djthefunkchris Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Cool. To me, it would just have made more sense if Orton won this match and then Kane won the rematch at Extreme Rules. But oh well. /nod. I knew there was something I wasn't seeing, as all points seemed valid except that one, to me. The reasoning of it being such a huge event (I think they broke the record with this one, although I have no idea what the buy rate was like yet), to use it to enhance their future is something I can get behind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Informant Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Honeslty I disagree on Randy. He's had almost exactly as much time as a "top guy" as Cena has had. He's even recently had jesus pushes as both a heel "Legacy" and as a face The Viper. Heck wasn't it last year he was Stone Cold Randy Orton. As a matter of fact didn't he face CM Punk and beat him last year at Wrestlemania. Randy has had as much time in the spotlight as anyone. Multiple time world champion, multiple Wrestlemania's, etc. The very fact that Randy was facing Kane was a joke. This Wrestlemania was odd there was virtually no interesting build up for any but the three big matches. Randy has had several odd match ups at Wrestlemania but none the less he's been there. Randy to me just never does it, he pops the crowd but he's never gotten to the level he should be at. The guy is a third generation superstar, good looking guy, still youngish. I agree that wrestling fans are obsessed about age for some reason. Always have been. I'd like to point out Ric Flair was Triple H's age when he beat VADER for the title. How many people complained then that he was too old and should be passing the torch to the younger guys? Hogan was passed HHH's age when he started doing Hollywood Hogan and that turned in CRAZY huge business for them. Hall and Nash were 37 and 38 when they started the nWo. Chris Jericho was 42 when he wrestled CM Punk last night and he's only a year younger than Triple H. My point is I could go on and on forever. As long as these guys can go out there and do what they do every night and lets face it these guys are better athletes in their 40's than most people are in their 20's. Age shouldn't be an issue. Pro Wrestling operates under such micro time lines. Think about it the original Hulkamania lasted essentially from WM1-6. Thats roughly a six year time period. The nWo was hot for about 2 years. The attitude was hot for roughly what five years? The things that spark and get wrestling going hot only last for a couple of years. If a guy is 42 and he gets white hot for three years he's still only 45. And as I just pointed out three years is an eternity in the wrestling world. Wrestlemania III had 90,000 fans (kayfabe) Wrestlemania VII was forced to move locations because it wasn't seeling. So four Wrestlemania's later they can't put half that many people in the arena. Time moves very quickly in pro wrestling and so therefore if the guys are a bit older whats it matter as long as they can stick around and be healthy for a good three to four years tops then I'm all for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaySo Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hive Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 . Insanity. I keep getting suprised at just how much over he is. Have Cena lead a heel stable with him and Punk and they won't experience any merc sale decrease from Cena's turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn michaels Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 I hear rumours of an HBK vs. HHH match next year. Say it ain't so! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Insanity. I keep getting suprised at just how much over he is. Have Cena lead a heel stable with him and Punk and they won't experience any merc sale decrease from Cena's turn. The fact that Cena acknowledged it on Raw was pretty cool as well. I didn't think he would, but only because of the character issue's... Cena being face, Bryan being a heel. But he did, and that was pretty great, I thought at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 I hear rumours of an HBK vs. HHH match next year. Say it ain't so! Loser has to go against Undertaker again, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hive Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 I hear rumours of an HBK vs. HHH match next year. Say it ain't so! It isn't so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn michaels Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 It isn't so. Thank God! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Thank God! You don't want to see Shawn Michaels in ONE more match? I have to admit, that I wouldn't mind seeing one more match for Shawn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djthefunkchris Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Honeslty I disagree on Randy. He's had almost exactly as much time as a "top guy" as Cena has had. He's even recently had jesus pushes as both a heel "Legacy" and as a face The Viper. Heck wasn't it last year he was Stone Cold Randy Orton. As a matter of fact didn't he face CM Punk and beat him last year at Wrestlemania. Randy has had as much time in the spotlight as anyone. Multiple time world champion, multiple Wrestlemania's, etc. The very fact that Randy was facing Kane was a joke. This Wrestlemania was odd there was virtually no interesting build up for any but the three big matches. Randy has had several odd match ups at Wrestlemania but none the less he's been there. Randy to me just never does it, he pops the crowd