Backlash Spoiler Alert- Do Not Read If You Don't Want To Know Results

[djthefunkchris]

[QUOTE=PeterHilton;229565]Not a fan of tip toes. The bottom line about TNA is this: the actual in-ring talent is great. You could almost easily argue that top to bottom they have better performers than the WWE. But they're run by the chimpanzees on those monster.com commercials. Just one bad booking mistake after the other. The cynical part of me wants to say that JJ knows he's in a no-win situation financially so he continues to push himself. Not because he thinks its what's best for TNA, but so that he can get as many big paydaysa as he can befor ethe whole thing goes under. Either way, TNA would have to triple its audience and buy rates, do house shows, AND actually charge admission to their shows before they could come close to being a "viable" company.[/QUOTE] I still tip toe mainly because I don't want to "rub it in"... There have been a few debates in the past., big ones' between WWE and TNA fans, and well.... Bassically, it went like this.. Don't talk about TNA till you watch it yourself and then you can comment on it... WWE fans go watch TNA for a pretty good while... post about it, and they post honestly (especially me, I wanted to be proven wrong actually). What comes up is that only two shows out of dozens were worth it to me (and the other's that watched as well, heck, they might still watch it). One of the shows was the two hour premier, for their new time slot. The other was a "best of" and I found out that they were almost all from PPV's. So then it went from well, I'm not talking about the TV show, I'm talking abou their PPV's, they are awesome compared to the WWE.... Then, without even actually watching any of them, most the TNA guys started to realistically compare, and they ended up mostly admitting that it was subpar for the most part... However, there were alot of middle fingers and sticking tongue's out at each other before all this happened. Bottum line, is that since TNA fans have become more optimistic (or realistic) about WWE (and TNA), I feel it's only right to return the favor... You know they STILL Want TNA to be better, but at least they aren't saying "TNA IS Better" anymore. They instead use phrase's like "I wish TNA could take advantage" of different situations, or "Had the Clout To do" this or that. To me that's perfectly exceptable to what it was before... So I tiptoe around them because they are being totally civil now, as compared to really not that long ago. So I might think: "Are you nuts? TNA Impact??? You can't be serious!"... That's not what's going to come out of my mouth. What you will here is "I wouldn't mind seeing TNA give WWE a run for the money, and I believe they could if they had unlimited clout (like WCW kind of had) they could". I'm essentially saying the same thing, if you really read into it... Unlimited money is bassically saying they have no chance... However, I say it in as nice a way as I can, pluss.... There is the fact that I really do think someone that would give the WWE a run for their money, would really improve the industry in a whole anyways... I have no problem with that someone being TNA.

[PeterHilton]

I generally agree. But I think part of being a good fan is being a good consumer. Wrestling is a TV show. I wouldn't ask someone to watch a TV show that's terrible for weeks on end just to be "a good fan." For what? I say the same thing about the WWE. I stopped watching during those terrible Triple H/Goldberg months and again recently when i got sick of DX. I just find it hard to support a company that makes the same mistakes repeatedly. The loyalty of TNA's fanbase is largely undeserved IMO.

[Guest Ransik]

To whom ever said if TNA were in TEW that it would be bankrupt... you can't go bankrupt if you still have money. Spike TV owns the contracts of Sting & Angle... and to my knowledge TNA doesn't actually pay those two. They've actually broken even... and they got the breaking even point FASTER than WCW did with all the money Turner allowed them to spend on big name stars. I think only having about $15 million about 5 years ago and STILL running but on national TV with some of the better known stars in the world is pretty damn good. If they get 2 hours... it'll just take one of those rare "nWo/DX" angles to get TNA right up on top.

[PeterHilton]

I said that and I don't believe that last post at all. So...a company with laughable buyrates, that has no gate revenue from a large majority of their shows, that only recently started running house shows, that has publicly said that most of their ad revenue goes to Spike, and whose performers are almost all on PPA contracts has all of a sudden "broken even?" Says who? Dixie Carter? Panda has been bankrolling them for at leas the last two years and according to their corporate records TNA has yet to turn a profit. I mean..logically speaking, even if they aren't paying Angle and Sting, I don't see how that is possible. EDIT: Apparently their chairman (Dixie's dad) made a statement that the would break even [B]for the month of October 2005 [/B] and would start turning a [B]monthly [/B] profit by mid 2006. He came out six months later and said that timetable may have been premature. Even so, six months or so of making money does not negate 4 years of losses, topping out at nearly $1 million a month while they were on FSN. So yeah. Sorry, they'd have gone bankrupt. w/o Panda they were dead.

