TEW2010 Developer's Journal Discussion

[Phantom Stranger]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TeemuFoundation" data-cite="TeemuFoundation" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I understood that and I don't have a problem with the feature itself. I was just answering crayon's question. My point was the idea of a booker downright telling a worker to take sick bump in the match is just disturbing to me. Granted, they can refuse, but a competent booker wouldn't even suggest that. </div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Foley's own career kinda challenges you on that.</p><p> </p><p> "Mick, that huge leap into the guardrail popped the crowd, so we'll just do it around the loop, OK?"</p>

[lovestruck420]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Phantom Stranger" data-cite="Phantom Stranger" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Foley's own career kinda challenges you on that.<p> </p><p> "Mick, that huge leap into the guardrail popped the crowd, so we'll just do it around the loop, OK?"</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Very true actually. I would more assign it with them asking him in WCW to do the Elbow drop to the outside constantly. May not look very sick, but onto a concrete floor with no padding can mess you up.</p>

[Phantom Stranger]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lovestruck420" data-cite="lovestruck420" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Very true actually. I would more assign it with them asking him in WCW to do the Elbow drop to the outside constantly. May not look very sick, but onto a concrete floor with no padding can mess you up.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> True, though the Nestea plunge is the one he eventually insisted on holding onto for special occasions - showing the 'refusal' part of the feature... <img alt=";)" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/wink.png.686f06e511ee1fbf6bdc7d82f6831e53.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[praguepride]

<p>Yeah, my guess is it'll be a combo of personality & style.</p><p> </p><p>

So psycho workers and/or naive workers will probably accept more. I really hope naive workers are naive in that sense </p><p> </p><p> </p><p>

"Don't worry. Falling off the top of a steel cage onto those tables...you'll be fine."</p><p> </p><p>

"oh...ok..."</p>

[Cold Cobra]

Nice to see the return of the Sick Bump. Brings back memories...

[The Final Countdown]

With TEW08 being my first experience with a Ryland sim since EWR, I was surprised at the fact that there wasn't a 'Sick Bump' option in the road agent notes. Glad to see it coming back, and it should be neat to see how personalities affect who will or won't be willing to take the bumps.

[TeemuFoundation]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Self" data-cite="Self" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Not really. A shooting star to the outside isn't a 'bump' if someone catches you. It's not really all that dangerous if you have the athleticism to rotate all the way and the guy you're landing on knows how to catch you. I'd use 'All Out Match' to symbolise that kind of move<p> </p><p> A sick bump is SICK. It's like Shane O Mac jumping off the titan tron. It's like Jeff Hardy swantoning off a gigatic ladder through 3 tables. It's like Mick Foley going off of the Cell.</p></div></blockquote><p> Of those three, only Foley jumping off the top of the Cell is what I would classify as a "sick bump". Shane's jumps were glorified mattress bumps and a Swanton off the top of a ladder is something I could do. A recent example could be Foley getting Speared by Edge through the flaming table at WrestleMania 22. I might suggest that as a sick bump.</p><p> </p><blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Foley's own career kinda challenges you on that.<p> </p><p> "Mick, that huge leap into the guardrail popped the crowd, so we'll just do it around the loop, OK?" </p></div></blockquote><p> Hardly a sick bump. I was talking specifically talking about sick bumps.</p>

[FlameSnoopy]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Cold Cobra" data-cite="Cold Cobra" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Nice to see the return of the Sick Bump. Brings back memories...</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Agree. I loved the old sick bumps feature in EWR, used to do it on my main events in my local promotions ladder matches.. Oh the times..</p>

[Phantom Stranger]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TeemuFoundation" data-cite="TeemuFoundation" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div><p> Hardly a sick bump. I was talking specifically talking about sick bumps.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> If we're talking about bumps that seriously increase the potential for injury, I suggest you pop over to Have A Nice Day, reread the relevant section, and reconsider. When he tried to get a career-ending injury it was one of the moves he returned to - which sounds like a sick bump to me.</p>

