Cverse grand tour

[Boltinho]

So I’ve had this idea for a while and never had the opportunity. I need a rest from my main game and having read all of Self’s awesome CGC diary I thought I’d have a crack.

 

The idea is to do a Grand Tour and play for a chunk with every starting CVerse company.

 

I’ll obviously give my thoughts and impressions and try to have a go at comparing them too. Somehow.

 

For each company in alphabetical order I’ll play a set time keeping conditions as close to canon as possible. I won’t change any product settings at all. So CGC will keep to an hour of TV and NOTBPW will keep those crazy expected match lengths. I may add things like development territories but only if it seems a natural thing to do rather than for the sake of it. I’m not playing to develop anyone of course.

 

For those with TV/PPV deals I’ll play 3 months. If some of them have a PPV near the end of the month I might finish slightly early. For those without broadcast distribution I’ll play a year.

 

I’ll keep roster turnover to a minimum unless it needs adjusting. My base setting is one-in, one-out but if a company is too small I’ll look at hirings etc. I might look at company relationships and trades if they seem appropriate but they won’t be gratuitous. For example EWA won’t be hooking up with BHOTWG or UEW but they might do a deal with 21CW.

 

Obviously I’ll be updating as I go along to make sure I get through it – it’s a big project!

[Boltinho]

Scoring. All scores on a 1-5 scale with 5 being very good and 1 being very weak.

 

21CW

 

Starting roster 2

Ease of play 2

Difficulty of challenge 1

Room to grow 5

Average grade C+/B-

Strongest grade B- [75]

Overall rating 2

[Boltinho]

Starting alphabetically the first company I’ll be taking for a spin is one I’ve played a lot with but not in the current game version – 21CW.

 

Expectations

A SE company with only flawed stars. Dark Angel is great but he’s almost certainly in time decline. Joss Thompson is great but he’s liable to jump ship. Jonathan Faust is small and average in the ring. Adam Matravers has little charisma. Jeff Nova is a star but can’t get in the ring (any more).

 

21CW is not an easy ride but you do have a few advantages: there’s no one you can hire to improve yourself but also no competition so you can build anyone you like. It’s tough to grow but no chance of any promotional battles either.

 

Initial reactions

Pretty much as I expected although I was shocked at the size of the roster. It’s massive. At the top end you’ve got some nice workers without any clear cut dominant ones and then there is a huge mass of young workers who would turn into something after paying some dues. Basically anyone who’s an established wrestler in the UK works for them (or has a reason why they don’t) and they can keep all the talent they like on a PPA to be used once or twice a month whilst they develop.

 

Because of the size of the roster and the number of people who need developing or getting over (basically everyone) I see stables as being pretty key here. Good talkers (Nova, Kathleen Lee) can get swathes of people over and multi-man matches can ensure our few good workers can teach lots of youngsters.

 

It’s a bit top-heavy too. There are a load of ME/UM talent with no storylines. With 2 hours of TV we can change that but there’s no point in burning through bit matchups for the 4th match on a card. And there are only so many ME vs developmental prospect feuds the fans can take.

 

Feuds

There are only 2 set up:

 

Dark Angel vs Jonathan Faust

Angel is the epitome of someone who doesn’t need the strap. He’s a huge draw and clearly has performance stats that are the best in the region. Faust is a talker but quite frankly too small to be a main player in-ring. Maybe with a bit of training he can be a real top performer – hence this feud.

Long-term I see Faust as head of a stable where he lets others do the dirty work and tries to wriggle out of harm’s way himself.

Long terms I see Dark Angel as… Well there is no long-term really. A road agent who does some guest appearances on camera to get his successor over maybe.

 

TITLE: Edward Cornell vs Adam Matravers

So Ed is a pretty solid hand. Apart from the family connection that writes his character pretty well he’s a good all-rounder and deserves the belt.

Adam is one of my favourites but is getting on a bit and has a glaring weakness – his lack of charisma. Fortunately his girlfriend/manager Phoebe Plumridge is the perfect solution to this and so I’m happy with this feud. If I can get them both over a bit more and looking great they can have some awesome matches and turn in nice promos. A big blow-off between these two will likely main-event Head-to-head in March for me.

