The Official TNA / Impact / GFW Discussion Thread

[liontamer]

Watching destination X right now. If I'm not mistaken, this is pope's second week announcing. So far it's much better than the first. He came off as overly excited about everything on the first one to me.

 

Unless he's injured, I don't get why they brought him back in this role (not that I don't think he can be a fun color guy). He was so over on his prior run, a legit world title contender before getting injured, and is more entertaining than most of the current roster. For a company looking to build new stars, I'd think you'd want him to fill the void left by all of the departures.

 

Also, did they ever tie up what was happening with snow since pope took over? He was packing his suitcase for the move to Wed, and then suddenly never mentioned again that I can recall.

[Remianen]

No company will ever be a threat to WWE, but WWE can kill itself. You won't beat a company that has been around for 60+ years the brand and name is too cemented into fans that it will not ever be taken down by another wrestling company.

 

This is not true, in any sector of business. Microsoft was beaten (it wasn't 'killed' but it's not the influential company it was at its height). And WWE doesn't have to be 'taken down' by another wrestling company (MS was beat by a SEARCH ENGINE company as well as a former tech peer who innovated their way to a $700 billion valuation). That's the key. You either evolve with the times (which WWE is actively trying to do with its moves into film and which Netflix has been masterful at doing, so far) or you become a relic of a bygone age, trying desperately to regain your former position and cultural significance. We've seen this happen repeatedly over the last 30-40 years.

 

CEna is pushed because he sells a lot of merch and is incredibly over as an act with the younger kids and the females in the audience. I know none of us older wrestling fans wants to admit this, but its true. Also I would argue the last few years he's actually been doing a pretty good job of working with young stars to make them a big deal (see the Shield, Kevin Owens, Sami Zayn, to an extent Rusev, though they really need to transition him back to the M/E sooner rather than later otherwise his momentum is going to level off).

 

Yeah, it's a realization I came to a few years ago. If you have a moneymaker, you put it in the best position to continue to make you money. You ride it til its wheels fall off. In the case of Daniel Bryan (who was not on Cena's level but still a moneymaker), that happened, unfortunately.

 

Watching impact for the 2nd time since getting destination america. Play by play guys shouldn't be heel. Save it for the color commentators. Josh Matthews makes impact nearly unwatchable. Not to mention Josh Matthews is so bad at his job he makes heel cole look like bobby freakin heenan.

 

Josh Matthews is decent but he's apparently trying to be something he's not suited to be. I wouldn't say he's so bad as to make heel Cole look like Bobby Heenan (that's William Hung territory) but in his current incarnation, he does need to be carried or muted by a stronger worker (which Mike Tenay would qualify as). I also think Taz can be annoying when he loses track of his audience (using Japanese names for moves instead of their more well known Western monikers). It's correct, don't get me wrong, but I don't think there are too many puro fans watching TNA.

[jwt13]

If I'm not mistaken I believe Pope has retired from in ring action I could be wrong though.

[crownsy]

I would say I'm a infrequent TNA watcher at best these days, but I did catch the last two. What a train wreck, pun intended, the micki james - James storm stuff has been.

 

Week 1: "We had this guy kill this girl people, so edgy! so ground breaking!"

 

*predictable response intensifies

 

Week 2: "Just kidding, she's only emotionally hurt! the Train "just missed" her, but she's really scared now guys!"

 

Jesus.

 

It reminds me of like.... hell mabey even 5 or 6 years ago when they were having the cast of that awful Mcgrubber movie host raw, and R-Truth came out and Mcgrubber set off an explosion that left only R-truth's boots.

 

I'll always remember that as a train wreck segment where they went "look how edgy we are! we killed someone!" as a joke of a segment because for the rest of raw this was me and my stoned buddies every time Cole or Lawler would comment on anything like nothing happened

 

"Can we get an update on the vaporization of R-Truth?!?!"

 

"Cole, you don't seem concerned a man was just reduced to atoms on the main stage, maybe thoughts and prayers are appropriate?"

 

"Jerry, a WWE superstar was just killed in front of 18,000 people, any comment?"

