The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[TheKenwyne]

Here's the promo on 411:

 

http://www.411mania.com/wrestling/news/201131/[VIDEO]-2011-Surivor-Series-Promo.htm

 

Seems pretty explicit to me. The Rock will wrestle. Survior Series Team Rock vs. Team Cena?

[Teh_Showtime]

Team Rock vs Team Cena

 

Team HHH vs Team Punk

 

plus title matches

[OldStingberg]

I'm not sure Team Rock vs. Team Cena works too well if they're both faces. Same with Team HHH vs. Team Punk. Besides the weird 'who do people root for' factors, who would the heels wrestle at Survivor Series?

[Hive]

Here's the promo on 411:

 

http://www.411mania.com/wrestling/news/201131/[VIDEO]-2011-Surivor-Series-Promo.htm

 

Seems pretty explicit to me. The Rock will wrestle. Survior Series Team Rock vs. Team Cena?

 

I think you guys are putting too much into that promo. It is said that he will "return to action". And yes, while that *could* mean that he will wrestle - it could also mean that he will just cut a promo on Cena and lay a Rock Bottom. "Action" does not necessarily mean that he will wrestle. Maybe he'll be a guest referee between Cena and Del Rio?

 

On another Survivor Series topic, I expect some sort of "new nWo" team to participate in a match. The big question is just whether it will be with Triple H and Nash or Punk and Nash...

[OldStingberg]

I think you guys are putting too much into that promo. It is said that he will "return to action". And yes, while that *could* mean that he will wrestle - it could also mean that he will just cut a promo on Cena and lay a Rock Bottom. "Action" does not necessarily mean that he will wrestle. Maybe he'll be a guest referee between Cena and Del Rio?

 

To me, the key is "returns to action for the first time in almost eight years." We saw The Rock lay out Cena at WM this year, but his last match was about seven-and-a-half years ago. I think the implication is pretty clear. If The Rock's not wrestling at Survivor Series, I'd say the WWE was being intentionally misleading with that promo.

[20LEgend]

I think the suggestion of Special Guest referee might be the closest to being truth. If they aren't just lying and adding it to try and hype it.

[milamber]

Just found a video of Andy Levine's (aka Kevin Hackman) FCW debut. Don't think he'll be in the WWE for a while yet, plus he needs a name change and a better finisher.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5x99HUYeKk

 

Apparently Triple H pedigreed both Ryder and Mahal off-air recently.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_gszqX3nQU

 

 

As noted before, The Rock will be appearing at this year's Survivor Series pay-per-view but won't be wrestling. Sources expect him to deliver a promo and get physically involved somehow with Cena, but not wrestle a match.

 

The WrestleMania 28 build is set to go in full effect at Survivor Series and Rock will likely appear at the Royal Rumble and Elimination Chamber.

 

The Figure Four Weekly Newsletter reports that there has been talk of doing a best-of-three series between The Rock and John Cena to solve the problem of who wins the WrestleMania main event. It's talk right now but if it happens, Rock and Cena would wrestle at WrestleMania, the following pay-per-view and then a third time at SummerSlam 2012.

 

Source: F4Wonline.com

[Mr.Macho]

There's a featured video section on the front page of that site currently showing a Survivor Series promo hyping the Rock's "return to action for the first time in almost eight years."

 

http://thesmarkreport.com its right their in front of you as stated above! Sorry I should have been more clear.

[bigtplaystew]

I think if you expect the Rock to be in a match at Survivor Series or any time before wrestlemania you are setting yourself up for disappoinment. Which is fine. Just don't waste my message board time complaining about it.

[Jaysin]

I think if you expect the Rock to be in a match at Survivor Series or any time before wrestlemania you are setting yourself up for disappoinment. Which is fine. Just don't waste my message board time complaining about it.

 

 

I think what you should be doing is not wasting YOUR time reading these arguments. This is a DISCUSSION thread. People will discuss whatever they want. They don't have to cater to your beliefs or thoughts.

[bigtplaystew]

Thank you for that intelligent discussion piece then.

