SWF In 2013

[jhd1]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Eisen-verse" data-cite="Eisen-verse" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I'm not sure what these levels constitute #'s wise, as it's been awhile since I set them, but this is what Duane Fry's talents are set at</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Higher than normal so you should be okay. What types of gimmicks are you using?</p>

[Eisen-verse]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jhd1" data-cite="jhd1" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Higher than normal so you should be okay. What types of gimmicks are you using?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I tend to utilize gimmicks that the performer already has success with. Occasionally, I'll go with a 'realistic' or 'unique' but not very much.</p>

[jhd1]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Eisen-verse" data-cite="Eisen-verse" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I tend to utilize gimmicks that the performer already has success with. Occasionally, I'll go with a 'realistic' or 'unique' but not very much.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> When you say "already had success with" do you mean the same gimmick type they begin the game with? That's not usually the best measure of a gimmick's 'fit', as the starting gimmick ratings (as far as I know) have nothing to do with how well it would grade out normally.</p><p> </p><p> I have a new promotion in my diary game and I've had Bs and As for lots of workers (I've had lower as well, of course) so it is possible. It's partly a combination of playing to your worker's strengths and also checking they fit with your product. It is also worth keeping in mind whether it is a generic gimmick or not, and whether someone else is using it.</p>

[Eisen-verse]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jhd1" data-cite="jhd1" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>When you say "already had success with" do you mean the same gimmick type they begin the game with? That's not usually the best measure of a gimmick's 'fit', as the starting gimmick ratings (as far as I know) have nothing to do with how well it would grade out normally.<p> </p><p> I have a new promotion in my diary game and I've had Bs and As for lots of workers (I've had lower as well, of course) so it is possible. It's partly a combination of playing to your worker's strengths and also checking they fit with your product. It is also worth keeping in mind whether it is a generic gimmick or not, and whether someone else is using it.</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Oh, I suppose I should clarify. "Already had succes with" means that I look to their pre-set ability to play certain gimmicks. So, if Big Cat is better at playing a 'brute' than others then I tend to look at gimmicks that can suit that fact. </p><p> </p><p> B's and A's for gimmicks? I would LOVE that. I mean, I've been able to debut people at high momentum levels (Bruce the Giant came in at an "A") but his gimmick still says "B-". In most cases, all of my gimmicks fall between C+ and B-. There are a few who have secured C ratings though; which sucks (Valiant, Rogue, Remo, etc.). I'm not sure what I could be doing wrong?</p>

[ampulator]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Eisen-verse" data-cite="Eisen-verse" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Oh, I suppose I should clarify. "Already had succes with" means that I look to their pre-set ability to play certain gimmicks. So, if Big Cat is better at playing a 'brute' than others then I tend to look at gimmicks that can suit that fact. <p> </p><p> B's and A's for gimmicks? I would LOVE that. I mean, I've been able to debut people at high momentum levels (Bruce the Giant came in at an "A") but his gimmick still says "B-". In most cases, all of my gimmicks fall between C+ and B-. There are a few who have secured C ratings though; which sucks (Valiant, Rogue, Remo, etc.). I'm not sure what I could be doing wrong?</p></div></blockquote><p> I would say a B- is a fine gimmick rating. The real issue is receive less than B-. </p><p> </p><p> I believe TEW 2013 is a lot stricter when it comes to gimmicks. If you don't tailor gimmicks correctly for even the easiest products for gmmicks and/or for workers that are good at gimmicks (whatever that gimmick may be), then it's possible to get a gimmick rating less than B-.</p><p> </p><p> And when I mean tailor the gimmicks, I really mean you have to try experiment. Unfortunately, the SWF's product has a narrow range when it comes to what is and isn't good. It's going to be difficult to find what it is.</p>

