph, but you know, revisionist history.

[Celuwyn]

Wow, Another Wrestlemania without a surprise.. And i'm not event watching wrestling all the time, by the look of the card i already know who win

[Peter.1986]

Cause they're nothing but a bunch of cowards who don't want to take any risk and it's making the product garbage.

 

And if you think they didn't have sponsors back then then you're deluding yourself.

 

Not the same sponsors, they had sponsors yes, but they didn't have the how ever many millions from investors in the stock market, there was an article not long ago saying vince lost in one day the same amount as he made in the whole attitude era, so that shows you the scale.

 

But there's no need to argue the point, bring back the attitude era, that's when I enjoyed it.

[moon_lit_tears]

 

I think personally that anyone expecting Sting to win was delusional, and the backlash against Triple H is mainly of the hurting butt variety.

 

This isn't Starrcade. Starrcade ain't around any more, wonder why.

 

Firstly, unlike Sting who will probably never wrestle again, or if he does then only in Undertaker-like circumstances, Triple H still has future feuds and storylines to consider.

 

He's lost (or drawn via DQ) his last nine matches since beating Lesnar at WM29, excluding a dark match with the New Age Outlaws. This includes losing to Daniel Bryan at last year's WM. Most people seem to conveniently forget that Bryan never lost to Triple H, the return match was a no contest draw on Raw.

 

Secondly, and most importantly, the whole match was WWE vs. WCW. Nobody watches Braveheart and is pissed that the English won. WWE won, get over it. Yes, the nWo backing up Sting was a bit weird after being sworn enemies for what feels like centuries, but like I said this is WWE vs. WCW, the Monday Night Wars distilled into one match. Who else is going to represent WCW? Team Canada? The Filthy Animalz?

 

Triple H was 100% always going to win this, and what you're all ignoring is how damn fun the match was, for what it was ever going to be.

 

I like to think that Vince saw Joffrey's wedding in Game of Thrones, looked at the midget re-enactment of the War of the Five Kings and said "we're doing that at WrestleMania!". Then the creative team in unison said "no, no more midgets!", so Vince said "ok we'll use Triple H and Sting as the avatars of their respective companies instead". (There's a zero percent chance this is what actually happened, but...).

 

 

That aside, I thought this was easily the best Wrestlemania since XX, possibly even since X7. The main event was an incredible match. Reigns stiffs Lesnar, makes him bleed hardway. Immediately realises he's made a terrible mistake. Lesnar DESTROYS HIM.

 

 

I agree with this. I'm not a fan of HHH, but I wasn't expecting Sting to win. I doubt he will show up again anyway. I honestly think this was a one time thing.

 

And Sting was right, and last night just proved it.

 

And yes, the product is garbage, and the ratings show that, particuarly compared to way back when. It's trash and Vince continuing to bury WCW any chance he can get is trash.

 

But then I don't expect WWE fans to realize that. Professional wrestling fans, yes, but not WWE fans.

 

 

They could've still had him win. Sting's first and quite possibly only match in WWE as a loss because Vince is still bitter. Yeah, sorry, I don't play that Vince still doesn't bury WCW, particularly after JBL's trash commentary.

 

Or at the very least, if you're going to have Sting lose, don't bury WCW on commentary.

 

Or better yet, don't bury WCW anymore. All this Sting is a big fish in a small pond BS. No, WCW was not a small pond Steph, but you know, revisionist history.

 

LOL

 

Okay so I get WCW USED TO BE a big thing, but guess what? In the war of the wrestling worlds they lost, and in the end are now owned by WWE, so they can do whatever they want. If Vince wan'ts people to poopoo over WCWs past, guess what? It's going to happen, we odn't have to like it, but it's what it is.

 

I was never a huge WCW fan, only a few stars, in general I thought it was pretty meh.

[Nathers7]

"We took someone from obscurity and developed it into something important"

 

Said Vince McMahon about Sting.

 

Lol.

[Ashkihyena]

Not the same sponsors, they had sponsors yes, but they didn't have the how ever many millions from investors in the stock market, there was an article not long ago saying vince lost in one day the same amount as he made in the whole attitude era, so that shows you the scale.

