The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread May Contain Spoilers

Astil · September 17, 2013

Actually, when is the last time he lost? In a match I mean. He's beaten every one of the shield in 1 on 1, John Cena and Randy Orton. If that's not a push I don't know what is. Yeah he gets beat. But when someone doesn't get beat they're a "superman" and it's bad. I'm not picking on you because you do have valid points but this has always bugged me. This storyline stink because Bryan gets beat up all the time but somehow always finds a way to win. He should be made to look more strong. Cena stinks because he gets beat up all the time but somehow always finds a way to win. He shouldn't look so strong. See the problem?

Bryan is fighting the odds, which Punk did against HHH, Stone Cold did against McMahon and even as far back as Hogan did against Andre (slamming the giant and all that). It's rather basic to me, face gets win, heels attack after the match, face continues to want to fight heels, repeat.

Teh_Showtime · September 17, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="alphadraighon" data-cite="alphadraighon" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>There's a fine difference between a building heat and making someone look bad. I think they've crossed that line recently. I realize that the storyline IS about how HHH doesn't think that Bryan is a worthy main eventer or champion, but that being said they should be showing that he actually IS. They've put the title on him twice in six weeks...and he's lost it within 24 hours both times. He's gotten the big win at the PPVs, and been left unconscious almost every other time.</div></blockquote> So you say they should be showing that he deserves it but then just gloss over his two wins in PPV main events? He's never getting beaten in a 1 on 1 situation he always loses 3 or 4 on 1 and it's usually after he's had a good amount of offense. Bryan could look a LOT worse in this feud. And must I say that Dusty and Steph segment was one of the best I've seen in a VERY long time. When the Shield came out I didn't think it could actually get better but it did. Stephanie is doing a hell of a job out there as a ruthless heel, and Dusty cut by far his best promo since he retired in my opinion. I'm usually not a fan of the Big Show crying and manipulating but the fact that he was forced to destroy a 70 year old man just makes them (Stephanie especially) come across as cold and unforgiving.

alphadraighon · September 17, 2013

It's not a matter of that they are doing it. It's how they are doing it, and why.

As for the superman comparison...I can't say I remember the time that Cena ended almost every show on his back. I can't remember the last time he "needed" the whole babyface locker room to come out and help him clear the ring of four guys. See what I'm saying?

Like I said at first, it's a gut feeling, mostly. I can't exactly put my finger on any one thing that they are doing wrong that I could use to say "gee, it's obvious to me..." It's not a poorly executed story. The details feel like they're just putting more effort into making him look weak than anything else. I think that because they've spent most of the last decade building things around Cena that they've created this air (intentionally or otherwise) that he's the ONLy top guy, he's the only "true" hero of the company, and that without him everything falls apart. THAT is what this story feels like to me, and I think that in the end that is hurting Bryan and the other babyfaces.

I don't know. Maybe I'm rambling. In truth, whether I like it or not, it's got me talking about it, which is something I don't often do. I guess in that respect, regardless of the details, the storyline is a success, which in the end is what matters.

alphadraighon · September 17, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Teh_Showtime" data-cite="Teh_Showtime" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So you say they should be showing that he deserves it but then just gloss over his two wins in PPV main events? He's never getting beaten in a 1 on 1 situation he always loses 3 or 4 on 1 and it's usually after he's had a good amount of offense. Bryan could look a LOT worse in this feud.</div></blockquote> I didn't gloss over it. I mentioned right away that they immediately took the title off of him both times. Yes, he didn't lose the belt in a match, and the "uncrowned champion" thing works for a lot of people. But as a fan, seeing someone win a title and then immediately lose it screams of "we don't think he should be the guy."

Astil · September 17, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="alphadraighon" data-cite="alphadraighon" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>It's not a matter of that they are doing it. It's how they are doing it, and why. As for the superman comparison...I can't say I remember the time that Cena ended almost every show on his back. I can't remember the last time he "needed" the whole babyface locker room to come out and help him clear the ring of four guys. See what I'm saying? Like I said at first, it's a gut feeling, mostly. I can't exactly put my finger on any one thing that they are doing wrong that I could use to say "gee, it's obvious to me..." It's not a poorly executed story. The details feel like they're just putting more effort into making him look weak than anything else. I think that because they've spent most of the last decade building things around Cena that they've created this air (intentionally or otherwise) that he's the ONLy top guy, he's the only "true" hero of the company, and that without him everything falls apart. THAT is what this story feels like to me, and I think that in the end that is hurting Bryan and the other babyfaces. I don't know. Maybe I'm rambling. In truth, whether I like it or not, it's got me talking about it, which is something I don't often do. I guess in that respect, regardless of the details, the storyline is a success, which in the end is what matters.</div></blockquote> For Cena the Nexus and Henry. As for what else you're say...I think I get what you're saying. Can't say I agree, but I see what where you coming from. I kinda want to say "give them a shot" especially since they've done good building Bryan so far and the last time they made a big deal about Cena losing was Punk and Punk parlayed that into a year plus title run. That said I can see the ... hesitance I guess.

