The All Elite Wrestling Discussion Thread

[milamber]

- Darby vs Bowens was great. Andrade sauntering in like a boss.

- Technique by Taz feat. Hook.

- BunnyFord vs TayJay street fight was a Women's MOTY Contender. Bottle to the head. Bunny & Tay blading. Multiple chair bumps. Thumbtacks. Barbed Wire. This is awesome chants. Surprised the ref never put gloves on.

- Hype for Hangman/Danielson.

- Ego vs Cody © was great. Loud dueling chants for Cody.

[Jaysin]

Is it a cheap shot if it's the truth? Swole isn't any good. Her real life personality and struggles make her likable, but that doesn't change the fact that she's a mediocre at best worker.

 

Should the women's division get more tv time? Absolutely, but to claim there's a lack of diversity is fairly funny to me.

[Self]

Is it a cheap shot if it's the truth?

 

Yes.

 

I don't completely agree with Big Swole's opinion, and thought she was pretty terrible in the ring, but that was a massively unprofessional/childish comment from Tony. He needs some thicker skin and to put the social media away.

[Jaysin]

Meh, I guess I just see it as merely correcting a false narrative. She claimed she left because the company wasn't diverse enough when in reality, the owner of the company, who is also a person of color, let her contract expire because she isn't good at her job.

 

Can I see how it could be interpreted as immature and unprofessional? Yes, but I also see how he is getting ahead of a false narrative before it takes shape.

[aXminster]

Seems like the roster is split over the issue, depending on how they've been treated and how much they care about diversity.

 

Swole was interviewed about her experiences in AEW and was entitled to her opinion. TK should have discussed it with her instead of taking a cheap shot that made him look like an ass.

 

I doubt it will happen (because casuals probably won't know what happened) but it would be interesting if next week's important shows took a hit in the metrics Tony is so fond of lauding. He'd only have himself to blame.

 

Is anyone actually not gonna watch Bryan vs Hangman because Tony Khan said a bad worker is a bad worker?

 

Swole sucks and she has sucked forever. Her program with Britt Baker was terrible. I'm glad she's done with the company and I never wanna see her again. She was one of the AEW wrestlers that I wanted to see gone.

[Matt_Black]

I thought Swole had improved quite a bit, though in fairness, that took her up to the level of "passable".

[milamber]

Never understood the Swole hate. She was a little sloppy at times but until recently she was arguably better than Bunny & Penelope who were getting plenty of TV time. Even inexperienced talent like Velvet, Jade, Julia, Anna, Abadon & Blue had more opportunities.

 

Meanwhile Swole put over Britt and got relegated to Dark. Her and Diamante had to beg for a feud to get noticed. Their final match on Dark was good.

 

On top of that Swole has Crohn's Disease. It's amazing that she in such good shape and able to wrestle.

[Blackman]

The few matches I saw of her were decent considering she's not a vet (if they were short). She had a distinct look and had potential imo.

 

But if - upon not getting extended for not being good enough - you start yappin' how there's a lack of diversity, one can only raise his eyebrows. "Women not getting enough time? No black people?" Are you kidding me? Lashley, BigE, Belair,... These haven't been pushed lately, have they? And they certainly weren't champions.

 

Her daughter didn't feel "represented", because her dad's (Alexander) momentum got smashed after leaving the Hurt Business. Let's just classify her little outburst as frustration and move on. Maybe she gets a place in WWE. Could be nice, but I'm not watching it anymore so meh.

 

AEW might've started with the philosophy of getting the best out of every worker. I don't know if they succeed there as that seems superhard, even in TEW, but if you don't step up... Well... But again: what I've seen was decent.

[Peppermint Rage]

The few matches I saw of her were decent considering she's not a vet (if they were short). She had a distinct look and had potential imo.

 

But if - upon not getting extended for not being good enough - you start yappin' how there's a lack of diversity, one can only raise his eyebrows. "Women not getting enough time? No black people?" Are you kidding me? Lashley, BigE, Belair,... These haven't been pushed lately, have they? And they certainly weren't champions.

.

 

Bobbly Lashly, Big E and Bianca Belair, of course known top stars in AEW

[Mootinie]

I thought Big Swole was booked and presented as though she was both better and more experienced than she actually was. She was a four year pro being asked to do eight to ten minutes during her first reps on live television because the division had nobody else at the time. It did feel like she was exposed and she never really recovered from that. She wasn't given time to adapt to live TV and what that entails, it's a different animal to smaller indie shows and taped events where the editors can help you out. And it's so hard once you have one or two stinkers because then the pressure is really on. I felt for her when she wrestled Shida on the Dynamite Anniversary because, for Swole, the match had to be good. And it was not. It was really quite bad. Only Shida could get away with it when Swole couldn't. I roughly agree that she didn't "make the grade", but the pandemic and AEW's hiring practices at the time did her no favours.