but he's never gotten to the level he should be at. The guy is a third generation superstar, good looking guy, still youngish. I agree that wrestling fans are obsessed about age for some reason. Always have been. I'd like to point out Ric Flair was Triple H's age when he beat VADER for the title. How many people complained then that he was too old and should be passing the torch to the younger guys? Hogan was passed HHH's age when he started doing Hollywood Hogan and that turned in CRAZY huge business for them. Hall and Nash were 37 and 38 when they started the nWo. Chris Jericho was 42 when he wrestled CM Punk last night and he's only a year younger than Triple H. My point is I could go on and on forever. As long as these guys can go out there and do what they do every night and lets face it these guys are better athletes in their 40's than most people are in their 20's. Age shouldn't be an issue. Pro Wrestling operates under such micro time lines. Think about it the original Hulkamania lasted essentially from WM1-6. Thats roughly a six year time period. The nWo was hot for about 2 years. The attitude was hot for roughly what five years? The things that spark and get wrestling going hot only last for a couple of years. If a guy is 42 and he gets white hot for three years he's still only 45. And as I just pointed out three years is an eternity in the wrestling world. Wrestlemania III had 90,000 fans (kayfabe) Wrestlemania VII was forced to move locations because it wasn't seeling. So four Wrestlemania's later they can't put half that many people in the arena. Time moves very quickly in pro wrestling and so therefore if the guys are a bit older whats it matter as long as they can stick around and be healthy for a good three to four years tops then I'm all for it. I think (meaning I'm not sure) it has something to do with the overall thought process with the "smark" type network. To me "smarks" have always been alot more "Marky" then "Smarky"... if that makes sense. It's like they "try" to look at it as if it was "real", and think that other people not in their clique think it is real. Not everyone, and I don't even think it's on purpose... I don't know how to explain it, but it's like you think about how it would look to a 10 year old or something similar. Most people that don't know the inside and outside of wrestling, if they don't know anything else about the bussiness at all, they know it's fake. Has been, always will be, has been known for almost 100 years. The whole issue about "Vince" being the one to ruin it for everyone or whatever is just foolish to me. Before I even knew who WWWF was, I knew wrestling was fake. My grandfather, my father, everyone told me. Didn't stop me from making a fake ring outside and acting out the roles though... fact probably encouraged me. The only thing letting "Kafabe" die did, was admit that everyone else knows it's fake. Lots of people don't even believe half the "true" injuries.... Don't get me wrong... I'm sure I can go around the neighborhood here and find someone that thinks wrestling is real, but it's no more or less then it ever was before. It's just now people in the business can talk about it as well now.... Really the only difference I've ever seen. Anyways, that's what I think happens... "How does this look to someone that believes this is real? What are they doing?" Then they tend to forget that a 5'0" person beating a 7 footer is totally unbelievable, yet try to make it happen... So I can't really explain it, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tha Black Phenom Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 I definately see your point, except that Kane's career is winding down and Orton is still young and will in all likelyhood by one of the very top dogs of WWE for many years to come. Had this been on any other PPV, I wouldn't have said much about it - but this is WrestleMania. This is the one time per year when WWE catches a much broader viewership than their usual suspect fans, due to it's status and celebrity involvement. So in my opinion, it should be used to promote their franchise players in the eyes of the mainstream casual viewers. Guys such as Orton, Sheamus and Cena (though one could argue that Cena doesn't need it anymore). And that's why I feel that Orton shouldn't be losing to a veteran who doesn't need the rub in an undercard match. I agree that Orton won't lose much in regards to WWE's loyal fanbase, I just feel they missed promoting him to people outside that base. But yes, I'm sure he'll eventually come out victorious in this feud. Missed opportunities... more like a nickel falling out of your wallet. Orton has won at the past two WrestleManias. He's a staple of the product, he's made. They haven't missed an opportunity at all as you make it seem - sure he's younger, but both Kane and Orton, on paper, are just that: veterans. Heavy amount of exposure with both the older and younger crowd. Neither of them are gonna be hurtin' for a win, nor should there be much split milk over the decision(IMHO). If anything, a good portion of that "outside base" are defunct fans who used to think the world of Kane with his mask on(nostalgia filter...), and what better timing than to show Kane - with his mask on - tearing the house down. The very fact that Randy was facing Kane was a joke. This Wrestlemania was odd there was virtually no interesting build up for any but the three big matches. Randy has had several odd match ups at Wrestlemania but none the less he's been there. There's always that one match at WrestleMania featuring two relatively big stars but minimal buildup. But