The All Elite Wrestling Discussion Thread

[hollywoodshinebox]

6 hours ago, Matt_Black said:

Let's be honest- Will Ospreay is not as big a name as some fans like to think he is. He might be known to AEW fans, but a lot of the casual fans who watch WWE probably have less an idea of who he is.

He's a big name for what is the wrestling community, which are the ones buying all this stuff at the end of the day, even more in the case of AEW where there isn't yet the same casual appeal of other brands. A lot of people who accompany AEW know who Ospreay is and if they didn't know they got to when he showcased himself big time with the company. That's also why almost every time he got great reactions from the crowds, he didn't get crickets. 

[ColdBloodedSausageMaker]

6 hours ago, Matt_Black said:

Let's be honest- Will Ospreay is not as big a name as some fans like to think he is. He might be known to AEW fans, but a lot of the casual fans who watch WWE probably have less an idea of who he is.

 Both agree and disagree here.

You are absolutely right about most fans not knowing who Osprey is.

AEW also wants to start running Wembley every year, Osprey coming in was arguably their biggest English star and since Tony strapped a rock to him, Osprey has become even bigger. That win over Jericho at All In London absolutely was a star-making push for him.

If Osprey left for WWE, he might not come in a star but given that WWE wants to push guys so they run big UK Shows (Drew McIntyre for example) WWE would make Osprey a star.

It's addition to AEW in part by subtraction.

Look at Sheamus, someone who isn't nearly as skilled or talented or has Osprey's star quality, WWE absolutely stuck a rocket on him and have continued to give him a push because of who Sheamus can draw to the product.

[aXminster]

Ospreay is the best name they could add to the roster. I'd take him over Copeland any day of the week.

I read some fantasy booking about last night's main event and I really liked one that said it would be great if Adam Cole threw in the towel and caused MJF to lose the belt. Exactly what he did to Cody. The majority of people seemed to hate the ME so I'm glad I didn't waste my time.

[Dawn]

9 hours ago, Matt_Black said:

It's really like something Vince would do. Like, when they announce a mystery partner, and then it turns out it's someone we see on the show every week, and they're not big enough a star to really justify the suspense. "Who will Becky Lynch tag with against Damage CTRL? Could it be- oh. It's Natalya. That's fine, I guess."

Mystery partners in WWE are mostly lowkey (not to say they aren't disappointments from time to time, they are) and they're not a frequent enough occurrence to be considered a meme. Tony's big announcements are hyped to oblivion and turn out to be mostly completely unnecessary. Was there really not a better way to 'debut' Ospreay as an official member of the roster?

Edited November 19, 2023 by Dawn

[The Swanton825]

3 hours ago, Dalton said:

Compare Toni Storm vs. Jamie Hayter from Full Gear 2022 and Timeless Toni vs. Hikaru Shida from Full Gear 2023.

Spoiler: the former was a much better match with much more heat.

I was talking about the gimmick, not match quality. If we're judging gimmicks solely by match quality, then Taker's biker gimmick was better than any of his Deadman personas because he had most of his best Mania matches as Biker Taker.

[milamber]

- Lethal vs Kingston (c) - Stoke's commentary was the best part. ***
- Claudio vs Buddy - *** 1/2
- Gunns vs Joe & MJF (c) - ADAM! *** 1/4

- Christian & Sons vs Sting, Darby & Copeland. - Brilliant entrance. - *** 3/4
- Cassidy (c) vs Mox - Unexpected winner. ****
- Toni vs Shida (c) - New Champ. Mariah! *** 3/4
- Tag Title Ladder match - **** 1/4
- Julia vs Goth Blue vs Statlander (c) - This match overdelivered.**** 1/4
- Hangman vs Swerve - MOTN. Most brutal AEW match ever. Staples were a nice change from the usual thumbtacks. Blood drinking was too much. **** 3/4
- Golden Jets vs Young Bucks - ****
- Jay vs MJF (c) - Overbooking made Jay look a bit weak but MJF's selling carried it. No devil... *** 3/4

Not a Top 5 PPV but very entertaining. TK hitting back at criticism that he doesn't pivot plans to capitalize on hot wrestlers with wins for Toni, Julia & Swerve. Christian & Swerve entrances were perfect. Line of the Year from Nigel: "Matching staples now."

Edited November 20, 2023 by milamber

[milamber]

Strap the rocket and make him next AEW Champion.

[Dawn]

45 minutes ago, The Swanton825 said:

I was talking about the gimmick, not match quality. If we're judging gimmicks solely by match quality, then Taker's biker gimmick was better than any of his Deadman personas because he had most of his best Mania matches as Biker Taker.

Really curious to an elaboration of this take ngl lol Taker's latter run as Deadman from 2007 to 2013 produced his best matches is the most common perception, at the very least (one I agree with)

[The Swanton825]

58 minutes ago, Dawn said:

Really curious to an elaboration of this take ngl lol Taker's latter run as Deadman from 2007 to 2013 produced his best matches is the most common perception, at the very least (one I agree with)

His two matches with Triple H didn't come close to his match with him at WM 17, the HBK matches were great but felt like the same match (I always find myself mixing up which spots happened at 25 or 26), and I honestly didn't give much of a crap about his match with Punk while it was happening since there was zero chance Punk was winning. As I'm writing this, I'm also realizing two things: how many bad matches Taker got saddled with at Mania (It wasn't until 14 that he even had a good one) and two: matches I thought were Mania were on other PPVs. Don't know why the heck I thought his Hell in a Cell match with Lesnar was at WM. Too many head injuries for this guy, obviously.