[Matt_Black]

Not that the women's division didn't have a lot of green talent at the time, but unlike Britt Baker, Swole didn't have quite as much charisma and mic talent to make up for shortcomings in the ring.

 

It's just striking because we've so many other talents improve significantly in a relatively short time. Anna Jay, Tay Conti, Red Velvet, etc.

[ironfist]

I'm just gonna chime in as a guy who has been watching AEW from the jump with my thoughts on the Swole situation.

 

I never actively disliked her because she did seem like she was trying, plus she was being featured, as mentioned earlier, when the division was short on options. The thing is it does seem like her cries of lack of diversity are extremely hollow when you look at where AEW's womens division is currently.

 

The current TBS tournament is culminating at a huge show for them which is being highlighted by a massive World Title rematch and a Tag Title match that many are looking forward to. While all the matches in said tournament may not have all been great, you can't argue that the women haven't been featured and given ample time for their matches. Especially if you stack it against WWE's recent Queen's Crown tournament where only one match exceeded 3 minutes, the finals which came in around a whopping six minutes. Also Jade Cargill is in the finals of said tournament and most likely going to win, which again flies in the face of Swole's claims.

 

However, all of that being said I do believe that Tony Khan handled the situation poorly. He simply needed to point out things much as I did and didn't need to attack Swole personally. That was definitely amateurish and not a good look from the head of your company.

[Peppermint Rage]

They've put importance on the tournament and yet it's still an extremely rare special occurance for them to put more than one womens match on dynamite, I'd hardly consider one match in the the main show that is watched being featured

[ironfist]

I'd rather them have one women's match featured a show that has some kind of meaning, than 3 matches that are just thrown out there for no reason and given no time. They have limited TV time and a roster that is honestly probably too large, there are a number of men who people complain aren't getting enough time as well. They are also having a women's match on each Rampage pretty regularly.

 

They are at least trying to give many of their female talent something to do, the aforementioned TBS Tournament, Anna Jay and Tay Conti's extended feud with the Bunny and Penelope Ford, Hikaru Shida and Serena Deeb's feud. All of these have been long running and given ample time, not to mention Britt Baker being pushed as a big deal with segments every week. I'm not going to sit here and tell you it's perfect but I believe progress has been made from where the division started.

[crownsy]

Yes.

 

I don't completely agree with Big Swole's opinion, and thought she was pretty terrible in the ring, but that was a massively unprofessional/childish comment from Tony. He needs some thicker skin and to put the social media away.

 

Or, much like the Roster has said now, don't cry about your former boss being racist on twitter (a public forum) and then get mad when he calls you out on said public forum.

 

She can backtrack all she wants now and say she wasn't meaning to imply AEW was a racist company, but that's only because basically no one but Lio rush (who has since been like I talked to Tony, were good now) backed her up on that take and now she looks foolish.

 

Swole has a great story, but she clearly thinks she's a Main Event level talent and she just isn't. and everytime she isn't treated like one, she stays "true to herself!" and pops off on social media.

 

so yea, it is what it is. She was pissed off about being let go, wanted a response on her social media, she got one she didn't really like, and now she's "clarified" her position.

 

truly, Twitter is a cesspool lol

[crownsy]

Not that the women's division didn't have a lot of green talent at the time, but unlike Britt Baker, Swole didn't have quite as much charisma and mic talent to make up for shortcomings in the ring.

 

It's just striking because we've so many other talents improve significantly in a relatively short time. Anna Jay, Tay Conti, Red Velvet, etc.

 

aside from Red Velvet, all those prospects are already significantly better than Swole in the ring.

 

This might be best for her, if she can find a place that lets her work like 100+ match's a year she might really improve. Right now though her Mic work and Ring work are below where she thinks she should rate by a fair margin.

[Self]

Or, much like the Roster has said now, don't cry about your former boss being racist on twitter (a public forum) and then get mad when he calls you out on said public forum.

 

She can backtrack all she wants now and say she wasn't meaning to imply AEW was a racist company, but that's only because basically no one but Lio rush (who has since been like I talked to Tony, were good now) backed her up on that take and now she looks foolish.

 

Swole has a great story, but she clearly thinks she's a Main Event level talent and she just isn't. and everytime she isn't treated like one, she stays "true to herself!" and pops off on social media.

 

so yea, it is what it is. She was pissed off about being let go, wanted a response on her social media, she got one she didn't really like, and now she's "clarified" her position.

 

truly, Twitter is a cesspool lol

 

Sure. The world would be a better place without Twitter.

 

I don't know much about Big Swole's social media history, but I do remember when she got in Lance Archer's face during the early days of the pandemic. When asked to be a fan, she tried to get herself over at the expense of the show, and that told me she was no one I could get behind.

