The Official MMA Discussion Thread

[brashleyholland]

I watched Couture/Lesnar for the first time the other day and was wondering, why did Brock get that shot when Big Nog had the interim belt? And was Brock expected to lose? To quote himself "I saw a 220 pound man I was going to just crush..." xD

 

The simple answer is $$$. The slightly more convoluted one is that UFC Champion Randy Couture had walked out on the UFC to fight Fedor and was in the midst of a contract dispute.

 

So Nog held the interim belt, but the UFC were planning on the Couture thing going to court, as he had Mark Cuban as a financial backer (Cuban wanted to put Couture vs Fedor on HDNet). Because they didn't know how long the Couture situation would last, they had to take a 'business as usual approach with the Interim Championship. Mir was the top contender, so they made the Mir/Nog match.

 

The one and only reason that Couture wasn't stripped of the title was that the dispute centred around the definition of 'retirement'...had the UFC stripped him of the belt (thus no longer recognising him as their champion, essentially acknowledging his 'retirement'), it would have been harder for them to argue in court that they expected him to return to the Octagon.

 

Also, TUF 12 is airing on Sky Sports, wonder how long it takes till they swallow it all...

 

I asked the UFC's UK president this, and I'm going to ask Dana at 120. As far as the 'here and now' goes, they have a long-ish deal with ESPN. I've been told that rumours of PPV are 'conspiracy theories'...that doesn't mean that a move to Sky Sports is out of the question in the future.

 

Part of this deal is that Sky News will cover the UFC...to me, this is a set up for Sky to enter a bidding war with ESPN (one they'd be likely to win) for UFC events when the contract comes up.

 

It's a kicker for UK fans as many get ESPN free on BT Vision or Virgin media. Sky Sports is available on those platforms, but you have to pay an additional premium. As for right now, I don't have Sky Sports. If I want to watch football that isn't on ESPN, I go to the pub. If I want to watch TUF (which is being aired 6 days later than the US broadcast) I have to pay for Sky Sports. MMA fans simply aren't going to pay that for TUF. It was bed enough asking them to wait three/four days in the past, but a week? Plus, who watches weekly episodic programming on a premium sports channel? Will TUF get pre-empted for live sports (yes)?

 

Now, I've got a lot of stick from US fans in the past when I've written about what a bad move it would be for the UFC to try PPV in the UK. The argument that "You guys shouldn't complain because we've been paying for it for years" simply doesn't wash. The UK does not do PPV, simple as. Whether it's 'fair' or not is irrelevant.

[The Shape]

I asked the UFC's UK president this, and I'm going to ask Dana at 120. As far as the 'here and now' goes, they have a long-ish deal with ESPN. I've been told that rumours of PPV are 'conspiracy theories'...that doesn't mean that a move to Sky Sports is out of the question in the future.

 

Part of this deal is that Sky News will cover the UFC...to me, this is a set up for Sky to enter a bidding war with ESPN (one they'd be likely to win) for UFC events when the contract comes up.

 

It's a kicker for UK fans as many get ESPN free on BT Vision or Virgin media. Sky Sports is available on those platforms, but you have to pay an additional premium. As for right now, I don't have Sky Sports. If I want to watch football that isn't on ESPN, I go to the pub. If I want to watch TUF (which is being aired 6 days later than the US broadcast) I have to pay for Sky Sports. MMA fans simply aren't going to pay that for TUF. It was bed enough asking them to wait three/four days in the past, but a week? Plus, who watches weekly episodic programming on a premium sports channel? Will TUF get pre-empted for live sports (yes)?

 

Now, I've got a lot of stick from US fans in the past when I've written about what a bad move it would be for the UFC to try PPV in the UK. The argument that "You guys shouldn't complain because we've been paying for it for years" simply doesn't wash. The UK does not do PPV, simple as. Whether it's 'fair' or not is irrelevant.

 

All very interesting. Thought ESPN was part of a larger channel pack (the largest) on Virgin though so costs extra, annoyingly as I'm moving back to uni soon with four people who I'm gonna have to indoctrinate into watching it haha.