this year was completely justified, the top two matches admittedly needed hefty amount of exposure and hype. Those two matches basically sold the event, and then behind THAT... you had the World title matches. Even if Orton and Kane spent the last five weeks brawling all over the locker-rooms and backstage areas, the priority order would've remained the same. Orton has been paving the way for guys like Barrett, Ziggler and Rhodes all year, the last thing I would've wanted was for him to face yet another up-and-comer at Mania. Kane's position is so malleable within the roster, I thought he was a great opponent for Orton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teh_Showtime Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 It seems like people are forgetting WWE had to shift dramatically after Wade got hurt. So OFC the non 3 main event matches weren't built up efficiently (aside from Show/Cody) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Final Countdown Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 It seems like people are forgetting WWE had to shift dramatically after Wade got hurt. So OFC the non 3 main event matches weren't built up efficiently (aside from Show/Cody) I wonder what the original plan was if Wade hadn't gotten hurt? Wade vs. Orton? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teh_Showtime Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Rumors say he was to win MITB at mania but i don't buy it. Likely Wade and Orton again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Target Practice Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Is it just me, or is there a bit of a shortage of upper-card faces in the WWE right now? I'm thinking Sheamus, Cena, Punk and Orton right now, assuming Rocky doesn't actually stick around. After that, you've got... well, Santino and Kofi Kingston. Maybe Show as well, depending on how you define 'upper' card. Whereas viable upper-card heels you've got Jericho, Del Rio, Henry, Christian, Miz, Dolph Ziggler, Jack Swagger, Daniel Bryan, possibly Kane and Cody Rhodes too, and now Brock Lesnar as well. Not to mention Wade Barrett whenever he comes back from injury. What would you do, turn a couple to face, or would you form a few into a stable? There does seem to be a distinct lack of stables at the moment. Wrestling doesn't feel right without a good heel stable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tha Black Phenom Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 It's been that way for years. IF you were to try to add on the list of upper-card faces, you'd have Zack Ryder, R-Truth.. that's it. It's why I thought Sheamus would be the breakthrough babyface this year but it hasn't looked promising so far, and I wouldn't even be surprised if they did a switcheroo on their feud, have Bryan turn face and Sheamus back to heel. Then, you have Lesnar into the mix.. no idea if they're gonna do another face vs. face duel or just have Lesnar as a popular heel. So alternatively, they can do things like turn Miz, Cody Rhodes, Jack Swagger or Del Rio face(just noted the guys I thought have run their course the most). No way they can house all these heels and keep them relevant, one of them will have to switch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan93 Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 I wonder what the original plan was if Wade hadn't gotten hurt? Wade vs. Orton? Rumors say he was to win MITB at mania but i don't buy it. Likely Wade and Orton again Wade was supposed to win MITB, and Orton was supposed to face Alberto Del Rio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 I still think Del Rio would make a great face and he's pretty stale right now so a turn might do him some good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moe Hunter Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Wade was supposed to win MITB, and Orton was supposed to face Alberto Del Rio. They already started the GM vs GM storyline before Wade got injured. No way were they going to have that as well as a MitB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtplaystew Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Wade was supposed to win MITB, and Orton was supposed to face Alberto Del Rio. He works for WWE booking so HE KNOWS! I have one word to sum up my feelings on Lord Tensai: Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huntman Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 I have one word to sum up my feelings on Lord Tensai: Why? Because he's awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaysin Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Randomly noticed how different wwe.com is from the last time I actually went to their site(it's been a long time) and I stumbled on this. Greg Valentine has a comically large head. He looks like he belongs in a cartoon. http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e322/VenomousPrime/gregvalentine_1_full.png Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juggaloninjalee Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Don't forget about Rey Mysterio guys. He is an upper card guy. I think Lesnar could be a face on some nights as well depending who he is up against. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjohns44 Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 I can stand the 'YES' chants as a potential replacement for 'WHAT?!' and along with the random Daniel Bryan chants here and there, even if he's not involved in a segment or match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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