[Guest codey]

Did anyone watching this weeks NXT find it really weird that they kept Yoshi Tatsu's old music with the gimmick change? It seemed really off.

 

EDIT: Just read the previous discussion, please try and be less condescending in the future. It's really unnecessary.

[bigtplaystew]

First of all, my only point was that I don't want to read a bunch of people complaining about how WWe "let them down" again when they had unreasonable expectations. I'm not saying there's no way Rock's wrestling. I'm just saying if you've EVER watched a WWE product before you should know they over sensationalize things sometimes.

 

A very similar conversation broke out when the Rock came back on Raw and said he was "never going away." I watched countless ADULT fans who've watched for a very long time assume this meant he was joining the fulltime roster.

 

I'm just saying.. be realistic here it's not likely that the Rock is wrestling at Survivor Series. Especially when you are breaking down what amounts to a sentence fragment.

 

 

I never said I expected people to cater to my needs or anything of the sort. That was all made up by someone who felt the need to try to take a shot at me rather than add to a conversation.

[Self]

A very similar conversation broke out when the Rock came back on Raw and said he was "never going away." I watched countless ADULT fans who've watched for a very long time assume this meant he was joining the fulltime roster.

 

To be fair, that was a pretty misleading thing for Rock to say. I don't blame any fans, adult or not, to have taken him at his word. Especially if they're not on the internet or studying the inner workings of things.

 

Similarly, here we've got a misleading advert. Not cool.

[bigtplaystew]

To be fair, that was a pretty misleading thing for Rock to say. I don't blame any fans, adult or not, to have taken him at his word. Especially if they're not on the internet or studying the inner workings of things.

 

Similarly, here we've got a misleading advert. Not cool.

 

 

 

I'm sorry does it say anywhere that the Rock WILL WRESTLE at survivor series? nope.

 

And did the Rock ever say, "I'm joining the WWE roster fulltime??" Nope.

 

 

He simply said he wasn't leavign again. He then later agreed to take part in Wrestlemania. The fact that YOU, adult or not, are not satified with this... is quite frankly YOUR problem and I get sick of people complaining about stuff like this.

 

 

They use catchphrases and words that are misleading (WWE? MIDLEADING?? NOOOO) to some I guess but it's just hype machine banter to get you to buy a PPV.

 

I thought we all understood this.

 

 

I dont mean to come off "condescending" or mean or angry but I feel like WWE fans, especially the adult ones, get a little ahead of themselves and expect WWE to overdeliver. Then I gotta sit here and read a bunch of garbage about how some fans "expected more" from them and crap like that.

[Tha Black Phenom]

Fans cheer and back winners...period. At some point, if they guy/team they are following doesn't win (and win clean), they stop being seen as credible (see WCW vs NWO -WCW never got the upperhand and eventually crowd support for the "good guys" turned into apathy). Even if a heel is going to ultimately lose, they still need to be seen as a credible threat to the face. Think about how boring Batman comics would be if the worse thing the Joker did to get over was to try to get Batman thrown in jail or to knock over a hot dog stand. Those aren't "evil". The Joker got over b/c he very often had Batman at his wits end and Batman was either just a bit smarter or quicker on the draw or pulled out a miraculous batarang throw just in time to foil the Joker's plans.

 

Wrestling is similar. The heels HAVE to be seen as a threat. Whether it be to the faces title, to the faces health, or something. In the end, the face needs to win the war, but the heel needs to win some battles along the way. I don't think Christian won enough battles to make the war really interesting.

 

The war maybe hasn't been all that interesting, but it sure got Christian higher than where he used to be. Heels get to be seen as a threat through coattail-riding mechanics a lot more often than in the past. I hear a lot of the IWC ask "why didn't the heel win this to make him look stronger" and honestly, the way I've always seen it is that the heel gets lucky victories and hangs on to the babyface's shadow by drawing heat and being an overall jerk. Victories won't come along often, and when they do it'll be done to make the said victory stand out. The threat factor mainly resides in backstage assaults, the feud's heat and cheap one-ups.