 

I could see them putting the PPVs on sky but so long as they don't go near Box Office I don't mind. I don't see how they could within a very long time frame anyway because WWE does it (and gets SSN coverage lol) but that has such a longer history and was formerly mainstream...and still I doubt many people buy it.

 

But as someone who by default goes to Sky Sports News whenever I turn a TV I'd love to see it covered on there, just hope they don't come at it with a really, I dunno, patronising tone? Not as many people have sky sports as I always imagined having been basically unable to live without it for so long, but still this seems like a huge step towards mainstream acceptance here. That, and Michael Bisping appearing in Hollyoaks

[brashleyholland]

All very interesting. Thought ESPN was part of a larger channel pack (the largest) on Virgin though so costs extra, annoyingly as I'm moving back to uni soon with four people who I'm gonna have to indoctrinate into watching it haha.

 

Yeah, it's free with XL on Virgin...although it works out at about the same price as getting the smallest TV package plus £12.99 a month for ESPN.

 

I could see them putting the PPVs on sky but so long as they don't go near Box Office I don't mind. I don't see how they could within a very long time frame anyway because WWE does it (and gets SSN coverage lol) but that has such a longer history and was formerly mainstream...and still I doubt many people buy it.

 

I don't have them to hand, but as far as I understand the WWE's PPV numbers are pretty insignificant.

 

Here's the issue though. When I was young, I would record WWE PPV's and watch them on Monday after school. My young cousin does the same thing, either records or watches the Box Office replay because he's too young to stay up till 4am on a Sunday.

 

With a live fight, the whole point is watching it live. We already know that people won't buy PPV over here, I'd wager that people won't pay to watch a next day replay either. By the time Sunday evening rolls around, results are all over the internet anyway - and now they'll be all over Sky Sports as well.

 

But as someone who by default goes to Sky Sports News whenever I turn a TV I'd love to see it covered on there, just hope they don't come at it with a really, I dunno, patronising tone? Not as many people have sky sports as I always imagined having been basically unable to live without it for so long, but still this seems like a huge step towards mainstream acceptance here. That, and Michael Bisping appearing in Hollyoaks

 

I'm sure they won't be patronising, but there is a conflict of interest. Sky Sports News is going to be covering the UFC...which is great, really great. But are they really going to push the boat out in terms of telling people they can watch the UFC on ESPN? Hmmm.

[Daffanka]

Barnett seems to have officially signed for Strikeforce which means they actually have an interesting heavyweight fight they can put on in the near future.

 

If you don't know who Barnett is or why you should be excited then watch this fight which, until Santiago - Misaki 2, was my favorite fight of all time.

 

Barnett hasn't fought decent competition in a long long time and we're maybe finally going to see how he stacks up to some of the guys who're decent to good in the MMA of today. Ideally he'd fight Fedor but if that fight screws up and Fedor doesn't want to fight Bigfoot maybe they can make that happen. Or he'll get Chad Griggs.

[The Shape]

Looks like Hughes/Penn 3 at 123. Huge match, not sure what BJ does if he loses though.

[brashleyholland]

Looks like Hughes/Penn 3 at 123. Huge match

 

I really don't think it is at this stage.

 

It's weird, this is a fight I've wanted to see for a long time...but now that it's here it means so little. I guess I was anticipating BJ moving back to 170lbs after clearing out the 155 division and taking the trilogy from Hughes as a way to get his feet wet at welterweight before going after a Fitch/Hardy.

 

Now, even if he wins he's still in limbo...can't put him back in the 155lb race as long as Edgar is around, same goes for GSP at 170. Maybe if St Pierre beats Kos and Shields/Kampmann he'll move up, but that's a long way off.

 

Still, should be an intriguing fight to watch.

 

not sure what BJ does if he loses though.

