The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[OldStingberg]

Raw got a 2.7 rating last night with 3.86 million viewers. According to PWTorch, there's only been seven episodes of Raw that have had a worse rating in the past 14 years, and five of those happened on a major holiday. And looking at the past five years of Raw against week 1 of Monday Night Football, viewers have dropped from 5.52 million viewers in 2007 to 3.86 million viewers this year.

 

So, um, yeah, that's not good.

[bigtplaystew]

oh noez. its the end of wrestling!

[Guest codey]

Last night was the first Monday Night Football of the year, after all.

 

Plus, it's been pointed out every time ratings get brought up that they're kind of down across the board for everything.

[OldStingberg]

Plus, it's been pointed out every time ratings get brought up that they're kind of down across the board for everything.

Second part first. This is kind of true, but mostly irrelevant. TV ratings are down from the 90's because there's more quality shows on basic cable, which has spread viewers out. TV watching in general is actually pretty flat. But those sort of trends are pretty irrelevant when we're talking about just the past couple of years. For example...

 

Last night was the first Monday Night Football of the year, after all.

 

Very true, which is why comparing Raw's rating last night to its rating in previous years against week 1 of MNF is very relevant. Like I mentioned, Raw's rating in that situation is down about 33% from just four years ago. And that 33% drop is pretty consistent with Raw's yearly ratings this year compared to four years ago. That's not good.

 

And bigt, I don't know why you'd go with snark for this. No one is saying this is the end of wrestling. I'd argue this past month has shown that there will always be an audience for what the WWE does, no matter how relatively bad it is.

 

But if you're a wrestling fan, and you're not concerned about a 33% drop in viewership in just four years, I mean, I don't know what to say.

[djthefunkchris]

Well, I'm sure WWE isn't really concerned about "RAW", since they are bassically guarrenteed their slot till the end of 2014, when it will be up for renewal again. It would have to get really bad for that to happen.

 

Just last Friday:

http://www.thefutoncritic.com/ratings/2011/09/01/usa-network-celebrates-biggest-summer-ever-739512/20110901usa01/

 

· WWE MONDAY NIGHT RAW made USA the #1 network in all of television in its Monday 9pm-11pm time period among M18-34, coming in second only to ABC in P18-34 and to HIST in M18-49, M25-54, and total males M2+. Only CBS and NBC delivered more P18-49 or P25-54 than Raw in its timeslot this summer.

 

What I think would show you better of how or what is going on, is to look at what RAW is doing in comparison with other shows, period... Not comparing it to itself from four years ago.... without comparing other shows from four years ago (that are still around).

 

Have to think in a bigger picture.

[OldStingberg]

Well, I'm sure WWE isn't really concerned about "RAW"...

 

The Raw Supershows would suggest otherwise.

 

On the other hand, maybe not. Maybe they're really thrilled that they're beating summer shows like Hell's Kitchen, Rizzoli & Isles and repeats of Hawaii 5-O. If that's the bar they've set for Raw, then mission accomplished I guess.

[bigtplaystew]

Second part first. This is kind of true, but mostly irrelevant. TV ratings are down from the 90's because there's more quality shows on basic cable, which has spread viewers out. TV watching in general is actually pretty flat. But those sort of trends are pretty irrelevant when we're talking about just the past couple of years. For example...

 

 

 

Very true, which is why comparing Raw's rating last night to its rating in previous years against week 1 of MNF is very relevant. Like I mentioned, Raw's rating in that situation is down about 33% from just four years ago. And that 33% drop is pretty consistent with Raw's yearly ratings this year compared to four years ago. That's not good.

 

And bigt, I don't know why you'd go with snark for this. No one is saying this is the end of wrestling. I'd argue this past month has shown that there will always be an audience for what the WWE does, no matter how relatively bad it is.

 

But if you're a wrestling fan, and you're not concerned about a 33% drop in viewership in just four years, I mean, I don't know what to say.

 

I was messing around, broski. Trying to add some levity to what amounts to a very familiar whine-fest in low ratings discussions. My lolz didn't work. Sorry.

 

 

I understand you are "concerned" but the people that complain about low buyrates, attendances, and ratings really add nothing new to the discussion. It's all been said before. It just comes across as aimless whining to me at this point. WWE still does decent enough numbers and RAW and Smackdown are still among the highest rated shows on their respective networks. So the shows aint going anywhere and neither is the WWE.

 

But you are rightly entitled to your opinion as I am mine. I guess I just fail to see a valid opinion in "ratings are low... yeah..." type posts.

[Bull]

The Raw Supershows would suggest otherwise.

 

On the other hand, maybe not. Maybe they're really thrilled that they're beating summer shows like Hell's Kitchen, Rizzoli & Isles and repeats of Hawaii 5-O. If that's the bar they've set for Raw, then mission accomplished I guess.

