Ellin's Grove: Dragons & Demons [Game Thread]

[djthefunkchris]

He said something about catching up, and then didn't appear again.

 

See... Now that's an interesting development to me. Also, since you pointed it out, my thoughts on you might be changing. This was bugging me a bit, but I'm kind of hoping Ray comes around and I roll the dice right, so I can talk more on this.

[Zergon]

Yes, just waiting for an answer one way or the other.

Nope, you read it right, it changed more recently, the rest of my posts were more or less just harassing her. I know her, she knows me, and I know she is way better than she lets on half the time. I felt like her tactic changed from "let's figure this out" to "Hey, we can get a mislynch on DJ this phase!". Now (as opposed to just before the back and forth), I think maybe she was/is just actually worried I am scum, and just doesn't want to take any chances.

 

I gave it some thought... and I felt like if I said "NO" there was no real win for me or for town in that.

 

I feel the town (as a whole) would feel it would be my duty to do whatever I can to prove myself as town... rather than just letting me get misslynched and hope the town learns something from it.

 

IF there is no downfall from Leion being resurrected that's a plus, if there is a downside, the plus is I am still here to help take care of it.

 

 

 

I'm not sure I follow you here, I know this is for everyone but could you try to clarify your thoughts here?

 

 

 

Just a heads up, I already did use it (or try to).

 

Alright, thanks for the answers and fair enough on resurrect, it´s certainly the best course of action for you regardless of potential downfalls (which might not even be there) so I got no problem with that.

 

As for the part you didn´t quite follow, let´s see if I can make my thoughts bit clearer. What I´m worried about is if third party or scum group could have resurrect ability as well (since I´m not certain if town would/should have more than one) and if they do, I wonder if that would change the aligment of resurrected player to same as the person doing the resurrection. So say, if you would be scum and us resurrect on Leion, then Leion would come back ot life but as scum.

 

So basically, what I´m asking here is if Leion is resurrected what do people think of a) does that make you as town like you claim or at least give enough pause that we should look elsewhere? b) do we assume both Lukess and Leion still being town or could one of them have aligment change? and c) does anyone have any other direction they would like to discuss?

 

Not sure that explanation made any more sense but hopefully it did clear my thought progress a bit.

[Zergon]

Also, since we are in the middle of conversation, guess it´s good policy to inform that I have to go to work now so asnwers (if needed from me) might take some time. I try to check on occasionally during work but will be around ten hours until I´m able to give my full attention to this again.

[djthefunkchris]

Thanks Zergon, that's what I thought you were saying. I am on the same thought process, and that is what I was talking about in the post I quoted of EP's.

 

I thought to myself when seeing I didn't do the lukes res... "Uh oh". But I'm not in any position to say anything of it, since I am the one on the hot seat.

[BHK1978]

Guys, this is not the way to go. I've obviously been framed right off the bat.

 

Why do I read this in a 1930's gangster voice? Like James Cagney saying it?

 

 

I don't think that's BHK's style. I think he was excited to have found scum in his mind and wanted to share it as soon as possible. If it were me I would have probably asked DJ a few questions first before dropping the result.

 

It was not excitement on my part, it was more the type of player DJ is, which is why I looked into him in the first place. There are certain players who I want to know their alignment right away and as an investigator I could do that.

 

I felt that I should either look into DJ or TSS because people tend to follow their lead almost blindly if either of them are allowed to gain a leadership foothold in the game. It ended up being DJ because he gave me the worst vibes out of the two during the first phase.

 

So yeah I went with all of the subtly of a bull in a china shop, because I had a result against someone who I felt could mislead us as a town if he was allowed to do so.

 

DJ, did I read you wrong here as I got the idea that you thought MLT was town at this point or did your opinion change after she posted more?

 

Interesting development with the resurrect talk, I´m not against trying to bring people back so they can play more but I slighly worried on this case since Leion role sounds to me like it could be part of a mini-game (sacrifice innocend child to get dark powers kind of thing) and if he´s the target, then bringing him back will give the hunter an easy target since everyone knows who he is now. That said, doing the resurrect is also only real way I could see DJ potentially being able to defend himself and I hate to deny that for him...

 

If resurrect fails then as DJ said, he´s likely going to be lynched so I guess the main question should be what if DJ success to bring Leion back? Then were would we go? With Lukess already being resurrected there would be two abilities of that kind in play and even if one is one shot would they both be town and if not wouldn´t one likely chance the aligment of resurrected player?

 

BHK: I would like to hear your opinion on this latest development since a) you the one I trust most after your reveal and b) you risked your life to give us this info in the first place. So do you think DJ is scum/third party after his claim and if he has resurrect ability should he try to use it on Leion?

 

You hit the nail on the head with a later post but you asked me in this post, so I shall respond in this post.

 

My thing is I have to trust my result until proven otherwise. Could he have been framed?

 

Sure, this is Mafia expect the unexpected. I am not moving my vote regardless because I have to believe my result was real. I would not hold it against anyone else if they want to remove their votes if he is able to bring Leion back.

 

Now where you hit the nail on the head and where we are on the same page is this. If DJ is indeed Scum and they are able to bring someone back from the dead, would they use it as a tool to try and clear DJ?