 

Surfing. I'm going to say surfing

[SaySo]

<p>Lashley wants a re-match with Chad Griggs</p><p> </p><p>

Former WWE and TNA wrestler Bobby Lashley says he wants a re-match against Chad Griggs, who gave him his first MMA loss at the "Strikeforce: Houston" card in August. Lashley says he's talked to Strikeforce about having his return fight by November.</p><p> </p><p>

Lashley claimed to Ariel Helwani of MMAFighting.com that he was not physically well going into his fight against Griggs. As we reported after the fight, Lashley was taken to a Houston hospital for IV treatment. Lashley revealed he needed IV treatment in the days leading up to the fight due to health complications.</p><p> </p><p>

"I already asked for a rematch, because when you have certain events like I did that sort of hindered me from being able to open up and fight, I've got to go back," Lashley said on the MMA Hour show.</p><p> </p><p>

"I'd hate for them to use that fight to boost somebody's career, saying, 'Okay, he beat Bobby,' because that wasn't really the case. If I didn't have these problems, and I'd been able to go out there and fight, I think it would have been a pretty quick win for me. But I just didn't have anything in me."</p><p> </p><p>

Lashley said he became fatigued in the second round of his fight against Griggs due to a variety of health issues. He said doctors discovered he had mononucleosis going into the fight, but they did not do blood work.</p><p> </p><p>

Blood work was done after the fight, Lashley said. As a result, he believes Strikeforce is waiting for the results before green-lighting a re-match against Griggs.</p><p> </p><p>

Lashley, who has remained very quiet since the loss to Griggs on August 21, said he'll take a different mindset into his next MMA fights without the pressure of being undefeated.</p><p> </p><p>

"Now I'm just going to go out there and fight. I'm not going to have any pressure on me. If they want to keep that as a loss, then keep that as a loss so I have a loss, because now I'm just going to go out there and fight," he said. "Because once you have a loss, you're not undefeated anymore so now I don't have to worry about that. So I can just go out there and fight."</p>

[Stennick]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="SaySo" data-cite="SaySo" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26660" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Former WWE and TNA wrestler Bobby Lashley says he wants a re-match against Chad Griggs, who gave him his first MMA loss at the "Strikeforce: Houston" card in August. Lashley says he's talked to Strikeforce about having his return fight by November.<p> </p><p> Lashley claimed to Ariel Helwani of MMAFighting.com that he was not physically well going into his fight against Griggs. As we reported after the fight, Lashley was taken to a Houston hospital for IV treatment. Lashley revealed he needed IV treatment in the days leading up to the fight due to health complications.</p><p> </p><p> "I already asked for a rematch, because when you have certain events like I did that sort of hindered me from being able to open up and fight, I've got to go back," Lashley said on the MMA Hour show.</p><p> </p><p> <strong>"I'd hate for them to use that fight to boost somebody's career, saying, 'Okay, he beat Bobby,' because that wasn't really the case. If I didn't have these problems, and I'd been able to go out there and fight, I think it would have been a pretty quick win for me. But I just didn't have anything in me."</strong></p><p> </p><p> Lashley said he became fatigued in the second round of his fight against Griggs due to a variety of health issues. He said doctors discovered he had mononucleosis going into the fight, but they did not do blood work.</p><p> </p><p> Blood work was done after the fight, Lashley said. As a result, he believes Strikeforce is waiting for the results before green-lighting a re-match against Griggs.</p><p> </p><p> Lashley, who has remained very quiet since the loss to Griggs on August 21, said he'll take a different mindset into his next MMA fights without the pressure of being undefeated.</p><p> </p><p> "Now I'm just going to go out there and fight. I'm not going to have any pressure on me. If they want to keep that as a loss, then keep that as a loss so I have a loss, because now I'm just going to go out there and fight," he said. "Because once you have a loss, you're not undefeated anymore so now I don't have to worry about that. So I can just go out there and fight."</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> HAHAHA stay classy Bobby. Boot somebodies career? You're a NOBODY, beating Bobby Lashley is barely a step up from beating any other scrub. The guy had an undefeated record through what? 3 or 4 fights? He's been in MMA for what? Less than a year full time? I'm not saying he wouldn't have won but he's not to a point where beating him helps anybodies career. More than it would against any number of nobody opponents.</p>

[Daffanka]

Didn't you see the tremendous boost Seth Petruzelli's career received when he beat Kimbo?