 

NEW: tag titles Absolutely Flawless vs Defence Force

The tag champs for me are a holding plan. With so many big(gish) names twiddling their thumbs it seems a smart move to get a couple of them boosting the tag division. Pitbull and DJ Reason with your decent performance skills and existing tag experience. They’ll have a shortish feud that will expand to feature more teams and likely end with the vets holding the belts.

 

NEW: UK title – Luke Cool vs Wade Orson

No great leap of faith here. Wade Orson is one of 21CWs great assets. With his age and ability it’s very likely he’ll be on your NBT or at least hot prospect list and is heading for a good career. In fact he’s one of the few guys that could get signed away to the big buys so maybe worth giving him a written contract at some stage.

Luke is the champ right now. He’s an OK hand but probably won’t be a push. Given the product and situation it seems more useful to me to have Wade regularly winning on TV with a belt.

 

NEW: STABLE WARS - Lee Agency vs New Breed

I told you stables would be key. This is all about giving established workers something to do and raising up prospects to TV level.

The Lee agency (bad rip-off I know but this is a quick game) will be Kathleen leading Kevin “Business” Jones, Joss Thompson, the Ivanoffs and War Machine against a group of young talents from the NSW (Leigh Burton, Ricky Storm, Michael X, Sifu & Joe Simpson). Obviously the heels will be winning but cheating to do so and trying to give big rubs every time they interact together (matches or angles). War Machine is already managed by Cliff King so that will be an early sub-storyline.

The faces clearly need some star power too so Jeff Nova will be involved encouraging them, etc.

 

Plans

That still leaves a few names with nothing to do: Philip Cooper, Leo Price, Daniel Black Francis and plenty more. They’ll be rotated in and out of the show to fuel people in key storylines. TBH they might be kept deliberately low-key. After feuds are over I can’t draft on many other names so fallow periods will be useful in 21CW to keep things fresh. If they were on written contracts I’d be handing out some hefty holidays.

 

It also leaves quite a lot of young heels I like who have nothing to do right away. The Red Devils, Bedlam, Nightmare, etc. Cliff King will be settling into a role as a long-term leader of a youth stable who can’t quite get things going. I imagine he’ll do a lot of training angles over his career.

 

21CW seem to be in dire need of a development company – but that would mean written deals and expense. If this were a long-term game I’d set up a B-brand that tours the UK weekly instead where midcarders and names not involved in storylines get wins over the hordes of young workers available.

 

Oh and for people who haven’t played with 21CW – Nightmare will never be featured in a match. EVER. I know he looks like a project but he’s really not.

 

Possible hires

I won’t be doing it here (I think) but the obvious people to bring in are:

 

British Samurai

To lead a ROF invasion of technical workers

 

Highland Warrior (and his son Jeff Mcpeterson)

To lead a hardcore MOSC invasion.

 

UK Dragon

He’s one of my favourite workers. Maybe as a ringleader of Japanese imports?

 

Joey Beauchamp

If you end up with a lightweight major name Joey could be a good foil.

 

Merle O’Curle

Maybe to work with British Samurai as above but I like Merle as the equivalent of a monster heel too. The problem being his lack of charisma in a very SE company. I can only see him really as a midcarder.

 

Beast Bantom

Potentially the top monster heel available who could head to the top of your card in time. You’ve already got War Machine though. They could probably rotate 6-month deals and pushes.

 

Ali Bloxsome

A hard-core druid? Great hire to bring in for seasonal stuff. I’d love to bring him in for a month around each solstice for example. Either way a decent vet to handle short-term fame.

[Bigpapa42]

Nice idea. Lots of work, but a great read, I imagine. Will be following.

[Kainlock]

I too look forward to this

[demondragonking]

I'll throw my support behind this as well. Good idea and great start. I await more.

[Bad Collin]

This is a great idea. I will be following especially as I have been thinking about a 21CW game/diary for a while.

[Boltinho]

Nice idea. Lots of work, but a great read, I imagine. Will be following.

 

Yeah. Well - I needed a project.

 

Shows are ongoing but a little slowly. 2 hours of TV really seems like overkill for me with 21CW.