[jhd1]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Eisen-verse" data-cite="Eisen-verse" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Oh, I suppose I should clarify. "Already had succes with" means that I look to their pre-set ability to play certain gimmicks. So, if Big Cat is better at playing a 'brute' than others then I tend to look at gimmicks that can suit that fact. <p> </p><p> B's and A's for gimmicks? I would LOVE that. I mean, I've been able to debut people at high momentum levels (Bruce the Giant came in at an "A") but his gimmick still says "B-". In most cases, all of my gimmicks fall between C+ and B-. There are a few who have secured C ratings though; which sucks (Valiant, Rogue, Remo, etc.). I'm not sure what I could be doing wrong?</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Momentum and gimmick ratings aren't linked, so I wouldn't worry about that. What does your product say regarding gimmicks?</p><p> </p><p> As an example, mine currently says...</p><p> </p><p> "Will expect proper gimmicks"</p><p> "Won't like Highly Risky gimmicks"</p><p> </p><p> Some workers do better than others though. Jarid Hart has a C+ with his Egomaniac gimmick, but Erin Scott has an A with Girl-Next-Door. There's nothing wrong with B-, by the way. Certainly in 2010, B- was the 'default' gimmick rating where you wouldn't receive a penalty (or gain any bonuses).</p>

[ampulator]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="jhd1" data-cite="jhd1" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Momentum and gimmick ratings aren't linked, so I wouldn't worry about that. What does your product say regarding gimmicks?<p> </p><p> As an example, mine currently says...</p><p> </p><p> "Will expect proper gimmicks"</p><p> "Won't like Highly Risky gimmicks"</p><p> </p><p> Some workers do better than others though. Jarid Hart has a C+ with his Egomaniac gimmick, but Erin Scott has an A with Girl-Next-Door. There's nothing wrong with B-, by the way. Certainly in 2010, B- was the 'default' gimmick rating where you wouldn't receive a penalty (or gain any bonuses).</p></div></blockquote><p> Actually, depending on what kind of B- you get (71.1? 76?) you might get a slight bonus. </p><p> </p><p> But in any case, there's a lot of gimmick "notes" within the product details that can hint at what you need to do. The problem isn't that, though, but rather conflicting ones, which is something that SWF has.</p><p> </p><p> Here's all their gmmick notes: </p><p> "...will mean that fans will expect all wrestlers to be packaged with a proper gimmick."</p><p> "...will attract fans that will not like highly risky gimmicks."</p><p> <strong>"...will attract fans that will not like one-dimensional gimmicks."</strong></p><p><strong> "...will attract fans that will not 'get' subtle gimmicks."</strong></p><p> </p><p> The problem is the last two notes. That means he can't have something too subtle, but it can't un-subtle either. That forces the gimmicks to be at a very narrow range for subtlety (around D- to C-).</p>

[Eisen-verse]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="ampulator" data-cite="ampulator" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Actually, depending on what kind of B- you get (71.1? 76?) you might get a slight bonus. <p> </p><p> But in any case, there's a lot of gimmick "notes" within the product details that can hint at what you need to do. The problem isn't that, though, but rather conflicting ones, which is something that SWF has.</p><p> </p><p> Here's all their gmmick notes: </p><p> "...will mean that fans will expect all wrestlers to be packaged with a proper gimmick."</p><p> "...will attract fans that will not like highly risky gimmicks."</p><p> <strong>"...will attract fans that will not like one-dimensional gimmicks."</strong></p><p><strong> "...will attract fans that will not 'get' subtle gimmicks."</strong></p><p> </p><p> The problem is the last two notes. That means he can't have something too subtle, but it can't un-subtle either. That forces the gimmicks to be at a very narrow range for subtlety (around D- to C-).</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I thought that may have been the issue. I mean, it makes sense with a company like the SWF. You've got a WIDE range of people who tune into your shows for whatever reason. So, with that in mind, you have many 'mouths to feed' in a way. Everything kind of averages out in the end; middle of the road due to all the ranging viewers.</p><p> </p><p> I just didn't know if I was the only SWF version that came away with so many lackluster gimmick ratings? </p><p> </p><p> I mean, thus far, even those who have a "C" for a gimmick have been doing well in most segments/matches. That said, I didn't know if it could be BETTER if their gimmick was better.</p><p> </p><p> Right now, I personally haven't overseen a gimmick change that has done better than a "B-".</p>

[gord]

Anybody else find it odd that SWF runs its PPVs on Thursday nights? Is there a reason for this? Has anyone moved them to the more-conventional Sunday nights?