[Self]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="TeemuFoundation" data-cite="TeemuFoundation" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Of those three, only Foley jumping off the top of the Cell is what I would classify as a "sick bump". Shane's jumps were glorified mattress bumps and a Swanton off the top of a ladder is something I could do. A recent example could be Foley getting Speared by Edge through the flaming table at WrestleMania 22. I might suggest that as a sick bump.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> The mattress bump I'll give you. The Swanton I won't. I'd wager most people on this board could 'do' the swanton, but that doesn't stop it from being painful. I could take the spear through the flaming table. Does that make it any less painful or risky? No.</p><p> </p><p> Kind of a pointless argument (but a fun one I'm sure we could go on with for hours) It's a good feature. I'd be very tempted to start an indy deathmatch fed and have every single match contain a sick bump. Mmm. Bloodthirsty.</p>

[Adam Ryland]

Please stop the Teemu vs. Everyone Else argument, it's been going on for three pages now and is pointless.

[falling_star]

Sick Bump FTW

[praguepride]

<p>Self, I'll PM you some ideas I just had.</p><p>

edit: I just realized. In 2010 we're not just going to bump a thread, we're going to sick bump threads <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[crayon]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="justtxyank" data-cite="justtxyank" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>To really sell how crazy the luchadores were, they should have had guys miss high risk moves and sell an injury throughout a match. Not just, "Oh he missed the frog splash, he has a stomach now for 10 seconds!"</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I would hope that he also has a stomach outside of the 10 seconds following a missed frog splash, to be honest. Because wrestling without a stomach really <em>is</em> crazy!</p>

[praguepride]

<p>I'd like to hear the announcers sell that</p><p> </p><p>

"OH MY GOD! He landed so hard is stomach popped out his mouth!"</p><p> </p><p>

That'd be hilarious for a place like RoH, have a guy who's "organs" kept popping out of place <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p><p> </p><p>

Kind of like a comedy undertaker character, where the undead aspect is played for laughs.</p>

[Sigilistic]

<p>Wow...now I can get really sadistic with my SWF games. Piss me off and I'll have you take a sick bump while jobbing to Big Smack Scott.</p><p> </p><p>

But in all seriousness, very awesome addition.</p>

[praguepride]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Sigilistic" data-cite="Sigilistic" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Wow...now I can get really sadistic with my SWF games. Piss me off and I'll have you take a sick bump while jobbing to Big Smack Scott.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> That would be a funny road agent note though.</p><p> </p><p> "Joe Jobber died in the ring, but there was still a lack of selling."</p><p> </p><p> edit: I'd mark out hard if the C-verse is updated where Big Smack Scott becomes an "internet sensation" and "goes viral" going up to A* popularity in the US </p><p> </p><p> SOLELY BECAUSE WE CAN'T STOP TALKING ABOUT HIM ON THESE FORUMS!</p>

[DreamGoddessLindsey]

<p>I don't think the "Sneaking Written Deals" are going to take place hardly ever if at all. The $7,000,000 requirement is a bit over-the-top I think. I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one) and they have nowhere near $7,000,000. I have never seen a Cult promotion get to that high amount of money either. Hell, starting National promotions in most databases (including TCW in the default database) only have $10,000,000.</p><p> </p><p>

So unless the amount is lowered to something more reasonable like $1,000,000, this feature will probably never take place.</p>

[Adam Ryland]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="DreamGoddessLindsey" data-cite="DreamGoddessLindsey" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one)</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> No, they haven't. A TEW written deal is full-time employment and a monthly pay cheque regardless of activity, it is not just a deal that involves some degree of exclusivity. ROH have never done anything like that.</p>

[LFC_chris]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="DreamGoddessLindsey" data-cite="DreamGoddessLindsey" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I don't think the "Sneaking Written Deals" are going to take place hardly ever if at all. The $7,000,000 requirement is a bit over-the-top I think. I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one) and they have nowhere near $7,000,000. I have never seen a Cult promotion get to that high amount of money either. Hell, starting National promotions in most databases (including TCW in the default database) only have $10,000,000.<p> </p><p> So unless the amount is lowered to something more reasonable like $1,000,000, this feature will probably never take place.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> USPW start with $5m tbf IIRC. I think that'd maybe be something mote like a better figure, but I can understand why it's high. It's something I've wanted to see though - I don't think 'size' itself should be an obstacle in signing written deals - if the money's there it should be possible.</p><p> </p><p> I wouldn't know about ROH or whatever, but workers should'nt be willing to sign written deals with a company that doesn't have either national exposure or loads of money as it wouldn't make sense on their part.</p>