 

Likewise, I hear Miz's WWE title run "wasn't all that great". Even I, who is by no means a fan of The Miz at all, can attest that reign did its job and it elevated him enough to be a star today. He's not headlining anything right now but he could at anytime.

 

The question you have to ask is, what's the difference between where he was before this and where he is now, in real terms? The last few months, sure. He's been a little behind the times. But when he was the leader of the New Nexus? He was on TV this much. He's on TV a little more, now? What is it exactly?

 

I recall Punk not even being featured on a Raw or two during the New Nexus run. He definitely is on TV and on the mic more often now.

 

Forgot to add, if they (they being Vince/Steph/creative/etc) can't have a decent idea of what is/is not going to get a reaction then they shouldn't be in a position to determine that.

 

Honestly, it's a fairly intricate variable at times. Only sometimes.

 

To be fair, that was a pretty misleading thing for Rock to say. I don't blame any fans, adult or not, to have taken him at his word. Especially if they're not on the internet or studying the inner workings of things.

 

Similarly, here we've got a misleading advert. Not cool.

 

I defended Rock for a while after his birthday bash, but I agree with you, it's hard to say he wasn't misleading. Though, I mean.. even I knew what he meant, and I knew he would never come back full-time, but I suppose Rock could've somewhat considered how fickle wrestling fans can be... and hell, it's not even them who started calling out The Rock on that. No, it had to be Cena and Randy Orton themselves, though Orton did it only through interview or something. A lot of wrestling fans out there want, want, want, marks and smarks alike, so there was bound to be people misunderstanding what Rocky meant.

 

Now this.. will he be in the ring at Survivor Series? I doubt it, but I wouldn't put it past them either. I dunno.

[OldStingberg]

I'm sorry does it say anywhere that the Rock WILL WRESTLE at survivor series? nope.

 

And did the Rock ever say, "I'm joining the WWE roster fulltime??" Nope.

 

 

He simply said he wasn't leavign again. He then later agreed to take part in Wrestlemania. The fact that YOU, adult or not, are not satified with this... is quite frankly YOUR problem and I get sick of people complaining about stuff like this.

 

 

They use catchphrases and words that are misleading (WWE? MIDLEADING?? NOOOO) to some I guess but it's just hype machine banter to get you to buy a PPV.

 

I thought we all understood this.

 

 

I dont mean to come off "condescending" or mean or angry but I feel like WWE fans, especially the adult ones, get a little ahead of themselves and expect WWE to overdeliver. Then I gotta sit here and read a bunch of garbage about how some fans "expected more" from them and crap like that.

 

You're more concerned with the people being misled than the people doing the actual misleading? That's absurdly ridiculous. I mean, it's so absurd I can only assume you're just trying to rile people up.

[OldStingberg]

Likewise, I hear Miz's WWE title run "wasn't all that great". Even I, who is by no means a fan of The Miz at all, can attest that reign did its job and it elevated him enough to be a star today. He's not headlining anything right now but he could at anytime.

 

Could he? Or could he only headline against Cena or Orton? Serious question.

[Teh_Showtime]

Nobody would be surprised to see Miz headlining an event these days.

 

But it's unlikely to happen because Orton and Cena are still there, but he is probably #4 in the company behind Cena/Orton/Punk

[djthefunkchris]

Could he? Or could he only headline against Cena or Orton? Serious question.

 

I get where your coming from, and I agree.... except you left other's out I think could headline with him... Undertaker, Kane, Big Show, Punk, HHH, etc.

 

But your general point isn't lost. He would have to have a popular opponant. However, he could definately be the second headliner.... The one that's the second to the top.

 

What people mean though, is when the other's aren't there, Miz can be built right back to do it. IN other words, YES he can, with the right variables.

 

But I see your point there.