 

and then Truth came out the next show like nothing had happened, leading to a fun 2 weeks of "R-truth is Jesus!! He hath Risen!" bad jokes.

 

Edit: found it

 

[Mootinie]

It's sad because I'd heard nothing but unanimous praise for that storyline and how real it felt, but they very quickly derailed that.

[BHK1978]

So I guess Remi did not get abducted by the Amish. Well there goes that theory.

 

In regards to the Mickie James/James Storm thing. I thought they built it up pretty good, they had me guessing as to where they were going with the storyline and so to me I kind of figured that wherever they went it there would be no real good payoff. Granted I did not think they would throw her at a train but there you have it.

[liontamer]

After starting to watch lucha underground, I think they out X-division the x-division. Kind of reminds me of TNA on FX years ago, but with better production and storytelling. Found a lot of the destination x matches slow

 

Thought pope did much better throughout the destination x show than the prior week. I hope that he is not really done in the ring.

 

After watching about a dozen lucha underground shows, I love ivelese (sp) (is she the blonde tough enough chick that got hurt?) and Johnny Mundo is awesome. Would have liked to have seen these two in TNA, but they are in good storylines now.

 

TNA would do well to move more towards this style (particularly in terms of the intensity/speed and the production) without outright copying it. They don't need to be as spotty though as I'm pretty sure I've already seen two guys in lucha give themselves concussions.

 

My one irritant with lucha, is that although I like Stryker better in terms of announcing quality than pope, Matthews, and snow, I think his overuse name dropping and the way he presents his knowledge of history has an unintended effect of cheapening things that they are doing. Just the way he states things sounds like he is basically admitting that they are copying stuff for pops. Things like "I think he stole that move from liger", or reminding us that someone had ripped apart the belt before (something I didn't know and his comment instantly cheapened it, as to me it was innovative. It would be like WCW announcers telling us outright that the nWo storyline was copied when it started. We don't need to know that). Vampiro does much better with this and I like him much better at the table than in the ring.

 

One thing TNA should NOT copy is the lucha title belts. That first belt was crap. Glad it was ripped apart.

[Stennick]

I agree with you on virtually everything lucha related. Stryker is actually very good for having never really done this full time, let alone at this pace or this level in his entire life. I like some of what he does. He does an excellent job of explaining lucha libre in general and more specifically LU to those that might be tuning in for the first time and he does it casually. There was a moment at the start of the match where two men were circling the logo in the middle of the ring and he just casually mentions what that logo represents in the LU universe. His correct annunciation of names and playing off of history two workers might have from AAA or even CMLL or somewhere else that viewers in the states likely wouldn't be aware of is all really good. Then there are moments when he kind of cheapens the moment like the times you mentioned.

 

LU in general is fabulous the out X division the X Division. Honestly those two dives that Angelico did I guess it was two and three weeks ago now. I never saw anything close that that incredible, death defying and amazing in TNA. Maybe the cage walk that Elix did back in like 05 or whenever that was. That being said these guys are walking the ropes nearly every week. I saw Aerostar just casually do it about three weeks ago. They out story tell the WWE and TNA combined. Cueto even though he's an actor is an incredible performer. He's evil but he's not cartoon evil like Vince likes to portray. You get this sense this man truly is a despicable human being.

 

I could go on all day about how awesome LU is. I randomly found it one night airing those mini marathons they do and I've been hooked. Any promotion that can make Ezekiel Jackson must see tv and an incredible character has earned my viewership.

[TheOmniWarrior]

Josh Matthews just pulled me completely out of immersion of TNA "1985 called they want their heel color commentator back." Play-by-Play shouldn't be using backstage terms... ever. Gah they need to get rid of him and maybe get a guy whose not a wwe reject for play by play.

[Stennick]

I really enjoyed Matthews in I think it was 03ish when he was on Velocity with different partners like Snow, Miller, Demott even. I really thought he had talent but his run in TNA with the training wheels taken off has badly exposed him. Its crazy he can be this bad after doing this for a decade and as I said doing it well within the confines of the WWE. Matt Striker on the otherhand has blown me away since leaving and working with LU.