 

My understanding for the Supershow thing was to try and get more people to watch Smackdown. You know, feature those guys on mondays so people might want to see them on fridays.

[Fantabulous]

My understanding for the Supershow thing was to try and get more people to watch Smackdown. You know, feature those guys on mondays so people might want to see them on fridays.

 

The idea was boost Raw's ratings. The problem is that, at best, only one guy from Smackdown (Orton) means anything because nobody else is treated like anyone super important. It also doesn't help that Smackdown guys consistently get treated like second-tier wrestlers when on the 'A' show so it does nothing to stop the perception of Smackdown being the secondary show rather than an equal to Raw.

[Teh_Showtime]

I don't think a 2.7 is that bad considering the NFL is the #1 sport in america

 

compared to the summer it wasn't a HUGE dropoff, they dipped below 3.0 a.couple times.

[juggaloninjalee]

I noticed last night that Netflix has some WWE videos.

 

I watched the Rise and Fall of WCW which was very interesting. Wish they went more in depth though. That's my only critique of that.

 

Also saw Ricky the Dragon Steamboats video which again was great. I really liked it and I felt it portrayed Steamboat as a guy who was one of the all time greats which he was.

 

I may watch another one tonight but this has me pretty happy right now. Hopefully they bring more WWE videos to Netflix.

[Hive]

Netflix has Rise and Fall of WCW now? Nice, better watch that. Watched a lot of their other wrestling documentaries, some good stuff here and there.

[juggaloninjalee]

Netflix has Rise and Fall of WCW now? Nice, better watch that. Watched a lot of their other wrestling documentaries, some good stuff here and there.

 

Which ones have you seen?

 

I have seen the Big Show one, Ricky Steamboat, and Death of WCW.

 

Plan on watching the 50 greatest superstars of all time, John Cena one, and top 20 personalities or whatever since 2000.

[ZMAN]

R&F of WCW is decent. It did feel like they spent the majority of it just bashing the hell out of the company though. I can't imagine any passionate WCW fan relying on that DVD as a good source of information. For me it was good, because I just remember hating WCW back in the day and being such an anti-WCW mark. But I imagine if I was actually a WCW fan, then I would **** all over that dvd. Pretty much all that I learned from it was that the people working there had their heads up their asses 90% of the time. Oh and some **** about Crocket promotions was in there too.

[Hive]

Which ones have you seen?

 

I have seen the Big Show one, Ricky Steamboat, and Death of WCW.

 

Plan on watching the 50 greatest superstars of all time, John Cena one, and top 20 personalities or whatever since 2000.

 

Well I have actually seen the WCW one before, it's just been a while.

 

On Netflix, I've seen most of the documentaries - except for the one about Cena, since he doesn't interest me. And the 50 greatest superstars, I just couldn't get through.

 

But watched Steamboat, Bret Hart, Big Show, Hardy Boyz... and I think that's pretty much all they have in terms of documentaries. They also have some mostly-matches stuff, like one with The Rock. I watched that as well, but I find the documentaries to be the most interesting.

[Hive]

R&F of WCW is decent. It did feel like they spent the majority of it just bashing the hell out of the company though. I can't imagine any passionate WCW fan relying on that DVD as a good source of information. For me it was good, because I just remember hating WCW back in the day and being such an anti-WCW mark. But I imagine if I was actually a WCW fan, then I would **** all over that dvd. Pretty much all that I learned from it was that the people working there had their heads up their asses 90% of the time. Oh and some **** about Crocket promotions was in there too.

 

Yeah it does bash WCW a lot. Not as much as the Monday Night Wars documentary, but still a lot. And I cannot for the love of it understand why a guy like Triple H, who worked there for like one day, has to featured so heavily on that dvd. Him bitching about losing to Alex Wright is nothing but arrogant crap, and shouldn't be there.

 

Still, it's better than nothing...

[djthefunkchris]

I was messing around, broski. Trying to add some levity to what amounts to a very familiar whine-fest in low ratings discussions. My lolz didn't work. Sorry.

 

 

I understand you are "concerned" but the people that complain about low buyrates, attendances, and ratings really add nothing new to the discussion. It's all been said before. It just comes across as aimless whining to me at this point. WWE still does decent enough numbers and RAW and Smackdown are still among the highest rated shows on their respective networks. So the shows aint going anywhere and neither is the WWE.

 

But you are rightly entitled to your opinion as I am mine. I guess I just fail to see a valid opinion in "ratings are low... yeah..." type posts.

 

Although I wouldn't put it that harshly, I do agree. As a point I made before stated, competition makes for better watching, and right now they have none and haven't since the end of WCW. Want them to do better shows, get TNA to be competitive somehow.... At least I think it would work.