[Teh_Showtime]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="gord" data-cite="gord" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Anybody else find it odd that SWF runs its PPVs on Thursday nights? Is there a reason for this? Has anyone moved them to the more-conventional Sunday nights?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Yes I found it odd a very long time ago but over time I've just come to accept it. I think the bigger oddity in the Cverse is USPW having their PPVs on a random day and week every month which makes linear planning pretty difficult. I usually change them to Saturday week 3 but haven't bothered for 2013. Never once thought about changing SWF from thursdays though.</p>

[Bigpapa42]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="gord" data-cite="gord" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="34914" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Anybody else find it odd that SWF runs its PPVs on Thursday nights? Is there a reason for this? Has anyone moved them to the more-conventional Sunday nights?</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Not really. The convention of Sunday night is normal to us. That convention has developed in reality due to all kinds of factors, including the development of television viewing patterns, sporting standards (particularly NFL football), and other such factors. Same way that Monday became "wrestling night" for us but in the C-verse, its Tuesday night. Different reality, different standards.</p>

[Eisen-verse]

Looking to my screamo/intense music fans. I'm trying to find a song that suits Angry Gilmore's incessant, inexhaustible, uncontrollable anger. Preferably, a song that has a lot of screaming (literally from the second the song starts) is what I have in mind. More or less, I'm looking for a song that instantly sets the tone for someone like Gilmore.

[Rayelek]

Looking to my screamo/intense music fans. I'm trying to find a song that suits Angry Gilmore's incessant, inexhaustible, uncontrollable anger. Preferably, a song that has a lot of screaming (literally from the second the song starts) is what I have in mind. More or less, I'm looking for a song that instantly sets the tone for someone like Gilmore.

 

Doesn't quite meet what you're looking for in terms of screaming, but how about "When Everything Falls" by Haste the Day?

[Adam_Starr36]

" You're Ever So Inviting " by UnderOath .. Does that fit into the scream genre? .. It's 2 years old though, but always good.

[SB92]

What do y'all think about my idea of what to do with Lobster Warrior?

 

I'm going to have Marat Khoklov continue his undefeated streak and I'm going to have Lobster Warrior constantly request a shot to end the streak but The Khoklov Camp don't take him serious and always refuse until Lobster Warrior decides to offer his mask on the line is when they finally accept the match, Lobster Warrior will put up a good challenge but lose and I'm going to bring Lobster Warrior back under his real name and I'll eventually have him end the streak which (if Lobster Warrior gets over enough) will lead to a main event run towards the world title.

[Guest codey]

I think it would be interesting to actually keep Lobster Warrior as Lobster Warrior. Most people tend to switch him to his real name since they have no idea how to book a comedy character so strongly so they automatically assume it's a weak gimmick. Truth is, though, he's been running the gimmick since TEW started in 2005, so it's obviously hugely successful.

 

I'd look at Jay Lethal's Black Machismo from TNA as an example. A comedy character who was in plenty of funny segments, but also a dangerous wrestler who kept the comedy out of his matches. I like to think Warrior's more along the lines of that than a Santino-type whose mostly a comedy match worker.

[Self]

In theory, I'm a massive fan of the Lobster Warrior gimmick, but I admit he's become lost in the shuffle in my game. I'm 6 months in, and he's still at the same popularity, as hasn't had a single feud worth mentioning.

 

Having him lose his mask, come back more serious, and push for the title is a fine idea. If a little... what's the kid-audience of SWF? I know it's more attitude than modern WWE, so I wonder how bummed the fanbase would be for their wacky hero to disappear, replaced by Man-With-Black-Trunks #6469.

 

I'd be tempted to go a step further. He drops the mask himself. He goes overboard in distancing himself from the character. He abandons his Lobster Warrior mannerisms and moves. Someone makes a seafood joke, he flips out. Child with a foam lobster claw cheering him on, he makes cry. He has some success with his new serious attitude, but still fails to win the big one. The conclusion being that the Lobster is, in some part, who he is. He doesn't go back to the full gimmick, but he reintegrates some of his old moves into his style. Uses some of the old lobster tricks. The fun stuff he used to use to frustrate his opponents. Only by finding a new balance can he effectively win the big one and rise to the top.