 

I mean why not use it? It might clear DJ for the rest of the game as people would be willing to brush off my result. As Scum that might be a risk their willing to take.

[BHK1978]

Some of y'all ain't subtle. Not necessarily a bad thing, though. Bulling ahead can find scum, too. See you know who in the other game, brother. I too, would like to hear more from DJ.

 

I can play the subtle game too. You know, investigate night one...vig night two.

[Rabbitman]

There is the school of thought that says we might protect ourselves from a vengeful, psychotic mother, by bringing leion back. That is the only thing that would have given me pause as to the benefits of reviving leion over lukess.

 

However a chance at getting both back and potentially saving a town leader from a lynch? Too good to pass up.

 

I'm in no way voting for DJ if it works, despite knowing the potential risks, as have been laid out already. If future contradictory information comes to light, then fine he will die then but today? Not for me.

 

The problem for DJ, as he has said himself, is that he'll be lynched if he fails. We can't waste the result on his word, without something tangible to back his word up.

[BHK1978]

DJ is also very capable of talking himself out of a lynch, hell I was his teammate one time when he did it (I was proud to say I did not vote on him despite the fact that he was obviously Scum that game). Hell he has snowed me in the past when I have voted for him because he is good at coming up with a good cover story.

 

Look at what he has done right here, he has brought up enough reasonable doubt that he might talk his way out of this. Then his team could easily wipe me out tonight.

 

Either way I did what I could, I have to trust my result and that is all I can do.

[Rabbitman]

It's alright, if Dj gets lynched and turns up town, one of our 6 or 7 revivers can bring him back.

[djthefunkchris]

DJ is also very capable of talking himself out of a lynch, hell I was his teammate one time when he did it (I was proud to say I did not vote on him despite the fact that he was obviously Scum that game). Hell he has snowed me in the past when I have voted for him because he is good at coming up with a good cover story.

 

Look at what he has done right here, he has brought up enough reasonable doubt that he might talk his way out of this. Then his team could easily wipe me out tonight.

 

Either way I did what I could, I have to trust my result and that is all I can do.

 

I have to believe that we are protecting you tonight. I personally recommend it.

 

A framer doesn't know who your going to target, they get lucky and "Hope" there target gets targeted. As scum I've had a few games where we were very successful in our framed targets, others where we missed the boat several times, and several times by only one night.

 

My point being, ok... They figured I would be targeted and framed me. That's VERY LUCKY of them. I know the lower numbers in this game gives them better odds, but the odds are still very much against them.

[djthefunkchris]

It's alright, if Dj gets lynched and turns up town, one of our 6 or 7 revivers can bring him back.

 

Don't think that hasn't crossed my mind as well. Just wondering if others are as limited as I am.

[bak42]

My point being, ok... They figured I would be targeted and framed me. That's VERY LUCKY of them. I know the lower numbers in this game gives them better odds, but the odds are still very much against them.

 

Which is exactly why I'm having trouble believing it.

[Zergon]

Why do I read this in a 1930's gangster voice? Like James Cagney saying it?

 

 

 

 

It was not excitement on my part, it was more the type of player DJ is, which is why I looked into him in the first place. There are certain players who I want to know their alignment right away and as an investigator I could do that.

 

I felt that I should either look into DJ or TSS because people tend to follow their lead almost blindly if either of them are allowed to gain a leadership foothold in the game. It ended up being DJ because he gave me the worst vibes out of the two during the first phase.

 

So yeah I went with all of the subtly of a bull in a china shop, because I had a result against someone who I felt could mislead us as a town if he was allowed to do so.

 

 

 

You hit the nail on the head with a later post but you asked me in this post, so I shall respond in this post.

 

My thing is I have to trust my result until proven otherwise. Could he have been framed?

 

Sure, this is Mafia expect the unexpected. I am not moving my vote regardless because I have to believe my result was real. I would not hold it against anyone else if they want to remove their votes if he is able to bring Leion back.

 

Now where you hit the nail on the head and where we are on the same page is this. If DJ is indeed Scum and they are able to bring someone back from the dead, would they use it as a tool to try and clear DJ?

 

I mean why not use it? It might clear DJ for the rest of the game as people would be willing to brush off my result. As Scum that might be a risk their willing to take.

 

I agree with you on DJ and TSS being the most potential town leaders, and that´s the only reason I feel that framing might be an option as one of those two would be my default options if I had that kind of ability. That said, I still think it´s more likely that your result is right and DJ is either scum or third party.

 

I also agree with you that if DJ is scum and scum team does have resurrect ability then using it here to try to save DJ is the likely way to go. Which is why I did ask if resurrecting Leion (I currently work with the idea that Leion would be resurrected as if not, then lynch DJ is the likely way to go) would be enough to clear DJ or at least stop the lynch? I honestly not sure myself how I feel about that as that just leaves lots of unanswered questions about do we trust DJ, Lukess and/or Leion, is there a framer or is your ability working as we think it is (meaning it´s not giving reverse results or something else) so I feel that we would be left with more questions than answers. On other hand, I kind of hate lynching DJ anyway just to gain info as he would be big asset to town if he´s what he claims he is and that´s why I´m asking if people have potentially other directions we could look at since I would like to get some info from this day phase.