[brashleyholland]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26660" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>HAHAHA stay classy Bobby. Boot somebodies career? You're a NOBODY, beating Bobby Lashley is barely a step up from beating any other scrub. The guy had an undefeated record through what? 3 or 4 fights? He's been in MMA for what? Less than a year full time? I'm not saying he wouldn't have won but he's not to a point where beating him helps anybodies career. More than it would against any number of nobody opponents.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I think Lashley's problem is that he's got a ton of people around him telling him that he's the next Brock Lesnar, when that's clearly not the case. He's not as well-known, talented, charismatic or bankable in any way, shape or form. Lots of potential there, but the last 12 months have unfortunately proved that Lashley was too busy believing his own hype.</p>

[Stennick]

What the status of the freak show....er I mean fight between Batista and Lashley, was that just MMA fantasy booking or are they getting something done?

[brashleyholland]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26660" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>What the status of the freak show....er I mean fight between Batista and Lashley, was that just MMA fantasy booking or are they getting something done?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Still no deal with Batista...they were originally aiming for an October/November PPV with that fight and Fedor/Overeem...what with Fedor and Lashley losing and Batista not signing, and a whole host of other issues, it's not come off.</p>

[SaySo]

I don't see how Batista could even survive in MMA. He was like a bouncer before becoming a sports entertainer. If Batista is going to be fighting, maybe he should start with the Jose Cansecos of MMA (if he's even fighting still).

[brashleyholland]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="SaySo" data-cite="SaySo" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26660" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I don't see how Batista could even survive in MMA. He was like a bouncer before becoming a sports entertainer. If Batista is going to be fighting, maybe he should start with the Jose Cansecos of MMA (if he's even fighting still).</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> You never know....he's a big dude, if he was matched up with a small 0-0 or 0-1 heavyweight then he might be able to pull off a win. In terms of him beating anyone even remotely relevant though, it's a non-starter. </p><p> </p><p> The plan was to feed him to Lashley, in the hope that people would pay for it based on their WWE backgrounds, and that the exposure could slingshot Lashley into a title fight against Fedor/Overeem/Werdum. It was a rotten idea.</p>

[Daffanka]

<p>The one advantage Batista would have is that he's rich so he'll be able to afford proper training. The disadvantage is that unless he's fighting Rob van Clief he's almost certainly going to be in worse physical condition than his opponent, even if they're an 0-1 fighter brought up from the regional circuit.</p><p> </p><p>

Also since there hasn't been a big outcry I'm assuming no one took the Marquardt greasing thing seriously. I'm glad he got a win and Toquinho really needs to learn when it's okay to complain. </p><p> </p><p>

Other things: Olivera is pretty awesome.</p>

[brashleyholland]

The one advantage Batista would have is that he's rich so he'll be able to afford proper training. The disadvantage is that unless he's fighting Rob van Clief he's almost certainly going to be in worse physical condition than his opponent, even if they're an 0-1 fighter brought up from the regional circuit.

 

 

Ron? I'd still put that guy ahead of Big Dave in the cardio stakes :-p

 

Also since there hasn't been a big outcry I'm assuming no one took the Marquardt greasing thing seriously. I'm glad he got a win and Toquinho really needs to learn when it's okay to complain.

 

Nobody took it seriously because it didn't happen, thank goodness. That team has a history of accusations, but unless we have a Men In Black-level conspiracy theory on our hands, it's all good. The officials checked him; no grease, no oil, no balm. It's all gravy baby.

 

Other things: Olivera is pretty awesome.

 

Yes, yes he is!

[ampulator]

I just can't see Batista making it. They would have to pit against that's pretty bad. Any smart fighter will take him the ground, and then he's dead in the water there.

