The Official WWE / NXT Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[RKOwnage]

<p>Seattle Seahawks' GM John Schneider:</p><p> </p><p>

<a href="https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfkXAwYCAAAbSu4.png" rel="external nofollow">https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfkXAwYCAAAbSu4.png</a></p><p> </p><p>

<img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/biggrin.png.929299b4c121f473b0026f3d6e74d189.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /></p>

[dpoolez]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="lazorbeak" data-cite="lazorbeak" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>That's pretty out there. As I mentioned a few pages ago, Austin was treated as a top guy from 96 to winning the title in 98, only losing major matches to Bret Hart and the Undertaker in a 20 month period. Bryan was in the middle of 50/50 booking weeks before Summerslam, losing to Wade Barrett. He's also spent the last two-three months putting over Bray Wyatt, a guy WWE clearly sees as a big name, but is/was not nearly as popular as Bryan. Beyond that, he spent 3 months banging his head against the glass ceiling of Randy Orton, without getting any comeuppance of any kind. None of that booking applied to Austin. Austin didn't just lose or have screwy finishes 3 times against HBK, then turn around and put Goldust over for 3 months, because that would've been terrible booking for his character.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> But Bryan didnt put Wyatt over for three months. Didnt Bryan/Punk beat the Wyatts at SvS? He did lose at TLC but that was hardly a fair fight and losing to Bray Wyatt helps Wyatt look strong going into a very likely loss to Cena. Bryan is more than popular enough that a minor loss in a match that had great reviews isnt going to hurt his popularity. Id much rather them use him to put some guys over now then to have him Cena things up for nearly 10 years before they feel comfortable with putting someone over him cleanly to build the other guy up.</p><p> </p><p> Bryan still has his Cena win, multiple Orton wins going from before their post-SS feud, and multiple wins against The Shield to make him look credible.</p>

[Stennick]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="delv213" data-cite="delv213" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Bret was in WCW feuding with Flair and Perfect by 1998. I always find it odd when people think Bret was a mark for himself. Bret was treated like a hero during his Anti-American stuff here in Canada during 1997. People in wrestling always laugh when they say Bret thought he was a Canadian hero and took himself too seriously, in reality he was voted 39th Greatest Canadian by CBC in 2004. Saying he was a hero here isn't too much of a stretch.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> He was a mark for himself. He didn't like Shawn Michaels so he didn't want to lose the title to him in Canada? What is that? Its not like they were in Calgary, hell they were in bizzaro Canada anyway with it being in Montreal. He was asked to lose the title, he was not a part of that company anymore, it doesn't matter how he was asked to lose it you go out there and lose it. </p><p> </p><p> I like Bret ok but for all his blabbing about respect and tradition when it came time to drop the title on his FINAL night in the company he didn't want to do it because he didn't like the guy he was dropping it to. I like Bret but he was a huge mark for himself. He's not the only one but in the situation he was in there is no excuse for not doing what he was asked to do.</p>

[The Final Countdown]

I sort of agree with you, Stennick. On the other hand, I agree with Bret that Shawn faked, or at the very least embellished, his knee injury/"losing his smile" to get out of putting Bret over at WM13 and returning the favor from the previous year. So I get your point and agree with it to an extent, but I don't blame him for not wanting to drop the title to that particular guy, in Canada no less.

[Stennick]

<p>Whats funny is that people think Austin won King of the Ring and did the 3:16 thing, feuded with Bret Hart and went onto be huge. </p><p> </p><p>

You talk about 50/50 booking the pay per view before King of the Ring he lost to Savio Vega. He wasn't even on the pay per view before that but he lost in a dark match to Savio Vega again. The two months before that he wasn't even on the pay per views period not even in dark matches. So yeah the only thing of note Austin did in 96 was win the King of the Ring. </p><p> </p><p>

The truth is that Summerslam Austin wasn't even ON the actual show. He faced Yokozuna on the pre show. He also wasn't on the September In your House Pay Per View, In October he was the curtain jerking match with Triple H. He then wrestles Hart at Survior Series and then in December he's in a dark match again. Then of course in 97 he wins the Rumble, does the main event thing the next month and then of course Wrestlemania and from there he's a huge star. </p><p> </p><p>