 

But there's no need to argue the point, bring back the attitude era, that's when I enjoyed it.

 

Well, at least you're making some sense, and the sponsors back then had some sense, cause now they're crap.

 

But they won't, Vince is a coward whose gone senile a long time ago...as in 2001 long ago when WCW went out of business and he was allowed to rampage freely and look where it's got him.

 

"We took someone from obscurity and developed it into something important"

 

Said Vince McMahon about Sting.

 

Lol.

 

That's Vince McMahon, the sore winner. Usually it's the other way around and the loser is usually sore, but nope, not this time.

[Peter.1986]

I won't disagree that the announce team buries WCW, but for the sake of making it seem "real" why wouldn't they? I was a pretty hardcore WCW fan back in the day and I won't disagree to some level that yes Vince "punished" a lot of the WCW guys for crossing him, but I don't think that is the case any more.

 

Think about it for a minute from Sting's perspective, you don't think he knew he was going to lose before he ever signed on for the match? I would almost guarantee the entire storyline and match was scripted before he signed on the dotted line because he was so worried about "getting buried" and how he would be handled. He was booked incredibly strong from start to finish, every segment he was in (with the exception of the actual match) he came out looking better than Triple H.

 

Again, I would have loved to see Sting win, but they booked him incredibly strong, and the man had an amazing match at Wrestlemania, let's be happy about that. Like people said earlier, Sting will probably never be on TV again whereas Triple H is still involved in storylines, it just made since for H to go over.

 

That's the other thing. From the show point of view they hate wcw, so for them not bury them would kind of be saying they forgot wcw ever existed. If wrestling was real, they would still be skating their rival company.

 

But from a backstage point of view wcw interests are Wwe interests.

 

From a wcw fans point of view, do you actually think they buried wcw wrestlers? If you do then who?

 

I think if you look back at it not really any of the top guys made the jump, and the guys that came over you wouldn't have accepted it if they beat sting, Goldberg, any of nwo in the wcw, so why would they suddenly be over enough to bury the rock, stone cold etc?

 

Secondly just because they lost doesn't mean they were buried, Wwe were always going to win, they had the guys already there come out on top because they were already in the plans and would have got more over. It may be more of a case of them using wcw wrestlers to get their own wrestlers more over, which isn't really burying wcw wrestlers.

 

I maybe wrong, but I think it was more of a case of making the roster they were going to keep look stronger rather than going out to bury wcw wrestlers

[Ashkihyena]

That's the other thing. From the show point of view they hate wcw, so for them not bury them would kind of be saying they forgot wcw ever existed. If wrestling was real, they would still be skating their rival company.

 

But from a backstage point of view wcw interests are Wwe interests.

 

From a wcw fans point of view, do you actually think they buried wcw wrestlers? If you do then who?

 

I think if you look back at it not really any of the top guys made the jump, and the guys that came over you wouldn't have accepted it if they beat sting, Goldberg, any of nwo in the wcw, so why would they suddenly be over enough to bury the rock, stone cold etc?

 

Secondly just because they lost doesn't mean they were buried, Wwe were always going to win, they had the guys already there come out on top because they were already in the plans and would have got more over. It may be more of a case of them using wcw wrestlers to get their own wrestlers more over, which isn't really burying wcw wrestlers.

 

I maybe wrong, but I think it was more of a case of making the roster they were going to keep look stronger rather than going out to bury wcw wrestlers

 

Uh no, there was no reason for them to have JBL trash WCW the way he did, no reason at all. They're always taking potshots at WCW when they can.

 

Oh, and by the way, the InVasion Angle back in 2001 says hi when they buried the WCW wrestlers.

[Peter.1986]

Uh no, there was no reason for them to have JBL trash WCW the way he did, no reason at all. They're always taking potshots at WCW when they can.

 

Oh, and by the way, the InVasion Angle back in 2001 says hi when they buried the WCW wrestlers.

 

Who from wcw was in with a shout of winning the main title who got buried in Wwe?

[Ashkihyena]

Who from wcw was in with a shout of winning the main title who got buried in Wwe?

 

....what?