[SaySo]

<p>Cael Sonnen at it again lol</p><p> </p><p>

<a href="http://mmajunkie.com/news/20641/ufc-poet-chael-sonnen-adds-georges-st-pierre-brock-lesnar-to-current-hit-list.mma?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+mmajunkie+%28MMAjunkie.com+Feed%29" rel="external nofollow">http://mmajunkie.com/news/20641/ufc-poet-chael-sonnen-adds-georges-st-pierre-brock-lesnar-to-current-hit-list.mma?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+mmajunkie+%28MMAjunkie.com+Feed%29</a></p><p> </p><p>

Sonnen didn't limit his challenges to fighters outside his own division. There were brief mentions of Michael Bisping ("I don't think I'm going to help his career") and Wanderlei Silva ("used to be a fighter"), for instance.</p><p> </p><p>

But as testament to his belief that it's simply not possible to bite off more than he can chew, Sonnen took his challenges all the way to the top – UFC heavyweight champion Brock Lesnar.</p><p> </p><p>

"If Brock Lesnar was here right now, I'd take my boot off and throw it at him, and he'd better polish it up before he brings it back to me," Sonnen said. "Talking about he's the baddest guy in the UFC? Brock, quit eating so many raw eggs and doing push-ups because it's affecting your realm of reality. Are you kidding me? I'd slap you in your face, and you wouldn't do anything.</p><p> </p><p>

"'I'm Brock Lesnar. I've got this $5 haircut and a knife tattooed on my chest.' I'll shove it up your face if you get in Chael Sonnen's way."</p><p> </p><p>

With that in mind, Sonnen debuted a poem-in-progress, currently titled "Anderson, who you gonna send?"</p><p> </p><p>

"Anderson, who you gonna send?"</p><p>

Anderson, think it through.</p><p>

There's still a few months before they lock the cage door behind me and you.</p><p>

Last time, they raised your hand, but it was plain to see</p><p>

I took a lot more about of you than you took out of me.</p><p>

I broke the mirror, and I blew away the smoke.</p><p>

It was me who tapped, but it was you who broke.</p><p> </p><p>

-Chael Sonnen</p>

[Stennick]

Its a shame MMA took off, these guys could be doing big business in pro wrestling. "I'll knock the tan off your socialist back" ha ha

[ampulator]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="26660" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Its a shame MMA took off, these guys could be doing big business in pro wrestling. "I'll knock the tan off your socialist back" ha ha</div></blockquote><p> You should be saying it's shame that wrestling is down, that MMA took off. <img alt=":p" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/tongue.png.ceb643b2956793497cef30b0e944be28.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[RingofHonorGuard]

Wow, Chael is really throwing himself out there this time. GSP vs. Sonnen sounds like a pretty interesting fight though, could be a good fight for GSP to move up to 185 on.

[Zoloftjunkie]

<p>Hey Sayso you could just provide a link to your articles instead of posting a huge post.</p><p> </p><p>

And this just in chael "I choked in the biggest fight in my life" sucknen is still a douche bag that needs to shut up.</p>

[Daffanka]

I don't really like this immediate rematch though I'm not sure who would've gotten the shot before him. It's one thing when it's a controversial call that could've gone either way like Machida - Shogun or Penn - Edgar but honestly that was about as clear cut a finish as you're going to get. MW has always had a lack of good challengers though so they're probably just running with something that's actually hot.

 

Glad to see Sonnen hasn't lost a step though

[brashleyholland]

So Sonnen has been busted for PEDs. Wow.

 

If he appeals successfully, then the proposed January rematch with Silva should be able to go ahead...it depends when the hearings are set etc. It's worth noting that a fighter successfully appealing a positive drug test is historically a rare occurrence.

 

Secondly, if he appeals unsuccessfully, or simply doesn't appeal, then he'll be looking at a year out, so August 7th, 2011. Sean Sherk appealed the length of his suspension and had it reduced to six months. That would put Sonnen's suspension at 7th of Feb. Either way, it kills the momentum for Silva Sonnen 2.

 

Regardless, I'd be highly surprised if the instant rematch goes ahead now. I guess we'll see for certain what's more important to the UFC; integrity or profit. I hope it's the former.

[brashleyholland]

Also, looks like Arlovski will indeed be involved in the 'WGP Final 16' event in Korea, although he won't be part of the tournament itself, instead competing in a superfight.

 

Sergei Kharitonov? And if so...why not just have them compete in an MMA fight? I guess the thought process behind it is that if one of them wins in a spectacular way, they could be useful as alternates for the WGP Finals.