[RayW]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="DreamGoddessLindsey" data-cite="DreamGoddessLindsey" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25024" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I don't think the "Sneaking Written Deals" are going to take place hardly ever if at all. The $7,000,000 requirement is a bit over-the-top I think. I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one) and they have nowhere near $7,000,000. I have never seen a Cult promotion get to that high amount of money either. Hell, starting National promotions in most databases (including TCW in the default database) only have $10,000,000.<p> </p><p> So unless the amount is lowered to something more reasonable like $1,000,000, this feature will probably never take place.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> But isn't that the idea? Only a cult promotion in an extremely good financial situation would, in the real world, be able to offer someone a written deal (in regards to what TEW considers a written deal).</p><p> </p><p> Why would someone agree to an exclusivly written deal to a promotion that isn't popular enough that it isn't a household name, and might not be able to actually see his contract out due to financial promblems somewhere down the line, especially if at the time of signing the contract they only have $1,000,000. ONE MILLION DOLLARS?! In business terms, even with todays economical climate, that isn't a lot. Not at all. For these wrestlers (yes, even in game), this is there only real career path, and why risk everything they have, or could have, to join a company that isn't that wealthy?</p>

[praguepride]

Especially when you consider that you need to actually PAY them that amount.

 

So if a guy gets a written deal for $10,000 a month for two years, that's $240,000 for that one guy.

 

If we use your $1,000,000 example, 1/4 of the companies finances are now tied up in a single person.

 

$10 mil seems reasonable because it's definitely something that's going to be hard to achieve, otherwise every cult promotion will start signing written deals which is not realistic.

[DreamGoddessLindsey]

But isn't that the idea? Only a cult promotion in an extremely good financial situation would, in the real world, be able to offer someone a written deal (in regards to what TEW considers a written deal).

 

Why would someone agree to an exclusivly written deal to a promotion that isn't popular enough that it isn't a household name, and might not be able to actually see his contract out due to financial promblems somewhere down the line, especially if at the time of signing the contract they only have $1,000,000. ONE MILLION DOLLARS?! In business terms, even with todays economical climate, that isn't a lot. Not at all. For these wrestlers (yes, even in game), this is there only real career path, and why risk everything they have, or could have, to join a company that isn't that wealthy?

 

You overlook the fact that the game uses much smaller amounts of money than the real world. Do you think Triple H works for $30,000 a month? No, he has a multi-million dollar deal, probably at least $100,000 or more a month. That means all the money amounts are downscaled for playability purposes.

 

$1,000,000 is way more than enough to hire people up to $10,000 or so per month, maybe even $15,000. In fact, it may even be cheaper than the combined pay per appearance amounts.

 

Honestly, I think the amount of money shouldn't be a factor. The owner restrictions on contract amounts should cover all the bases, and if someone is stupid enough to offer too many expensive contracts (like Heyman did late in ECW's life), then they go bankrupt out of stupidity.

 

Basically, I'd like to see it more like WMMA2. Even the smallest promotions can get exclusive deals, but you have to be careful not to overstep your financial means. Make it a matter of management rather than arbitrary limits. Put the challenge into the hands of the players to manage the finances instead of putting limits on things. I would just rather see more flexibility.

 

The only thing this could be used for is for National promotions who fall to Cult despite being profitable, so they can still keep their top talent. For promotions starting at Cult or below, the $7,000,000 requirement will likely never be fulfilled.

 

Sorry, this is meant as constructive criticism. I think think the amount is far too arbitrary and pulled out of thin air and way too high. $1,000,000 would make more sense, as that is a good healthy place for a Cult promotion to be if they are actually doing well.

[randomfreeze]

How do we know the money system works the same? Maybe it's even easier to make money in this version than '08. You keep saying that seven mil is an arbitrary number when you don't even know how the the financial system works. I think Adam deserves a little more respect than to say he's pulling numbers out of his ass here.

[Phantom Stranger]

Basically, I'd like to see it more like WMMA2. Even the smallest promotions can get exclusive deals, but you have to be careful not to overstep your financial means.

 

Exclusive does not mean written.

 

Just ask 21CW.