[Remianen]

So I guess Remi did not get abducted by the Amish. Well there goes that theory.

 

Nope. But I have helped raise four barns since I moved here!

 

 

I like LU but I don't want to get sucked in. Been disappointed too much over the years. At some point, it seems like every upstart company with unique features either abandons their uniqueness and blatantly copies the big dog (hi TNA!) or gives up and goes out of business or merges with someone else (DGUSA, Wrestlicious). Awesome product though.

 

I don't get TNA's direction though. EC3 vs Angle (A-GAIN, to quote Chris Jericho) where all of a sudden the title and the passage of time is going to lead to a different result? Slammiversary on PPV for the 16 people willing to buy it? And oh how the X-Division has fallen when people like GRADO are contending for the title.

[BHK1978]

Josh Matthews just pulled me completely out of immersion of TNA "1985 called they want their heel color commentator back." Play-by-Play shouldn't be using backstage terms... ever. Gah they need to get rid of him and maybe get a guy whose not a wwe reject for play by play.

 

They still have a guy in Mike Tenay, but he was deemed too old to have the job. I guess they think younger fans would not think he was hip enough.

[jwt13]

They still have a guy in Mike Tenay, but he was deemed too old to have the job. I guess they think younger fans would not think he was hip enough.

 

Basically the same thing WWE did replacing King with Booker

[Remianen]

Basically the same thing WWE did replacing King with Booker

 

But let's be real here. King was a bit over the top. His commentary was firmly stuck in the mid to late 80s. And though I found him hilarious when commentating divas matches, he seemed to come off like a creepy, dirty old man to many people. He was masterful when paired with JR, who could deflect and redirect him when necessary. But Cole isn't JR (obv) so it was always a bit dissonant when they were together. Both JBL and Booker are improvements. I think it's good that they shunted him to the B show with the "rookie" announcer.

[jwt13]

But let's be real here. King was a bit over the top. His commentary was firmly stuck in the mid to late 80s. And though I found him hilarious when commentating divas matches, he seemed to come off like a creepy, dirty old man to many people. He was masterful when paired with JR, who could deflect and redirect him when necessary. But Cole isn't JR (obv) so it was always a bit dissonant when they were together. Both JBL and Booker are improvements. I think it's good that they shunted him to the B show with the "rookie" announcer.

 

I'm not a Booker fan he's not bad but I prefer King. I love JBL though he is always great.

[Teh_Showtime]

I think I was the only person who enjoyed Booker's initial run on SD in 2011-2. He was particularly great during Bryan's WHC reign and especially the first Punk/Bryan PPV match

[Jaysin]

I think I was the only person who enjoyed Booker's initial run on SD in 2011-2. He was particularly great during Bryan's WHC reign and especially the first Punk/Bryan PPV match

 

I also enjoyed Booker's commentary back then. It was insanely enjoyable.

[lukess11]

I also enjoyed Booker's commentary back then. It was insanely enjoyable.

 

I liked his favorite "5".

[CPBHBK]

I also enjoyed Booker's commentary back then. It was insanely enjoyable.

 

Honestly I never enjoyed Booker's commentary, I wish they would bring Lawler back to RAW and replace him or JBL either one

[Jaysin]

Honestly I never enjoyed Booker's commentary, I wish they would bring Lawler back to RAW and replace him or JBL either one

 

King has had maybe five or six good moments on commentary in the last 15 years. Booker's commentary is just so ridiculous that it's entertaining. Lawler's is just bad.

 

JBL has been pretty bad since his return as well.

[BHK1978]

I thought last night's show was pretty good.

 

I have to say it was cool to see Vader even if he is old and cannot do much in the ring anymore.

 

I am still not really sure why Jeff Jarrett was on the show other than the whole King of the Mountain thing. I though he was going to say he was going into the TNA HOF and have one last match. I also thought he was still minority owner of the company, maybe he is no longer but the last time I heard he still was.

 

I have not caught a lot of Lucha Underground but I thought Hernandez was there so I was a little surprised when he showed up. Though I love the thought of LAX coming back when Homicide heals up.