However although Austin wasn't losing he wasn't by any means a focus of the show until the Royal Rumble. In fact I'd argue that being left off of every Pay Per View but two for the rest of that year was just as bad if not worse than 50/50 booking. Its not like they had some grand vision for Austin but just like Bryan after about six months it became pretty obvious he was going to be the guy. So you can't really say </p><p> </p><p>

Whats really interesting is that they just randomly pulled the trigger on Austin first to win the King of the Ring. He hadn't won a pay per view in like six months before this, he had lost his last two pay per view matches and he wasn't even the first choice to win this (Triple H was). Then after the King of the Ring he doesn't even wrestle on a pay per view for I think two or three pay per views after this when he's curtain jerking against Triple H. So its not like Austin's ride to the top was anything but pre planned and non stop. He had long stretches where he didn't even get a pay per view match and he's left off of the pay per view before his big push starts. So yeah Austin's push was not any different.</p>

[Stennick]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="The Final Countdown" data-cite="The Final Countdown" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>I sort of agree with you, Stennick. On the other hand, I agree with Bret that Shawn faked, or at the very least embellished, his knee injury/"losing his smile" to get out of putting Bret over at WM13 and returning the favor from the previous year. So I get your point and agree with it to an extent, but I don't blame him for not wanting to drop the title to that particular guy, in Canada no less.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> If he was staying in the company I'd have no problem with it but he was leaving and thats who they asked him to lose to. Not too mention Canada is an entire country. I would understand if he didn't want to lose in Calgary to Shawn but losing the entire length of the country away from his home in his last match. If he was staying then I would totally agree with him not losing but he was leaving the company so in my mind he should lose to whoever that company....that MADE him from nothing to something wanted him to lose to. </p><p> </p><p> I understand why he wouldn't want to but I always though "I didn't want to lose in Canada to him" was silly. Canada is an entire country thats like Austin saying he doesn't want to lose in the United States. Just my opinion.</p>

[TakerNGN74]

If he was staying in the company I'd have no problem with it but he was leaving and thats who they asked him to lose to. Not too mention Canada is an entire country. I would understand if he didn't want to lose in Calgary to Shawn but losing the entire length of the country away from his home in his last match. If he was staying then I would totally agree with him not losing but he was leaving the company so in my mind he should lose to whoever that company....that MADE him from nothing to something wanted him to lose to.

 

I understand why he wouldn't want to but I always though "I didn't want to lose in Canada to him" was silly. Canada is an entire country thats like Austin saying he doesn't want to lose in the United States. Just my opinion.

 

First off let me just state that I am a huge Bret Hart fan, he was my first favorite professional wrestler when I started watching in 1988 when I was three (Yes over Hogan) and I even told Bret Hart that when I met him in 2007 and I will remember what he said to me after I told him that for the rest of my life.

 

Bragging aside I agree with this post, in an interview Jim Cornette did with Kayfabe Commentaries for the Timeline The History of WWE 1997 DVD release. Cornette claims that Bret said that he wouldn't lose the belt in Canada. Which is the dumbest thing you could ever say that's like Steve Austin losing the belt and right before it happens Austin saying he wasn't going to lose the belt in the United States.

 

Not to mention that directly after the Screwjob Bret went on National radio and exposed the business saying "you know all those belts I won? I didn't really win them people put me over." But then lost one FOR REAL and he calls up the papers and tells them "I didn't really lose it. Vince McMahon didn't help the situation either when he did that "Time Honored Tradition" Promo saying your supposed to drop the title when you leave because that further exposed the business when we were still in the age where everything was under wraps for the most part.

 

The whole situation was childish (The screwjob) It was a heel vs. heel program and both guys were being childish, Shawn was mad at Bret because Shawn was only making $750,000 on a guaranteed contract while Bret was making over One Million Dollars a year. Bret was leaving to make 2.5 million in WCW and was being a huge baby because he didn't want to put Shawn over in Canada. Not to mention the original plan was for Bret to win in Montreal and then hand the belt over on November 10th on RAW which would have been stupid IMHO.

 

Anyways there ends my rant which is probably the longest post I have ever posted inside of this thread hope you guys enjoyed it.

[lazorbeak]

He was a mark for himself. He didn't like Shawn Michaels so he didn't want to lose the title to him in Canada? What is that? Its not like they were in Calgary, hell they were in bizzaro Canada anyway with it being in Montreal. He was asked to lose the title, he was not a part of that company anymore, it doesn't matter how he was asked to lose it you go out there and lose it.