Tha Black Phenom · September 17, 2013

They're doing nothing wrong with Bryan. The only reason he ends up with his back on the mat almost every night is to magnify the fact that this is a numbers game. There was the [then] WWE champion, along with the deadliest stable on the roster, with the boss and the boss' wife in their backpocket, how else would it go?

All of a sudden it's easy to forget they had Bryan go over John Cena CLEAN. And I can't even remember the last time he got pinned on Raw, not to mention he had his little stint of overcoming the odds in that gauntlet and other contests before SummerSlam.

Even disregarding all that, just look at the crowd reactions every week. That should tell you enough he's not going anywhere, even if they're keeping the hot seat for John Cena at least they have a viable alternative now(other than Punk as well).

TheWrestlingMan · September 17, 2013

Did anyone not see this coming? After I heard the count was fast I already knew he would be stripped. WWE is just so boring and predictable to me right now. This storyline with HHH and Company is just boring you have the most boring two main eventers with Randy and DB and it's just not entertaining me at all. I was starting to like WWE again but I haven't even been able to get past an hour of a Raw in 3 or 4 weeks. DB is a great wrestler but he's just plain and boring and the same goes for Randy. The faster they end this the better imo.

Rickymex · September 17, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TheWrestlingMan" data-cite="TheWrestlingMan" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Did anyone not see this coming? After I heard the count was fast I already knew he would be stripped. WWE is just so boring and predictable to me right now. This storyline with HHH and Company is just boring you have the most boring two main eventers with Randy and DB and it's just not entertaining me at all. I was starting to like WWE again but I haven't even been able to get past an hour of a Raw in 3 or 4 weeks. DB is a great wrestler but he's just plain and boring and the same goes for Randy. The faster they end this the better imo.</div></blockquote> Are you trolling?

TheWrestlingMan · September 17, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Rickymex" data-cite="Rickymex" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Are you trolling?</div></blockquote> Not at all, this is my opinion on this crap the E is feeding out right now. Cena might nor be able to wrestle but he's at least mildly entertaining. DB isn't WWE Championship material imo, He is a real solid Mid-Uppermid card guy who would do better with the IC and US belts. He is just so generic and bland it's hard to get behind the guy which is part of the terrible group they have in creative right now but also just the lack of charisma on DB's part.

djthefunkchris · September 17, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="alphadraighon" data-cite="alphadraighon" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I didn't gloss over it. I mentioned right away that they immediately took the title off of him both times. Yes, he didn't lose the belt in a match, and the "uncrowned champion" thing works for a lot of people. But as a fan, seeing someone win a title and then immediately lose it screams of "we don't think he should be the guy."</div></blockquote> That's kind of good, since the message they have been trying to send is "They don't want him as the guy."<img alt=";)" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/wink.png.686f06e511ee1fbf6bdc7d82f6831e53.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> <blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TheWrestlingMan" data-cite="TheWrestlingMan" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Not at all, this is my opinion on this crap the E is feeding out right now. Cena might nor be able to wrestle but he's at least mildly entertaining. DB isn't WWE Championship material imo, He is a real solid Mid-Uppermid card guy who would do better with the IC and US belts. He is just so generic and bland it's hard to get behind the guy which is part of the terrible group they have in creative right now but also just the lack of charisma on DB's part.</div></blockquote> I think DB has loads of charisma... I've watched some of the appearances on other programs he's made, and he was loaded with charisma. I can't wait for more of that to come through, as he has been showing more and more as time goes by... Not to mention all his prior stuff with Kane couldn't have been easy. I couldn't have kept a straight face through half of it, and I know Kane couldn't, seen him turn away from the camera quite a few times through that (to hide the fact he was laughing). I would absolutely love a mid-card loaded with Daniel Bryans. There used to be a time we had great characters like that in the midcard. Right now however, he's "THE" Main Event. It wouldn't matter if he was going up against Zack Ryder, he's going to Main Event the night. Also, just a FYI, Zeb and Heyman re-wrote a RAW on the spot one night, and I wouldn't be surprised (because that RAW was awesome) if they aren't being consulted more often then not these days.