 

There is the school of thought that says we might protect ourselves from a vengeful, psychotic mother, by bringing leion back. That is the only thing that would have given me pause as to the benefits of reviving leion over lukess.

 

However a chance at getting both back and potentially saving a town leader from a lynch? Too good to pass up.

 

I'm in no way voting for DJ if it works, despite knowing the potential risks, as have been laid out already. If future contradictory information comes to light, then fine he will die then but today? Not for me.

 

The problem for DJ, as he has said himself, is that he'll be lynched if he fails. We can't waste the result on his word, without something tangible to back his word up.

 

Fair enough, do you have other potential directions to go if not DJ?

 

 

In general, I think it would be good idea to have a plan what town should do if Leion is resurrected so that we could still gain something if that is enough to halt DJ´s lynch.

 

 

And now I´m back to work again, just felt that this needed to be posted now.

[BHK1978]

I have to believe that we are protecting you tonight. I personally recommend it.

 

A framer doesn't know who your going to target, they get lucky and "Hope" there target gets targeted. As scum I've had a few games where we were very successful in our framed targets, others where we missed the boat several times, and several times by only one night.

 

My point being, ok... They figured I would be targeted and framed me. That's VERY LUCKY of them. I know the lower numbers in this game gives them better odds, but the odds are still very much against them.

 

It could be plausible that you were framed. If a framer is indeed in this game, you would be one of the better targets to frame.

 

This could also be the case of, "Hi I am Lex Luthor and I am your friendly neighborhood serial killer. Make a deal with me."

 

See what I mean?

 

You are very good at being Scum (as town a member of town as well) and talking your way out of things. But I respect the fact that if you are indeed Scum you are building a great case for yourself to not be lynched. Far too often in games of late others have just rolled over, at least you are playing to your win condition and doing a good job of it. If you are Scum.

[BHK1978]

I also agree with you that if DJ is scum and scum team does have resurrect ability then using it here to try to save DJ is the likely way to go. Which is why I did ask if resurrecting Leion (I currently work with the idea that Leion would be resurrected as if not, then lynch DJ is the likely way to go) would be enough to clear DJ or at least stop the lynch? I honestly not sure myself how I feel about that as that just leaves lots of unanswered questions about do we trust DJ, Lukess and/or Leion, is there a framer or is your ability working as we think it is (meaning it´s not giving reverse results or something else) so I feel that we would be left with more questions than answers. On other hand, I kind of hate lynching DJ anyway just to gain info as he would be big asset to town if he´s what he claims he is and that´s why I´m asking if people have potentially other directions we could look at since I would like to get some info from this day phase.

 

There is noting in my role write-up that would lead me to believe I could get an opposite result. I looked over it before posting my result just so I could share my result with no gray area on my part.

 

As for your line of thinking in regards to resurrecting Leion and him coming back as Scum. Well that thought obviously crossed my mind as well.

 

Maybe the scum team's resurrecting power only works on certain players, player that they can recruit. That was something that crossed my mind as well.

 

There is a lot of reasonable doubt out there, far more than I would like. But as the great Kurtis Blow once said, "These are the breaks."

[BHK1978]

He said something about catching up, and then didn't appear again.

 

I wanted to point out that post happened before he was offed. He has not posted since he was killed, which sucks because you know if he does not come back someone wasted a power on him.

[Rabbitman]

After NRL mascot mafia I'm wary of people being bought back in the sense that they can sometimes not realise they've been bought back and go on and do other stuff. Maybe lukess logged in, saw he was dead and got sidetracked with life, before he could notice he was back?

[Rayelek]

Leion has been brought back to life!

[BHK1978]

Leion has been brought back to life!

 

Well okay then.

 

I do not blame anyone from moving their votes off DJ. I will not be doing so, but I totally understand why others might.

 

If people do decide to do so, I would implore you to keep in mind all that has been talked about and be weary of someone who has an evil result against them.

 

He could have been framed, he could be on a Scum team who thought using their revive would save him. There is just as much reasonable against him as there is for him.

[Rabbitman]

Fantastic, now post.

 

Can't bring myself to join the Dj train now. There's still the doubts that remain, that have been mentioned about a bold scum ploy but whereas the odds with a failed resurrection leant towards Dj being scum over town, the odds are now in his favour I feel.

 

Gettting off work soon, I'll have a quick re-read and see if anything stands out.

[BHK1978]

With that I am, in the words of the great Jman, "Off to bed (I may stay on and check back here in twenty minutes or so). I will not be on here for the rest of the day phase.

 

If Scum do ending up offing me, good luck town.

[Rayelek]

michgcs is replacing lukess11!

[hellshock70]

Leion has been brought back to life!

 

 

In light of this...

 

 

Change Vote: No Vote

[michgcs]

Catching up.

[Guest Eliphas]

lukess11 has been resurrected!!

 

I'll have a vote count for you guys in the next hour or so.

 

michgcs is replacing lukess11!

 

So I guess resurrection does change things in this game...

 

Catching up.