 

I like Bret ok but for all his blabbing about respect and tradition when it came time to drop the title on his FINAL night in the company he didn't want to do it because he didn't like the guy he was dropping it to. I like Bret but he was a huge mark for himself. He's not the only one but in the situation he was in there is no excuse for not doing what he was asked to do.

 

Maybe he was a mark for himself, but I'm not sure how you can blame Bret at all for the screwjob. He didn't want to job to HBK as champ, he's entitled to feel that way. He had put HBK over repeatedly and didn't like the guy, so he didn't want his last act to be putting him over in a situation where Bret would be the babyface by default. And the part where it's not Bret's fault: WWE agreed to that- they didn't browbeat him into losing, they didn't pay him extra to do it the way they did for Jeff Jarrett in 99, they just said "okay, we'll have you lose the title tomorrow" and changed the finish without telling him.

[Stennick]

I'm not blaming him for the screwjob per say but I am saying he's a whining baby and that he was LEAVING the company so in my opinion if you're leaving a company you get no say in who gets your job when you leave and why do you care who gets your job when you leave if you're LEAVING. The WWE decided they wanted Shawn to be the champion, Bret didn't like Shawn so didn't want to drop a title to him when he complains about Hogan doing this VERY thing in his book. So its not ok for Hogan to not want to job to Hart but its ok for Hart not wanting to job to HBK? I agree with Taker it was all very childish and I'm not saying he's at fault but he certainly lost a lot of respect doing it this way. That with the whole "I don't want to lose the title in Canada thing" as if losing the title in Montreal Canada was any different than Austin losing the title in Chicago, Illinois.

[TLCJR4LIFE]

Looks like the WWE isnt going to acknowledge phil.

[dpoolez]

I agree completely with Stennick. Although Vince is still at fault for pushing Bret to sign with WCW (Bret wanted to stay loyal to the WWE), Bret lost any real say he had when he did sign with the company.

 

It was his last night, he was an employee at the end of the day, he should've done the job like his boss said and left for WCW. Had that happened that would've stopped some of the WWE's momentum going into 98.

[Teh_Showtime]

Had Bret not been used like crap in WCW they would have put them out of business. Sting finally toppling Hogan and then the addition of Bret Hart should have been the catalyst to actually break up the NWO (instead of split it into 2 factions like it did) but alas that's the way things fell.

[lazorbeak]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Teh_Showtime" data-cite="Teh_Showtime" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>Had Bret not been used like crap in WCW they would have put them out of business. Sting finally toppling Hogan and then the addition of Bret Hart should have been the catalyst to actually break up the NWO (instead of split it into 2 factions like it did) but alas that's the way things fell.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I'm assuming you're also positing that WCW using Bret Hart correctly would mean Steve Austin falls down a well and is never heard from again (and the Rock contracts gigantism from drinking too much nerve tonic). Because that's about the only way WWF would have gone "out of business" from losing Bret Hart. The reality is it freed up a spot for a guy that was either better on the mic or a more believable champ or both. That's like arguing WCW would've gone under without Ricky Steamboat.</p>

[Stennick]

So has anyone's opinion on this Punk thing changed? Or do a lot of people still believe its a work? They didn't even mention his name. Also the fans started a small CM Punk chant to start but nothing to great and it died out fairly quickly. I'm still not sure what his deal was. He says that Triple H was not a big enough match for him at Wrestlemania....what did he WANT to do? He wasn't going to be in the main event even without Batista because this is Daniel Bryan's year. Dude has earned that shot through crowd reaction alone. So what exactly was Punk planning on doing as the number 3 babyface on RAW? I mean isn't this the same thing as Mankind refusing to wrestle Big Show at Wrestlemania XV because he was the number 3 face and deserved a "bigger match". It doesn't really make any sense. Cena's not pissed off about facing Bray Wyatt who is MUCH less of a star than Triple H. Anyway boring show the build up to Mania is going slooooooow I think I'm tuning out until the WWE Network launches even on fast forward these shows put me to sleep.