[Guest Ransik]

The only shows they don't receive gates for are the Orlando shows... and these days that really is less then half their monthly shows. 3 shows a month (2 if the PPV is out of Orlando) is all now. I dunno how many shows they're actually running a month out of Orlando, but it's very easy to see how they can be headed to breaking even. Even if only 1,500 people show up for a House Show at an average paid of $15 per person... that's $22,500 a show... and since the lower card workers get about $500 a night... I can see it happening. And heck... I don't even know how much they charge for House Shows but I'm sure it's more than an average of $15 since most Indys charge $10 these days. You have 7 or 8 matches with about 10 lower card workers... that's $5,000 right there. $17,500 left for the top guys, building rental and ring crew... may not be more than few hundred bucks if that... they may be losing some money on certain shows, but they're getting quite better with the revenue than they were even a year ago.

[djthefunkchris]

If your even half right, that's good news, and I like hearing good news. However, PeterHilton's point about them losing money for years, is still valid. In TEW they would have gone bankrupt without "extra" cashflow, or bassically, going into the editor and adding some more money to the pot. It's nice to know that the mods that show TNA actually hold up, will now be right, if what your saying is actually true... For the record, this is the first time I've heard that they were actually breaking even, let alone making a profit. I've heard them speculate..... but I never heard of any evidence for it.

[Guest Ransik]

I dunno, I usually read about the House Show results and they're pulling roughly half the crowds the WWE does for House Shows... and I'm gonna assume ringside seats aren't exactly cheap... we'll say $50 or so to be on the safe side. They may not be selling out arenas and they may not be out of debt, but they are technically making a good chunk of dough with the House Shows they're putting on. I think I remember reading 8 or 9 House Show reports last month at the very least.

[djthefunkchris]

It sounds reasonable, I have no idea how much seat costs are though. Even if they were only 5 bucks, it's better then NOTHING... which is what they were getting before. What they need is someone "Outside" of the bussiness, to do their bussiness, lol. However, if things are actually looking up for them, then they might be "learning" something, and that's always good news.

[AfRoMaN36]

[QUOTE=keefmoon;229550]It's true that old ECW wouldn't have succeeded at a mainstream level because of the product it was offering, and it is true that the E had to water it down until no-one likes it. But that just tells me that they should never have resurrected it in the first place.[/QUOTE] Good post indeed, but no one could have predicted that Sci Fi of all channels would disaprove hardcore matches. Theyre freaken aimed at men and the brand is called "Extreme Championship Wrestling" what could they have possibly expected?

[PeterHilton]

[QUOTE=Ransik;229647]I dunno, I usually read about the House Show results and they're pulling roughly half the crowds the WWE does for House Shows... and I'm gonna assume ringside seats aren't exactly cheap... we'll say $50 or so to be on the safe side. They may not be selling out arenas and they may not be out of debt, but they are technically making a good chunk of dough with the House Shows they're putting on. I think I remember reading 8 or 9 House Show reports last month at the very least.[/QUOTE] They are averaging one show a week during their "tours." But they have one show in May and don't have another house show scheduled until June and then not again unles something changes until September. So its just a semi-regular thing. I'm sorry but this goes back to the idea that TNA is a profitable company. It's not. Not yet. And like I said if Panda hadn't come in and rescued "daddy's little girl" Dixie Carter TNA would've folded a while back. They are a long way from being a viable competitor to the WWE. And until the product improves significantly I don't see that happening.

[PeterHilton]

[QUOTE=djthefunkchris;229651]It sounds reasonable, I have no idea how much seat costs are though. Even if they were only 5 bucks, it's better then NOTHING... which is what they were getting before. What they need is someone "Outside" of the bussiness, to do their bussiness, lol. However, if things are actually looking up for them, then they might be "learning" something, and that's always good news.[/QUOTE] Ticketmaster lists their seat prices at $50 for front row floor seats, $30 for the rest of the floor, and $20 everywhere else. Panda is the outside company managing their finances. They made a ton of budgetary cuts and were smart enough to get Spike to pay parts of Angle's and Sting's contracts in exchange for some decreased revenue pay-off. So its going in the right direction, but Panda had to write off a ton of losses and pay back a lot of TNA's debt when they bought ownership in the company. In reality, it will be years before TNA actually "turns a profit."

[jbergey_2005]

[QUOTE=syndicate;229506]match of the year on raw? yeah right... the crowd looked bored as hell the match was not bad but is was not that great but shawn carried him through the whole match[/QUOTE] Its fine that you have your own opinion but why are you trying to push your opinions on other people when it is clearly in the minority? Were you at this event or something why would you say the crowd looked bored as hell? You are obviously hating on Cena because as much as Michaels carried the WM23 match Cena carried the 55min classic on RAW. Please try to be constructive with you criticism or you wont be taken seriously.