Rickymex · September 17, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TheWrestlingMan" data-cite="TheWrestlingMan" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Not at all, this is my opinion on this crap the E is feeding out right now. Cena might nor be able to wrestle but he's at least mildly entertaining. DB isn't WWE Championship material imo, He is a real solid Mid-Uppermid card guy who would do better with the IC and US belts. He is just so generic and bland it's hard to get behind the guy which is part of the terrible group they have in creative right now but also just the lack of charisma on DB's part.</div></blockquote> Then I just don't understand how you can say Daniel Bryan lacks charisma. His World Heavyweight Championship heel run was filled with douchebag boyfriend and big ego charisma, his entire Team Hell No run was some of the best comedy in the WWE istory, and his slow weak link evolution and feuds with the Shield, Orton, and Cena were spetacular. There is nothing that would suggest a lack of charisma at all if you take into account how much he has connected with the crowd. Plus how is a small bushy beard technical genius with severe anger and napoleonic issues bland?

milamber · September 17, 2013

Night of Champions Review:

Tag Team Turmoil - Fast and fun but also botchy. Elimination order was good with PTP going over Real Americans as expected.

Opening Segment - Heyman stealing the show already. I knew the IC title had to be on the line but I thought it would be against Punk.

Axel vs Kofi (IC Title) - I'm glad Axel is pulling double duty. He gets way too much hate, IMO. Decent match. Perfect Plex would be a better finisher for Axel.

Natalya vs Naomi vs Brie vs AJ (Divas Title) - Way too botchy. Double Sharpshooter and Black Widow made it watchable.

RVD vs Del Rio (WHC Title) - Good match and a heelish win for Del Rio. RVD going ECW on his ass! Feud not over.

Fandango vs Miz - Average filler match.

Axel & Heyman vs Punk - Anaconda Vice! Punk vs Heyman was fun while it lasted. "I'm tapping! I'm tapping!" Ryback as the new Paul Heyman guy is interesting... maybe...

Ambrose vs Ziggler (US Title) - Decent match. I like Ambrose but his moveset is too boring. He's also yet to put on a great 1-on-1 match.

Shield vs PTP (Tag Titles) - Fun match. PTP looked like they had a legit chance of winning.

Bryan vs Orton (WWE Title) - Great match. Bryan won! Would have preferred Orton to win but most fans would have been too impatient so I can understand why they pulled the trigger. Plus that fast ref count is going to come into play.

Verdict: Underwhelming PPV that ended on a high note with Bryan's win. Predictable card and predictable results up until the main event. It was more like a good, filler-light episode of Raw but I'll give it a pass as it's obviously building on long term storylines heading towards Survivor Series. Hopefully Battleground won't be a throwaway PPV. MVPs of the night: Heyman, Bryan, Orton and PTP.

sebsy · September 17, 2013

Personally, I thought this was one of the worst PPV's for a long while.

ADR vs RVD was sloppy and just plain bad. Divas match was poor with terrible booking. One of the better matches was PTP vs Shield which says a lot. Think they've really done the wrong thing with the ending to the Orton vs Bryan match too.

milamber · September 17, 2013

Raw Review:

Opening Segment - Armstrong the corporate stooge. Vacant title is interesting. I'm glad Bryan didn't hand it over willingly. Did Steph just give Orton the go-ahead to start punting heads again?

Ambrose vs Ziggler - Much better than their NOC match. Ziggler wins!

Fandango vs Truth - Decent match but it's hard to care. Truth's "What's Up?" gimmick should be retired. At least Fandango (who should turn face) won and there were "Summer Rae" chants.

Dusty/Steph/Show/Shield - Great segment. I hope Dustin returns for a couple of months, then Cody can return for Survivor Series.

Divas - AJ was more interesting than the match... again. Headset conspiracy.

Sandow vs RVD - Solid match but I want Sandow to win occasionally.

Orton vs Miz - Mrs Miz is a decent actress. Mr Miz looks like he smoked some weed backstage. Good brawl.

Heyman/Ryback - Paulrus has a new crush <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/wink.png.686f06e511ee1fbf6bdc7d82f6831e53.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Ryback the Anti-Bully!

Real Americans vs TOF vs Usos - Multi tag team matches are fun. I'm down with the Usos getting another crack at the Shield.

New Wyatt promo - Epic win!

Reigns vs Bryan - Bryan twisting Reigns up like a pretzel. Reigns turning the tide with his power game. Rollins bump. PPV quality match. Locker-room revolt!