[delv213]

Watching the Raw replay since I missed the original show airing, but I had to watch once I heard the fans were chanting for Punk all night and Bryan went over surprisingly. I marked out for JBL and Lawler making reference to the "infamous" Christian Blue-Dot over his face story that former WWE writers always talk about.

[Stennick]

They weren't really chanting CM Punk "all night' they were quiet most of the night and the Punk chants were BARELY audible. Nothing like the Royal Rumble not even close.

[djthefunkchris]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So has anyone's opinion on this Punk thing changed? Or do a lot of people still believe its a work? They didn't even mention his name. Also the fans started a small CM Punk chant to start but nothing to great and it died out fairly quickly. I'm still not sure what his deal was. He says that Triple H was not a big enough match for him at Wrestlemania....what did he WANT to do? He wasn't going to be in the main event even without Batista because this is Daniel Bryan's year. Dude has earned that shot through crowd reaction alone. So what exactly was Punk planning on doing as the number 3 babyface on RAW? I mean isn't this the same thing as Mankind refusing to wrestle Big Show at Wrestlemania XV because he was the number 3 face and deserved a "bigger match". It doesn't really make any sense. Cena's not pissed off about facing Bray Wyatt who is MUCH less of a star than Triple H. Anyway boring show the build up to Mania is going slooooooow I think I'm tuning out until the WWE Network launches even on fast forward these shows put me to sleep.</div></blockquote><p> I tend to not believe anything til' we here from a credible source. I speculate lots of things, but I think the one that stood out to me as something that might be credible, is that he wanted to go back to being a Heel, as he felt he could be the number one heel. I've actually heard Punk say in interviews more then once that he likes being the bad guy better. That's why I feel it sounds more credible. People tend to here what they expect to here, rather then what was said, and I can certainly see how someone could get the wrong message if that was actually said. I just have a hard time picturing Punk as this big baby backstage. I don't see him as this huge monstrous ego running around, especially when he's been quoted to saying he see's himself as Batman as opposed to Cena's Superman, and has never had anything but good words for Cena or Bryan, thinking both deserving of high status. </p><p> </p><p> I heard he was unhappy about wrestling HHH, but I don't think it had to do with HHH not being a big enough match for him... I think it was more of a "I want a match with someone on the active roster" thing. </p><p> </p><p> About the "Small" CM Punk chant. There were twitters from people saying they were kicked out tonight for chanting CM Punk, some earlier then others.</p>

[delv213]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>He says that Triple H was not a big enough match for him at Wrestlemania....what did he WANT to do? He wasn't going to be in the main event even without Batista because this is Daniel Bryan's year. Dude has earned that shot through crowd reaction alone. So what exactly was Punk planning on doing as the number 3 babyface on RAW? I mean isn't this the same thing as Mankind refusing to wrestle Big Show at Wrestlemania XV because he was the number 3 face and deserved a "bigger match". It doesn't really make any sense. Cena's not pissed off about facing Bray Wyatt who is MUCH less of a star than Triple H. Anyway boring show the build up to Mania is going slooooooow I think I'm tuning out until the WWE Network launches even on fast forward these shows put me to sleep.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> The Big Show was actually built up extremely well the first few months when he jumped from WCW. Don't forget that Vince had big plans to push Show as a legitimate threat since he originally inked him to a 10 year deal worth over a million a year. The reason Show lost a lot of steam is because he had a ton of heat with guys backstage specifically The Undertaker who was always highly critical of Show during his career. </p><p> </p><p> Punk was definitely not going over Triple H at Wrestlemania, there was no way Triple H allows anyone to go over him on the way out. Why would Punk want to feud with a guy who's essentially just there to hurt him? Didn't Triple H already do that to him in 2011?</p>

[delv213]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>They weren't really chanting CM Punk "all night' they were quiet most of the night and the Punk chants were BARELY audible. Nothing like the Royal Rumble not even close.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> I'm watching it right now, I don't know what you're talking about? I've counted a CM Punk chant for every segment except for the Santino/Emma vs Fandango/Summer Rae dance off. I don't even have my t.v on that loud.</p><p> </p><p> Possible U.S feed getting edited? I'm hearing another CM Punk during the Axel/Sheamus match right now.</p>

[bigtplaystew]

<p>Raw was a little screwey and disorganized tonight but god DAMN that Summer Rae needs to be on TV more. Yowzers.</p><p> </p><p>