 

For me, it's Punching Up vs Punching Down. A disgruntled ex-employee having a moan? Pretty standard. The boss of an important company insulting an ex-employee ? That's a bit different. He already has the power. It's kicking someone when they're down. On Twitter of all things.

 

I agree with Tony Kahn on all things but execution. He was right to let her go. He was right for why he let her go. Just don't kick someone when they're down.

[crownsy]

Sure. The world would be a better place without Twitter.

 

I don't know much about Big Swole's social media history, but I do remember when she got in Lance Archer's face during the early days of the pandemic. When asked to be a fan, she tried to get herself over at the expense of the show, and that told me she was no one I could get behind.

 

For me, it's Punching Up vs Punching Down. A disgruntled ex-employee having a moan? Pretty standard. The boss of an important company insulting an ex-employee ? That's a bit different. He already has the power. It's kicking someone when they're down. On Twitter of all things.

 

I agree with Tony Kahn on all things but execution. He was right to let her go. He was right for why he let her go. Just don't kick someone when they're down.

 

I agree with all that except we all know Twitter narratives affect real life.

 

I'm not sure he can just leave it out there that AEW is basically a good ol' white boy network with regards to upper management when she took that to a public forum and never call her on that bull (which, spare me her 2000 word clarification on her blog that she was just speaking to diversity. her initial tweet broken down was AEW is run by a good ol' boy network too, sheep, that's why I'm "choosing to leave and be true to myself!" no you got fired functionally)

 

The pick up the phone thing works both ways. If she really believed that she needed to talk to him about how AEW was a good ol boys network, and has "qouta" diversity just to be able to say they do, then pick up the phone, not twitter.

[milamber]

I don't think Swole thought she was a main eventer. She was relied upon lot on early on because the women's roster was thin even though she only had 4 years experience and never been on TV... but management were never fully behind her like they were Britt, Jade, Velvet, Shida, Riho, Bunny, Ford etc. After the Britt feud she got relegated to Dark working squashes with even greener talent and kept off TV. Basically the same as WWE Catering/House show loop. How was she supposed to improve?

 

 

It’s Sunday, take time to actually listen to the podcast instead of reading headlines and excerpts.

 

Understand diversity isn’t just a statistic, counting us/POC isn’t the mindset.

 

Not one time did I ever mention anyone as racist.

 

Comprehension is key

 

https://t.co/p5bpFdq8dI

[Peppermint Rage]

I'd rather them have one women's match featured a show that has some kind of meaning, than 3 matches that are just thrown out there for no reason and given no time. They have limited TV time and a roster that is honestly probably too large, there are a number of men who people complain aren't getting enough time as well. They are also having a women's match on each Rampage pretty regularly.

 

They are at least trying to give many of their female talent something to do, the aforementioned TBS Tournament, Anna Jay and Tay Conti's extended feud with the Bunny and Penelope Ford, Hikaru Shida and Serena Deeb's feud. All of these have been long running and given ample time, not to mention Britt Baker being pushed as a big deal with segments every week. I'm not going to sit here and tell you it's perfect but I believe progress has been made from where the division started.

 

you for some reason you assume if there was more women's matches they'd be meaningless, you realize they could have multiple meaningful matches, and if they were meaningless that would be because there isn't enough women's stories, a problem easily solved by y'know having more women's stories

[Makhai]

They've put importance on the tournament and yet it's still an extremely rare special occurance for them to put more than one womens match on dynamite, I'd hardly consider one match in the the main show that is watched being featured

 

You can't beg them to sign 400 people, and then complain you can't get them on TV all the time. Most of the females in that company are projects, if I'm being kind. You tell FTR they can't work tonight because we need to clear 10mins for Swole versus Bunny. This was why I said they gotta be more selective, because they'll just logjam their roster. Here we are.

 

 

Swole going is a step in the right direction. And now that some of the WWE girls are coming free, getting rid of the projects that aren't panning out makes perfect sense.

 

With that said, Dynamite is quite 40s white guy at the moment.

[Blackman]

Bobbly Lashly, Big E and Bianca Belair, of course known top stars in AEW

 

Was she targeting AEW specifically? It seemed more like wrestling in general.

 

The point is that she was clearly just looking for reasons outside of herself. Hopefully her vision is clearer now.

[Jaysin]

Bryan vs Hangman II was incredible

[Matt_Black]

You tell FTR they can't work tonight because we need to clear 10mins for Swole versus Bunny.

 

Stop giving Dan Lambert air time and tell Cody to knock it off with the elaborate entrances and that's at least an extra 20 minutes per week.

[aXminster]

That was a nasty injury. Hope Rey Fenix recovers well.