 

Matt Morgan's return was a little shocking as well because I had read he had retired from wrestling and was done with it, with no thoughts of coming back. I guess he changed his mind.

[CPBHBK]

 

I am still not really sure why Jeff Jarrett was on the show other than the whole King of the Mountain thing. I though he was going to say he was going into the TNA HOF and have one last match. I also thought he was still minority owner of the company, maybe he is no longer but the last time I heard he still was.

 

His one last match is King of the Mountain. Also there are rumors he might be buying TNA from the Carters.

[liontamer]

SO I'm trying to reconcile reports....

 

I hear TNA going out of business, being late paying people etc (including photos of matt hardy paid late, yet he's still there)....

 

I see in a few weeks time the return of awesome kong, matt morgan, crimson, jeff Jarrett, Hernandez, not to mention over the past several months the addition of the rising, return of low ki, Mickey James, and rumors of dolph ziggler.

 

 

are the rumors just BS in this case?

[Stennick]

Like all things in life its complicated. Here is the jest of it.

 

Dave reported that DA was cancelling their deal with TNA in September. Shortly after that DA moved TNA from Friday to Weds, then almost immediately announced the deal with ROH without ever having a single word about it with TNA.

 

The problem is supposedly (and backed up by a leaked memo) that although TNA is bringing in most viewers than anything else on the show that a lot of advertisers don't want anything to do with them. So their DNA (do not advertise) makes it hard for them to secure advertising that would make it financially beneficial to keep them since DA is apparently financing a large part of the companies operations at this point.

 

So all signs point that in September or October when DA has fulfilled their mandatory part of the contract they will part ways with TNA and keep ROH because even though ROH pulls in at best half the viewership of TNA they are paying much less money to them because ROH isn't as dependent on television money because they are owned by a television company, they have a dedicated fanbase and they tour a lot.

 

So if TNA can't secure its fourth television deal in 11 years it doesn't seem possible for them to stay in business. I mean maybe they can get on some other network but the finances would have to be overhauled. DA is only available in about 50 percent of cable homes. Its 49th in network size. Thats a steep drop off form Spike which was available in 80 percent of homes and was the 17th biggest cable network. With TNA not really touring at this point because of the cost involved in that they are almost strictly a television property. They couldn't secure a deal with a bigger network than DA previously and they are even more damaged goods this time around with their last deal having lasted not even a year. I can't imagine how a network smaller than DA would be able to put together the funds needed to continue financing a company that is already massively struggling with money in the first place. Not to mention they last 70 percent of their audience leaving Spike for DA I don't want to think about a TNA pulling in 30K in viewers on some network like the Speed Channel or some nonsense. Even though Dixie is shopping a reality show about a woman running a company that has always been a mans world (pro wrestling) so I suppose its possible that she tries to keep it alive somewhere until that option is officially dead to her.

 

As far as being late on payments and bringing more people in its kind of an illusion. Mickie James is gone, Low Ki just left today, Austin Aries' contract is up at the end of the month. So there are a lot of "big" names leaving the company. Not to mention Jeff is hurt for a good amount of time with his injury. So most of the names you mentioned are already gone. That combined with TNA seemingly being delusional about everything and probably believe that DA will keep them on despite ROH being a lot cheaper of an option and likely not the DNA problem that TNA has become.

 

A lot of guys show up despite being late with their pay because....where else are they gonna go? It seems like these guys work because eventually they will get paid and also the fact that just being on television secures you a higher rate on the indies than not being on tv so if anything its free advertising for other work.

 

I suspect that TNA will be a thing of the past in its current form by the end of the year. JR mentioned that Keith and Jarrett might step in and buy it but....why? I mean JJ has the GWF gimmick going on and the TNA name is so badly damaged that it seems much easier to let the company go out of business and then cherry pick the guys you want for your own company. The only thing of value would be the tape library and honestly that would be of no value to anyone but McMahon.

[Kitarzu]

I would agree on everything except the last sentence. The tape library is extremely valuable for Jeff Jarrett.