under-talented big men

[takertitan]

an idea most people prob wont like, but i think it would help games with WWE and the such. The idea is how the game is effected by big men. As it is now, the only real benifit to signing a big man is gimmic releated. Normally they are undertalented and better options are out there, but bookers still bring them in. Why? Big men are attractions. I am not trying to be Johnny Laurinaitis here, but the crowd does tend to enjoy watching 1 big guys go out and brawl rather than 2 small guys do the same thing. So maybe having big men on the roster give you some more options? Stuff like "don't fall over", "show your power", "really emphasize your hight"... as road angent notes. Also, maybe boost if 2 big guys are in the ring, or a boost in advance booking or popularity gain for giant killers and such. Generally, big guys like Khali have a purpose (even though we all hate him). His job is to like crazy strong and powerful vs weak guys, but people who DO manage to beat him come out looking VERY strong, more so than if the same guy beat a smaller guy with the same overness.

[Chriswok]

This would be tied into the 'Look' and 'Super Star' ratings, surely? Think I read somewhere that entertainment based promotions would be using these two stats alot more, so I think in a way this has already been implemented into the game.

[Comradebot]

It's true, look and superstar quality matters alot. Its why in my game with USPW, Gargantuan, who's rumble skills are peaking in the low D- area, is capable of entertaining people in ring. And why T-Rex can put on A matches, while being considerably worse than most people who regularly put on Bs. So big guys are useful in the right federations. You may not be able to use Giant Redwood in CZCW, but in USPW he can be a solid midcarder (just keep him away from the microphone at all costs.)

[Day_Dreamer]

Look doesnt really justify it. What separates Khali from Maria if they both get a high rating in looks and low rating is talent. Maybe a stat like legitamacy needs to be introduced. Or maybe the game should favor big guys eventhough they are talentless, just like in real life.

[Dragonmack]

[QUOTE=Day_Dreamer;408351]Look doesnt really justify it. What separates Khali from Maria if they both get a high rating in looks and low rating is talent. Maybe a stat like legitamacy needs to be introduced. Or maybe the game should favor big guys eventhough they are talentless, just like in real life.[/QUOTE] Other that Hogan and Undertaker, most big men aren't the headliners of their company. At best they get transitional title reigns, or are just the latest heel for a champion to overcome. Even more than most wrestlers, big men, especially those cast as monster heels, need to be handled properly and protected so they can look good. Ultimately though, usually a more normal sized person will still end up the main headliner and be the ones in matches people remember. That is why no one talks about any 60 min classics between Ric Flair and a Nikita Koloff or One man Gang or between Bret Hart and Yokozuna.

[Derek B]

[QUOTE=Day_Dreamer;408351]Look doesnt really justify it. What separates Khali from Maria if they both get a high rating in looks and low rating is talent. [b]Maybe a stat like legitamacy needs to be introduced[/b]. Or maybe the game should favor big guys eventhough they are talentless, just like in real life.[/QUOTE] Highlighted because this is very close to what the current menace stat is. Note to everyone: read the help files. :)

[Remianen]

[QUOTE=derek_b;408364]Note to everyone: read the help files. :)[/QUOTE] pffft, what for? :rolleyes: takertitan, you're asking for a redundant mechanic to be added to the game for the benefit of ONE style of promotion. Where's the mechanic to help NOAH or NOTBPW? How 'bout the mechanic to help SHIMMER or QoC? Granted, it might be easier if Adam put "Menace: Boost this stat if you want your big men to flourish" but reading the description should tell you the same thing. I'll give you an example of stats people have little to no clue about. What made Mike Awesome special as a big man? Hint: there's a stat in the game to cover it. Look at the stats each worker has then try to figure out HOW each of them is represented in the ring. They're ALL represented (except business/booking). This might seem tasteless under the circumstances but tell me, how could you NOT give Chris Benoit an A* in Acting, given what occurred and people's (who supposedly KNEW him) reactions to it? I'd say given the start of their most recent matchup, you'd have to give Kurt Angle and Samoa Joe at least an E- in MMA (perhaps even as high as D-). Look at the MMA ratings of INSPIRE's roster. Is that by accident?