 

The example used was a four year time period, and yet if you go back four years on this very board, you will see certain people saying the exact same thing then, and if you go back farther, you will see it again and again... It's kind of a "doom" discussion that has proven to be wrong over the years, at least in any amount of realistic time period. 20 years go by, they might fold, who knows... Vince won't be around forever, and really I don't expect it to stay where they are after he's actually done completely with the company, for whatever reason that would be. Perhaps someone better might take charge, but it's kind of hard for me to believe that, since the only one that come close had to spend more money then they made to compete.

 

I honestly don't expect Pro-Wrestling to stay at this level forever...

[Fantabulous]

The Rise and Fall of WCW documentary is one of those deals that seems informative on a superficial level but doesn't offer a lot beyond that. The problem is that to tell an accurate account of what happened with WCW's rise and fall would take a great deal of time and would also require acknowledging things WWE just isn't going to. It's a story that WWE do have the capability of telling but they lack the willingness to do so and there probably isn't enough of a market for the story that they'd see it was worth doing. Even with what they do put in the documentary, there's too much bull****ting, either because that's the spin they want to put or because they're not that worried about accuracy, to give it much of a recommendation. I can say it's a good for a laugh but only if you want to get a chuckle out of some very obvious bull****ting.

[bigtplaystew]

Macho Man's DVD on there is spectacular, as is The Rock's. The Rock's has full matches. All of them in fact.

 

Also, the Best of Nitro DVD is well worth watching. It's obviously got the post-takeover spin to it which annoys some people, but there are quality matches on there. The Jericho/Mysterio match is one of the better matches of that entire era if you ask me. Very good stuff.

[juggaloninjalee]

Macho Man's DVD on there is spectacular, as is The Rock's. The Rock's has full matches. All of them in fact.

 

Also, the Best of Nitro DVD is well worth watching. It's obviously got the post-takeover spin to it which annoys some people, but there are quality matches on there. The Jericho/Mysterio match is one of the better matches of that entire era if you ask me. Very good stuff.

 

Those are all on Netflix?

[bigtplaystew]

Those are all on Netflix?

 

Yep just do some searching they are all on netflix streaming. At least they WERE but I'm pretty sure they still are. There's some really good ones on there but for some reason the Cena one and the Steamboat one don't have the matches from the DVD on there.

 

 

A really good WWE produced doc is that "True Story of Wrestlemania" one thats on there. Pretty interesting.

 

Just know that every WWE produced doc has their spin on it. Doesn't make it all lies or anything, but just keep that in mind and you'll be entertained more easily.

 

 

I like the 50 greatest Superstars of All Time. Their order is B.S. but the little clips are entertaining to watch. It's done slightly out of storyline too so it's somewhat interesting. The Cage Matches one is great.

 

Yea their WWE library is fairly extensive. Also, Hunt to Kill and Knockout (Stone Cold movies) and the last two WWE produced films (Legendary and I am what I am) are on there if you're interested.

[Fantabulous]

I figure it goes here with him being fired, but Matt Hardy has been arrested again, on another DWI charge.

[juggaloninjalee]

Yep just do some searching they are all on netflix streaming. At least they WERE but I'm pretty sure they still are. There's some really good ones on there but for some reason the Cena one and the Steamboat one don't have the matches from the DVD on there.

 

 

A really good WWE produced doc is that "True Story of Wrestlemania" one thats on there. Pretty interesting.

 

Just know that every WWE produced doc has their spin on it. Doesn't make it all lies or anything, but just keep that in mind and you'll be entertained more easily.

 

 

I like the 50 greatest Superstars of All Time. Their order is B.S. but the little clips are entertaining to watch. It's done slightly out of storyline too so it's somewhat interesting. The Cage Matches one is great.

 

Yea their WWE library is fairly extensive. Also, Hunt to Kill and Knockout (Stone Cold movies) and the last two WWE produced films (Legendary and I am what I am) are on there if you're interested.

 

Yeah I have been able to enjoy them knowing they are somewhat biased so far. I love most things involving wrestling.

 

I figure it goes here with him being fired, but Matt Hardy has been arrested again, on another DWI charge.

 

I don't know what him and Jeffs problems are. They have blown so many good opportunities. They are a joke. I've never been a fan but these guys could be at the top of wrestling if they weren't such screw ups.

[bigtplaystew]

The Hardys problem? uhm... drugs...

[Hive]

But watched Steamboat, Bret Hart, Big Show, Hardy Boyz... and I think that's pretty much all they have in terms of documentaries. They also have some mostly-matches stuff, like one with The Rock. I watched that as well, but I find the documentaries to be the most interesting.

 

Oooh, forgot to mention the Bobby Heenan and Chris Jericho documentaries as well. Good stuff.