Verdict: Strong show. In retrospect it was actually a good pay-off for Night of Champions, which was all about maintaining the status quo (Bryan victory aside).

http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt88/milamber/armstrong-three-sixteen-6299_zpse11bc5fc.jpg~originalhttp://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt88/milamber/BUVHs6DIgAAZLedjpglarge_zps65f367d2.jpg~original

djthefunkchris · September 17, 2013

On RAW, loved the subtle hint in the HHH/Armstrong segment, where HHH kept cutting him off saying "Don't worry, I'll take care of you." Just like a mobster almost... "Take this fall and I'll make it worth it to you." It was pretty obvious he was going to say, "But Hunter, I only did what you told me to do."

panix04 · September 17, 2013

I have been really enjoying wwe lately, but I thought N.O.C was very underwhelming - rant on its way - from a mark perspective it was depressing only really one face getting the win - I barely count the miz match (can you be a face if nobody cares about you?) that match seemed a bit out if place anyway IMHO. ADR retained, which kind of makes sense as there is a shortage of heels at the right level to challenge for that belt, but I really find him dull - some heels I hate because they are damn good (see Paul heyman) some I hate because I want to fast forward them when they start talking - at least ADR has a few decent spots I like - unlike Curtis axel - I know as an Internet wrestling fan I should like him - but he's so generic and crap on the mic it is painful and the fact I had to endure him twice almost made me cry

the divas match was well booked in my opinion, AJ's great and nattie was made to look strong. Hopefully those two will eventually get put in an extended feud. The CM Punk match was alright but the ending irked me (in a markish way), I'm not a big ryback fan (although I loved him as an announcer the other week - actually made me chuckle) Im beyond irritated by the de-push of my hero dolph Ziggler - a few months ago he was getting massive pops and carrying the companies 2nd belt and now he's having to 'earn' US title shots? Every time he gets given a push he works his ass off only to have the ball taken away from him. Honestly I know he has a rep for being a whiner - but I can't blame him for being a tad miffed. So yeah! I hope the next ppv is a freebie or the stories on raw and sd had better be decent over the next few weeks because for the first time since wrestle mania I feel I wasted my cash on this ppv

sorry dont wanna sound negative - needed to get it out my system!!

panix04 · September 17, 2013

On a less rant-y note. Can we have the Rhodes trio on tv every week? Dusty amazing on the mic! Dustin looked better last week than he did 5 years ago!

djthefunkchris · September 17, 2013

I have been really enjoying wwe lately, but I thought N.O.C was very underwhelming - rant on its way - from a mark perspective it was depressing only really one face getting the win - I barely count the miz match (can you be a face if nobody cares about you?) that match seemed a bit out if place anyway IMHO. ADR retained, which kind of makes sense as there is a shortage of heels at the right level to challenge for that belt, but I really find him dull - some heels I hate because they are damn good (see Paul heyman) some I hate because I want to fast forward them when they start talking - at least ADR has a few decent spots I like - unlike Curtis axel - I know as an Internet wrestling fan I should like him - but he's so generic and crap on the mic it is painful and the fact I had to endure him twice almost made me cry the divas match was well booked in my opinion, AJ's great and nattie was made to look strong. Hopefully those two will eventually get put in an extended feud. The CM Punk match was alright but the ending irked me (in a markish way), I'm not a big ryback fan (although I loved him as an announcer the other week - actually made me chuckle) Im beyond irritated by the de-push of my hero dolph Ziggler - a few months ago he was getting massive pops and carrying the companies 2nd belt and now he's having to 'earn' US title shots? Every time he gets given a push he works his ass off only to have the ball taken away from him. Honestly I know he has a rep for being a whiner - but I can't blame him for being a tad miffed. So yeah! I hope the next ppv is a freebie or the stories on raw and sd had better be decent over the next few weeks because for the first time since wrestle mania I feel I wasted my cash on this ppv sorry dont wanna sound negative - needed to get it out my system!!

This is what I think the overall concern is about making PPV's lead in to TV (RAW). I knew going in that this PPV was going to be a story continued edition, which in turn tells me it's not worth buying. RAW is what ended up answering questions to go forward, not the PPV. This is something that I read they were going to do, and I mentioned it before. It's to help bring up show ratings. I guess the concern of PPV buys isn't as heavy for some PPV's.

Ziggler can move around to any place on the card, and he can help every place on the card with his fantastic selling, and somewhat flashy in ring work. Right now he is helping with a midcard belt that needs help... as Heyman has been helping out the other one.