 

2-3 good matches go in and then all of a sudden you're looking for material where UMs you aren't pushing are going to need to get some wins. Strange situation

[Lo-Drew]

I'm intrigued by this as well. Will definitely be following this.

[TLCJR4LIFE]

Bolt I'm also doing this but I'm taking every company to Global. Mind if I post some of my own musings in this thread?

[consortium11]

I have a slightly different take on 21CW.

 

First thing to note is that 21CW is arguably the single most menace based promotion in the world... even more than USPW or DIW. Your starting roster features 11 workers with 80+ menace with many of those in the high 80's. Not that it applies to this game but when the National School of Wrestling starts turning out prospects for you you get even more... seeming at least one (if not two) 80+ menace monsters a year. For all the talk of USPW being the land of the giants, 21CW is very much the land of the normal sized faces vs the monster heels.

 

Considering the way that menace is something akin to a cheat button when it comes to high angle ratings and thus high overness, when I play Nightmare normally gets a quite a few matches (normally at least one per PPV). Not because he's a project and not because his high overness makes up for his other awful stats but because with 92 menace I can spend a month building him up in short menace angles and then job him to a worker I actually care about at the PPV. Rinse and repeat. Of course I could do that with the other monster heels (and I do sometimes use Danny Patterson in that role who can at least train people in brawling) but I view both War Machine and Brickhouse Balder as projects who I like to keep strong.

 

I also don't think Beast Bandom and War Machine quite occupy the same spot. Bantom comes pretty much ready made with acceptable top and second row stats; once his overness is increased (relatively easy with his menace) he can hold his own in matches. War Machine in contrast is quite a long way further back in his development (understandable considering his age) and really needs a lot of work on his skills before he's really in a position to headline major shows even with his overness. War Machine, Brickhouse Balder and eventually Grave Digger basically all need the slow-build treatment to get the most out of them, being given time to develop their skills.

 

In storyline/fluff terms I'm not necessarily sold on the idea of bringing in the likes of British Samurai, the McPeterson's and Merle O'Curle; all of them pretty much hate Jeff Nova and his version of 21CW. When I do put such concerns behind me and bring some of them in I tend to do an RoF invasion with Samurai, O'Curle and the Shooters. Gameplay wise you suffer from the immediate overness issue; an invasion should be a major storyline but all of those guys have popularity in the low 30's/high 20's... less than your lower midcarders which means putting them in main events is likely to tank those ratings.

 

If I was going to do a MOSC invasion I'd personally hold off a little; the National School of Wrestling produces almost as many hardcore brawlers as it does high menace workers (often at the same time) who would on paper be the natural fit as successors to MOSC.

 

Quick tip; hire Nick Adams as your road agent (replacing the Steamroller... he's better). Turn the Steamroller into a manger/entertainment trainer; entertainment skills of 80+ are wasted simply being a road agent.

 

These aren't necessarily good fits for your game as they're all projects that are likely to take longer than 3 months but here are some gems in the British scene that are well worth a hire:

 

Melanie Florence and/or Papa O'Keefe: All of Florence's entertainment stats are 80+ while O'Keefe's may not be as strong but he does come with a built-in gimmick perfect for 21CW. They suffer from the same issue all new hires for 21CW do (low overness) but that can be mitigated by making one a colour commentator and they're absolute perfect trainers for developing entertainment skills in others.

 

Michael Gregory: His bio is somewhat unfair; looked at purely in terms of brawling his 64 is actually one of the highest you can find in the UK. His performance skills need work but there are a lot of veterans out there to help that. And he has 82 star quality. If you train up his entertainment skills and put him in a tag-team to develop his performance stats while hoping for decent potential and destiny rolls you've got a guy who eventually can headline the company.

 

Brilliant White: If you can get past the fluff reasons why you shouldn't hire him (and the in-game drug history) you get a generic flashy high-flier with woeful performance stats. But you also get one with 80+ charisma and acting. It may not always pay off, but something can be done with that.

 

Greg Gauge: You can hire him. You can tie him down to a written so he can't be stolen. You should. He'll start out as one of the best wrestlers on your roster and he'll only get better. Pairing him with either Dark Angel or UK Dragon seems a match made in heaven.