[Tha Black Phenom]

/nod, and that's also what I mean, right now we'd feel comfortable putting Punk and Miz in that short list of guys DJ just posted. The only thing being that yes, they're not in Cena or Orton's position yet but at least we got guys nearing that status now. They're the ones being made. They're bringing them in one after the other, and yeah we'll have to endure a lot of hopscotch booking (you could even argue.. if that's what the current generation appreciates) good and bad, but soon enough one of these guys will get "there" too. Maybe it's gonna take Miz turning face? A face-turned Ziggler, or some other popular skyrocketing heel persona shot out of a cannon, who knows. Maybe they did miss the boat with Punk(boat sure as hell hasn't sank yet though). but all that's needed is patience and something's bound to stick, eventually.

[bigtplaystew]

You're more concerned with the people being misled than the people doing the actual misleading? That's absurdly ridiculous. I mean, it's so absurd I can only assume you're just trying to rile people up.

 

If THAT'S what you took out of what I had to say, then I don't know how to explain this any more clearly, but I'll try:

 

ITS WWE! THEY LIE! WHEN YOU COMPLAIN ABOUT THIS YOU SOUND SILLY TO ME!

[Basmat01]

I get where your coming from, and I agree.... except you left other's out I think could headline with him... Undertaker, Kane, Big Show, Punk, HHH, etc.

 

as much as I like the Miz i dont consider him an A grade maineventer. He would fall into the B grade maineventer zone lol.

 

Only Cena, Orton and CM Punk really seem to be the only ones that have any real drawing power these days.

 

Undertaker is pretty much on his last legs these days, dont be suprised if he only has one or two big matches left in him.

 

Kane hasnt been a credible maineventer in years. He falls into the C grade maineventer zone lol and Big Show just moves up and down the card. Both Kane and Big Show just help put talent over these days.

 

now that I think about it WWE mainevent seems to look pretty thin these days

[lazorbeak]

One of the big problems with WWE being the only game in town is that so much of their roster is so stale and the audience has seen guys as mid-level for so long that it would be tremendously difficult to suddenly make John Morrison or whoever a main eventer without something drastic like him disappearing for a year. I mean John Cena's rise up the card had a real arc, from being turned babyface by the fans to beating the Big Show at WM XX, to winning the belt for the first time at 21, there was a sense that he was rising up the card and would be a big deal. Obviously you don't need everybody to duplicate that, but the number of guys who win big matches and then tool around doing nothing is too big to list. I mean if you look at WWE's roster in 2008 vs. today the big difference is that the top of the card is gone: Undertaker, Jericho, Batista, Jeff Hardy, and HBK are all gone, but it's pretty tough to see guys that have been jobbing consistently since 2008 as the heir apparent to those belts. I mean Kofi won his first IC title in 2008 over Jericho, and has continued to stay at that exact level for 3 years, without any real character development except now he doesn't have an accent and he briefly feuded with Orton. Dolph Ziggler, Santino, Rhodes & DiBiase, Morrison, Swagger, R-Truth, etc., have all been on the roster such a long time without any real momentum that it's awfully tough to make them main eventers just because the top of the card is gone.

 

Honestly that's why I think Sheamus should be their great white hope for the future (pun intended). He's already been built up as a heel, he's in a great position as a rising babyface, and is incredibly marketable with his Celtic symbolism and distinct look. He did have the rug cut out from him once, but it hasn't happened 3-4 times (yet) and the fans seem to respond to him.

[Rone Rivendale]

One of the big problems with WWE being the only game in town is that so much of their roster is so stale and the audience has seen guys as mid-level for so long that it would be tremendously difficult to suddenly make John Morrison or whoever a main eventer without something drastic like him disappearing for a year. I mean John Cena's rise up the card had a real arc, from being turned babyface by the fans to beating the Big Show at WM XX, to winning the belt for the first time at 21, there was a sense that he was rising up the card and would be a big deal. Obviously you don't need everybody to duplicate that, but the number of guys who win big matches and then tool around doing nothing is too big to list. to him.

 

I couldn't agree less. Edge was a midcarder for a decade and then they turned the swtich on him and he was an instant Main Eventer who won 11 World Titles. JBL was a midcarder for a decade and they pushed him directly to Main Event and it worked. He became one of the best Heels the WWE has ever had.

 

Morrison, as used in your example, is still very young. It's way too soon to start saying he has lost his chance at superstardom. WAY too soon.