 

My only other idea is to put him with Jungle Jack & Captain Atomic and make the Hero Squad a stable, then turn them all heel. Heroes For Hire. Saving the world... for a price. Super-powered hired guns. I did it before with Captain Atomic ("Corporate Atomic") and had fun with it.

[Bigpapa42]

Not a bad approach, Self.

 

I honestly don't even consider having him lose the gimmick at this point. I completely get why people do, but it feels unnatural to me now. The way I book him is to play him pretty straight. A comedy character who has moved past the comedy for the most part. Other than a few crustacean-related catchphrases and the ring gear, he's just like any other talent. There is still some implicit comedy in the fact that dressing up like a lobster - imagine him going onto a late night talk show wearing a suit and the claws, acting completely normal except mentioning having grown up at the bottom of the sea.

 

I see him as a constant target for heels, who pick on the guy who is different. The babyfaces all accept him for who he is. So in that sense, the character is a walking life lesson for the kids watching. But he's more than that. The average fan loves him not just because he's a determined, "never say die' babyface but because he's a helluva wrestler. I see him as a very polarizing figure at the same time, because the SWF would have a smarky fan base and a segment of those fans would hate the fact that the SWF has saddled this super-talented wrestler with this gimmick.

 

Keeping him in the gimmick gives me so many dynamics to play with in different ways. Taking him out makes him just another talented wrestler. I prefer the fun dynamics.

[gord]

What do y'all think about my idea of what to do with Lobster Warrior?

 

I'm going to have Marat Khoklov continue his undefeated streak and I'm going to have Lobster Warrior constantly request a shot to end the streak but The Khoklov Camp don't take him serious and always refuse until Lobster Warrior decides to offer his mask on the line is when they finally accept the match, Lobster Warrior will put up a good challenge but lose and I'm going to bring Lobster Warrior back under his real name and I'll eventually have him end the streak which (if Lobster Warrior gets over enough) will lead to a main event run towards the world title.

I did the EXACT same thing with him in my game. Had him unmasked after a loss to Khoklov (cost me $10,000 to do so) then beat him at the next PPV. His pop and momentum took a real hit in the losing, but the win bumped his pop way up and he's now a main eventer.

[mitsukaikira]

Looking to my screamo/intense music fans. I'm trying to find a song that suits Angry Gilmore's incessant, inexhaustible, uncontrollable anger. Preferably, a song that has a lot of screaming (literally from the second the song starts) is what I have in mind. More or less, I'm looking for a song that instantly sets the tone for someone like Gilmore.

 

Arsis - Worship Depraved

 

It IS Angry Gilmore.

[Eisen-verse]

If you’re going to take Lobster Warrior’s mask off, having him lose it because he tries to be a ‘hero’ and fails (ala not beating Khoklov) is probably the best way to go with it. That said, you almost certainly have to turn him heel shortly after the unveiling. I REALLY like Self’s approach in that vein. You could turn the scenario a little more darker, if you wanted, by having him feel as though he ‘let everyone down’ by not beating Khoklov. It’s the consummate ‘Hero failed and now doubts whether or not he was ever a hero at all’. Often, these kind of figures take a failure pretty tough. He could descend into sadness; become a shell of his former self as he just can’t get over the fact that he didn’t beat Khoklov.

 

Slowly, he becomes more and more agitated as sadness turns to frustration. He’s going through the 7-Cycles of Loss really. Ultimately, he transforms into this spiteful, frustrated, and overtly jaded figure. This is where Self’s persona can come in handy (ie: making kids cry… flipping out at Crustacean jokes). He eventually becomes this rabid fighter; taking out his frustration on others.

 

With all of that said though, I’m one who also loves the Lobster Warrior gimmick. Sure, he doesn’t seem to really fit given the SWF’s original product BUT even 18-34 year old males like a good comedy gimmick here and there. Look at the bWo in ECW. Lobster Warrior is more successful (wins and titles wise) than those guys BUT they did pretty well for themselves as a comedy act in, probably, THE most male-slanted companies we’ve ever seen.