EDIT: Add another one to the head injury count. I forgot the last thing I was going to say. My idiocy caused me to pick a bad example, but my point remains that gimmick quality and match quality are not a 1:1 thing.

Edited November 20, 2023 by The Swanton825

[FellaLibby]

4 hours ago, The Swanton825 said:

EDIT: Add another one to the head injury count. I forgot the last thing I was going to say. My idiocy caused me to pick a bad example, but my point remains that gimmick quality and match quality are not a 1:1 thing.

This is why in TEW we have gimmick ratings lol

[Matt_Black]

Taker's best match as the American Badass, in my opinion, was the ladder match with Jeff Hardy, though that was more for the story, character work, and announcing than the actual match quality. "C'mon kid! Make yourself famous! Climb, you crazy bastard! CLIMB!!!"

[Jaysin]

Well they walked back on Eddie Kingston defending his titles every match. 

[MightyDavidson]

4 hours ago, Jaysin said:

Well they walked back on Eddie Kingston defending his titles every match. 

Given one of those titles isn't theirs, they might not have had a choice in that.

[Mootinie]

The stipulation that winning the C2 meant you won a belt to be defended in ROH and NJPW STRONG was super odd. Why would any AEW talent want to win that? Well done on surviving that grueling tournament, you’re off to our developmental brand’s TV tapings and a much smaller feeder league for a Japanese promotion. Always sounded pretty dumb, just give them a trophy and parlay it into a World title shot. 

[aXminster]

MJF vs Samoe Joe just happened a few weeks ago. I really wanted a different main event.

[milamber]

- Swerve vs Lethal was good.

- I think the Devil is either Kyle (working for Cole) or Perry. Joe has come to collect.

- Cassidy, Shibata & Hook vs Former JAS was solid. Danhausen!

- Poor Roddy. Wholesome Christian Cage family segment. Killswitch engaged.

- Rush vs White was good.

- Fantastic speech from Timeless Toni. Shame the new TBS Champion Julia didn't get a segment on TBS

- Blue vs Jay vs Ruby was solid. It felt a bit rushed.

- Briscoe vs Mox was good. Long overrun.

[Self]

I like the concept of the Continental Cup. I love the G1 and ripping it off has always been one of my favourite things to do in TEW. Probably could have done with a few weeks of build, but I'm glad they're doing it. Maybe in a few years, with the right winners, it'll have some prestige behind it.

 

[Jaysin]

4 hours ago, aXminster said:

MJF vs Samoe Joe just happened a few weeks ago. I really wanted a different main event.

Its been over two months

[aXminster]

47 minutes ago, Jaysin said:

Its been over two months

And since then, Joe has beaten Willie Mack, Keith Lee plus 3 squashes (Tony Nese, Rhett Titus and Jon Cruz), besides the tag match with MJF.

No need for this to be on a pay-per-view main event.

[Jaysin]

20 minutes ago, aXminster said:

And since then, Joe has beaten Willie Mack, Keith Lee plus 3 squashes (Tony Nese, Rhett Titus and Jon Cruz), besides the tag match with MJF.

No need for this to be on a pay-per-view main event.

Joe gets a bigger reaction than most of the roster. Not giving him a title shot is dumb. Audiences want him in the main event. You are in the minority here judging by social media reactions to the announcement. 

[aXminster]

1 hour ago, Jaysin said:

Joe gets a bigger reaction than most of the roster. Not giving him a title shot is dumb. Audiences want him in the main event. You are in the minority here judging by social media reactions to the announcement. 

I feel like I'm totally disconnected from the rest of the AEW audience lol I don't like 80% of the stuff that most people seem to love (Orange Cassidy, Danhausen, The Acclaimed, Moxley etc)

But AEW is still the only company I like and for a PPV main event I'm not really looking forward for this match. Could've done it for Winter is Coming or something else.

[aXminster]

One can dream...

[Self]

I'm a fan of the Continental Cup concept (I rip of the G1 in practically every game of TEW I play) so I watched some of the highlights. Swerve's got an aura about him. Looks a lot bigger and more impressive than he did in Lucha Underground. 

In my fantasy booking, he'd lose the Cup via some last minute points, have an intense feud with whichever babyface 'screwed' him, then challenge for the belt. Keep him featured. Keep him talking. Keep him wanting the title shot. 

[Jaysin]

On 11/23/2023 at 10:47 AM, aXminster said:

I feel like I'm totally disconnected from the rest of the AEW audience lol I don't like 80% of the stuff that most people seem to love (Orange Cassidy, Danhausen, The Acclaimed, Moxley etc)

But AEW is still the only company I like and for a PPV main event I'm not really looking forward for this match. Could've done it for Winter is Coming or something else.

Its definitely fair to have different opinions, I was just trying to continue discussion. I love talking wrestling and it's fun to when we have different ideas of what works. I'm burned out on the Acclaimed myself. They have been too heavily featured and over exposed. Plus, I hate the ugly pink belts.

I know MJF is very popular, but he's also being over exposed for my tastes. His face turn has helped a lot in that regard but I feel like they're treading water waiting for the devil reveal and it seems more and more likely that it's Adam Cole. Which is fine I guess, but I'd rather it be someone big like Punk or even someone new like David Finlay. 

This angle seems like it could be a huge success or a huge failure. 

[milamber]

ROH was really good this week. YMMV with Rousey in the main event but the match was great.