And no editing, there were a lot of CM Punk chants. I don't recall it being every segment though. I think it's just about impossible to edit a live crowd feed. They can dump out but there's only so much "dump" time it wouldn't work for that.</p>

[Stennick]

<p>The chants were there but nothing even close to the Royal Rumble. The "revolt" some people around the internet were predicting was way off. Not too mention that its not hard to get a CM Punk chant going. People like him so ten or twenty smarks start a chant and everyone is going to join in. I wouldn't say it was even close to everyone. The chants were there but they were disorganized and weren't nearly as clear as the ruckus crowds we've seen in the past. </p><p> </p><p>

Honestly I got pulled back in to watching RAW right before the Rumble like everyone else. I watched the week after only for the crowd's follow up to the Royal Rumble crowd. That crowd was boring, I watched this week to see if there would be some sort of Royal Rumble level revolt for CM Punk and it wasn't there. I'm not interested in ANY feud they have going on right now. </p><p> </p><p>

Are the New Age Outlaws bad guys? Why are they acting like good guys? Why are you taking the awesome Rhodes brothers story and just sort of killed it for the New Age Outlaws to get a title reign? The answer doesn't matter it doesn't interest me. </p><p> </p><p>

Randy Orton is from my home town, we're the same age and I can't even begin to ever be interested in him. He's the most boring man on the planet. Even his lame Viper stuff diddn't do anything for me. The only time Batista has been relevant is 2005's face turn. The only time I have ever been interested in Daniel Bryan is his good promo right before the Rumble. Most of the time I find him a watered down version of Bryan Danielson with a yes chant. The Authority screwed DB out of the title and picked Randy Orton as their champion but now they are leading yes chants and stacking the deck against Orton? Huh? </p><p> </p><p>

This Authority angle went off the rails long ago. Why did Vince randomly stop being on TV the night after Summerslam? What happened to Vince's guy vs. Triple H's guy at Wrestlemania. </p><p> </p><p>

For me the thing I enjoyed about the Attitude era was the break between matches for backstage skits, promo's etc. Now we get matches that I don't care about that span two commercial breaks. </p><p> </p><p>

I just want the network to launch so I can watch 97-2003 wrestling over and over again and not worry myself with this lame product anymore.</p>

[bigtplaystew]

<p>Stennick do you even like wrestling? :-D</p><p> </p><p>

Honestly... Why on earth do you watch?</p>

[milamber]

<p><strong><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Raw Review:</span></strong></p><p> </p><p>

Opening segment - Orton did well to handle the Punk chants. LOL at HHH & Steph trolling with the Yes Movement.</p><p>

<strong>Shield vs Big E, Kofi & Mysterio</strong> - Solid match. Ambrose stealing Roman's thunder was a nice touch. Wyatt promo was more nonsensical than usual.</p><p>

<strong>Christian vs Swagger</strong> - OK match.</p><p>

<strong>Outlaws vs RhodesDust (Tag Title Cage Match)</strong> - OK match. Kudos to Cody for doing the big Moonsault spot with Road Dogg barely catching him.</p><p>

<strong>Ryder vs Titus</strong> - Effective squash. LOL at bitter Jobber Miz.</p><p>

<strong>Fandango & Summer vs Santino & Emma</strong> - Dance-off was a bad way to debut Emma because the non-NXT crowd didn't care or understand Emma's goody babyface gimmick. But I'm looking forward to a mixed tag feud. Just do it on Smackdown and give the kids at the front signs and bubble guns for her entrance so the crowd start having fun when she's on.</p><p>

<strong>Sheamus vs Axel</strong> - Solid brawl. Sheamus doesn't look rusty at all.</p><p>

<strong>Del Rio/Batista</strong> - Boring mic work and a nothing brawl.</p><p>

<strong>Ziggler, Truth & Woods vs The Wyatts</strong> - OK match but way too short. Ziggler and Bray should have a singles match. Good Shield promo.</p><p>

<strong>Naomi vs Aksana</strong> - Watchable match. Plus AJ on commentary <img alt="" data-src="//content.invisioncic.com/g322608/emoticons/smile.png.142cfa0a1cd2925c0463c1d00f499df2.png" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /> Naomi has a lot of potential. Shame the other divas keep legit hurting her.</p><p>