[takertitan]

By no means did i say and any part of my post "i think USPW needs a boost, so lets make big men more over". now did i? no. but you still feel the need to throw random almost related insults at me. Maybe, insted of trolling the forums all day saying stuff sucks, maybe you REALLY need to shut up or help? BTW Remiamen, I normally find your posts useless 90% of the time, cause from past experience i know your just trolling the forums trying to make yourself look like you have a clue what you are talking about. so now that i have delt with your tiny brain, i will continue. Now, as a matter of fact, each company does have a stat that directly relates to them. Some relate to in ring talent, some are other things. For example, USPW is more of a brawling entertainment while you need a some basic understanding of wrestling and some hardcore ability in DAVE. What i am asking for does not even fall under stats, it falls under size. But again, you can't read and have a small brain. Day Dreamer summed it up quite well, basically saying "looks is too general". So I think Ryan said he was putting in a sex appeal stat? i may be mistaken. The problem is Khali is not good looking(inless your into that whole 7 foot tall can't speak english thing, then by all means...), but he is a giant. And a giant generates a shock value, or buzz, right away. If you hate Khali so much, lets go back and look at Andre. Andre shows up in a promotion, never worked in that area, no one has a clue who or what he is. They just make a poster saying "come see the giant this saterday night at the Random Wrestling Show". That would generate interest, and its not a gimmic, he is just tall. Before he even speaks or does anything, he is over. He could walk out there and fart, and the crowd would be scared. [I]"Other that Hogan and Undertaker, most big men aren't the headliners of their company. At best they get transitional title reigns, or are just the latest heel for a champion to overcome. Even more than most wrestlers, big men, especially those cast as monster heels, need to be handled properly and protected so they can look good. Ultimately though, usually a more normal sized person will still end up the main headliner and be the ones in matches people remember."[/I] As i said in the first post, they have a purpose. They are ment to be the "OMG" of the show. And when 1 is beat, they in turn make someone a star. Most people will agree that Umaga or Big Daddy Vis are not the most over people on the WWE roster, but they big. And when they come out and wrestle, the crowd looks on amazed that this little babyface has to face this 400 lbs beast. that in turn generates a decent match because of this. SO, this is what i(OMG! I USED I REMIANEN! I WANT SOMETHING! OMG! freakin jerk...)would introduced: Size stat(non-visable stat). Size is a rating would be given to workers who use there size as a positive. Rey would have a high size stat even though he is small because he uses is small size well, esp vs big men. Big show would have a high size stat, because once again he uses his giant size well. Someone in the middle however, prob does not get a great rating. This kind of stat might already exist (you do get that: worker1 did an interview where he said he liked working with people smaller/bigger than himself) but its not as well defined enough i think. btw remianen, before you type, maybe you should think? is what i am typing useful? or is it just me trying to feel important?

[Genadi]

[QUOTE=takertitan;408494]The problem is Khali is not good looking(inless your into that whole 7 foot tall can't speak english thing, then by all means...), but he is a giant. And a giant generates a shock value, or buzz, right away. [/QUOTE] From the help guide which comes free with TEW..... Looks: This is how good the worker looks. It is not purely down to physical beauty, as a worker who is not particularly attractive but has an impressive physique would have a high Looks rating. Menace: This measures how menacing a worker looks. The higher it is, the more he looks genuinely tough, and so the more he can convince fans he's really going to do some damage. Superstar Quality: Some workers have an "X factor", something about them that makes them come across as a real star. This is a measure of that. The higher the level, the more the worker comes across as a genuine superstar. Derek gave some good advice at the start of this thread. He's a wise man listen to him, you'll save yourself some time :)

[Derek B]

Note to takertitan: Remi is on the development team with myself and several other posters who know what we are talking about. Second note: You are describing the menace stat STILL. Please look at the help files for more info. Last note: A size stat for how people use their size doesn't make much sense. It seems to be adding a mechanic that can only come into play if you use people at the extremes of size ranges. If your roster consisted of 100% Rey Mysterio sized people, your stat would have no place for that worker. Rey is used in an underdog role because he's small compared to most... underdog is a gimmick, not a skill. Also, keep an eye on your PM box. Insulting/attacking people as you did in your post is likely to see you get a message from Adam at some point. I'm not a moderator but I recognise a personal attack when I see one.

[takertitan]

from what i can gather though, the menace stat effects mostly on the gimmic end of things. and big vis had an amazing physique... yeah... i would not consider Khali/Mark Henry/Big Daddy V oozing with "star power"...

[Chriswok]

Which is why Big Vis would have a low 'Look' and a high menance, his size and the tattoos certainly make him stand out from the rest, so perhaps he'd have a slightly high Star Power rating then other big men his size and physique. I'm not saying he should have 80%+ rating, but it'd certinaly be higher then most other 'fat' big men.

[Jaded]

[QUOTE=takertitan;408523]from what i can gather though, the menace stat effects mostly on the gimmic end of things. [/QUOTE] Have you considered that two people on the development team might be more likely to know what the menace stat is for than you do?

[Adam Ryland]

As has been pointed out, this isn't worth debating - the concept is already covered in the game (and documented in the help files) and the premise (that size has no real effect other than on gimmicks) is completely false anyway.