 

This is how I see Lobbie. A more successful version of the bWo. Fans, even drunk ones, love him because he’s overtly simple in nature. It’s like a sense of nostalgia back to their childhood. They can suspend belief long enough to accept him and ultimately KNOW (smark wise) that he’s a great wrestler. Plus, despite the ‘attitude-era’ feel of SWF, there are still kids watching the product who love him. May be bad parenting to have them watch but hey… What are you going to do?

[Kitarzu]

Looking to my screamo/intense music fans. I'm trying to find a song that suits Angry Gilmore's incessant, inexhaustible, uncontrollable anger. Preferably, a song that has a lot of screaming (literally from the second the song starts) is what I have in mind. More or less, I'm looking for a song that instantly sets the tone for someone like Gilmore.

 

The first coming to mind is this, considering also Gilmore's gimmick:

 

Killswitch Engage - This Fire Burns

[Irish Wolf]

I haven't taken the mask off of Lobby in 2013 I did in 2012. If I were going to do it 2012 I'd probably do it the same way. Have him in a feud against anyone but preferably a big guy and he;ll be able to win matches on TV but every time he gets to his real opponent on the PPV he gets crushed. Then you have andother guy in a fued with a big man, in my 2012 it was Gregory Black and they're fued will intertwine and they'll win their tag matches at PPVs but only because whoever you use gets the win.

 

Lobby starts getting depressed and his partner tries to keep his spirits up, but finally tells him that it was never the mask or super powers the Chris Morisette was the real power behind his wins. He tries to convince Lobby that he should take of the mask and he'll start seeing wins again, he has to use the pwoer of his fighting spirit not the power of the mask, Lobby doesn't want too so they make a deal If The friend wins his match at the next PPV and Lobby loses his then in his next Lobby loses the mask til his next PPV match. And of course this is exactly what happens.

 

So after lobby takes his mask off there's a bunch of train montages and a few tag matches which they win the first three because of the partner and then finally at the tag match before the PPV which will be against two monsters but not the people they're feuding with Morissette gets the win. Now with out the mask he goes into his PPV match psyched up by his friend and he takes the big win over the guy who had been crushing him for the past few months. And his friend says you see it was always just you.

 

Then they round up the feuds with their respective guys and Lobby and whoever his friend is have a program where its a friendly competition, best of seven series. which of course comes down to the last match and you can choose to turn either of the guys, his friend being frustrated that Lobby is about to beat him and cheats to win turning heel or Lobby getting a big head but seeing he's about to lose cheats to win and turns heel.

[Rayelek]

While taking the mask off of Lobster Warrior is something you can do, I usually like to leave it on in SWF, as that's what the fans know him as. In the past, he's formed a championship winning tag team with Jungle Lord (Kings of the Wild) and also pushed for the World Championship without losing the mask.

 

However, when taking off the mask, as I have when I stole him from SWF to my own company, I usually refer to him as "The Warrior" Chris Morrisette, still doing some of the Lobster Warrior mannerisms and moves, just not wanting to copy the character and costume (somewhat pretending copyright is a thing in the C-Verse).

[Teh_Showtime]

If I unmask Lobby I tend to call him Chris Rockwell instead of his real name, it just sounds better to me.

 

I actually just unmaksed him at When Hell Freezes Over 2014 after Rogue beat him senseless and then ripped the mask off of him. This is during his ongoing feud with the Chase Agency and Paul Huntingdon is my current champion who won the title the night he walked out of a match with Lobby (count out loss) and he cashed in my version of Money in the Bank. Lobby was pretty much screwed during his title match which was a triple threat with former champ Rich Money, and his team failed to defeat the Chase Agency at Christmas Clash. The match was Huntingdon, Rogue, Eric Eisen, and Enforcer Roberts vs Lobby, Valiant, Jack Bruce and Magnum Kobe.

 

Valiant was the number one contender due to winning Welcome tobthe Jungle battle Royal for a shot at WHFO that he lost, which was the same night Rogue beat Lobby. My plan is for him to have an identity crisis of sorts going forward instead of taking the mask off and suddenly kicking major ass. I highly doubt he gets a title reign but as of now the plan for Supreme Challenge will be for him to defeat Rich Money who will insert himself into the story when he begins to ridicule him.