 

Hugh de Aske: Not quite as impressive a starter as Gauge, you still get a guy with an average of about 60 for top row skills, decent performance stats and good entertainment skills. With some time to develop he can become an absolute rock in your roster.

 

Nigel Svenson: A natural fit if you're doing a ROF invasion and a decent addition even if you're not. Being an uncharismatic technical worker he's not necessarily a "21CW style" wrestler but with a little help to boost his overness he can quite quickly become a midcard mainstay and a good trainer for other workers.

[Boltinho]

I have a slightly different take on 21CW.

 

Great to see a different pov. I agree with most of it of course. As much as I love Nigel S though he's a stretch for 21CW with his lack of charisma. If I hired him I'd team him with someone like Faust or Cooper. But for this current game of course it's not right. Thanks for sharing - I'm really interested in that sort of debate

 

Bolt I'm also doing this but I'm taking every company to Global. Mind if I post some of my own musings in this thread?

 

Of course! The more the merrier sir. This thread isn't about what Im doing - its about comparing the companies

 

__________________________________________________________

 

Quick update on my game. Its been slow going due to extreme busy-ness with work and family but we've held the Steel Cage Challenge. That and all TV shows graded out as B-. Pretty solid stuff but the midcard and lower is really developmental. Danny Patterson has been hired by Faust to try and get past Dark Angel. Ed Cornell's pop has started to get high enough. And Nova is doing wonders for the young NSW products in their battle against The Lee Agency (who do very well on menace thanks very much). More updates to come...

[TLCJR4LIFE]

Im about 2 years into my 21CW and am almost National(should be but unlucky region importance screwed me)

 

My take on 21CW was different than both. I'm playing with everything on as default(sans numbers instead of grades) and as the Headbooker.

 

The first year I tackled it as essentially the Dark Angel show. If you notice, 21CW still runs a lot of matches instead of angles on their shows, so Dark Angel really has to be the guy at first to carry your shows while your other guys get more popular and skilled.

 

Nearly all your Main Eventers have around below average performance so having Dark Angel carry the belt while the other guys get better isn't a bad idea. Note Dark Angel needs careful booking because he can't do Entertainment..using him in Overness angles is generally the way you want to go.

 

As far as young talent goes Brickhouse Balder is a major, major headcase and generally isn't worth it at all. He actually has pretty weak Star Quality I found out later...and he's much more raw than War Machine.

 

Don't be fooled..Buff Martinez is a guy who easily can be called upon to spot Main Event. Has the skills, charisma and Star Quality to be a big star...not a very good promo though.

 

 

SIGNINGS

The thing is most of my roster that weren't busts or guys I specically hired as jobbers are guys that were already there. 21CW is big enough where you should be able to find a little bit of anything you are looking for already on the roster, that said there are a couple of signings that will patch up any roster. At this point, I'm sticking a lot of the NWS guys in Development and pushing them when they come up....but that should be a given.

Looking strictly at the most successful signings I made I'd recommend the following

 

Beast Bantom : Already been pointed out twice in the thread but he's a charismatic star big man that with time could learn to work as a babyface. He's definitely Upper Midcard material.

 

Hugh De Aske - As consortium pointed out, he's an absolute midcard ace. He has charisma, star quality, well rounded top row skills and good performance. He's not a main eventer but he's as good as it gets for a reliable hand in midcard getting grades.

 

Jason Dempsey - I signed him late as a random addition to my Development. Including him in my list and not with the pregens and other young workers because in my game he's projected as a future Main Eventer and he's already 24 when you start. Sign him up, he's good in the ring and maybe you'll get lucky with his development.

 

Melanie Florence - World class Color Commentator that not only is an ace there but can be used to develop the roster in entertainment.

 

 

Nick Adams - As pointed out, he's better than the Steamroller. I no longer use him however as I have Hanshiro Furusawa from when I purchased BCG.

 

Red Dragon - Weird huh? I signed him solely for story purposes and he turned out to be an excellent hire. Good thing about him is he can work babyface and heel very well and is an all around solid midcard hand. I use him in a tag team but he also can work singles. His main weakness is his stamina and consistency. This guy is actually my favourite jobber on the whole roster. He's one exactly ONE singles match(his debut) in two years here(although hes won quite a few tag team matches) and he's pretty much gotten himself to C- overness pretty easily.