Of course I've never seen Ziggler as a big money maker, although I too cheered when he won, and his reaction made it all the better. Since then, he hasn't shown any of the charisma I've been waiting for him to show, as many times as he has had to talk, nothing comes through. "I've been too damn good for too damn long!" is the only thing he really said, and it was far from the best thing to say to get the kind of reactions he needs for people to buy into him. He really needed to keep that air of excitement about it, and it would have paid off better I believe.

Far as the PPV in general, it was only a so/so PPV, with Bryan's match being the only real pay off for the crowd. OF course that was took away the very next day, but it was still there for the PPV.

Russelrules44 · September 17, 2013

Right......

In other words, Paul Heyman has saved Ryback's career, Thanks to CM Punk........kinda..........ok, so it was mostly Ryback kicking Punk's ass at the end of CM Punk vs Axeyman, and that table?...The exclamation point....so that just leaves me with 1 question...

Does that mean he's done with the bullying?, If so, Good, I actully perfer Ryback Rules more than the bully called Ryback.

Rickymex · September 17, 2013

John Cena is truly one of the nicest guys in the world.

And Cesaro is determined to send Kofi back to Ghana.

djthefunkchris · September 18, 2013

Antonio Cesaro did something similar before....

http://grizzlybomb.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/WWE-Monday-Night-Raw-Recap-Review-3413-Antonio-Cesaro-The-Miz-Barricade.gif

It's such a funny thing to do for someone that is supposedly soooo serious all the time. Just adds to his character in a good way.

djthefunkchris · September 18, 2013

Right......

In other words, Paul Heyman has saved Ryback's career, Thanks to CM Punk........kinda..........ok, so it was mostly Ryback kicking Punk's ass at the end of CM Punk vs Axeyman, and that table?...The exclamation point....so that just leaves me with 1 question...

Does that mean he's done with the bullying?, If so, Good, I actully perfer Ryback Rules more than the bully called Ryback.

I don't really prefer either one, I liked the "Feed Me More" Ryback. The guys loaded with charisma, or should I say character, they just need to find the right thing for him. I have hopes that Heyman delivers with him. His reaction to the kiss on the cheek by Heyman was perfect... Reminded me of old Jerry Lewis type stuff. Ryback's reaction was kind of like he was saying "Wow! How about that everyone!" That smile he has, when it's genuine (or when it at least looks genuine), is something that will help him if used right.

http://whatistheexcel.com/wooobooru/_images/4210a913c5b1e6832951066e728da036/7908%20-%20ryback%20wwe%20yelling.png

It's like Mark Henry. I don't care how bad and mean he acts, if you look at his face, no matter how he's acting, you can't help but to think "Momma's Boy." http://www.wwehunks.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Mark-Henry-Hair-Style.jpg

Plus, Mark Henry probably has the prettiest smile of all the guys on the roster.

http://www.wwe24seven.com/images/19/mark-henry-41.jpg

Russelrules44 · September 18, 2013

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="djthefunkchris" data-cite="djthefunkchris" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I don't really prefer either one, I liked the "Feed Me More" Ryback. The guys loaded with charisma, or should I say character, they just need to find the right thing for him. I have hopes that Heyman delivers with him. His reaction to the kiss on the cheek by Heyman was perfect... Reminded me of old Jerry Lewis type stuff. Ryback's reaction was kind of like he was saying "Wow! How about that everyone!" That smile he has, when it's genuine (or when it at least looks genuine), is something that will help him if used right. http://whatistheexcel.com/wooobooru/_images/4210a913c5b1e6832951066e728da036/7908%20-%20ryback%20wwe%20yelling.png It's like Mark Henry. I don't care how bad and mean he acts, if you look at his face, no matter how he's acting, you can't help but to think "Momma's Boy." http://www.wwehunks.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Mark-Henry-Hair-Style.jpg Plus, Mark Henry probably has the prettiest smile of all the guys on the roster. http://www.wwe24seven.com/images/19/mark-henry-41.jpg</div></blockquote> I loved Feed Me More! I wonder why he gave it up?

Astil · September 18, 2013

Never been a huge fan of the Ryback, but I do agree with what DJ said. He has the Miz ability to look likes he's having a good time torturing you. Very hate-able.

milamber · September 18, 2013

http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt88/milamber/1185259_587985294582545_751910319_n_zpsa0eae338.jpg~originalhttp://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt88/milamber/image_zpseaeb8f07.jpg~originalhttp://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt88/milamber/0l5dQe5_zps37c25a1a.jpg~original

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The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread May Contain Spoilers