<strong>Bryan vs Orton</strong> - Great long match. Perfectly scripted with both men targeting body parts and controlling half the match each. Kane's involvement planted the seeds for Bryan to take on HHH at WM30. Anyone still think D-Bry is being buried?</p><p> </p><p>

<span style="text-decoration:underline;"><strong>Verdict:</strong></span> Average Raw. Lots of matches but only the main event was memorable. Outside of the Punk chants WWE were reportedly trying to stop during commerical breaks, the crowd was a bit lame, and the booking didn't help.</p><p> </p><p>

<span>http://i.imgur.com/8qOIVwe.gif</span><img alt="BfmP6csIUAAgB0t.jpg" data-src="https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfmP6csIUAAgB0t.jpg" src="<___base_url___>/applications/core/interface/js/spacer.png" /><span>http://i.imgur.com/WUvvrlG.gif</span></p>

[shawn michaels]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="Stennick" data-cite="Stennick" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>So has anyone's opinion on this Punk thing changed? Or do a lot of people still believe its a work? They didn't even mention his name. Also the fans started a small CM Punk chant to start but nothing to great and it died out fairly quickly. I'm still not sure what his deal was. He says that Triple H was not a big enough match for him at Wrestlemania....what did he WANT to do? He wasn't going to be in the main event even without Batista because this is Daniel Bryan's year. Dude has earned that shot through crowd reaction alone. So what exactly was Punk planning on doing as the number 3 babyface on RAW? I mean isn't this the same thing as Mankind refusing to wrestle Big Show at Wrestlemania XV because he was the number 3 face and deserved a "bigger match". It doesn't really make any sense. <strong>Cena's not pissed off about facing Bray Wyatt who is MUCH less of a star than Triple H.</strong> Anyway boring show the build up to Mania is going slooooooow I think I'm tuning out until the WWE Network launches even on fast forward these shows put me to sleep.</div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Oh sure. It's not like Cena has ever main evented WM, hogged the spotlight for a decade, burried the Nexus on his own initiative (acording to Y2J and Edge), participated in the disgusting Sandow burial (he tends to appear at several of these moments. Yet, I rarely hear a story that says "Cena did it, but adamantly. He did not want to do it."), and so on. He's on is way to beating Flair's recognized 16 world title record and he's pretty much done it all at this point, except for breaking the streak. Sure...he's not pissed about facing Wyatt. Then again, let's see how that match goes and we'll talk later.</p><p> </p><p> I might be a Cena hater, but the way you talk about Punk and even Danielson (washed up version? You mean: "I only like indy stuff so I'm gonna bash at the mainstream career of Bryan?). And I'm not even rambling just because I think you're wrong at everything you said. Most of your posts in this specific page are spot on. Raw is boring, i fell asleep watching it last night, the remarks you make about the storylines in your other post are also spot on. You are a smart guy, you know what you're talking about, I respect that. Just don't use Cena examples when I'm around, unless you plan to give Punk an unbiased treatment.</p>

[dpoolez]

<blockquote data-ipsquote="" class="ipsQuote" data-ipsquote-username="delv213" data-cite="delv213" data-ipsquote-contentapp="forums" data-ipsquote-contenttype="forums" data-ipsquote-contentid="25169" data-ipsquote-contentclass="forums_Topic"><div>The Big Show was actually built up extremely well the first few months when he jumped from WCW. Don't forget that Vince had big plans to push Show as a legitimate threat since he originally inked him to a 10 year deal worth over a million a year. The reason Show lost a lot of steam is because he had a ton of heat with guys backstage specifically The Undertaker who was always highly critical of Show during his career. <p> </p><p> Punk was definitely not going over Triple H at Wrestlemania, there was no way Triple H allows anyone to go over him on the way out. Why would Punk want to feud with a guy who's essentially just there to hurt him? Didn't Triple H already do that to him in 2011?</p></div></blockquote><p> </p><p> Punk took like 5 finishers in his match with Triple H before going down. He lost that match and then went on to have the longest reign in 25 years. How exactly did the Triple H feud hurt him? If anything Punk got a rub just for being on par with Triple H, the guy who destroyed The Undertaker just months before, throughout the entire match.</p><p> </p><p> If anything killed Punk's momentum it was ADR taking the title off of him for absolutely no reason at all.</p>