 

UK Dragon - Midcard stud. Currently have this guy around the UK Title picture. He's a guy you need around there to bring prestige to the belt with his solid match ratings. His flaw is his age. He is very old.

[consortium11]

Great to see a different pov. I agree with most of it of course. As much as I love Nigel S though he's a stretch for 21CW with his lack of charisma. If I hired him I'd team him with someone like Faust or Cooper. But for this current game of course it's not right. Thanks for sharing - I'm really interested in that sort of debate

 

For me there's always been a space in a company like 21CW for solid, uncharismatic technical workers although in truth it rarely gets them past the midcard. If you look at the existing roster... even some fairly high up the card... there's quite a few guys with mediocre at best charisma; Harry Wilson, Pit Bull Brown, Stevie Stoat, Red Devil's etc etc.

 

Svenson isn't someone I push as a superstar and he spends a lot of time jobbing early on; sometimes I deliberately don't sign him to a written so he can tour in Japan and develop his skills that way. I normally end up giving him a feud against a monster heel and win (if it's against Nightmare) or lose (against most of the rest) it's enough to bring him up to midcard where he functions as a trainer for others.

[Spud1305]

Sounds interesting. Like your assessment of 21CW.

Are you playing as the owners/existing bookers or are you using your own user character?

[Boltinho]

Sounds interesting. Like your assessment of 21CW.

Are you playing as the owners/existing bookers or are you using your own user character?

 

Playing as Jeff Nova in 21CW. Anything else would feel silly.

 

Prob will stick to owners/bookers for everyone unless something weird comes up.

 

Update - I'm just going into March. Been super busy so moving slow. Frankly I haven't been enjoying booking 21CW that much either. Strange seeing how much I've played with them in the past (I had a long running diary in TEW2010). I don't like the 2 hr TV shows. I don't like the 80% match ratio and I don't like the huge roster. It feels like I'd like a smaller roster with less chance to burn through matches. I don't want to have 2nd rate people inbig matches if my stars are going to be in angles. And if I put my stars in matches I don't have enough time to add others into angles.

 

Will hopefully get it finished tonight and move on

[Boltinho]

DOUBLE POST!

 

So - got through the last month and although I'm pleased it was done I stand by my earlier comments. It's a fun company with potential - but the starting situation is a bit rubbish. In 6-12 months time my 21CW would have:

 

• Reduced the roster right down to high 20s from the mid-40s it starts at (assuming you sign the 5 NSW grads).
  
• Built 3-5 real stars at the top. Likely: Adam M, Ed Cornell, Jon Faust, Joss T.
  
• Wade Orson and Daniel BF would be well on their way to being strong UM hands.
  
• A few of the good midcarders would be built up a bit more (Leigh, Ricky, War Machine, Bedlam)
  
• Likely just one ME vs ME feud at any time which would rotate amongst the stars
  
• A handful of ME vs midcarder feuds
  
• At least one stable vs stable feud.
  
• Kath Lee, The Steamroller and Cliff King would all be leading stables
  
• Midcarders and below on 3-6 month rolling contracts
  
• Product adjusted from 80% matches. FAR too high
  

 

And that would make it fun for me. Until then it's a bit of a slog. But the lack of competition and $$$ at least gives you room to play.

 

Scores to go in 2nd post...

[Spud1305]

I agree about playing as Jeff Nova, because it seems without him, 21CW would still be smaller promotion.

Like your potential plans to how you would have carried on and you stars that you would have built the company around.

I read through your 2010 diary and liked the way you booked things.

Will be interesting to see what you do with the other promotions.

[setalight]

Just wanted to say I started my first ever C-Verse game yesterday and decided to start with 21CW, I have used a lot of the information provided in this thread and its helped me out a lot. If you continue to do this for other companies I'll be following it.

[Boltinho]

Just wanted to say I started my first ever C-Verse game yesterday and decided to start with 21CW, I have used a lot of the information provided in this thread and its helped me out a lot. If you continue to do this for other companies I'll be following it.

 

Thanks sir

 

I will carry on but too busy right now with other stuff. 5SSW are VERY different and ACPW are a big fun company for me.